Dragon Prince II: Double the Princes for Double the Fun!

[The Fury]

She trusts her father more than she should, but so did a lot of people.

True, though Viren didn't do anything suspicious until after King Harrow got assassinated. And not many people seemed aware of the fact that Viren even had secret chambers and dungeons, much less who and what he put in them.

I don't honestly see anything wrong with slaughtering a deer to restore her brother's health. Again, it's no different than hunting. Some vegetarian-leaning viewers might disagree with her actions, but it doesn't strike me as evil, or as any more wrong than what people do every day.

The issue that I took from it isn't that Claudia killed a cute baby deer, rather that she purposefully mislead Ezran into helping her because she knew that he wouldn't approve of what she was doing if he knew.

Ezran might be clever and sensitive for his age, but he's ultimately a little kid. I don't blame her for not telling him everything in that situation. And I disagree with your parsing of why she didn't - yes, partially she was panicking and wanted to fix her brother as fast as possible, which was why she did it that way, but I think that "spare Ezran's feelings" was also part of it. She knew he was sensitive and didn't want him to know what she was doing because of that.

That might have to be a point where we'll just have to disagree. I'll admit that my read is a lot less generous, though ultimately I agree that Claudia's action is understandable but I also think that it's manipulative and dishonest.

[Resileaf]

(The other interesting thing is that if Viren has a redemption arc, and Aaravos turns out to be more sympathetic than people are assuming, then the show might not have one singular Big Bad at all, which might fit its themes - the "evil" comes from the vicious cycles of violence rather than from an evil dark lord or anything like that. Aaravos, remember, wanted to give magic to humans, which implies that he may actually have opposed the original war.)

It would be a very mature look at war from a kid's show. That evil (generally) does not come from one side to the other, but from a never-ending cycle of attacks and counterattacks.
A very worthy lesson.

[John Cribati]

Also it should be noted that Viren told Soren "kill the princes" entirely unprompted, but Claudia actually asked (in jest, admittedly, but she did ask) whether the egg was more important than her brother.

[Metahuman1]

Also it should be noted that Viren told Soren "kill the princes" entirely unprompted, but Claudia actually asked (in jest, admittedly, but she did ask) whether the egg was more important than her brother.

Heck, the fact that he said it in response to a joke, and it was CLEARLY not the response she was expecting at the time only makes it more credible that she didn't immediately question it. People have been known to not think real clearly when you throw them badly off balance in a conversation.


Resileaf:

It would. I had wondered and thought abit about that being the angle they'd perhaps be going for back during season 1. And season 2 seems to be leaning more in that potential direction, assuming the Star Elf guy isn't a dark overlord type and Verin isn't just treated as irredeemable for the rest of the series.

I hope that it proves to be the case, it would be quite a solid decision. Much as I do enjoy my Dark Lord style villains in fiction.

[lord_khaine]

Well so far all our bad guys have had reasonable motivations.
The Dragons want to keep the humans in their own land.
Verin wants to protect humanity from getting exterminated by the monsters that killed the Queen, and god knows how many others.
Star Elf likely want to get free.

[Aquillion]

Well so far all our bad guys have had reasonable motivations.
The Dragons want to keep the humans in their own land.

I don't see this one as reasonable at all. Keep in mind that the whole "their own land" division only happened because the dragons engaged in a massive campaign of ethnic cleansing in the first place (the writers have specifically compared it to the Trial of Tears IIRC, so it's supposed to be seen as a horrific act that dramatically escalated the current cycle of violence.)

The direct cause of that was "humans use Dark Magic" (and presumably "some humans use dark magic fueled by living, sentient elves and dragons".) But it seems unlikely it was more than a tiny handful of humans actually doing so, which makes what the dragons and elves did grossly disproportionate.

[lord_khaine]

In this specific case i talked about the dragon Thunder, who were in charge of enforcing the divide between the two lands.

And atrocities in the past aside, then harshly patroling the divide is likely in theory the best way to avoid a new war between elves and humans.
In the dragons eyes this was a human/ork situation. And i doubt anyone would really argue against roasting any ork scouting party that crosses the border to keep the peace.

The direct cause of that was "humans use Dark Magic" (and presumably "some humans use dark magic fueled by living, sentient elves and dragons".) But it seems unlikely it was more than a tiny handful of humans actually doing so, which makes what the dragons and elves did grossly disproportionate.

Likely to the elves, the use of dark magic were a gross violation of the natural order, something on the line with necromancy or worse, where the humans took by force what they had not been given.
Of course though, yeah their response to that were grossly disproportionate.

Thats more or less the theme of the show. Everyone thinks their reactions are proportionate.
But they still spiral things further and further downwards.

[Weimann]

I know the discussion has moved on a bit, but let me just state for the record (because goddammit, I'm getting some use out of my literature classes):

Spoiler: Flat, Round, Static, Dynamic

Show

A flat character is a character that has one or two big character traits that define their personality, and little beyond that. They're usually background characters, the type of characters you put in to fill a function in the narrative rather than being the focus of the narrative. By contrast, a round character has several, often conflicting character traits, and their complex reactions to the events of the narrative are interesting and touching.

Being a flat or round character does not have anything to do with their development. A dynamic character is one that changes between the start and the end of the narrative, in reaction to the events of the story and interplay with other characters. By contrast, a static character does not change, retaining the same general traits or perspectives throughout the story.

These concepts exist on separate axes. A flat character does not have to be static, nor does a round character have to be dynamic. Let's look at AtLA.
Flat and static characters: The Firelord. Toph's parents. The cabbage man.
Flat and dynamic characters: The Earth king. Suki. (I think, it was a while since I watched it, admittedly.)
Round and static characters: Azula. (Arguably Iroh.)
Round and dynamic characters: The Gaang. Zuko. (Is he usually included? Putting him in extra just in case.)

I would have a hard time calling any of the focus characters in the Dragon Prince flat. They might not be super logical or smart, but they're there.

In other news, I really like this show, you guys. I can feel that Avatar feel in it: the mix of action, offbeat humour and philosophical themes. Really hope there's a book three coming.