Unicorn Overlord

[Rising Phoenix]

Anybody else looking forward for this?

You can get the 7 hour demo atm and I've been mightily impressed. It takes inspiration from all the classic strategy rpgs (Ogre Battle, Fire emblem etc) and appears to have a created a very addictive and fun gameplay loop.

[Zevox]

I'm interested in it, since I quite liked Ogre Battle 64 way back in the day and it looks to be basically a new Ogre Battle, but won't be getting it immediately. Its release being sandwiched between Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth (which I'm currently playing) and Hi-Fi Rush's Playstation release just doesn't work out for me there.

[Rising Phoenix]

I've played through the demo twice now.

It's good. Writing appears to be solid and voice acting spot on. I haven't come across any annoying characters yet.

Some jiggle physic choices are umm... very much in your face (looking at you Scarlet).

I still need to learn how to do my tactics better though. I don't understand what most of them do.

Anywho will pick this up again when the full game comes out.

[Rising Phoenix]

Picked up the game Friday.

It most certainly lives up to the hype. It's better then FE Engage perhaps on par with Three Houses.

The only negative is that I am experiencing sever choice paralysis... There's 60+ recruitable characters- I have yet to come across anyone that I dislike...

[Starbuck_II]

I like the customzation.

Wish you could increase a group to more than 3 units earlier (need C rank to raise it to 4 units), but guess that would make it too easy.

I like shield dudes.

Fighters are only good to protect vs archers, they aren't best warriors, but pair them up with fliers and they make good synergy (Fliers are amazing at avoiding melee and dealing damage, plus decent magic defense).

Archers and magic are good for leaders since they can lend a bonus attack.
Clerics as leaders can lend healing to an attack.

[Razade]

Just got to the second mainline quest last night. The game presents it as a branching path but let me tell you: Even if you're overleveled - it is not.

One direction has foes that you don't really have a hard counter for and unless you grinded on the repeatable Challenge fight in the north of the first area, you're going to be 2-ish levels below the enemies. A lot of the enemies are also Advanced Units. I won't spoil which of the two is a trap because you'll figure it out pretty much from the jump. You can start to Advance your units at Reputation B. I'm a 1/3rd of the way away after 100%ing the first area and grinding a little on the repeatables.

The other region is more in line with levels of the first main quest. First one was level 8 and so far most have been in the 8-10 range. Most of my units range from 13-17 at this point.

I've got Lex with Aubin, Auch, and Chloe and they are terrifying. Not sure who I'll put in as their 5th when I'm able. The space between 4 and 5 is pretty wide. Still playing around with the main lord's group. It's very survivable but it doesn't really clinche fights in the same way my other units have. Especially the Lex led one.

[Rising Phoenix]

I finished the game the other night on expert. Restarted a second run the day after- thought about doing it on True Zenoiran- but decided against it. The game is good, but when it decides to be frustrating- it really IS frustrating.

You can break the game even without being over levelled- it's perfectly reasonable for a level 20 squad to beat an endgame one with the right tactics and gear.

I am going to say that replayability is not great- you can go to the higher level areas first sure- but if you do and can clear them- it completely ruins the challenge for the lower-level areas.

Here's hoping that the devs can provide a level scaling option so that we can tackle the areas in any order we want- this will also allow us to access different units at different times.

My favourite area by far is Drakenheim- great character design, solid world building, good maps, good music.

Least favourite area- Elheim- budget Lothlorian with terrible character designs.

[Razade]

The jump from 4 man to 5 man teams in Bastorias with the Werebears and mostly night battles has been pretty annoying honestly. Even overleveled, they're pretty rough without a 5th person.

Cleared the Colussium and now I have to consider where I want to put my Featherwing that was in my troop with Alain because obviously Battle Thigh Mom needs to be in that group.

Pretty close to the end though, it seems. Still have all of Albion and a little bit left of Bastorias. I'm a bit sad it's almost over honestly. I've enjoyed the game a great deal. But I guess it'll be back to Persona 3 here soon.

[Zevox]

With Rebirth and Hi-Fi Rush complete, I've picked up a copy of this myself now. I went in expecting modern Ogre Battle, and yeah, that seems to be basically what it is - albeit "modern" in this case means "with a whole lot of additions to everything," because oh boy is this more complicated than Ogre Battle ever was. Mostly in a good way, though I could see it getting to the point of being excessive as I go on. At this point though I'm quite enjoying the gameplay, this is a style I haven't had in a very long time (seriously, besides Ogre Battle: MotBQ and 64, do any other games work like this?), and I'm happy to see it again and see it expanded upon.

Story-wise, eh, less so. Feels pretty generic fantasy so far - not badly executed or anything, but nothing special. Though admittedly I'm not far in yet. I am kind of annoyed that they immediately did the damsel-in-distress/kidnapping thing with your starting healer though.

From how rapidly I've had people joining me I'm kind of getting a Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon feel to it too - like there's going to be a ton of named characters, but outside of when you recruit them they'll barely say anything. Well, I guess there's also the support (I'm sorry, "rapport") conversations, but it doesn't seem like there's that many of those, most character duos get only two from the look of it. Which isn't great, but eh, they're obviously trying to let you have entire squads of unique characters, unlike Ogre Battle where you mostly had groups of generics being lead by a named character. I'm just not sure that decision's the best one for the game style.

[Razade]

Mercs are honestly better than most named characters. You can set their stats however you want as soon as you pay for them instead of using a Mirror to change them, which you only get a select number of until super super super late game. You can also raise Rapport easily when you start unlocking Taverns.

[Zevox]

Mercs are honestly better than most named characters. You can set their stats however you want as soon as you pay for them instead of using a Mirror to change them, which you only get a select number of until super super super late game. You can also raise Rapport easily when you start unlocking Taverns.

Eh, even if that's true it would mean using generic filler characters when I could be using actual characters, and that's not going to happen.

Also, that Mirror item lets you fiddle with characters' stats? The description only mentions changing their appearance. That's a pretty important thing to just leave off the item description.

A bit of a frustration I'm having with the game right now: how can it have advanced so much compared to Ogre Battle, and yet not have figured out level scaling? First I rescue Scarlet at level 10 only for her to rejoin me as the same level 2 character she was when she was kidnapped; now I wander my way down to where you can recruit your first Witch with my average party level about 13 and find Yahna joins me at level 5. Especially the former with Scarlet being a major character whose kidnapping is scripted and you get no choice in, that sucks.

Oh, speaking of Witches though... wow, their character design is shameless, isn't it? The worst part being how they just never stop swaying their hips in that uncomfortable-looking fashion even when they're just standing there doing nothing else. In a game that otherwise has mostly pretty good female character designs (it is quite refreshing to see women in armor whose chest plates aren't sculpted to resemble breasts, and which actually covers their bodies just as much as male armor does), that one stands out like a sore thumb.

[Razade]

Eh, even if that's true it would mean using generic filler characters when I could be using actual characters, and that's not going to happen.

I mean...it is true...it's not something to debate. I'm not arguing against using the characters but characters without the unique classes are literally the same as the generic ones and save for the core story ones, have no actual use outside of the side quest you get them. I was mostly commenting that it's viable, and possibly preferable if stats are all you care about.

Also, that Mirror item lets you fiddle with characters' stats? The description only mentions changing their appearance. That's a pretty important thing to just leave off the item description.

Yes, it does. It's pretty handy. You only get a few over the course of the game until literally near the end and they cost Honors to buy. More than recruiting a Merc for sure for most classes.

A bit of a frustration I'm having with the game right now: how can it have advanced so much compared to Ogre Battle, and yet not have figured out level scaling? First I rescue Scarlet at level 10 only for her to rejoin me as the same level 2 character she was when she was kidnapped; now I wander my way down to where you can recruit your first Witch with my average party level about 13 and find Yahna joins me at level 5. Especially the former with Rosa being a major character whose kidnapping is scripted and you get no choice in, that sucks.

Yeah though it also works in reverse. If you beat higher level areas you get characters at higher level. That doesn't make it better but it does make it consistently weird.

Oh, speaking of Witches though... wow, their character design is shameless, isn't it? The worst part being how they just never stop swaying their hips in that uncomfortable-looking fashion even when they're just standing there doing nothing else. In a game that otherwise has mostly pretty good female character designs (it is quite refreshing to see women in armor whose chest plates aren't sculpted to resemble breasts, and which actually covers their bodies just as much as male armor does), that one stands out like a sore thumb.

It wouldn't be Vanillaware if the women didn't bounce. Scarlett bounced from Step 1. The Witch is probably the most Vanillaware of the character designs but most of the other characters are pretty well designed.

[Zevox]

And another region, another kidnapping... this isn't going to keep happening, is it? At least this one didn't last as long, but still...

A general impression to give at this point: while I like the tactics system and the many things you can do by programming that and combining characters in different ways in your units, I do kind of dislike how important equipment management ends up being. I'm spending a lot of time thinking about which accessories and weapons my characters should have, since they can give so many different benefits that can compliment or alter the way a unit plays, and staring at menus trying to decide who gets which item is not one of my favorite parts of games. In that way this is getting kind of over-complicated, IMO.

It wouldn't be Vanillaware if the women didn't bounce. Scarlett bounced from Step 1. The Witch is probably the most Vanillaware of the character designs but most of the other characters are pretty well designed.

Bounce? The witch doesn't really bounce. Are you maybe thinking of the shaman? They stand out a bit too, but less so since they're both fully clothed and don't move as much in their idle pose.

And this is the only Vanillaware game I've ever played. Looking at a list of their past games, the only one I've ever seen more than the name of is Dragon's Crown, which... well, I'm glad their art has improved immensely since that at least.

[WritersBlock]

Hey, everything about Dragon's Crown is epic win.

And I would not hold out hope for pc release. (Vanillaware has never done that) and if there was one, Atlus is involved so it would have denuvo slapped on it anyway.

Eh, at least I have the Vagrant/Sword of the vagrant when I want a vanillaware like game on pc.

[Zevox]

Wrapped up Elheim now, starting to feel kind of overpowered. The fact that my teams are beating Colosseum enemies 10 levels above them is kind of telling there - there's actually only three teams left for me to beat, including Amalia's. I've wound up recruiting a ton of mercs, but they're all to station as guards at towns, because wow there's a heck of a lot more of those than there are unique characters. I'm glad there's some that are always so cheap, with soldiers, fighters, and housecarls always being only 3 honor to recruit, that helps at least.

Elheim itself was kind of eh, and oh god, it gave me a new worst character design: the female elven fencer. Dear lord, her breasts are almost bigger than her head, and she's basically wearing fetish gear. It's legitimately stunning that a design like that is in the same game as the female soldiers, sellswords, radiant knights, or the angel, which are all considerably better than most fantasy games' female character designs. Even the witch, sorceress, and druid, who are otherwise the most sexualized designs in the game by a significant margin, look much better by comparison.

That aside though, still enjoying the game, though running up against the 10-unit hard cap is a bit frustrating now, since the game keeps throwing new things at me, and I don't want to disband my existing units to make new ones. I think I might need to do so for one or two though, as I start unlocking the 5th character slot - relocate characters from my least effective units to be the 5th in other units so I can make another unit or two with late-game characters. Maybe drop the two mercs I've been using since near the start of the game (a wizard and a griffon knight I recruited back while I was still filling out very early units) altogether to make room for unique ones.

I am now at the point where the game's basically told me I need to pick a romantic partner for Alain though. I did a lot tavern meals to pump up some characters' rapport, and I'm kind of leaning towards going with Berengaria, who I could do that with now, but there's a bunch of others I can't get the last conversation with until I do more of the game. Not sure if I should wait on that or not, it's hard to see anyone else displacing Berengaria as my preference, but there's maybe an off chance for a couple of them.

Hey, everything about Dragon's Crown is epic win.

I can't speak to how it plays, but having seen the character artwork, no, no it's not. It's pretty darn hideous, and that is not something I say easily. I wouldn't even say that about the elven fencer I complained about above, just that it looks like it belongs in a hentai instead of this game.

[Razade]

I am now at the point where the game's basically told me I need to pick a romantic partner for Alain though. I did a lot tavern meals to pump up some characters' rapport, and I'm kind of leaning towards going with Berengaria, who I could do that with now, but there's a bunch of others I can't get the last conversation with until I do more of the game. Not sure if I should wait on that or not, it's hard to see anyone else displacing Berengaria as my preference, but there's maybe an off chance for a couple of them.

You don't have to decide until you do the Unicorn Overlord main story quest so you have a lot of time left. You've got Bastorias where the difficulty is going to jump. It's when you start fighting full on 5 man teams consistently and they introduce a new mechanic. You've got Albion as well though it's pretty short and clear it's where they ran out of money. At least two other major world wide side quests to go as well. You can also pick the men to be the Maiden.

[Zevox]

You don't have to decide until you do the Unicorn Overlord main story quest so you have a lot of time left. You've got Bastorias where the difficulty is going to jump. It's when you start fighting full on 5 man teams consistently and they introduce a new mechanic. You've got Albion as well though it's pretty short and clear it's where they ran out of money. At least two other major world wide side quests to go as well. You can also pick the men to be the Maiden.

Really? That's more than a bit surprising actually. Still probably doesn't change anything for me, but good to know.

And for now at least I've started Bastorias without making that choice. It is a bit of a difficulty jump, but not too big in the first fight at least. I do have to say though, some of the Bestrals just look off to me. The Werewolves look good, and the Bears and Foxes are fine, but the Owls look just wrong to me somehow in a way I can't quite put my finger on. The Lion too, but I think that's because he's clearly just a reskinned Gladiator, which is not one the better class designs in the game to begin with.

[Rynjin]

I thought the game sounded interesting but $500 for a game is a bit steep.

[Razade]

Really? That's more than a bit surprising actually. Still probably doesn't change anything for me, but good to know.

Yep, the game lets you choose anyone you've got Rapport with with Alain and it only matters for the final quest which they do sorta tell you that but not in clear terms.

And for now at least I've started Bastorias without making that choice. It is a bit of a difficulty jump, but not too big in the first fight at least. I do have to say though, some of the Bestrals just look off to me. The Werewolves look good, and the Bears and Foxes are fine, but the Owls look just wrong to me somehow in a way I can't quite put my finger on. The Lion too, but I think that's because he's clearly just a reskinned Gladiator, which is not one the better class designs in the game to begin with.

The Wereowl is pretty weird yeah. But I mean, the Werebunnies make up for it. The lion is also pretty odd yeah, and he's a slightly better Gladiator. You're also not wrong, Gladiator is one of the weakest classes in the game without building around their gimmick and the added Beastral gimmick is an additional sticking point on him. The Beastral units in general are not very good. The Wereowl is the best of the Beastal units. Their ability to refresh Action Points breaks the game hard. Two of them on the back line with tactics to support one of the named Elves or any Cleric with two strong front line forces is basically a game ending unit.

I thought the game sounded interesting but $500 for a game is a bit steep.

Where are you finding it for 500 dollars? What? I got it for 40 bucks on Amazon. You can get a digital copy on Switch for 60 bucks as well.

[Rynjin]

Where are you finding it for 500 dollars? What? I got it for 40 bucks on Amazon. You can get a digital copy on Switch for 60 bucks as well.

It was a joke about it being a console exclusive.

[Razade]

It was a joke about it being a console exclusive.

Good joke. It really isn't if you have to explain it.

[Zevox]

Wrapped up Bastoria. Remember how I mentioned feeling overpowered? I have some evidence of such: I beat Amalia in the Colloseum at level 26, and Girard at level 28. Bonus fights clearly intended for level 40 teams. Admittedly, Amalia was mostly because her AI is stupid and all you need to do to win Colloseum matches is out-damage the enemy, but hey, a win's a win. And I again find myself sad this game has no level scaling, since she joined me as a level 40 character, so I feel like I can't use her until basically the end of the game without her being OP as hell (if then, frankly). Which is a shame, because I quite like her design, visually and mechanically.

The Wereowl is pretty weird yeah. But I mean, the Werebunnies make up for it.

I figured out what bugs me about the Wereowls: their heads are huge compared to the rest of their body. Literally wider than not only their waists, but because of their stance, wider even than their legs appear to be. And there's not much upper body in between their waist and their head, either, which makes it that much more off-putting.

And the bunnies are cute and all, but boy is the voice for those shopkeepers irritating. I'm happy I rarely buy anything from the provisions shop, because it's kind of painful to hear.

The lion is also pretty odd yeah, and he's a slightly better Gladiator. You're also not wrong, Gladiator is one of the weakest classes in the game without building around their gimmick and the added Beastral gimmick is an additional sticking point on him.

I actually meant their visual design, not their mechanical one. How their body proportions are just absolutely grotesque all around - the last remnant of that Dragon's Crown artwork in the devs' style, I suppose. Which is sad because they can do big, muscular characters far better now, as Amalia's existence shows.

Mechanically, I feel like Gladiators are fine. More defensive than you at first assume, but they're a neat alternative tank to the Hoplite/Centurion class, dropping all the defense in favor of massive hp and self-healing. I actually salvaged a team I was thinking of disbanding in part by swapping in Morard, so the team now includes him, Bruno (Gladiator), Selvie (Druid), and Auch (Warlock, leader). Admittedly the other part of salvaging the team was getting Auch the staff that lets you cast Trinity Rain, which basically ends fights on its own, but he does need the team to buy him time to cast it, so it works out pretty well.

The Beastral units in general are not very good. The Wereowl is the best of the Beastal units. Their ability to refresh Action Points breaks the game hard. Two of them on the back line with tactics to support one of the named Elves or any Cleric with two strong front line forces is basically a game ending unit.

The Bestral units seem good to me? The Foxes are a bitch to fight since there's always at least three of them and Weakness Hunter is crazy strong, so it's hard to stop them from killing at least one character, sometimes even with units that include a swordmaster. Admittedly with only Dinah I struggle to make her nearly as effective, but that's also in part because she's not getting my good equipment and isn't in a team built around her, she's in my 10th team that I'm trying to make work with characters I'd otherwise not be using.

The Werewolves obviously aren't great defensively, but they're potent offensively, do a ton of following attacks, and have higher accuracy than most non-archers, so they're good at killing even evasive enemies. I put mine in the back row of a unit, and he's doing good there. The Werebears are Centurions with actual offense at the expense of the cover and buffing abilities - or hammer soldiers who trade anti-armor effects for armor of their own, depending on how you look at it, I suppose. I've barely used mine yet, but he seems like he should be solid.

The Owls are actually the one I find the most awkward. I have put Ramona in my Berengaria-lead team to help shore up its survivability and to toss extra PP Berengaria's way, since her uses for it are insanely good; but aside from the PP-passing (which I assume is what you meant, since even at higher levels I don't see them getting an AP-generating ability?) and getting to buff allies with Truestrike at night their abilities don't stand out much.

Admittedly though, Yunifi is probably best Bestral despite not really being a Bestral, because Triple Counter is so crazy it made me put an archer on the front lines. With enough +evasion gear to make her nearly untouchable and a cleric behind her in case something does get through, admittedly, but still.

[Razade]

Wrapped up Bastoria. Remember how I mentioned feeling overpowered? I have some evidence of such: I beat Amalia in the Colloseum at level 26, and Girard at level 28. Bonus fights clearly intended for level 40 teams. Admittedly, Amalia was mostly because her AI is stupid and all you need to do to win Colloseum matches is out-damage the enemy, but hey, a win's a win. And I again find myself sad this game has no level scaling, since she joined me as a level 40 character, so I feel like I can't use her until basically the end of the game without her being OP as hell (if then, frankly). Which is a shame, because I quite like her design, visually and mechanically.

Levels don't mean much honestly. The game is more about what gear you give people and team composition. It's pretty typical to beat Amalia around level 25-30. You get a lot of really good loot in the first three areas.

Mechanically, I feel like Gladiators are fine. More defensive than you at first assume, but they're a neat alternative tank to the Hoplite/Centurion class, dropping all the defense in favor of massive hp and self-healing. I actually salvaged a team I was thinking of disbanding in part by swapping in Morard, so the team now includes him, Bruno (Gladiator), Selvie (Druid), and Auch (Warlock, leader). Admittedly the other part of salvaging the team was getting Auch the staff that lets you cast Trinity Rain, which basically ends fights on its own, but he does need the team to buy him time to cast it, so it works out pretty well.

Sure, but they're not actually meant to be defensive. That's not really their gimmick. You can make any unit useful and that's where gear really comes in. I'm just talking brute stats and damage and versatility. I'd say though, that that team is good because you have Auch (who is one of the best back line units in the game) and Selvie (Druid/Shaman is *the* most busted class in the game by far) than having two Gladiators in honestly.

The Bestral units seem good to me? The Foxes are a bitch to fight since there's always at least three of them and Weakness Hunter is crazy strong, so it's hard to stop them from killing at least one character, sometimes even with units that include a swordmaster. Admittedly with only Dinah I struggle to make her nearly as effective, but that's also in part because she's not getting my good equipment and isn't in a team built around her, she's in my 10th team that I'm trying to make work with characters I'd otherwise not be using.

The Werewolves obviously aren't great defensively, but they're potent offensively, do a ton of following attacks, and have higher accuracy than most non-archers, so they're good at killing even evasive enemies. I put mine in the back row of a unit, and he's doing good there. The Werebears are Centurions with actual offense at the expense of the cover and buffing abilities - or hammer soldiers who trade anti-armor effects for armor of their own, depending on how you look at it, I suppose. I've barely used mine yet, but he seems like he should be solid.

The computer has teams laid out to highlight the strengths of their teams. Beastrals are best when they're in an all Beastal team to make full use of the special mechanics that they make. More so than the Human Classes, the Elf and Beastral Unites play best when they're with other Elves and Beastrals. When I say "not very good", it's in consideration of all the other classes that don't need nearly as much tweaking to make them viable. As you point out, you're not making Dinah work on her own. Put her in a team with all Beastrals and you're going to see the sorts of shenanigans that the NPC units can pull off. But that requires you to make an all Beastral team and frankly you're better off using your Unit Slots for other things than that.

The Owls are actually the one I find the most awkward. I have put Ramona in my Berengaria-lead team to help shore up its survivability and to toss extra PP Berengaria's way, since her uses for it are insanely good; but aside from the PP-passing (which I assume is what you meant, since even at higher levels I don't see them getting an AP-generating ability?) and getting to buff allies with Truestrike at night their abilities don't stand out much.

I didn't say anything about generating AP. Not even once. I said refresh. Which is what their Passive Abilities do. Restore grants an ally 1PP (I did say AP, I meant PP. I beat the game a while ago) and in groups where PP is strong (like with the aforementioned Assassins who rely on PP for their Evade or Housecarls with their extra attack PP) they can do some seriously nuts stuff. They're a Support class. Pairing them up with a Healer (who you can just give more healing because those are PP for Clerics) and two front line units that rely on PP they're scary good. Especially at night.

Admittedly though, Yunifi is probably best Bestral despite not really being a Bestral, because Triple Counter is so crazy it made me put an archer on the front lines. With enough +evasion gear to make her nearly untouchable and a cleric behind her in case something does get through, admittedly, but still.

Yunifi is the best archer in the game. Hands down. She is crazy good just as a named unit. One of the top 10. She slots well in with basically any unit.

[tonberrian]

Just started the game, having a lot of fun.

[Zevox]

Sure, but they're not actually meant to be defensive. That's not really their gimmick.

Sure it is. They have tons of health, two self-healing abilities (one active and one reactive), and another ability that lets them survive a lethal hit once. That's half of their thing - the other half being AoE damage at the cost of low accuracy.

I'd say though, that that team is good because you have Auch (who is one of the best back line units in the game) and Selvie (Druid/Shaman is *the* most busted class in the game by far) than having two Gladiators in honestly.

No, it's how the team works together. I mean, Selvie herself is entirely a delaying tactic after all, Shaman/Druid does nothing but toss out debuffs.

The group was originally Auch, Bruno, Travis, and Selvie - started as the first three, added Selvie once I got the fourth slot. Early on that was good enough; over time, Travis' usefulness was falling off, and Bruno's damage output wasn't what it used to be as his accuracy issues became more of a problem and enemies he could consistently hit tended to have shields to guard the hits with, so damage was mostly coming from Auch, who couldn't carry a whole unit's worth of damage on his own. Dropping Travis for Morard helped both with survivability - since things that can hit dodgy scouts get more common later in the game - and damage, since Travis was only good at that very early on. Then Auch getting Trinity Rain and me retooling Bruno and Morard's tactics to focus more on keeping themselves alive over trying to do any damage was really what made the team come together.

Also, Auch's just a typical wizard, there's nothing really special about him personally. I mean, if you're like me and basically not using mercenaries he is the only wizard you get I guess, but even I recruited one wizard merc, since it was obvious I'd want more magic than the game gave me early on.

The computer has teams laid out to highlight the strengths of their teams. Beastrals are best when they're in an all Beastal team to make full use of the special mechanics that they make. More so than the Human Classes, the Elf and Beastral Unites play best when they're with other Elves and Beastrals. When I say "not very good", it's in consideration of all the other classes that don't need nearly as much tweaking to make them viable. As you point out, you're not making Dinah work on her own. Put her in a team with all Beastrals and you're going to see the sorts of shenanigans that the NPC units can pull off. But that requires you to make an all Beastral team and frankly you're better off using your Unit Slots for other things than that.

I don't think that's true, actually. Only Werefoxes really seem to want to have other Werefoxes (specifically, not other Bestrals in general) to shine, because mass Weakness Hunter is so good. Other Bestrals are quite independent. Well, Werewolves and Werebears are; Wereowls really want a team where them passing extra PP to someone is strong, but that's not Bestral-specific, as you're already aware.

Similarly with Elves, none of their abilities need or especially benefit from having other Elves present. You could maybe make an argument that Elven Fencers like getting Sylphic Barrier from each other in order to guaranteed trigger Evasive Impetus, but even that only happens when fighting specific classes (archers and, for some strange reason, fliers). Otherwise, the royal twins are just good, the Archers are a solid support class that also acts as a pseudo-mage (and a surprisingly good healer in party that has First Aid you can set to always target them at the end of a fight), and the Fencers... are weird and the weakest of the bunch IMO, somehow despite having a stun ability and a column-hitting magic attack. They just aren't as good at dodging as it feels like they're meant to be, even with multiple +evasion items equipped, and don't do enough damage as a back-line mage either.

(I did say AP, I meant PP. I beat the game a while ago)

Right, that's what I was talking about there.

Yunifi is the best archer in the game. Hands down. She is crazy good just as a named unit. One of the top 10. She slots well in with basically any unit.

Indeed. The only problem is deciding between using her as a front-line dodge-tank to abuse Triple Counter, and putting her in the back row to use Glacial Rain as a win condition.

[Razade]

Sure it is. They have tons of health, two self-healing abilities (one active and one reactive), and another ability that lets them survive a lethal hit once. That's half of their thing - the other half being AoE damage at the cost of low accuracy.

Their main strength is their ability to hit the front row in full. Their self heal makes them more durable but as you mention down below, their damage falls off compared to other units. They're a beefier Housecarl that doesn't really benefit much from upgrading and their self heal doesn't outpace having a dedicated healer.

No, it's how the team works together. I mean, Selvie herself is entirely a delaying tactic after all, Shaman/Druid does nothing but toss out debuffs.

I don't know what your Selvie is at, level wise but "nothing but debuffs" is really underselling just how powerful the Druid is. Their Passive Curse knocks off 1pp and lowers Initiative off an entire row of enemies. Pair that with a Featherwing or any unit that can grant Initiative bonuses to a stack and that means you're likely to get first damage in and may even kill units before they have a chance to respond. Their Offensive curse drops Physical and Magical attack by 50% which is a gamechanger for softer units. Their buff at 30 increasing all buffs is wild.

The group was originally Auch, Bruno, Travis, and Selvie - started as the first three, added Selvie once I got the fourth slot. Early on that was good enough; over time, Travis' usefulness was falling off, and Bruno's damage output wasn't what it used to be as his accuracy issues became more of a problem and enemies he could consistently hit tended to have shields to guard the hits with, so damage was mostly coming from Auch, who couldn't carry a whole unit's worth of damage on his own. Dropping Travis for Morard helped both with survivability - since things that can hit dodgy scouts get more common later in the game - and damage, since Travis was only good at that very early on. Then Auch getting Trinity Rain and me retooling Bruno and Morard's tactics to focus more on keeping themselves alive over trying to do any damage was really what made the team come together.

Right, this all is exactly what I'm saying. If you didn't have Selvie in that team I promise you you'd have seen the team drop off faster. You're highlighting all the issues with Gladiator by midgame. Put Bruno in a team where the enemies aren't losing PP and having their initiative lowered to let Bruno get in more hits and you'd have seen things go a lot more roughly. Adding Auch who is one of the best damage dealers in the game just out the gate and also having Selvie there to help him get his hits in earlier is doing a lot of pulling.

Also, Auch's just a typical wizard, there's nothing really special about him personally. I mean, if you're like me and basically not using mercenaries he is the only wizard you get I guess, but even I recruited one wizard merc, since it was obvious I'd want more magic than the game gave me early on.

I don't know what this means. There are no other Wizards in the game so there's no comparing him to them. He isn't anything like a Witch which is the main Magical Damage character you get when you can hire him on and he's the only straight magic caster who can do burn and get access to a few specific spell items. Auch is, also as mentioned, one of the best damage dealers in the game. He competes with Yahna and Yahna is busted as all get out.

I don't think that's true, actually. Only Werefoxes really seem to want to have other Werefoxes (specifically, not other Bestrals in general) to shine, because mass Weakness Hunter is so good. Other Bestrals are quite independent. Well, Werewolves and Werebears are; Wereowls really want a team where them passing extra PP to someone is strong, but that's not Bestral-specific, as you're already aware.

It's pretty much the prevailing opinion in the OU community. Plenty of chatter on reddit has run all the numbers on this stuff. Wereowl is the best outside of a full Beastral team but that's because they're just really good support Units. I forget the name of the items, because again it's been a few months now, but there's two specific ones that highlight their strengths. Call of the Pack from the Werefoxes are likewise really nasty and they stack.

Similarly with Elves, none of their abilities need or especially benefit from having other Elves present. You could maybe make an argument that Elven Fencers like getting Sylphic Barrier from each other in order to guaranteed trigger Evasive Impetus, but even that only happens when fighting specific classes (archers and, for some strange reason, fliers). Otherwise, the royal twins are just good, the Archers are a solid support class that also acts as a pseudo-mage (and a surprisingly good healer in party that has First Aid you can set to always target them at the end of a fight), and the Fencers... are weird and the weakest of the bunch IMO, somehow despite having a stun ability and a column-hitting magic attack. They just aren't as good at dodging as it feels like they're meant to be, even with multiple +evasion items equipped, and don't do enough damage as a back-line mage either.

Same with this as above. The Elf classes focus on magical damage over physical damage and they're all somewhat support-y and cover the missing pieces. I'm strictly speaking about the non-uniques. Auger and the other unique are potent on their own and play very well in a lot of different scenarios. The best regular Elf Unit outside a full elf team is actually hte archers as you say. They're good support and Magic Conferral is busted. Fencers aren't very good on their own, this is why they need Elven Archers. Two Elf Fencers and three Elf Archers with all the Elf Archers dropping Magical Conferral on the Fencers and you just watch them decimate. Especially if you equip them with the Elf Weapons that boost magical attacks. They will turn any enemy without strong magic defense into a joke.

[Zevox]

Their main strength is their ability to hit the front row in full. Their self heal makes them more durable but as you mention down below, their damage falls off compared to other units. They're a beefier Housecarl that doesn't really benefit much from upgrading and their self heal doesn't outpace having a dedicated healer.

I'd argue you are excessively focusing on the attack half of their abilities there. Again, half of what they do is self-healing and survival abilities - there's multiple fights that are clearly intended to show off this aspect of them as well. It's very obviously a big part of their intended class design. They are not just AoE beatsticks, they are also tanks, no question about it, and it just so happens they end up better at being tanks than at being AoE beatsticks.

As for outpacing a dedicated healer, obviously it doesn't do that, but it's quite potent, and unless you're hiring a bunch of mercs there's only three Clerics in the game anyway (only two for me, since the game did not make it clear you needed to get a unit close to the one from the first Drakenhold fight to get her to join you...), so it's not like you'll have one in every unit. And for some reason, healing can crit in this game, which works especially well for Gladiators - hand them an eyepatch and their healing can go crazy sometimes, and unlike a Cleric that'll also help their offensive capabilities.

I don't know what your Selvie is at, level wise but "nothing but debuffs" is really underselling just how powerful the Druid is. Their Passive Curse knocks off 1pp and lowers Initiative off an entire row of enemies. Pair that with a Featherwing or any unit that can grant Initiative bonuses to a stack and that means you're likely to get first damage in and may even kill units before they have a chance to respond. Their Offensive curse drops Physical and Magical attack by 50% which is a gamechanger for softer units. Their buff at 30 increasing all buffs is wild.

My Selvie hasn't been doing Passive Curse since very early in the game. She switch to Offensive Curse as soon as that became available, because again, team working together: Bruno is tanking all the hits but doesn't have a high defense, so debuffing enemy offense helps him against especially high-damage foes. And since early Bastoria she's not doing any of her innate class actions, since I picked up the staff that lets her cast Sandstorm in the Colloseum and handed that to her as soon as I had a spare Cornelian Pendant to get her enough AP to use it. Mass Blindness is one hell of a delaying tactic to buy Auch time to cast Trinity Rain.

My point here isn't that Selvie doesn't do anything good, it's that she's a support unit. She doesn't win fights on her own, she needs to be doing something that effectively supports the team's goal. Here, that's delaying the enemy to let Auch get Trinity Rain off to wipe the enemy in one shot. Selvie, Bruno, and Morard all do that quite effectively.

Right, this all is exactly what I'm saying. If you didn't have Selvie in that team I promise you you'd have seen the team drop off faster. You're highlighting all the issues with Gladiator by midgame. Put Bruno in a team where the enemies aren't losing PP and having their initiative lowered to let Bruno get in more hits and you'd have seen things go a lot more roughly. Adding Auch who is one of the best damage dealers in the game just out the gate and also having Selvie there to help him get his hits in earlier is doing a lot of pulling.

Selvie's presence has never helped Bruno get hits in earlier, his initiative is too bad for that. Even debuffed enemies go before him, even fairly early in the game. I doubt even switching her back to using Passive Curse to add that on top of Cursed Swamp would get him there. But enemies going before him isn't really much of an issue, again, because of his self-healing.

I don't know what this means. There are no other Wizards in the game so there's no comparing him to them. He isn't anything like a Witch which is the main Magical Damage character you get when you can hire him on and he's the only straight magic caster who can do burn and get access to a few specific spell items. Auch is, also as mentioned, one of the best damage dealers in the game. He competes with Yahna and Yahna is busted as all get out.

I literally told you what it means: mercenaries. You can hire more of any non-unique class at the game's forts. That includes Wizards/Warlocks like Auch, and Witches/Sorceresses like Yahna. I only hired two mercs for purposes other than guarding towns all game, but one of them was a Wizard, because it was obvious the game wasn't giving me enough magic users early on. Hell, this is the only way you could ever have a full unit of Bestrals, since you only get one of each type otherwise (unless there's an extra waiting for me in Albion or something, but that seems unlikely), and one of each type would not be an especially coherent Bestral unit.

It's pretty much the prevailing opinion in the OU community. Plenty of chatter on reddit has run all the numbers on this stuff. Wereowl is the best outside of a full Beastral team but that's because they're just really good support Units. I forget the name of the items, because again it's been a few months now, but there's two specific ones that highlight their strengths. Call of the Pack from the Werefoxes are likewise really nasty and they stack.

Are you talking about the items you get when you recruit the Werewolf and Werebear? Yeah, those items only give their best benefit in a full unit of Bestrals, but Bestrals don't need those items. Evaluating the units isn't about using those specific pieces of equipment. And it's nonsense to claim that Werewolves or Werebears need other Bestrals in any way, their abilities don't even interact with other Bestrals any differently than with non-Bestral units. Werefoxes are the only one like that.

And Werefoxes do not get an ability called Call of the Pack, nor does any Bestral unit? Are you maybe thinking of Werewolves' Bestral Howl, the attack buff to all allies in their row? Because that works with anyone, not just Bestrals, and doesn't indicate it stacks, so it's actually best with just a single Werewolf on the team, not a group of them.

Same with this as above. The Elf classes focus on magical damage over physical damage and they're all somewhat support-y and cover the missing pieces. I'm strictly speaking about the non-uniques. Auger and the other unique are potent on their own and play very well in a lot of different scenarios. The best regular Elf Unit outside a full elf team is actually hte archers as you say. They're good support and Magic Conferral is busted. Fencers aren't very good on their own, this is why they need Elven Archers. Two Elf Fencers and three Elf Archers with all the Elf Archers dropping Magical Conferral on the Fencers and you just watch them decimate. Especially if you equip them with the Elf Weapons that boost magical attacks. They will turn any enemy without strong magic defense into a joke.

If we're ignoring the unique classes, i.e. the royal twins, then there's only two Elf classes to talk about, and you already mentioned that the Archers are good outside of an Elf team, so the only class you're actually talking about is the Fencer. And frankly it just sounds like what you mean is they need buffs, one example of which the Elf Archer can provide, in order to be effective. Which means no, Elves don't need to be in a full Elf team to work, it just means the Elf Fencer specifically is an underwhelming unit and needs some kind of buff (such as a damage buff) to make it better, which is something I could agree with.

[Zevox]

Finished the game up today - including the one post-game quest it gives you. All in all, pretty darn good. I wanted it to be modern Ogre Battle, and it pretty much is, but even more improved compared to Ogre Battle 64 than I would've expected.

I will say that story-wise, while it executes its story well, it's overall nothing special. Pretty standard fantasy fare, you can mostly guess how things will go once you've seen the setup. Most of the characters are as well; some of the major ones have their good moments, but most feel held back from having any major depth by being limited to roles during your time in their home regions and a handful of rapport conversations, the quality of which runs the gamut. But like I said, still well-done for what it is, and I enjoyed it.

Touching on a couple of ending things,

Spoiler: Endgame

Show

I wound up saving before making my choice of "Maiden" and seeing a few different ones, just to get an idea what they're like. Seems like the male ones are all going for a "close friendship" angle, not an actual romance, which is somewhat disappointing but not terribly surprising for a Japanese-made game. The female ones are more obviously romantic, though I feel like more effort went into some than others.

Case in point, my favorite scene easily was Berengaria (and not just because she was already my pick). She actually starts the conversation by outright telling you she's not interested in the ring, even before you offer it, and you need to pick extra dialogue options to get her to reconsider. She's concerned about the high price of breaking the bond, given she doesn't believe there can be any guarantee neither of you will ever turn on each other, especially given she's from Drakenhold and has previously made clear that if conflict ever breaks out between Cornia and Drakenhold again, she'll be on Drakenhold's side. Trying to reassure her that you'd never turn on her fails utterly; she basically calls you naive and walks away (though you can still select her to try again after this, slightly disappointingly). Telling her that's a risk you're willing to take if it means spending you life with her is what gets through to her - she clearly both respects how bold you're being and wasn't expecting you to harbor feelings that strong for her, and this leads to the only version of the scene that I saw where Alain outright asks her to marry him, rather than just implying it, and ends with a much more touching scene between them than the rest that I watched. Compared to that, the rest of the scenes I watched were fairly ho-hum, particularly Nina and Aramis.

As for the ending itself, I'm not entirely sure what the point of the reveal with Queen Illenia was. Just to provide that last branch to the ending, I guess? But it kind of raises some questions they don't address, such as why she doesn't look like she's aged at all in the last decade, or why Alain would be being crowned King if the rightful Queen is still alive. Sure, she could choose to abdicate for him, but the issue isn't addressed at all when it probably should be. Speaking of the branching ending though, even though freeing Galerius' soul (and saving Illenia) is obviously the better ending, I did rather like the "striking Gallerius down" ending scene, very dramatic and cool. If that one didn't leave Baltro as a major hanging plot thread, I'd almost prefer it.

Also, yeesh, I really don't get the point of dumping all those new characters on you in the post-game bonus mission - especially not the couple of them that were pretty minor villains who don't even have a unique class. There's nothing left to do with them after that mission, the game doesn't have any sort of New Game+, and even if you had saved side-quests for after you'd gotten them you'll be over-leveled and steamroll them without trying, since everybody from that mission is joining you with their level already in the 40s and nothing scales in this game. Just a bizarre design choice to me, it doesn't make any sense.

Part of me kind of whats to start another run of the game now, crank the difficulty up, recruit the few characters I missed (the Rogue and his Archer buddy from early in Cornia, the Cleric from the first mission of Darkenhold, and the Wyvern Knight you can't get without said Cleric), experiment with different teams, etc. But this game is long, and I've just come playing two other 100+ hour RPGs in Persona 3 Reload and Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth, so I'm not entirely sure I want to do a second run of another long RPG right now. Especially with Stellar Blade about to come out next week.

[tonberrian]

You know, the game could have done something very silly in The Priestess Abducted. They could have let you kill Galerius the first time you fight him, and then use that to set up someone else. But alas.