GitP WarCraft 3: The Frozen Throne group

[Winterwind]

Alright, Mrmud, I got you added to the list at this thread's beginning, and that's, as Orange Zergling said, all "recruitment" there is. We have no clan and no organisation beyond this thread; we just meet weekly for a bit of fun. Welcome to GitP WarCraft group.

[The Orange Zergling]

Good news - after much trial and error I can now host. (apologies and/or cookies to moozy for putting up with me during the "error" part)

Which means that my lust for Rabbits vs Sheep will be satiated... somewhat.

[Setra]

I finally have my computer back and get to work both Friday and Saturday -.-;

6PM til 1AM.

Might be able to play some Friday.

[Winterwind]

Good news - after much trial and error I can now host. (apologies and/or cookies to moozy for putting up with me during the "error" part)

Which means that my lust for Rabbits vs Sheep will be satiated... somewhat.

I hope not over-satiated. I like it myself quite a bit, wouldn't want to have it missing from our playlist!

I finally have my computer back and get to work both Friday and Saturday -.-;

6PM til 1AM.

Might be able to play some Friday.

Welcome back, Setra!


So, reminder, tomorrow's our session again! I am not 100% sure whether I will show up, but I think I will!
EDIT: Wow, first time five PMs were required to reach every group member! We're growing!


Also, what do you think about the way we handled our custom map selection last time? (everyone making a proposal and us going through with the list, as opposed to our former "discuss until we find something everyone wants to play") It is a lot faster this way, even though it requires some compromises...
The only problem I see with that is that some maps take longer than others, making this approach not exactly fair - maybe next time, we should say that short maps get played several times? (Yes, I admit that I would benefit the most from that )

[Blood]

Bah. We're not one of those stuck-up, annoying, overly-organized clans. (Because most of them are like that on WC3.) We should just log on, then talk and/or play random custom maps/real WC3 maps, as chosen by whomever. It's pretty much what I do, anyway.

[Winterwind]

Yeah, that's generally my preferred solution, too, and the way we always did it naturally; it's just that sometimes, it takes so long to decide on what we all want to play. But yeah, I guess you're right, we should stick to the friendly and informal "talk it through" approach. Sorry, I think my desire to keep this group working in an as much as possible fun for everyone manner went overboard with me here.

[The Orange Zergling]

Nope, I'm still an addict.

I guess I wouldn't mind either method, myself.

[Crispy Dave]

if we can i wouldent mind starting a clan just to make it easyer to keep in touch and stuff

[Cryopyre]

I propose we start the group: AHA (Alliance-Horde Alliance)

If you're sick of being called sadistic for playing the Horde or immature for playing the Alliance, join now, so you can chat with the opposing faction before killing them!

[starwoof]

I propose we start the group: AHA (Alliance-Horde Alliance)

If you're sick of being called sadistic for playing the Horde or immature for playing the Alliance, join now, so you can chat with the opposing faction before killing them!

I vote we call it HAA. Horde-Alliance Alliance, because alliance sux. Sometime I'll show up for a game day, but I'm usually busy fridays. Also its a lot of trouble for me to switch from west to east.

[Winterwind]

if we can i wouldent mind starting a clan just to make it easyer to keep in touch and stuff

Why, do clans get some extra options for communication, or what? And if so, what are they? ('cause I have trouble imagining what could be more helpful for staying in touch than the friend list)

I propose we start the group: AHA (Alliance-Horde Alliance)

If you're sick of being called sadistic for playing the Horde or immature for playing the Alliance, join now, so you can chat with the opposing faction before killing them!

...Eh? You realise this is a WarCraft 3 group here, not World of WarCraft, right?

Sometime I'll show up for a game day, but I'm usually busy fridays.

Ah, I've been wondering why we never heard anything from you. Well, good luck finding the time, then, and keep in mind the sessions are long, so if you don't have time at 4 PM, come at 9 PM - we're very, very likely still be there.

Also its a lot of trouble for me to switch from west to east.

Yeeees. Of cooooourse it is.

[LiteYear]

From what I remember, the Clan Tab will list all the members of the clan you're in, and whether they're online (unfortunately, there wasn't any things like /f l or /f m for clan members). There was some sort of clan msg thing, but I think that only E-Mailed the message. The only other positive I can remember is that a clan gets their own channel, and members of the clan will go to that channel initially when they "enter chat" (instead of Frozen Throne USA-X). I don't know if it's worth it (especially since you need 10 people online at once to create the clan).

[Winterwind]

10 people online at once? Hmmm... with a bit luck, we might actually make it (over the course of each evening, I think we are a good deal more than 10, but not at once so far).
Seeing all people who are online? Geez, I could use that for the StarCraft group - my friend list does not fit anymore. Too bad StarCraft doesn't have this system implemented.

Hmm, otherwise, I don't really care or mind; it does seem to have it's benefits, but it might be difficult to get enough people to create/join it, and I think it may not be worth the hassle.

Also, Orange Zergling expressed his opinion that he wouldn't want a GitP clan, not with all the obligations and intra-clan intrigues he has seen in other clans. Now, while I don't think such a thing could befell our informal and friendly group - aren't we all fellow Playgrounders? - I think it is a perfectly understandable stance to take...

[Blood]

I don't mean to sound like a stuck-up bastard, but I probably am at the moment: I refuse to join a clan. You guys can make one if you like, and I'll still hang out with you all, but I refuse to join. Too many bad experiences, and too many people convincing me - "Oh, this clan won't be like that."

Yeah, right.

[Winterwind]

Care to elaborate? What did happen in these clans you speak of? 'cause I kinda fail to see how some additional functions to see who is online would change anything about the group dynamics/the group's purpose/whatever.

[Emperor Ing]

Let me guess, the clan shaman destroyed the clan by removing every non-shaman and cheiftain member from it?
That was how DSGI was destroyed. Damn i miss that clan.

[Winterwind]

My own assumption is something like people first insisting they don't care about play skill and there is no obligation to play ladder games (or to win them, anyway), and later on bullying the weaker players nevertheless.
Which quite obviously wouldn't matter for a hypothetical GitP clan, considering that we do not play ladder games as a group, and most(?) of us do not even play regular games to any significant amounts or at all.

[Crispy Dave]

we could make all members shamans

[The Orange Zergling]

Isn't there a maximum of 5 Shamans per clan?

[Winterwind]

Isn't there a maximum of 5 Shamans per clan?

I seem to recall something like that, too... *checking on battle.net* Yes, indeed, it says so here.

Anyway, Orange Zergling, now that you are here... could you tell me what these horror stories are you and Blood are afraid of seeing repeated if we created a GitP clan? Because I can hardly imagine what problems could befell a group like ours - frankly, I would not even consider it a clan, just activating some additional BattleNet functions which make it easier to see who is online, no more.

[The Orange Zergling]

Well, for starters, people from other clans 'infiltrating' yours and gaining trust and Shaman rank over time, then disbanding pretty much the entire clan.

Not to mention the little "lol, u suck" fights between clan Chieftains.

...and the Shaman's letting the power go to their heads and booting everybody who so much as doesn't lick their boots.

Then theres the "get back here u sad little sack of [crap]" whispers from members who just want to talk to you, even though you are in a game and they can do so through whispers.

And then the whole superiority issues that having ranks will no doubt bring.

*Hopefully* most if not all of us are mature enough to avoid most of these, but I've lost some people who I thought were good friends because they suddenly turned bastards.

And even if we don't have superiority issues, it looks bad to have 6 people have a "better" rank than the rest. Or even just 1, each clan requires a Chieftain, I believe...

So no, I won't join any clan formed, even if it would be beneficial. Too many bad experiences, too paranoid.

[Crispy Dave]

well my clan disbanded because the leader quit and the new one who was given the old ones account got pissed and disbanded it. but hey what damage could be done over the internet honestly

[Crispy Dave]

Well, for starters, people from other clans 'infiltrating' yours and gaining trust and Shaman rank over time, then disbanding pretty much the entire clan.

Not to mention the little "lol, u suck" fights between clan Chieftains.

...and the Shaman's letting the power go to their heads and booting everybody who so much as doesn't lick their boots.

Then theres the "get back here u sad little sack of [crap]" whispers from members who just want to talk to you, even though you are in a game and they can do so through whispers.

And then the whole superiority issues that having ranks will no doubt bring.

*Hopefully* most if not all of us are mature enough to avoid most of these, but I've lost some people who I thought were good friends because they suddenly turned bastards.

And even if we don't have superiority issues, it looks bad to have 6 people have a "better" rank than the rest. Or even just 1, each clan requires a Chieftain, I believe...

So no, I won't join any clan formed, even if it would be beneficial. Too many bad experiences, too paranoid.

you can be shaman

[Winterwind]

I see. Thanks for explaining.

Well, while I think most of this could not happen to us (for example, this whisper-thing does not happen, even though we are all on each others' friend lists, so why should it start if we formed a clan?), but someone being required to have a higher rank could get pretty unnerving, that's true (I would suggest making some friendly and reasonable person chieftain in that case - such as yourself or LiteYear - but best to avoid it altogether).

Besides, all it would spare us would be to type 'GitP' as channel and '/f l' after logging in; hardly worth the hassle.

[Blood]

[/anti-clan paranoia]

So I'm logging on now. Maybe we can get a couple games in before I log off from 5-6?

Don't leave while I'm gone.

[The Orange Zergling]

Some good news:

I found an easy, quick, and generally very painless way to use Hero attributes as damage. So far I've only implemented this for the Scorch, Hailstorm, Constricting Vines, and Judgement spells in my map, but I'll have time to do the rest later.

The maker of Control the Ruins is, in fact, active and working to fix most of the bugs we found in the game, as they've been reported before.

[Winterwind]

Some good news:

I found an easy, quick, and generally very painless way to use Hero attributes as damage. So far I've only implemented this for the Scorch, Hailstorm, Constricting Vines, and Judgement spells in my map, but I'll have time to do the rest later.

Great!

Now, my two eurocents would be to give each hero a mix of attribute dependant (=growing stronger with time) abilities, and utility abilities which remain useful at all times (such as reincarnation, damage reduction, critical strike, evasion, and so forth). Then it should be both balanced and provide distinctions between the classes which remain relevant throughout the game.

The maker of Control the Ruins is, in fact, active and working to fix most of the bugs we found in the game, as they've been reported before.

The problem is that, in my humble opinion, the greatest mistake about this map is the game concept itself - it takes forever for a group to hold the centre sufficiently long, and if a group manages to hold it sufficiently long I think it is going to be more fluke than anything.

Now, what I would have done in his place would be to get rid of the "hold ruins for 5 minutes"-goal entirely, and instead made it so that the creeps of the side controling the ruins get an upgrade every, I dunno, 30 or 60 seconds, or so, and the goal is to overrun the enemy base. This way, the side which manages to control the centre for a sufficiently long time would earn a distinct advantage and, presumably, win, but it would not be so incredibly difficult to achieve victory.
(Of course, I am not sure whether my idea would work either, and maybe his concept works out after all if the players are more experienced with the map, but this is just what comes to me after a short brainstorming )

[LiteYear]

I don't know... the main problem with the map is that, it didn't matter who or what was there; if a person got to the middle tile, that team immediately gains control. If the control trigger was changed (i.e. say it takes 5 seconds to switch control, and you can't take control if the hill is occupied by an enemy hero), it would be a lot better. (Alternatively, a cumulative timer would also be an option)

[Winterwind]

Yeah, that too... another way to do this map would have been to have a seperate timer for both teams set to a much longer time than 5 minutes, which runs down when a team controls the ruins and resumes where it was left when a team re-conquers the ruins again, with neither timer running when heroes of both teams are in the centre.

[The Orange Zergling]

After very unexpected and infuriating problems with damage-over-time attribute based spells, I managed to find a solution, and am now working to find a way to implement the same system for healing (which isn't as simple as just using a negative number), and damage/hit points of summoned units. There's also a new hero, the Necromancer.