Stats for the Stats God! The Deities of OOTS

[Tzardok]

This thread aims to collect or at least guess those traits of the deities in OOTS that are needed to take them as a cleric's deity. It is meant to be a companion to the Class and Level Geekery thread, even though it probably can't reach their rigorous exactness. Still, participation is welcome. If there is anything I missed, anything that can proove or disproove one of my guesses or anything else, don't hesitate to post.

Edit: This is a curated thread.

Northern Gods

Thor, God of Storms
Alignment: Good (to grant the Good domain), probably Chaotic (based on his general behavior (knocking up fertility goddesses, playing drunken darts with lightning, breaking the rules how a spell is supposed to work, and so on)).
Clerical alignments: takes lawful clerics (at least amongst dwarves)
Known granted domains: Good, unnamed homebrew domain (grants access to Thor's Lightning, Call Lightning and Control Winds)
Possible other domains granted: Chaos (if Chaotic), Strength
Favoured Weapon: Battle hammer (not explicitely stated, but he wields a hammer in most of his appearances, those of his clerics who walk around armed wield one, and his hidden artifact is battle hammer).

Loki, God of Fire
Alignment: Chaotic Evil (is listed amongst the evil gods in SoD)
Known granted domains: Chaos, Evil, Fire
Possible other domains granted: Trickery
Favoured Weapon: Unknown, probably Longsword
Special: grants Turn Undead

Odin, God of Magic, Head of the Pantheon
Alignment: Unknown
Domains: Unknown, possibly Knowledge, Magic
Favoured Weapon: Probably spear (Odin's highpriest wields one)

Hel, Goddess of Death
Alignment: Evil
Domains: Evil, probably Death

Surtur, Lord of Fire Giants
Alignment: Evil (based on behaviour), probably Lawful (if he reflects the most common alignment of fire giants)

Thrym, Lord of Frost Giants
Alignment: Unknown, probably Chaotic Evil (if he reflects the most common alignment of frost giants)
Known domains granted: One of Cold, Water and Winter

Dvalin, First King of the Dwarves
Alignment: Lawful (based on his strict adherence to his oath)

Fenrir, God of Monsters
Alignment: Evil (based on his love for murder)

Other Northern Gods
Sif, Goddess of the Earth; Tyr, God of War; Balder, God of Beauty; Heimdall, God of the Watch; Freya, Goddess of Fertility; Freyr, God of Prosperity; Sunna, Goddess of the Sun; Frigg, Goddess of Wisdom; Njord, God of the Sea; Mani, God of the Moon; Skadi, Goddess off the Hunt; Hoder, God of Winter; Vafthrudnir, God of Secrets; Sigrun, Queen of Valkyries; Bragi, Demigod of Poetry; Iounn, Demigoddess of Youth; Hermod, Demigod of Messengers

Southern Gods

The Twelve Gods (Pantheon)
Members: Dragon (Head of the Pantheon), Snake, Horse, Goat, Monkey, Rooster, Dog, Pig, Rat, Ox, Tiger, Hare
Alignment: True Neutral
Clerical Alignment: Any; cleric treats own alignment as if it were theirs for purposes of wether he falls from grace
Known granted domain: Law
Possible other domains granted: Animal, Chaos, Evil, Good, possibly all in the PHB
Favoured Weapon: Unknown, possibly any

Western Gods
Nergal, God of Death
Alignment: Most likely one of Lawful evil or Neutral Evil (has a lawful evil highpriest and an unholy will, has also been called evil)
Known granted domains: Death, Destruction, Evil
Favoured Weapon: Unknown

Tiamat, Goddess of Evil Dragons
There's next to nothing concrete in the comic about her, but as she's the one deity in OOTS that resembles her "canonical" D&D depiction the most, I'm going to assume that they have identical qualities.

Marduk, Head of the Pantheon (exact portfolio unknown)
Alignment: Likely to be Lawful Good, Neutral Good or Lawful Neutral (has a paladin)

Other known Western Gods
Adad, God of Thunder; Ereshkigal, Goddess of the Underworld; Ishtar, propably Goddess of Love

Others
The Dark One, God of Goblinoids
Alignment: Lawful evil
Known granted domains: Destruction, Evil, Law (SoD)
Possible other domains granted: War (his afterlife is described as a giant army)
Favoured Weapon: Unknown, possibly battleaxe (none of his clerics that have appeared wield weapons, but he's depicted with an axe)

Banjo, God of Puppets, and Giggles, God of Slapstick
Alignment: Chaotic puppet

Spoiler: Dead Deities

Show

The Eastern Gods (all titles are guesswork)
Zeus, God of the Sky, Head of the Pantheon; Ares, God of War; Apollo, God of Art; Aphrodite, Goddess of Beauty; Demeter, Goddess of Agriculture; Hades, God of Death; Poseidon, God of the Sea; Pan, God of Beasts

[Metastachydium]

Nergal
Alignment: Most likely one of Lawful neutral, Lawful evil or Neutral Evil (has a lawful evil highpriest)
Known granted domains: Death, Destruction

I'd venture a guess that the phrase "unholy will" in the post linked, coming from the author himself, might be sufficient to rule out LN.

Banjo and Giggles
Alignment: Chaotic puppet

[Enters rage ki frenzy.]

[137beth]

Great work!

Here's a minor correction:

Odin
Alignment: Unkown
Domains: Unkown

I think those should both be Unknown.

[Tzardok]

I'd venture a guess that the phrase "unholy will" in the post linked, coming from the author himself, might be sufficient to rule out LN.

Good argument. Included.

Great work!

Here's a minor correction:

I think those should both be Unknown.

Fixed. Hopefully everywhere.

[Jasdoif]

Adad was name-dropped, a Western god associated with weather.

---

Cross thread post....

Not sure how to make it curated, or wether it's worth it, but it can be found here.

Given the clear topic and informational structure of the thread I don't think you need to do anything...or at the very least, neither ThePhantasm nor I were ever required to declare anything for the Index of the Giant's Comments threads in the decade that "curated threads" have been around.


If you'd prefer it to be unambigious, adding a sentence like

This is a [post=12577293]curated thread[/post].

to the opening post seems to be the convention.

[Kish]

Seven instances of "propably" should be "probably."

[Metastachydium]

Speaking of Adad, we also know Ishtar's a thing, she's hostile towards Nergal and has likely something to do with love and relationships.

[Fyraltari]

I think we could add Fenrir as having an evil alignment what with his disregard of his own creations, his desire to kill everyone and piss on their graves and his high priest feeding on human children and limping elves.

[Tzardok]

I think we could add Fenrir as having an evil alignment what with his disregard of his own creations, his desire to kill everyone and piss on their graves and his high priest feeding on human children and limping elves.

Included. Thank you.

[ZhonLord]

To quote Malack about Nergal: "neither gods of death nor their clerics are NECESSARILY evil. If anything, Neutrality suits them better."

It's true that Nergal has an evil high priest, but I doubt he'd care if his servants are good or evil so long as they respect death. Malack's "thousand sacrifices a day" seems more like his personal plan than something Nergal asked him to do, unless there's something I haven't read in the supplemental books.

[Peelee]

To quote Malack about Nergal: "neither gods of death nor their clerics are NECESSARILY evil. If anything, Neutrality suits them better."

Malack, a cleric of a death god, is Evil, despite his own belief of neutrality suiting him better.

Yeah, im not going to put a whole lot of stock in what he says there.

[Kish]

Indeed, the whole point of his saying that, is to dishonestly imply, "I and my god are both Lawful Neutral."

When the main part of it is established as untrue (Malack was thoroughly evil), why would the rest have any credibility?

[hroþila]

I actually agree with what Malack is saying despite the blatant attempt at manipulation, but the thing is, he didn't even say that Nergal himself is Neutral. So in the absence of any actual evidence of Nergal not being Evil, I'm just going to assume that the god who, in the opinion of his high priest*, would feel honoured by obscene amounts of human sacrifice is probably Evil.

*or a very high-ranking priest at any rate

[Peelee]

I actually agree with what Malack is saying despite the blatant attempt at manipulation, but the thing is, he didn't even say that Nergal himself is Neutral. So in the absence of any actual evidence of Nergal not being Evil, I'm just going to assume that the god who, in the opinion of his high priest*, would feel honoured by obscene amounts of human sacrifice is probably Evil.

*or a very high-ranking priest at any rate

Oh, dont get me wrong, i feel the same way. Hell, my last character was a devoutly religious rogue assassin who multiclassed into cleric (not by design, healer left and my character story worked perfectly into going cleric). Wee Jas, neutral death god.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I actually agree with what Malack is saying despite the blatant attempt at manipulation, but the thing is, he didn't even say that Nergal himself is Neutral. So in the absence of any actual evidence of Nergal not being Evil, I'm just going to assume that the god who, in the opinion of his high priest*, would feel honoured by obscene amounts of human sacrifice is probably Evil.

*or a very high-ranking priest at any rate

It is clearly a technically true statement intended to deceive. Sure, the Northern and Easter Western gods of death are Evil, but there is no requirement for every Death god to be Evil; if the Southern gods have portfolios, the one who's in charge of death (Rat? Rooster? Snake? I'd guess Snake - very associated to Death, snakes - but I'd love for Rooster to be a banshee-like announcer of death) won't be Evil, since we have WoG confirming they are all TN.

GW

[Kurald Galain]

Thor
Alignment: Good (to grant the Good domain), probably Chaotic (based on his general behavior (knocking up fertility goddesses, playing drunken darts with lightning

In D&D terms, "chaotic" alignment means being in favor of personal liberties, freedom, and so forth; it has nothing to do with erratic or crazy behavior. Thor acting like a drunken idiot means he has low wisdom; it does not mean anything in particular about his alignment.

[Fyraltari]

Oh, the is Nergal evil argument again?
Count me on the "we don't have enough to be sure" camp.

It Sure, the Northern and Easter gods of death are Evil,

We have no idea how evil Hades was, though?

[Peelee]

Oh, the is Nergal evil argument again?
Count me on the "we don't have enough to be sure" camp.

Call it a shot in the dark but I feel comfortable saying "the deity who would apparently be ok with ongoing mass human/lizardfolk sacrifice" probably doesnt fit the bill for Neutral.

[Fyraltari]

Call it a shot in the dark but I feel comfortable saying "the deity who would apparently be ok with ongoing mass human/lizardfolk sacrifice" probably doesnt fit the bill for Neutral.

I guess Thor hates trees then.

[Tzardok]

In D&D terms, "chaotic" alignment means being in favor of personal liberties, freedom, and so forth; it has nothing to do with erratic or crazy behavior. Thor acting like a drunken idiot means he has low wisdom; it does not mean anything in particular about his alignment.

And Thor's "erratic" behaviour is how he expresses his own desires for freedom. Additionally, him breaking the rules just because he finds the result cool, and him grumbling about the laws governing a god's behaviour make it IMO pretty clear he's chaotic.

[Peelee]

I guess Thor hates trees then.

I feel like theres a small difference between trees and systemic decimation of an entire sapient populace.

That's just me, though. Your mileage may vary.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

In D&D terms, "chaotic" alignment means being in favor of personal liberties, freedom, and so forth; it has nothing to do with erratic or crazy behavior. Thor acting like a drunken idiot means he has low wisdom; it does not mean anything in particular about his alignment.

OK, but that still leaves his willingness to abandon a rule given even half-way believable excuse (or indeed mostly unbelievable ones) and disdain for "dumb rules" meant to keep the world from being unmade. His "you do you" personal philosophy. His "it feels weird to give you orders".

In addition to that, we have "erratic or crazy behaviour" mirroring that of Elan, which indicates that erratic and crazy behaviour is associated to Chaotic individuals in OotS, even if not in the D&D rules.

We have no idea how evil Hades was, though?

I meant Western. Fixed.

Grey Wolf

[Fyraltari]

I feel like theres a small difference between trees and systemic decimation of an entire sapient populace.

That's just me, though. Your mileage may vary.

The point is it's very easy in-universe for clerics to be severely confuse what their god wants with what they want.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

The point is it's very easy in-universe for clerics to be severely confuse what their god wants with what they want.

And the counterpoint is that there is a difference between being slightly annoyed by your worshippers deciding to wage holy war on non-sentient plant life, versus allowing your priest to plan a sentient being blood farm to be sacrificed to your glory at a rate of a thousand beings per day. Confused or not, the moment Malack started planning his little rein of terror, any good or neutral god should've dumped his tail.

GW

[Fyraltari]

And the counterpoint is that there is a difference between being slightly annoyed by your worshippers deciding to wage holy war on non-sentient plant life, versus allowing your priest to plan a sentient being blood farm. Confused or not, the moment Malack started planning his little rein of terror, any good or neutral god should've dumped his tail.

GW

Malack's plan would come into play in an estimated 30 years. From Nergal's perspective, the World has been on "will explode any moment now" for 60 years. Why waste a perfectly functional priest now for something that's very unlikely to happen when you can waste him then?

[Peelee]

The point is it's very easy in-universe for clerics to be severely confuse what their god wants with what they want.

And my point is that it's very easy to differentiate between attacking roots breaking a wall in your cave home and a freaking continental holocaust. There's some daylight between these two things, i think enough daylight for an entire damned alignment separation.

[dancrilis]

Call it a shot in the dark but I feel comfortable saying "the deity who would apparently be ok with ongoing mass human/lizardfolk sacrifice" probably doesnt fit the bill for Neutral.

I think this might be holding neutral to standards that neutral doesn't have.

Neutral gods can have evil clerics and those evil clerics can be as evil as they like providing they don't engage in behaviour that 'grossly violates the code of conduct required by his god'.

Neutral gods are not good.

Nergal might have any number of good clerics out there engaged in good works - he just may not care about either the good or the evil providing the worship keeps flowing in.

[Fyraltari]

And my point is that it's very easy to differentiate between attacking roots breaking a wall in your cave home and a freaking continental holocaust. There's some daylight between these two things, i think enough daylight for an entire damned alignment separation.

But the the literal holocaust is only theoretical so far. And we know that clerics and Paladins can get away with a lot as long as it's theoretical (and with much even if it's practical).

[Kurald Galain]

In addition to that, we have "erratic or crazy behaviour" mirroring that of Elan,

Ah yes, Elan, who is very much known for his high wisdom score...

I mean, if Haley were to start acting like a drunken lunatic all the time, then you might have a point about all chaotic characters acting like drunken lunatics

[Peelee]

I think this might be holding neutral to standards that neutral doesn't have.

Neutral gods can have evil clerics and those evil clerics can be as evil as they like providing they don't engage in behaviour that 'grossly violates the code of conduct required by his god'.

Neutral gods are not good.

Nergal might have any number of good clerics out there engaged in good works - he just may not care about either the good or the evil providing the worship keeps flowing in.

I am fully aware of all of this. I, however, do not think Neutral is as welcoming of genocide as you apparenrly do.