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2019-12-18, 04:54 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.
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2019-12-18, 05:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2015
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Nice catch!
Agreed. I hope we get a bit of a “last farewell” here. To be honest, his death didn’t have quite the impact I’d expect for such a long-running character.
Incidentally, I think I’ve worked out some of why I feel that way. You know how The Giant said that for a character’s death to feel like a suitable culmination to their story, it has to flow from their own choices, traits and flaws? Well Wooster’s clearly did (telling Lucrezia that Albia was still his queen), but it doesn’t actually feel in character for him. Yes, he’s a patriot, but he’s also a spy—he’s no doubt lied before about his loyalty to Albia to preserve his life many times. Why not lie again then, when not doing so was obviously going to result in direct bodily harm? Yeah, there were other Brits there, but I’d think they’d understand the circumstances. It doesn’t feel like his sacrifice stalled Lucrezia any longer than his acquiescing would, so it feels like he died for nothing. It seems so foolish that I wonder if some condition of Albia’s mind control forced him to, and I shouldn’t be wondering that about the death of a character we’ve known almost as long as we’ve known Agatha was a Heterodyne.Last edited by NobleCuriosity; 2019-12-18 at 05:59 AM.
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2019-12-18, 06:06 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2009
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
I'd expect the opposite of a farewell. I'd expect a scene where we realise that he always was for Albia, and only helped Agatha as much as it helped Albia, and that he deliberately took dangerous steps to cause unnecessary war and effectively betrayed the whole of the main cast.
Some retrospective character development, if you will.Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
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2019-12-18, 06:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- Hudson Valley, NY
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Wooster was not acting as a spy at that moment; he was an officer leading loyal troops. His defiance lead to his men fighting on for their Queen and that stalled Lucrezia. He died bravely, as an officer and a gentleman. More importantly, he won a place in the heart of a beautiful woman. That alone made it a good death.
Last edited by Scarlet Knight; 2019-12-18 at 06:48 AM.
"We are the people our parents warned us about!" - J.Buffett
Avatar by Tannhaeuser
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2019-12-18, 08:00 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Ah, here we go, this is the reason this clank came up again.
The novelization of the second book spells this out much more clearly, whereSpoilerafter meeting Agatha at Strurmhalten, Wooster deliberately downplays the amount of interest Gil has in Agatha to try and drive a wedge between them. He does feel a little guilty about that, but it's in the interests of England.
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2019-12-18, 09:21 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.
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2019-12-18, 09:26 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Tinfoil Hat Theory
SpoilerWooster wasn't really loyal to Albia and is a either a double agent for The Other's people or part of the conspiracy against Albia. He may not even be really dead. As for why I think he's a traitor, the message in miniclank SHOULD have gone to Albia, at least the part about Lu being The Other. But instead it ended up among a bunch of sparks who were not loyal to Albia.Member of the Giants in the Playground Forum Chapter for the Movement to Reunite Gondwana!
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2019-12-18, 09:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2013
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- Pacific NW
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
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2019-12-18, 10:04 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
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- England. Ish.
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
This scene, for those who wish to risk getting stuck in an archive binge. Again. 1 2 3
SpoilerIt isn't unreasonable for the clank to have been intercepted by Albia's enemies. Likewise it could have been passed down to the Queen's Society for examination and analysis after passing throuigh Albia's hands, and the conspiracy picked it up then.
My understanding of Wooster is that his loyalty is first to Albia, but then to Agatha and Gil, in that order. He has shown a great deal of concern for Agatha over their time together, and is terrified of anything happening that "would make Gilgamesh Wulfenbach melt England". But he isn't just motivated by fear of Gil - he is actually concerned when they find out what the Baron has done to him as well.
As a result, he does all he can to balance these loyalties, and does so quite well. He eventually manages to fulfill his orders (get Agatha to England) without breaking loyalty to either Gil or Agatha. Indeed, when he starts his investigation he states to Agatha that he believes her to be innocent, but warns her that if he finds otherwise she will be handed over to Albia's Justice.Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-18, 10:13 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2007
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- Land of Stone and Stars
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Spoiler: Likely outcomes (in my opinion)
1) In an unguarded moment, Wooster reacts genuinely to Agatha's plea - making it clear just how sympathetic he is and just how his complex loyalties truly break. Under most circumstances, Gil will remember him fondly, as he enjoyed their little spy games even if he's wholly Albia's creature. A last caustic remark at Gil's expense will push him to react poorly for comedic purposes, but it will be a heart-warming scene overall.
2) Wooster uses the dingbot to record a message for Albia, and our last impression of the servant-spy is a reminder that he was always a professional who made the best of what he had in trying times.
3) Unaware the dingbot is recording, Wooster reacts in a way that spells out just the level of influence Albia has on him - probably in a horrific way, showing she's always got a sliver of her attention channeled through her agents. Albia's reaction to Agatha's recording makes it obvious that she's a clear and present danger to the Heterodyne and her entourage, and Gil and Tarvek are left gaping in horror at the implications it has for the them.Spoiler: My inventory:
1 Sentient Sword
1 Jammy Dodger (I was promised tea)
1 Godwin Point.
Originally Posted by Kairos Theodosian
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2019-12-18, 11:04 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
So this bot not only does videomail but also records reaction shots? Why has Apple not invented this already? It's so obvious.
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2019-12-18, 11:09 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Ok, that is something I hadn't considered, but still don't see that Albia knew about The Other.
SpoilerGil is more aware than anyone what kind of threat Albia is to him and the rest of the group. Remember Klaus was an ex-boyfriend and probably knows more about Albia and her powers than anyone other than her most trusted (controlled) servants. And maybe he picked up more info on Queens in general in this time in Skif. (Gil said "To go against Albia of England's merest whim is literally thinkable.")Member of the Giants in the Playground Forum Chapter for the Movement to Reunite Gondwana!
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2019-12-18, 11:25 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
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- England. Ish.
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Here - in panel 1 Albia refers to Agatha's possession by Lucrecia, despite it not being mentioned in the previous discussion (starting here).
It is possible that it was mentioned off-screen, of course, but we don't appear to have a scenic break where that could have happened. She could also have it from reports from Wooster.
EDIT: On re-reading that page, Albia also says: "We could most likley extract whatever your foolish parents placed there in a trice". Does that mean that Bill also left something in her head as well?Last edited by Manga Shoggoth; 2019-12-18 at 11:29 AM.
Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-18, 11:41 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2007
- Location
- Land of Stone and Stars
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
SpoilerYou are 100% correct, but there's knowing and there's seeing. Knowing that the Queen had influence over her people is one thing, but having it demonstrated in a visceral way would still be unsettling. Take Gil himself for example. We knew Klaus had done something to him, but that didn't make it any less of a wham line to hear him shout "my idiot son" in the middle of an anti-Agatha tirade, revealing that a piece of Klaus had a deciding vote in Gil's skull. That was still a game changer, even in spite of the forewarning we already had. It not only meant that Gil was completely compromised, it meant that Klaus not only could but would use Lucrezia's tactics to get his way, even if he was gentler about it in his own way.
But I don't just mean Albia's control over Wooster would be the revelation, but that Albia's reaction would be the clincher. Imagine Albia all but literally drooling over the idea of getting her hands on a piece of Lucrezia's mind, even if she had to kill Agatha to get it, or possibly seeing Agatha herself as "food" in some way. Right now Gil sees Albia as a powerful Spark and skilled statesman who has married the two traits together to ensure the fundamental loyalty of her people - she's dangerous, yes, but Gil has grown up around dangerous people. Heck, he's dangerous himself. But there's a very definite difference between a virtual demi-goddess who is willing to tolerate you as long as you behave and a virtual demi-goddess that has already ear-marked you as a sacrifice.Spoiler: My inventory:
1 Sentient Sword
1 Jammy Dodger (I was promised tea)
1 Godwin Point.
Originally Posted by Kairos Theodosian
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2019-12-18, 01:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2015
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2019-12-18, 01:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2005
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- Mountain View, CA
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Like 4X (aka Civilization-like) gaming? Know programming? Interested in game development? Take a look.
Avatar by Ceika.
Archives:
SpoilerSaberhagen's Twelve Swords, some homebrew artifacts for 3.5 (please comment)
Isstinen Tonche for ECL 74 playtesting.
Team Solars: Powergaming beyond your wildest imagining, without infinite loops or epic. Yes, the DM asked for it.
Arcane Swordsage: Making it actually work (homebrew)
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2019-12-18, 04:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- England. Ish.
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-20, 03:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2012
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
New comic.
Spoiler
Well, now we know why the final clank vanished.
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2019-12-20, 03:24 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
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- England. Ish.
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Now that was a game of Chinese Whispers!
Oh, and the "Do I really soind/Look like that?" comments are the icing on the cake.Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-20, 05:44 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
- Location
- Germany
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Huh. How did Skitter end up in the Girl Genius verse?
And why is she working for Albia?
Assuming female Nick Fury and Skitter with a dye-job are in fact working for her."If it lives it can be killed.
If it is dead it can be eaten."
Ronkong Coma "the way of the bookhunter" III Catacombium
(Walter Moers "Die Stadt der träumenden Bücher")
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2019-12-20, 07:44 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Well wrong about somethings but right about others. And here is the page that makes me think if Klaus had gotten the message he wouldn't have killed Agatha.
Member of the Giants in the Playground Forum Chapter for the Movement to Reunite Gondwana!
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2019-12-20, 09:30 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
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- England. Ish.
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
I agree that at that point in time he wouldn't have, and if this were still the case then yes, Gil and Tarvek are underestimating Klaus badly.
Unfortunately, not long after that we have this scene. After that, Klaus no longer has any doubt that Agatha is in some way Lucrezia, and also knows that she is trying to take control. Seeing the message (and given the comparison with the big one in Sturmhalten) he might have given Agatha the benefit of the doubt, but I wouldn't bet on it - he might think that it is just one more trick from Lucrezia.
The overlay in Gil's head, which has had time to see things from Gil's viewpoint, obviously feels slightly different, but still doesn't trust her.Last edited by Manga Shoggoth; 2019-12-20 at 09:31 AM.
Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-20, 10:07 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
The copy of Klaus in Gil's head actually did trust Agatha to an extent. He just didn't want Agatha around His Son. Klaus had HUGE problems with female sparks and tends to project that on every female spark along with Klaus caring very deeply for Gil and he doesn't want to see him hurt emotionally since Agatha is Lu's daughter.
Member of the Giants in the Playground Forum Chapter for the Movement to Reunite Gondwana!
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2019-12-20, 11:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2013
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- Pacific NW
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Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
The last person in that chain of wingbot-couriers is probably one Doctor Monahan, who originally appeared years ago in The Works card-game. She specializes in creating giant rats.
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2019-12-20, 12:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
I have got to remember this for the next time I have a McGuffin going through a chain of couriers.
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2019-12-21, 10:46 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
I'm really impressed. The clank was planted as a plot point years ago, but we finally got it back!
There's a spoof version of Robin Hood (from Alf Tales) where Maid Marion passes a message ("The archery contest is a trap!") to her handmaid who passes it to the smith who may have passed it to someone else. It gets more and more messed up till it makes no sense by the time it gets to Robin.
Robin: Bring me my English-Gibberish, Gibberish-English Dictionary!
(consults dictionary)
Robin: The archery contest is a trap!
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2019-12-22, 06:57 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- England. Ish.
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
It's going to be fun when they finally release the time freeze...
Thanks - I don't have the game, so this has saved me much comic searching. (Although I don't know if "saved" is the right word here...). Rats, eh? I wonder if Krosp will get involved?
(Got it on my Android tablet from Amazon a while back - at 60 pence it's OK even if the higher levels are unavailable)
EDIT: Well done Geoduck - confirmed in the very first frame of today's page. Well, except for the rats - but they are probably on the menu as well.
(From Krosp's point of view, at least... Will we get a shout-out for the game, I wonder...)Last edited by Manga Shoggoth; 2019-12-23 at 07:07 AM.
Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2019-12-23, 12:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
And confimed.
Nice to put a name to the mask.
Beats calling her Scurry*.
And it sounds like she might be somewhat important in the future.
But she was friends with Lu?
Yeah, gotta agree with Agatha there.
*That was the (nick)name for Taylor's rodent controlling clone, wasn't it?
Because Doctor Mohanan still reminds me of our Lady of Escalation."If it lives it can be killed.
If it is dead it can be eaten."
Ronkong Coma "the way of the bookhunter" III Catacombium
(Walter Moers "Die Stadt der träumenden Bücher")
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2019-12-23, 12:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Sounds like Miss Thorpe may be joining the party on a semi-permanent basis.
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2019-12-23, 02:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2013
- Location
- Pacific NW
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response