Worse Than The Disease OOC 2

[u-b]

Can those three rangers still see that group of five after taking a couple of seconds for confirmation? If so, what's the range, and how far apart if they if the rangers go for hitting several in one burst? On that note, what level of guns skill do the rangers have, again (all rifles, for reference)?

Here they are. The equipment there is dated, but the skills are current.

[Shoot Da Moon]

Can those three rangers still see that group of five after taking a couple of seconds for confirmation? If so, what's the range, and how far apart if they if the rangers go for hitting several in one burst? On that note, what level of guns skill do the rangers have, again (all rifles, for reference)?

The Rangers can still see the targets.
The attackers are 7 (the nearest two) to 10 (two more) to 15 (the single furthest) yards away. They are all 3 yards in between one another when at the same distance (so the two at 10 yards are not 3 yards from the 15 yard one, you see).
The Rangers have base skill 14, IIRC.

[u-b]

The Rangers have base skill 14, IIRC.

It's 13 and 15, one more with their collimating sights and then those with radios and BARs have spend some time aiming.

[Shoot Da Moon]

It's 13 and 15, one more with their collimating sights and then those with radios and BARs have spend some time aiming.

I stand corrected.

[u-b]

Perhaps I misunderstood. At the beginning of the multiple projectiles section, it says "Use Shotguns and Multiple Projectiles (p. B409) to determine the number of hits.". I assumed that meant that they worked like shotguns in the sense that most ranges they do the full multiplied amount of shots, but at close range they have the normal RoF with a damage/DR multiplier based on the multiplier. I'm not sure how else to interpet B409 being referenced there.

Hmm... hadn't considered that rule. We'll have to see what the crowd and our GM say about it.

As for the damage, to show my working (using the rules in HT166): 7d+1 damage is converted into 25.5, multiplied by 0.85 to get 21.675. Dividing by 3.5 to get dice again leaves me with 6.19 - 6 dice with a remainder of 0.19 which (as the damage is between 1 and 10 dice, and the remainder is between 0.15 and 0.42) converts to +1.

This seems correct.

[Shoot Da Moon]

Hmm... hadn't considered that rule. We'll have to see what the crowd and our GM say about it.

This seems correct.

I'm comfortable with saying VoltHawk is right.
It does not appear to unbalance the game right now, the results are quite plausible, no-one objects to it as ruining any fun...
Passes the smell test.
We're good here.

[u-b]

I do not think duplex ammo should be strictly worse below 50 yards and that seems to be supported by majority opinion on GURPS forum, though people differ on details quite a lot. I think I can propose a resolution to my satisfaction in a day or two when new posts stop coming in and will see if it is acceptable for everyone.

[u-b]

Okay, we got no more responses on GURPS rules forums, but from the three we got basically no one recommends using B409 rule with multi-ball ammunition as it was neither designed nor intended for that. What we can do instead is...
1. Just ignore it and keep the rest as is.
2. Nerf things a bit as per HT172 multiple-projectile loads damage formula instead of the more specific HT173 multi-ball damage values, which gives us 5d+1 instead of 6d+1, AND/OR...
3. Nerf things a bit by treating shots under 50 yards to be equivalent to solid slugs, doing 7d+1 instead of two separate projectiles.

I'm fine with any combination of the above.

[Shoot Da Moon]

Okay, we got no more responses on GURPS rules forums, but from the three we got basically no one recommends using B409 rule with multi-ball ammunition as it was neither designed nor intended for that. What we can do instead is...
1. Just ignore it and keep the rest as is.
2. Nerf things a bit as per HT172 multiple-projectile loads damage formula instead of the more specific HT173 multi-ball damage values, which gives us 5d+1 instead of 6d+1, AND/OR...
3. Nerf things a bit by treating shots under 50 yards to be equivalent to solid slugs, doing 7d+1 instead of two separate projectiles.

I'm fine with any combination of the above.

For now, option 1.
We can come back and rethink things later.

[Volthawk]

So to confirm, we're saying that duplex just does the normal duplex thing at all ranges?

[Shoot Da Moon]

Sure.

We have not had much range in our gunfights so far anyway, IIRC.

[Shoot Da Moon]

This might be a good time to double-check how many bullets you have left in your respective magazines right now. Just in case you might be running out...

[AdamSpeg]

By my count, Lemus has 9/30 bullets still loaded.

[u-b]

If you are waiting for me, Sean's current mag has 11 rounds left (24 - 1 - 12) and the rest of his loadout is as per the doc without the backpack, so combat load.

[Volthawk]

Ranger-wise, they've only fired that burst at the north group, so that's one BAR at 11/20, another at 17/20, and an M16 at 7/20.

[u-b]

Ranger-wise, they've only fired that burst at the north group, so that's one BAR at 11/20, another at 17/20, and an M16 at 7/20.

Well, not quite. Look at all those extended capacity magazines...

[Volthawk]

Well, not quite. Look at all those extended capacity magazines...

Ooh, yeah. I forgot about those.

[Shoot Da Moon]

Good. Now that we have that settled, let's turn our attention back to the active enemies.
Lemus can move forward and try spotting them all again. He would be vulnerable to getting shot in the back, though.
He could signal to his allies where the bad guys are, and they might set up a flanking maneuver that way, if they can move quickly enough.
The risk is, the enemies will almost certainly reposition if you guys can't nail them all in time.
And the alarm is still raised either way.

[u-b]

For the record, Sean is still waiting for the grenades to explode.

[Shoot Da Moon]

For the record, Sean is still waiting for the grenades to explode.

His patience is rewarded with gore and noise.

[Volthawk]

Which rangers can see/shoot at the new group (assuming that they're not out of the fight already due to Sean's shooting)?

[Shoot Da Moon]

The targets have no cover penalty if you're firing at their vitals, the cart is at their waists.

As for the Rangers, they do not see the newcomers from their position. Only Sean...

[Shoot Da Moon]

When you decide on a plan, try to explain the steps of it in this thread, noting what you roll BEFORE you post it IC.

[u-b]

Unless corrected, Sean's plan is to...
1. Look at the next buiding to the west from a window of floor 1.
2. Reach the SE corner of that building while covered by Lemus, two M16 guys and potentially some of the rest of the group.
3. Look along both outer walls of the building and inside of it.
4. Either open some fire or wave for the rest of our four to run over to him and then enter the building.
5. Then we'll maybe search it and see how it goes.

[Shoot Da Moon]

Alright, does this make sense to you, other players?

[Volthawk]

Yup, sounds good.

[AdamSpeg]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Shoot Da Moon]

The bells are still ringing in the background, they might wind down and stop soon.

[u-b]

If nobody minds, we do the next buiding.

[AdamSpeg]

Yeah, let's keep building clearing.