The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

[IraWolf]

Worm That Walks is a template, too, I'm pretty sure...Mercane is a -0, IMO.

It'd be awesome is the Ha-Naga is the only actual creature (not template) to get more than a -0. XD What a coup.

[javcs]

It'd be awesome is the Ha-Naga is the only actual creature (not template) to get more than a -0. XD What a coup.

Nah, like I said, I think some of the dragons and the Elder Titan might get a +0.


But the Ha-Naga will be the only non-template creature that gets a +1 or better in the entire ELH. Because the Ha-Naga will be a +1 on account of level 21 racial casting with "only" 20RHD.

[ZamielVanWeber]

After finally studying the monster I agree with +0, -0, +0 for the LAs. No comment on non psionic versions.

Fiend Folio has a ton of cool monsters and templates we can adjust and we get to fix some editing errors!

[Bavarian itP]

I would very happily throw a vote behind Miniatures handbook, and have suggested it in the past.

Thirded. The Protectar, the Ramadeen ... and let's find out if cave dinosaurs are better than -0!

Also, it would be quick.

[Lans]

Og pureblood is a lot worse than the psionic one, I would put it at -0, the psionic one should be an easy +0

I think the psionic abomination, and halfblood are a weak +0

[Inevitability]

Non-psionic pureblood:
-0: 4 votes

Psionic pureblood:
+0: 7 votes

Psionic halfblood:
-0: 5 votes
+0: 1 vote

Abomination:
+0: 1 vote

Psionic abomination:
-0: 1 vote
+0: 6 votes

Regular pureblood will be downgraded to -0, psionic pureblood will remain at +0, psionic halfblood will remain at -0, psionic abomination will raise to +0.

The regular abomination technically got a majority vote for +0, but I'm going to let people re-state their opinion on that one, and then if more people agree I'll raise it too.

[javcs]

Regular Ambomination is LA -0.

[Blue Jay]

Agree with javcs: the regular Yuan-Ti Abomination is LA -0.

Also, "regular abomination" feels like an oxymoron.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Hang on. Can an Udoroot use Iron Heart Surge to restore its crowns?

This could be the greatest single idea I've had in quite some time.

[javcs]

Hang on. Can an Udoroot use Iron Heart Surge to restore its crowns?

This could be the greatest single idea I've had in quite some time.

No.

Losing a crown doesn't constitute a spell, effect, or condition.
Well ... strictest, most anal-retentive RAW, maybe, but only under the kind of reading that Iron Heart Surge can put out the sun or cure Vampirism or Lycanthropy, or restore you to full HP.
RAI, no, not a chance.


For that matter, even healing magic wouldn't restore lost crowns. Well, maybe something that can regrow or otherwise restore lost body parts.

[Inevitability]

Currently leaning towards the fiend folio for the next monsters: anyone strongly opposed?

[Thurbane]

Currently leaning towards the fiend folio for the next monsters: anyone strongly opposed?

I'm OK with FF.

[ExLibrisMortis]

FF works for me.

[danielxcutter]

I'm not strongly opposed, but I personally think that if we're going to use the update booklet for FF, we might as well for MMII as well. When we get there that is.

That being said I am strongly looking forward to some of the monsters, especially the Chronotyryn.

[No brains]

I don't remember enough of it to oppose.

Assuming I'm not confusing it for being in another book, I'm curious to see the Glimmerskin get some weird rating like -0*. IIRC, it mostly works like a magic item.

[StevenC21]

I really wish we could just do the Epic Levels Handbook. It wouldn't be long, and then we would be fully done with SRD material.

[Aniikinis]

I'm cool with FF. I can't wait to see what the Zhen-Kaiethergaunts get rated. It's probably gonna be mostly -/+0 with a few +1 thrown into the mix. I agree with Steven though, we should probably finish up with the SRD books too, even though the ELH is a playground for -0s.

[OgresAreCute]

I'm not strongly opposed, but I personally think that if we're going to use the update booklet for FF, we might as well for MMII as well. When we get there that is.

That being said I am strongly looking forward to some of the monsters, especially the Chronotyryn.

The update booklet for fiend folio isn't nearly as comprehensive as the one for MM2. It basically just updates damage reductions.

[javcs]

I'm good with Fiend Folio.

[Efrate]

ELH is all -0 unless it has a fair bit of casting. The templates might be interesting but there are maybe 10 monsters that will get anything else iirc. If we do elh one post should be all the clear -0s, trimming the fat then hitting the exceptions.

[StevenC21]

I completely agree.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Fiend Folio is the one with the Wendigo template, right? That I am looking forward to; wendigos are awesome.

[Mike Miller]

FF is good with me. For what it is worth, ELH would NOT be quick. There are a lot of entries.

[ZamielVanWeber]

FF is 100% my vote, unsurprisingly. I think there will be a number of LAs beyond +1 in there.

[Blue Jay]

The update booklet for fiend folio isn't nearly as comprehensive as the one for MM2. It basically just updates damage reductions.

To be fair, the stuff the update booklet altered in MM2 is mostly stuff that historically hasn't had much impact on our ratings. It mostly just recalculates skill points and feats, updates damage reduction, and adds a Level Adjustment. But, even when it changes abilities in a more substantive way, it's mostly things like Blindsense instead of Blindsight, polymorph instead of Change Shape, or (Su) instead of (Sp). A handful of monsters got Wild Empathy added, and constructs get their bonus hit points, and things like that. Occasionally, a monster gets +8 Str or something, but only rarely.

So I kind of feel like the update booklet probably won't change many (if any) ratings.

-----

That said, I'm in favor of doing Fiend Folio next.

[Dalmosh]

Speaking as a lurker, I'd be stoked to see FF get the treatment.

I've been waiting for years to see what you folks settle on for the Cerebral Hood.

My current campaign has a Selkie PC too, which RAW has some quite odd traits for something apparently intended as playable.

[Lans]

Fiend Folio is a good choice

[Thurbane]

FF was released well after MM2, and, in theory, was more 3.5 friendly than MM2. It includes a "Full Attack" line, and has 3.5 skills such as Survival.

[JMS]

As a lurker, I support FF, throwing a vote to finish the SRD with the ELH, with all the stupid -0 stuff at once after, and then.... Minatures people, you have won me over.

[Inevitability]

Abrian

Demonic intelligent animal-people-hybrid monsters, which we get one paragraph of information on and no mention in any other WotC supplement ever again. Yeah, that sounds like the fiend folio.

Abrians are 2 HD medium-sized magical beasts. Their ability scores are a fairly bland +2 strength and constitution, +6 dexterity, and -4 intelligence, which sounds about right for something with that many HD. As one would expect, abrians have an excellent base land speed of 50 ft: equal to heavy horses. Their natural weapons are an unremarkable secondary 'kick' (1d8), and a weak primary beak whose excellent critical stats (3x crit, 19-20 range) are made quite pointless by its low base damage (1d3), with neither reliable enough to be a primary attack mode.

Fortunately, what little information we are given about abrians implies they have thumbs. Their arms are described as 'humanoid', they own standard treasure, the game tells us their weak arms impact their carrying capacity, and WotC apparently also considered them playable enough for a +1 level adjustment.

Finally, abrians have a notable Shriek ability. This hits all creatures (unfriendly!) within a 20 ft. range, dazing them for one round on a failed save. An at-will save-or-suck is pretty dang good, but not hitting allies with it may be hard. Still, it seems wise to err on the side of this being at least somewhat useful, if only on the first round of combat.

Considering all this, I think abrians would be fine at +0 LA. They have a reasonable chassis and an interesting special ability, in addition to everything you'd expect a normal PC to have (speech, thumbs). 2 magical beast RHD are a fine price to pay for all that.

However, adding a single HD bumps abrians up to Large size, which probably makes them worth +1 LA. DMs allowing HD-advanced PCs should keep this in mind.