Conquest paladin / hexblade -> low, medium and high level considerations

[ApprenticeNO]

Hi,

I was hoping for some insight / feedback / thoughts on a character concept of mine.

We're a small group, 3 players + DM. The others are sorcerer and ranged rogue. We are currently level 1, but we all get a bonus feat at level 1. So I'm also looking at a character that feels good at all levels, especially in the mid ranges 8-12 which I imagine we will spend a fair deal of time in. Oh, and we do not use E(vil) in our alignment.

Stats:
Str 14 (or 13 depending on subrace or feat (if human))
Dex 10
Con 13 (or 14 depending on subrace or feat (if human))
Int 8
Wis 12
Cha 15

I don't want to play a half-elf (no disrespect, but yeah...) I've been looking at Aasimar (scourge and fallen), Tiefling (Levistus and Zariel). They all give +2 cha and either +1 con or +1 str. With the bonus feat, I can have Str 15, Con 14, Cha 18 at level 1, being able to use heavy armor which I imagine is better than medium armor and investing in Dex as well as keeping Str high enough to MC)

Races

Scourge
Assuming mid-ranges is the sweet spot, where our powers are really kicking in and where we will spend a good amount of time, compared to the lower levels at least), the idea of having a 2nd damage-dealing aura seems like a nice way to deal a decent amount of damage in combat, even more so when facing multiple opponents.

Fallen
Thematically very fitting the conquest paladin, playing on fear and everything, also the extra damage is never a bad thing. In a way similar to scourge, but the extra damage more focused on single target.

Levistus
Seems like a very solid choice. Resist to fire is never wrong, decent ranged cantrip and spells to improve my fighting (at least if I can see in the darkness....)

Zariel
Same as Levistus, the racial spells not as good or useful perhaps.

Human
2 feats at level 1... enough said I suppose. Can achive the same stats by getting the resilent (CON) as that extra 2nd feat or Heavy Armor Master. Both seems like good choices, Heavy Armor Master perhaps better early on? Vhuman not my first choice of race, even with that extra feat. But that's not written in stone, but in the long run I feel racials might triumph the extra feat


I'm personally leaning towards the Scourge mainly for the added AoE damage when facing multiple opponents, or even better, multiple weak opponents. At level 8, everything within 10' would take 4 (radiant) + 4 (psychic) damage if feared, right? Though Fallen are hands down thematically cooler with their racial ability. Tiefling seems to fit thematically as well, but the idea of burning everything around for an additional 8 points (no save) every round might be too much to pass up on :)

Level progression
Level 1 paladin (for heavy armor)
Level 2 warlock (Hexblade, to be able to use CHA with my one hander, extra spell slot and cantrips)
Level 3 to 9 paladin (Duelist style for added dmg with one hander, extra attack, paladin / conquest auras)

I know I postpond paladin abilities (extra attack, aura) by one level, but at the same time I get CHA to melee, as well as cantrips and extra spell slots. So feels like it's worth getting it early. Will make combat easier. Doesn't seem to be any merit taking warlock first, same saving throws, but no heavy armor. And I will find myself alone in the front often enough.

So then it boils down to, just how many warlock levels should I get. From what I gather, these are the consequences:

1 warlock level
- hexblade abilities
- cantrips
- 1 spell slot and 2 spells
- not losing out on any feats due MC (still paladin 19)

2 warlock levels
- hexblade abilities
- cantrips
- 2 spell slots and 3 spells
- invocations
- lose one feat due to MC (paladin max level 18)

4 warlock levels
- hexblade abilities
- cantrips
- 2 spell slots and 5 spells
- invocations
- lose paladin aura improvement
- not losing out on any feats due to MC (paladin 16, warlock 4)

5 warlock levels
- hexblade abilties
- cantrips
- 2 spell slots and 6 spells
- invocations (more and better ones)
- lose paladin aura improvement
- lose one feat due to MC (paladin 15, warlock 5)

So I suppose it comes down to
1) How important is the level 16 aura improvement aura
2) How important is that 6th feat

When I hit level 8, I will want to have 20 in Charisma.

So out of the 3 feats I have by hitting level 8 (paladin), 2 will be used to get 20 Charisma. That leaves one feat to play around with. After level 8, I will have 3 feats (or 2, depending on how many warlock levels I take?)

I should take warcaster or res (CON) I suppose? To bolster my con saving throw? I imagine warcaster being better since res (CON) doesn't increase my hit points and advantage on a saving throw with high modifers (from paladin) is better than a +proficiency modifier?

This is where it gets interesting I suppose...or difficult..

I'm not a big fan of Sentinel, which seems to require PAM..So that alone requires 2 feats. GWM is always a solid option, but that would require minimum of 4 levels in Warlock for that improved hexblade / pact of the weapon feature). I'm more than happy SnB with the fighting style (duelist) to get +2 dmg with my one hander.

Heavy Armor Master
While it's good, I feel it comes online a bit too late unless I start with it as a vhuman and took that instead of res (CON). At low levels it looks pretty insane though. And paired with Armor of Agathys (which Tiefling - Levistus also offer) there seems to be some synergi here making it last longer). Given I'm leaning away from sentinel, PAM and GWM, is this perhaps one of the really good feats to consider? And should I perhaps then consider it even as a level 1 paladin, leaving my Charisma at 16? Survivability would sky rocket, given I have LoH (paladin) and a potential second heal as an Aasimar.

Inspiring Leader
Seems like a good choice for a paladin, offering survivability every short and long rest. But worth it this early on? Very "party friendly" but they are ranged and doesn't want to even be hit in the first place, so if I do my job, they don't even get hit, which makes it pointless? Perhaps I'm a bit selfish, but a feat just to give myself some extra hit points when I have LoH and hex blade curse seems expensive?

Lucky
A potential life saver, but again..is it really worth it? DM rolls behind a screen, so the second part of Lucky is a bit more difficult to make use of.

Magic initiate and ritual caster
Increasing my spell casting ability, could add some flavor outside of combat which is also very important. Not sure what spells (cantrips, level 1 or rituals) that are worth a feat though?

Mounted combatant
This one I like, but I liked it even before I read what it does. As a paladin, I get two spells to summon my own steed. I *love* that and I think that has a lot of merit. In combat it can offer me advantage, it gives me mobility, and this feat seems to add an extra dimension to combat other than just fear, hit, heal.

Shield master
This feat offers both offensive and defensive abilities, offers survivability (as well as to my mount)

Warcaster / res (CON)
Is it necessary / required given we do get pretty good saving throws from our auras. How "concentration" based is the conquest paladin?

Any thoughts or insights on this?

My initial thoughts
Level 18/2 - Scourge.

Level progression:
Paladin 1 (+2 CHA)
Warlock 1 (hexblade)
Paladin 2 (duelist)
Paladin 3 (conquerer)
Paladin 4 (+2 CHA)
Paladin 5
Paladin 6
Paladin 7
Paladin 8 (warcaster)

From here on out, I'm not sure how to best progress. It comes to how many warlock levels I should take and at what point I should take them.

With 2 feats, I must admit mountaint combatant and shield master looks the most interesting to me. Should I have a 3rd (level 1 warlock or 4 warlock?) I suppose inspiring leader or perhaps even adding more magic abilities through magic initiate or ritual caster could be rewarding.

If I were to play a vhuman instead, I suppose I would take Heavy Armor Mastery at level 1, as well as +2 CHA). It would greatly improve my survivability, but at level 8+ does this feat still feel as rewarding and worth not having the racials (nightvision, resists, spells or aoe effects)

[Nhorianscum]

Query: Do you use magic items at your table?

Yes: Great. CQ already gives everything you want from Hexblade without MC. Cha SAD is useless here.

No: The MC for Cha sad mele isn't significant until after cha is maxed and fear takes priority. In the 4+9 range an extra +1/+1 with a one handed mele stick is not significant. After this we can delay IDS for a level as hexcurse is reasonably comparable.

As for racial choice my only input is that scourge can kill your concentration before your con save breaks +10.

[Quoz]

I would take a strong look at Yuan-ti for race. I played a straight Conquest paladin with one and the advantage to all saves vs magic (not just spells) is just ridiculous on a paladin that maxes out Charisma. It's not perfect stats, but outright immunity to poison is also quite useful when you eventually get cloudkill on your spell list 😉.

For feats, I would look at shield master. You likely won't be making the shove attack too often, but the boost to Dex saves and pseudo-evasion is really good. Combined with resilient Con it gives you amazing scores in all 3 of the common saves.

If it is allowed at your table and you can get a kind ruling from your GM, the Abberant Dragonmark feat from Ebberon served me very well. +1 Con, 2 cantrips and a 1st level spell from the sorcerer list, and an ability to upcast by burning a hit die. If your GM allows the upcast to apply to any spell (what counts as an 'aberrant spell' is never really defined), you get some solid spells to cast at higher levels. Aid and Armor of Agathys will be particularly useful.

[ApprenticeNO]

I suppose I should have written that as well. We go by the "normal races" that is the ones in PHB, but Aasima is alloweed and subraces of said races. Yeah, magical items is "on the table" so to speak.

Does that mean that even though I don't dip into warlock (early?) I still don't train STR above 15 but rely on items to provide me with 19+ in Strength? I doubt I will see a belt of giant strength anytime soon, but I suppose gloves might be reasonable to hope for. But since we can't craft them with downtime, magical items are basically "loot". So it's a somewhat unreliable source in that regards.

I did not consider the fact that Scourge also damages me...and yeah, DC 10 every round might be a silly thing to have to deal with. Good point! :)

So you would rather just go solo class paladin then? Potentially pick up hexblade way later?

[Aimeryan]

Yeah, the gloves are only uncommon - easily came across in loot. Many DMs offer merely uncommon items to be bought in cities, or be questable with some information gathering. In Adventure League games (which are considered *strict*) these are easily bought. You can expect them by level 5 or so.

Due to this, the Hexblade dip is not too useful for Cha-SAD, especially since you already need 13 Strength to MC (15 if you don't want to be slowed down in heavy armour, although a mount can solve that). Multiclassing up to at least 5 in Hexblade has the possibility of double-Smiting on a crit (Eldritch Smite, which uses only Warlock slots) - this can be great for nova'ing, but is better for a Half-Elf Vengeance Paladin since it is unreliable otherwise. Taking Hexblade simply for the Agonising Eldritch Blast option is possible for good ranged damage when needed, however, there are many ways to not need good ranged damage - fly (via magic, boots, mount), teleport, leave that enemy to someone else, simply taking full cover until the enemy comes to you, etc.

If you are happy to multiclass then I would recommend the Sorcadin, usually with breakpoints at 2, 6, or 11/12 for the Paladin side. The advantage of the Sorcerer component is Sorcerer spell list (Shield, Absorb Elements, Haste, Greater Invisibility, Shadow Blade, etc.), more spell slots for Smiting, and the advantage of Metamagic on a gish (which is ironically much better than it is for a pure Sorcerer, in my opinion) - Twin buffs, Quicken Booming Blade, etc. Also the subclass can be quite useful, with Divine Soul for Healing Word, Spiritual Weapon (Conquest already gets this, of course), and Spiritual Guardians being my preference.

Note: In respect to your party specifically, Mobile would be a great feat when combined with Booming Blade (whether Action or Quickened) - most enemies will have no choice but to move afterwards since there are no other melee targets. Combine this with Spiritual Guardians and the enemy may not even be able to reach you.

[Nhorianscum]

I suppose I should have written that as well. We go by the "normal races" that is the ones in PHB, but Aasima is alloweed and subraces of said races. Yeah, magical items is "on the table" so to speak.

Does that mean that even though I don't dip into warlock (early?) I still don't train STR above 15 but rely on items to provide me with 19+ in Strength? I doubt I will see a belt of giant strength anytime soon, but I suppose gloves might be reasonable to hope for. But since we can't craft them with downtime, magical items are basically "loot". So it's a somewhat unreliable source in that regards.

I did not consider the fact that Scourge also damages me...and yeah, DC 10 every round might be a silly thing to have to deal with. Good point! :)

So you would rather just go solo class paladin then? Potentially pick up hexblade way later?

Starting 16 str/16 con/16 cha should be doable for any race with a feat at first. Why would we dump str to 15?

Past that yeah. Setting yourself back a level of progression for... +1/+1... at cl5.... +2/+2 at cl9?

While locking into one handers?

Ew. If you wanna bash with cha cast spiritual weapon. It's on your list .

Take din to 7 and then once you're comfortable with the class and sub make your own choice at 8+. Be it full pally, padlock, bardadin, sorcadin, or whatever, really.

[Sception]

Are those stats rolled, or point buy? If point buy, you should consider some changes. Conqueror is a tanking subclass. As such, AC is a high priority. light armor isnt really a good option due to paladin multiclassing requirement and conquest cha focus. If you plan to wear medium armor, you really need that 14 dex. If you're wearing heavy armor, you need 15 strength at least.

Every conquest pally level has something good for the build.extremely important levels are 5 (second attack), 6 (aura of protection), 7 (aura of conquest), and 9 (Fear). You do not want to delay these levels any more than absolutely necessary. First level hexblade becomes abdolutely necessary when you need to take it early to establish your multiclass narratively or when your cha mod is ever 2 points higher than your weapon attack stat. Later hexblade levels can wait.

Re: concentration. [bold]Conquest Paladin is extremely concentration based.[/bold]. Aura of conquest is the build defining feature. It only works on frightened enemies, and two of your three best frightening effects (wrathful smite, conquering presence, and especially fear) are concentration based. All three of these abilities allow saving throws, so maxing your cha save is top priority, but shoring up your concentration saves is also critical.

Additionally, as a hexadin, you have a heavy motivation to grab warcaster. You'll need it to cast the Shield spell while wielding a sword & shield, it also lets you use booming blade as an opportunity attack, which helps when tanking fearless foes. that on top of advantage on concentration saves makes it too much to pass up.

All together, you'll definitely want warcaster as your bonus feat. Unfortunately, warcaster requires you to be able to cast a spell, and first level paladin can't. Therefore, you'll need to pick a race with built in spellcasting ability. Fortunately, both aasimar and tiefling variants qualify, thanks to the cantrips they come with.


I'm going to make the following assumptuons:

1) point buy
2) early multiclass for narrative/thematic reasons
3) Spellcasting race for 1st level warcaster.

Based on that, I'd recommend the following post-racial stat array.

Str 15
Dex 10
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 10
Cha 16

You could get the con higher by dumping one or more of dex, int, & wis to 8, which could be stronger mechanically, especially if you pick a +con race like scourge aasimar ti get your von to 16, but I don't like negative stat mods myself.

The above starting stats are possible with any of the following races: Fallen Aasimar, Scourge Aasimar, Zariel Tiefling, Stygia Tiefling. Of those, fallen aasimar is the best fit mechanically by far, but might be a bit tough to square with your non-evil campaign. If not going fallen aasimar, scourge is the next best, but either of the listed tieflings works great, too.

for level progression:

1st level paladin 1 for heavy armor proficiency.

2nd level hexblade 1 for Hex warrior, Booming Blade, Shield, & to establish the multiclass.

3rd-10th levels paladin 2-9 for wrathful smite & defence style, conquering presance, +2 cha, extra attack, aura of protection, aura of conquest, +2 cha, and Fear, respectively.

That gets you to level 10 with max cha, Enough strength to wear plate armor, +7 concentration with advantage, Oath of Conquest, Fear, hex warrior, hexblade's curse, booming blade opp attacks. It's a very solid package.

From there, you can keep going conquest for the rest of your levels as it never stops getting relevant abilities, from improved divine smite to greater find steed to cleansing touch to increased aura radius.

Alternatively, you could go back to hexblade & stay there, with invocations, boon (blade is good, but on a tank I prefer chain for gift of the ever living ones), maneuverability spells, eventual ability to cast Fear with short rest slots, etc.

You could also start levelling Celestial Sorcerer (healing word, heightened Fear, eventual Spirit Guardians) or Sword Bard (bardic inspiration, healing word, blade flourish).

After Conqueror 9 / Hexblade 1, it's really up to you on prefrence & style. Any combination of levels from paladin, warlock, sorcerer, or bard are fine to finish out. As for your remaining feats, inspiring leader, resilient con, sentinel, and/or alert are all ideal choices.

[ApprenticeNO]

I appreciate the feedback and insight. The stats were point but and with racial modifiers I would get 15 str (for heavy armor) 14 con and 16 charisma. I have a bonus feat, which I suppose could be warcaster instead of +2 cha. But then I would only have a +3 modifier in combat. I have read some say it's not worth dipping into warlock. I get that if you get an item with more than 20 str but there the other good stuff that comes with it. Why I figured warlock was good choice but an early dip made more sense. I understand conquest is primarily a tank / control paladin, but party wise we rely on everybody to dish out some dmg. I know other paladins, like vengeance so that better, but the concept of the conquest was so intriguing.

[Nhorianscum]

I appreciate the feedback and insight. The stats were point but and with racial modifiers I would get 15 str (for heavy armor) 14 con and 16 charisma. I have a bonus feat, which I suppose could be warcaster instead of +2 cha. But then I would only have a +3 modifier in combat. I have read some say it's not worth dipping into warlock. I get that if you get an item with more than 20 str but there the other good stuff that comes with it. Why I figured warlock was good choice but an early dip made more sense. I understand conquest is primarily a tank / control paladin, but party wise we rely on everybody to dish out some dmg. I know other paladins, like vengeance so that better, but the concept of the conquest was so intriguing.

Hexblade adds prof+ 3%ish output with hexcurse up.

Conquest does great damage out the box when we're novaing. It is still a paladin afterall.

HAM gives +1 str and unlike warcaster, you can actually take this feat at first level.

[djreynolds]

Are you grabbing improved divine smite at 11th level paladin, or life-drinker at 12th warlock?

These are just to consider.

[ApprenticeNO]

I must admit I haven't considered either. I just assumed one would take just 1 (or 2) levels in warlock to get most of the Pattison goodies, but I suppose once I hit lvl 8 paladin I have the key abilities from the conquest path. At that point warlock perhaps have more to offer? There are goodies in higher paladin levels but warlock or other classes might overshadow these somewhat?

[djreynolds]

I must admit I haven't considered either. I just assumed one would take just 1 (or 2) levels in warlock to get most of the Pattison goodies, but I suppose once I hit lvl 8 paladin I have the key abilities from the conquest path. At that point warlock perhaps have more to offer? There are goodies in higher paladin levels but warlock or other classes might overshadow these somewhat?

Improved smite and life drinker are very similar as they affect all of your attacks, just difference is radiant vs necrotic damage.

The thing is when do you want to enjoy using it by? By what "character" level, since you are multiclassing?

[Nhorianscum]

Improved smite and life drinker are very similar as they affect all of your attacks, just difference is radiant vs necrotic damage.

The thing is when do you want to enjoy using it by? By what "character" level, since you are multiclassing?

IDS exists for more than 1 level though.

[Mongobear]

I literally just made this character 2 weeks ago for a one shot, and it made me want to play one for a real campaign.

I went Fallen Aasimar, but I'll add my $.02 on other options.

Stats:
Str 14 (or 13 depending on subrace or feat (if human))
Dex 10
Con 13 (or 14 depending on subrace or feat (if human))
Int 8
Wis 12
Cha 15

I don't want to play a half-elf (no disrespect, but yeah...) I've been looking at Aasimar (scourge and fallen), Tiefling (Levistus and Zariel). They all give +2 cha and either +1 con or +1 str. With the bonus feat, I can have Str 15, Con 14, Cha 18 at level 1, being able to use heavy armor which I imagine is better than medium armor and investing in Dex as well as keeping Str high enough to MC)

Dragonborn (+2 Str, +1 Cha) and take the racial feat for the Fear effect instead of a Breath Weapon in XGtE.

Here's the thing about a Paladin + Hexblade MC, it's very stat dependant. If you're using standard Point Buy, it takes forever to max a single stat, let alone meet requirements for MCing and Heavy Armor.

I actually ended up abandoning the SAD Charisma build, because my table rolls stats, and I rolled pretty godlike (lowest stat was a 12, had two 17s before Racial/ASI mods.)

The other issue, is that Conquest is entirely dependant on its level 7 feature, every level you take outside of Paladin before that level delays that aura. Our one shot began at 9th level, and I rolled in at 7 P/2 W, solely for Invocations like Devil's Sight/AgBlast, and the spell slots for Smites. I actually considered Fiend instead since the only benefit from HB was the 1/Long Rest curse.

Hi,B]Races[/B]

Scourge
Fallen
Levistus
Zariel
Human

I'm personally leaning towards the Scourge...

I already mentioned Dragonborn, which in retrospect would've been a better option for me since I rolled really good stats, and didn't need many ASIs.

Fallen is good, and their Fear is built in, but it only lasts 1 round, you want longer effects to lock down entire rooms.

Scourge/Tiefling variants--Not as good as Fallen or Dragonborn, imo, but if you want one of these for flavor, go for it.

Human--Because of the free feat houserule, i would almost suggest standard human if you're dead-set on the SAD Charisma build. The +1 to everything really helps meets stat requirements.

If you weren't against Half-Elf, I'd suggest them purely for power, they're far and away the best option for meeting stat requirements.

Honorable Mention--Any of the Charisma boosting Elves. (Drow, Eladrin, Shadar-Kai, Half-Elf). Why? Elven Accuracy.

Level progression
Level 1 paladin (for heavy armor)
Level 2 warlock (Hexblade, to be able to use CHA with my one hander, extra spell slot and cantrips)
Level 3 to 9 paladin (Duelist style for added dmg with one hander, extra attack, paladin / conquest auras)

So I suppose it comes down to
1) How important is the level 16 aura improvement aura
2) How important is that 6th feat

When I hit level 8, I will want to have 20 in Charisma.

+Feat comparisons

If playing from level 1, don't go deeper than Warlock 1 until you have Paladin 7, Conquest revolves around the level 7 aura. Afterwards, decide based on the rest of your build.

If you're GWM or PAM, you will want Warlock 3, for Heavy two-handers, although a Spear+Shield PAM build might be good too. If going PAM, you'll want Paladin 12 for IDS, otherwise you can stop at 8 for the ASI.

I wouldn't focus on personal damage, you have Smites, and your party for that. Conquest is more of a Lockdown tank. You want to be in the middle of things and get stuff stuck on you.

Also, Hexblade is sort of mediocre past the initial dip. The Spectre ability is not worth using at the level you'd get it, and you won't get Armor of Hexes until atleast 17+, and you'll never get the capstone.

I'd recommend 18 P/2 W, assuming the full 20 levels, or 19/1 if you need the last Feat, as Invocations might not really matter.

As for various Feats:

GWM is amazing if you build for it, but you're more of a Tank than a damage dealer.

PAM is slightly better, because easier OAs, and trolling frightened things outside their Reach. Also, synergy with IDS and HB Curse.

Sentinel not worth it unless you also go PAM which requires 3+ Warlock.

Heavy Armor Master is ok early on, but 3 damage isn't a lot by the 10+ level range. Iirc, it gives a stat point, so it's ok if you had an odd score you need to bump up

Shield Master--Assuming you build to he a tank (you should be), this Feat is amazing. I took it on my own character, and shoving prone stuff that's Feared is hilarious since they can't stand up inside your Aura.

Lucky, Resilient, Tough, War Caster--All have their merits, but are either situational or replaceable by class features. With your +Cha to saves aura, concentration won't matter much, most of your spells with be via Paladin, which can use your Shield holy symbol.

Hopefully this helps. Also if you haven't seen it yet, someone here wrote a guide on Conquest, iirc it's called 'Wall of Fear' I would look it up if you want more/better advice.

[Keravath]

If you want to be self-sufficient I would tend to go ..

Variant Human - resilient con + Shield Master or PAM (use a shield and spear - spear is compatible with hexblade and PAM).
1- paladin
2 - warlock (hexblade)
3-7 paladin (for aura)
8 - warlock - take devils' sight and agonizing blast

Strength 15 is needed for heavy armor and if you want to use something other than the hexblade weapon.

Agonizing blast gives you an excellent ranged attack option - if you find yourself needing it you can take the second warlock level earlier.

GWM requires hexblade 3 blade pact and pact weapon to work with charisma.

Lucky is not a worthwhile feat compared to the other options. I've only seen it taken on a regular basis by high level characters with nothing better to take. It might save you on a re-roll but no guarantees and in practice I've seen it fail a lot.

[Mongobear]

*snip*

Lucky is not a worthwhile feat compared to the other options. I've only seen it taken on a regular basis by high level characters with nothing better to take. It might save you on a re-roll but no guarantees and in practice I've seen it fail a lot.

It's useful for turning Disadvantaged saves into Mega-Advantage, otherwise, you're spot on about it being a 'well I don't need anything else!' Feat.

[Spiritchaser]

I’m going to dogpile on the warcaster thing here. With the possible exception of Dex sorcadin shadow blade builds, I think all sword and board paladin hybrids do very well to get warcaster quite early. I think you COULD wait until 5 though if you took hexblade at level 2... which could open up some race options

[Mongobear]

I’m going to dogpile on the warcaster thing here. With the possible exception of Dex sorcadin shadow blade builds, I think all sword and board paladin hybrids do very well to get warcaster quite early. I think you COULD wait until 5 though if you took hexblade at level 2... which could open up some race options

As far as War Caster, it's useful if you grab Booming Blade to help in the lockdown tactics. Otherwise, I've never really seen much use for the Warlock spells, since Conquest gives AoAgathys anyways.

I always played mine burning slots on Divine Smite, Wrathful Smite, Cause Fear, and Fear. Never much use for anything else.

EDIT--On the topic of Sorcadin, I actually think Sorc is a better MC option than Warlock. More spells, higher level slots, and metamagic for Heightwn to make sure a Fear effect sticks on a priority target.

For a level 20 build, I could see something like 12 P/4 W/ 4 S being quite strong for a GWM or PAM build, or 8 P/4 W/8 S for anything else.

Also, if you're worried about Concentration, starting off as S1 for Con saves, then W1 for Charisma SAD, then P7 for Conquest aura would be pretty amazing, although surviving the early levels, and losing Heavy armor could be an issue, perhaps a Dex build with Draconic Sorc AC, or pick up W2 for at will Mage Armor, but that pushes Conquest 7 back significantly.

[KingWhipsy]

As far as War Caster, it's useful if you grab Booming Blade to help in the lockdown tactics. Otherwise, I've never really seen much use for the Warlock spells, since Conquest gives AoAgathys anyways.

Can't this just be bypassed by grabbing a Ruby of the Warmage and slapping it on your weapon as well? Casting your warlock spells that is.

[Sception]

The biggest spell grabs for a conqueror from a 1- 2 level hexblade dip, and their relation to warcaster, are:

1) eldtritch blast, as a backup ranged option. Needs warcaster to cast with sword & shield out, but if you were in melee range you'd be making melee attacks, do it isn't that big a deal. No material component, so ruby of the warmage doesn't help you.

2) booming blade, as a backup tanking option to discourage fearless enemies from walking away from you. Can cast it without warcaster or ruby of the warmage just fine, but it's much more effective when you can cast it as an opportunity attack, which requires warcaster.

3) shield, to block hits that make it through your other defences once your targets are locked down. Requires warcastee to cast with sword & shield drawn, which is a big deal. No material component, so ruby of the warmage doesn't help.


If you go for a three level dip, then the next most important spell is misty step. That has neither material nor somatic components, just verbal (i imagibe the verbal component is 'Hi!' or 'Bye!' depending on whether you're teleporting into or out of melee), so neither warcaster nor the ruby are relevant.


Thre are a few other decent spell options from warlock, some of which benefit ftom warcaster while others benefit from the ruby. Ideally your character would like both, but the biggest spell grabs in the first few levels gain a lot from warcaster and very little from the ruby.

[Bobthewizard]

Fallen Aasimer's Necrotic Shroud combines amazingly with Conquest's Aura of Conquest. Necrotic Shroud causes fear to all within 10', then the Aura of Conquest freezes them and causes damage every round. You want your CHA to be 20 by then.

You can keep strength at 13 on this build if you want. You can still wear Plate armor you just have a movement penalty if your strength is below 15. If you can do that to increase CON or CHA I would. Level 1 will be worse but after that you'll be fine.

After you get the Aura of Conquest, you could consider Divine Soul Sorcerer for more spell slots for smite and Spirit Guardians. This would push back getting the Fear spell but might be better in the long run.

[KingWhipsy]

3) shield, to block hits that make it through your other defences once your targets are locked down. Requires warcastee to cast with sword & shield drawn, which is a big deal. No material component, so ruby of the warmage doesn't help.

Thre are a few other decent spell options from warlock, some of which benefit ftom warcaster while others benefit from the ruby. Ideally your character would like both, but the biggest spell grabs in the first few levels gain a lot from warcaster and very little from the ruby.

Thanks for this insight! I'm currently working on a character very similar for an upcoming campaign and rolled pretty well. I'm planning on starting oath of conquest 3/hexblade 1 and my stats look as such (STR 15, DEX 14, CON 18, INT 11, WIS 12, CHA 18). I was planning on starting with a ruby of the warmage to have access to shield while sword and boarding but it looks like I'll have to pickup warcaster next level for that plan. What spells from warlock would you recommend? I had shield and cause fear as it seemed a good way to grab another fear spell. Would you take something else instead? I grabbed EB and booming blade as my cantrips as well. How would you recommend I move forward? I'm planning on sticking to paladin until paladin 8 at least so will have 2 ASIs to work with. One will probably be getting charisma to 20. The other could be used for any feat really tho I feel like warcaster is probably the frontrunner.

[Sception]

Those are some very high end stats. Rolled stat game, then? In any event, yeah, with that build you'll want to pick up warcaster next level, and with those stats you've definitely got the slack to do so.

As for warlock spell selection, the default choices for a 1st level dip are booming blade, eldritch blast, shield, and cause fear. You can deviate from that depending on restrictions (core+1 means no booming blade), or if you don't plan on picking up warcaster at all (in which case definitely swap out shield and maybe swap out booming blade), or if you just have a personal thematic reason to grab something else. But from a conqueror's perspective, those are the best spells you can grab from a single level of warlock. Cause Fear in particular, however, you should think of as a second level spell. When targeting a single enemy, wrathful smite is almost always the better way to inflict frighten as it's much harder to escape if the target fails the initial saving throw. This is because cause fear allows passive saving throws each round to escape, while wrathful smite allows wisdom *checks* instead. In addition to checks often being weaker than saves, due to the frighten condition itself checks are made at disadvantage. Furthermore, the target needs to spend their action to even attempt the wisdom check.

Now, if the target does pass the check, they'll escape from your aura during their turn, allowing them to walk away immediately, where a target passing a follow up save to escape cause fear has already ended their turn, giving you a turn to get them back under control. Additionally, cause fear can be done at a slightly longer range (though you need to get close to impose your aura anyway), takes only a standard action to cast instead of both a minor and a standard action as in the case with wrathful smite, and only requires the target to fail a save to take effect where as wrathful smite requires you hit hit first before the target even has to attempt an initial save. Still though, all in all wrathful smite is still your go-to frighten causer against single targets, and you get it from your paladin half.

Where cause fear finds its place is when upcast as a second level spell, letting you target two enemies. Aura of Conquest can grab as many frightened enemies as you can get in range, so multi-target frighteners are great. Granted, a level two cause fear isn't anywhere near as good as your channel divinity (big & party friendly aoe, no concentration) or the 3rd level spell Fear (ok aoe, no way for the enemy to break the effect after the initial failed save as long as you keep them trapped in your aura), but sometimes you just need to tag two enemies and either your CD and 3rd level slots aren't worth using or are already spent.


It's still probably not going to be your most common use of second level spells - aid, spiritual weapon, upcast bless, and even plain old non-upcast shield & wrathful smite are probably going to be more common uses of those slots, but it's a nice option to have, is extremely on theme, and is ime more likely to see use than other alternatives from the warlock list. Though there are certainly other decent spells to choose from if you wanted to try something else.


EDIT: probably also worth mentioning, since cause fear is verbal only, it can be cast just fine without warcaster or the ruby, and thus is a nice grab for a conqueror who needs to delay warcaster a bit. Due to your high starting stats you shouldn't have to worry about that, though. It's utility as a dual target frightener with second level slots is also worth considering for conquerors who want to stretch the warlock dip out to 3-4 levels, as a pair of dual target frightens on a short rest recharge is pretty decent. At the same time though, just a level or two more gets you short rest Fear, so it's a pretty niche conqueror build that takes more than two levels of warlock but less than five.

[KingWhipsy]

Those are some very high end stats. Rolled stat game, then? In any event, yeah, with that build you'll want to pick up warcaster next level, and with those stats you've definitely got the slack to do so.

As for warlock spell selection, the default choices for a 1st level dip are booming blade, eldritch blast, shield, and cause fear. You can deviate from that depending on restrictions (core+1 means no booming blade), or if you don't plan on picking up warcaster at all (in which case definitely swap out shield and maybe swap out booming blade), or if you just have a personal thematic reason to grab something else. But from a conqueror's perspective, those are the best spells you can grab from a single level of warlock. Cause Fear in particular, however, you should think of as a second level spell. When targeting a single enemy, wrathful smite is almost always the better way to inflict frighten as it's much harder to escape if the target fails the initial saving throw. This is because cause fear allows passive saving throws each round to escape, while wrathful smite allows wisdom *checks* instead. In addition to checks often being weaker than saves, due to the frighten condition itself checks are made at disadvantage. Furthermore, the target needs to spend their action to even attempt the wisdom check.

Now, if the target does pass the check, they'll escape from your aura during their turn, allowing them to walk away immediately, where a target passing a follow up save to escape cause fear has already ended their turn, giving you a turn to get them back under control. Additionally, cause fear can be done at a slightly longer range (though you need to get close to impose your aura anyway), takes only a standard action to cast instead of both a minor and a standard action as in the case with wrathful smite, and only requires the target to fail a save to take effect where as wrathful smite requires you hit hit first before the target even has to attempt an initial save. Still though, all in all wrathful smite is still your go-to frighten causer against single targets, and you get it from your paladin half.

Where cause fear finds its place is when upcast as a second level spell, letting you target two enemies. Aura of Conquest can grab as many frightened enemies as you can get in range, so multi-target frighteners are great. Granted, a level two cause fear isn't anywhere near as good as your channel divinity (big & party friendly aoe, no concentration) or the 3rd level spell Fear (ok aoe, no way for the enemy to break the effect after the initial failed save as long as you keep them trapped in your aura), but sometimes you just need to tag two enemies and either your CD and 3rd level slots aren't worth using or are already spent.


It's still probably not going to be your most common use of second level spells - aid, spiritual weapon, upcast bless, and even plain old non-upcast shield & wrathful smite are probably going to be more common uses of those slots, but it's a nice option to have, is extremely on theme, and is ime more likely to see use than other alternatives from the warlock list. Though there are certainly other decent spells to choose from if you wanted to try something else.


EDIT: probably also worth mentioning, since cause fear is verbal only, it can be cast just fine without warcaster or the ruby, and thus is a nice grab for a conqueror who needs to delay warcaster a bit. Due to your high starting stats you shouldn't have to worry about that, though. It's utility as a dual target frightener with second level slots is also worth considering for conquerors who want to stretch the warlock dip out to 3-4 levels, as a pair of dual target frightens on a short rest recharge is pretty decent. At the same time though, just a level or two more gets you short rest Fear, so it's a pretty niche conqueror build that takes more than two levels of warlock but less than five.

Yeah, rolled game for sure. And thanks for the help, looks like my min/max game is on point for the build. Do you even think it's worth investing in a ruby of the warmage if i'm grabbing warcaster with my next level? It'd likely be 50-100g of my 255g total.

[Sception]

Ruby of the warcaster honestly isn't terribly worth picking up for most conquerors who dip hexblade. Single level dip, as mentioned, generally grabs booming blade, eldritch blast, cause fear, and shield, none of which benefit. If you take warlock to second level spells the biggest grab is misty step which again doesn't benefit. Any and all third level spell slots might as well just come with FEAR stamped on them. If you have Fear from paladin levels then you can just cast it as a paladin spell using your shield to handle the somatic & material costs, but if your build takes 8 or less levels of paladin then you'll definitely want that ruby on your weapon by the time you get Fear from your warlock side. These generally function as more typical paladin/warlock multiclass builds with the conqueror's fear based lock down gimmick as a secondary focus. In the late game there's really something to be said for a Conqueror 7 / Hexblade 5 / Divine Sorcerer 8 build, with two Fears per short rest and sorcery points to heighten a few of those per day. Unfortunately, the delayed access to Fear (earliest level 12 vs. 9 for a single classed or late-multiclassing conqueror) and slower ASI progression makes the middle levels rather hasslesome in exchange for late progression benefits that most campaigns never see, and that run into trouble with the more frequent immunity to frighten at those levels. Conqueror 9/Hexblade 5/Sorcerer 6, while imo a bit weaker in the late game, makes for a smoother progression.

That said, plain old Conqueror 20 or Conqueror 18-19/Hexblade 1-2 are still my personal favorite Conqueror builds. They're simpler & more elegant, and I personally don't like to pass on Improved Divine Smite, Improved Find Steed, and Improved Paladin Auras in particular.