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2024-04-10, 05:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Loser of Total War: Rise of Kingdoms
as
The Astral Collective
Winner of Total War: Hanrui 3
as
The Four Courts of Hanrui/The Equinox League
Plausible Victor of Total War: Pricipia
as
The Chrysaorian Hegemony
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2024-04-10, 05:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2023
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- #30228, ifMUD; USA really
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2024-04-10, 05:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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2024-04-10, 05:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2023
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- #30228, ifMUD; USA really
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
I think flat has become our champion.
Also I did give Athedia a temporary boost last night, but all the stealing may have invalidated it.
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2024-04-10, 05:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2015
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Overcoming Evil
Don't have much time, but can confirm nothing new from Book yet. What's been posted in thread are the only indicators of minor or major injuries.
Haikus were just to play off of AV. No mechanics there.
I felt pocketed by the Kraken/Caedorus arrangement yesterday, but I'm no longer thinking that.
I'll ask Book about my current injuries and will report any other events of note.
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2024-04-10, 06:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2023
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- #30228, ifMUD; USA really
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2024-04-11, 05:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2019
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Yeah, story-wise flat is definitely a better choice than me for healing.
Let's see.
Thirteen players. One dead wolf. One Snowblaze.
flat_footed is confirmed town by flip. MerelBlackbird self-resolves atp and I'm willing to assume she's town until and unless we have evidence her healing failed. 3SecondCultist has a verified power and a roleclaim that fits with that power and has been pretty towny besides. Caedorus is the same except claiming neutral and the verification only holds if you're me or if you trust me sufficiently (there are some things I'm confused about concerning both of the above but I don't think digging into them publicly is the right play atp.)
That's the "I would be very surprised if there were wolves in the above tier" pile.
The "everyone else" pile consists of AvatarVecna, Xihirli, Dakrsidder, Let'sGetKraken, Cazero, Athedia and CaoimhinTheCape. There are probably at least two wolves in that pile. I have mechanical evidence that mildly indicates Cazero is town, which combined with his being the fourth vote on Persolus means I'm not interested in killing him today.
(Sidenote: I have a new 3SC theory now which would make some things make more sense, but revealing it is probably not a good idea.)
(Do I have time for ISOs? Should I be doing ISOs? Am I going to do ISOs? Maybe, not if I have sensible priorities and probably respectively.)I'm writing stuff, come and read it!
Werewolf games won: 24
Werewolf games lost: 14
Games as town: 23.5
Games as neutral: 5.5
Games as wolf: 9
Games narrated: 1
Deaths: 17
Extended Signature
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2024-04-11, 11:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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2024-04-11, 12:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2015
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- Behind you. RIGHT NOW.
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
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2024-04-11, 12:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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2024-04-11, 01:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2014
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
I think I'm going to park a vote on
Xihirli.
I'm also of the opinion that actual healing shall be reserved for mechanically cleared town, wich right now is just flat_footed.Last edited by Cazero; 2024-04-12 at 12:28 PM.
Yes, I am slightly egomaniac. Why didn't you ask?
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Originally Posted by Fyraltari
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2024-04-11, 01:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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- Canada
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
You were reportedly attacked at night. I don't know why on earth Persolus would have carried the night attack, but it's entirely possible someone interfered with the attack, and also plausible - though unlikely - that the wolves' target was protected. We have only your word for it.
You verifying Cultist's ability only matters so long as you're not trying to wagon him, and is a good method of pocketing town.
And being straightforward and helpful is good wolf behavior.
Look, none of this makes you a wolf - I think you're probably town - but Snow's alignment has been confirmed by multiple people, which could be a grand wolf conspiracy or plausibly pocketing, but it feels legit.
If anyone else is curious, I have left three hints about my role, one of which reveals what it is, the other two talking about it more general terms.
But if Snow is going to shoot me, let me know and I will explicitly claim.Loser of Total War: Rise of Kingdoms
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The Astral Collective
Winner of Total War: Hanrui 3
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The Four Courts of Hanrui/The Equinox League
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2024-04-11, 01:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
I also think I know something about Caz's identity btw. Not sure if it makes me trust him more or not but there is that. Do we still have a day left?
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2024-04-11, 01:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2022
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Past that point by now, but I'll just say there was another avenue under which you could've gotten an idea of whether Merel was likely town. They mentioned using an attack aspect on Persolus N1, so assuming the 3 minor injuries came from lynch, which flat_footed would know from how much damage he took, then it would've done 1-2 major injuries. From there, it would be finding out how much damage said aspect did and asking if anyone else used one, plus how much it inflicted.
Additionally, I personally think you guys are putting pressure on the wrong people. As far as those in the everyone else pile, I still think Athedia and Xihirli are the most likely to not be wolves. Personally, I'd say Caoim and AV are by a small margin the best options, simply because I can't see a way to attribute even a modicum of town points to them yet. If Kraken claims, Im the next best option.
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2024-04-11, 01:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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2024-04-11, 01:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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- Canada
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
I agree with your assessment. AV is getting a pass by virtue of poetry, from what I can tell, and Cao has done nothing giving him points other than not pivoting onto the wagon I poorly championed last-minute... which risked Persolus, but he never voted him.
SoCaohimn, for pressure.
I'm definitely not opposed to claiming, but a) I want to see if people can put it together from the frankly way too subtle hint and b) I have other reasons for only wanting to claim at a certain time.
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We do, yes. I'm hoping to have more activity this evening.Last edited by Let'sGetKraken; 2024-04-12 at 01:11 PM.
Loser of Total War: Rise of Kingdoms
as
The Astral Collective
Winner of Total War: Hanrui 3
as
The Four Courts of Hanrui/The Equinox League
Plausible Victor of Total War: Pricipia
as
The Chrysaorian Hegemony
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2024-04-11, 02:23 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2022
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Last go round? If youre referring to the 2nd cycle, I voted Merel as there were no other leads and no explanation was offered for the 1st cycle vote. If youre referring to the 1st cycle until it was broken last second, there was a 3-way tie, and I didnt want to break it; I wanted to see how itd resolve, especially since Providence is generally in favor of town, plus my guess was as good as any for who the wolf was.
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2024-04-11, 02:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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- Keystone of the USA
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2024-04-11, 03:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2019
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
First question: a) I haven't paid enough attention to you, and b) I'm deliberately setting a very high bar to be removed from POE, I want to make sure it's actually a reliable one for once. I don't think you're particularly likely to be a wolf, though.
Second question: 3SC's mysterious source claims I'm town, Caedorus has evidence supporting the fact I'm town, I'm claiming the fact I have a vig shot and trying to use it in a pro-town way, I was attacked at night.
Right, let's do this properly then.
Could AvatarVecna, CaoimhinTheCape, Dakrsidder, Let'sGetKraken and Xihirli please answer the following questions:
- why shouldn't I shoot you? (Don't answer this by claiming, unless you think claiming is optimal anyway. I will declare who I intend to shoot in ~10-14 hours to give time for a claim.)
- which two of the above names do you think are most likely to be wolves? Why?
- do you townread any of the above names? If so, who and why?
- do you suspect anyone outside the above names? If so, who and why?
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ISOing Kraken to try and track down hints about his Name. No luck so far, but I found this and want to talk about it.
So there's a list of people who could have been trying to save Persolus that 3SC made. Kraken and AV are the only names in my POE that are also in that list.
I do think Kraken has been pretty towny in a vacuum from skimming through his ISO but also. There's a voice in the back of my mind now wondering about whether I should really have discarded that Kraken/Xihirli world, and the "town!Kraken implies town!Xihirli, town!Xihirli implies town!AV" reasoning I had at one point.
(I will say that neither of those implications are fully watertight. The first I never actually did the work to check (I should do that, shouldn't I?) and the second is literally "I trust Xihirli's ability to read AV, Xihirli says AV is town".)
So there's a world where some combination of Kraken/AV/Xihirli are wolves. There's a world where my implications are valid and Caoimhin/Dakrsidder are wolves. There's a world where I'm misclearing one of Athedia/Cazero or even one of the others.
(There's also the wolf!Merel world but I think the way she's handled the claim thing and the healing thing has been towny so I'm working under the assumption we're not living in that world unless it turns out the healing hasn't worked.)
Though there's also the potential for mixed worlds, overlap, this is not as black and white as I'm setting out. I'm just rambling incoherently at this point, aren't I?
Eh. Whatever.
I don't want to shoot Kraken, because I do think he's been towny. I don't want to shoot AV because I trust the Xihirli implication.
Down to three names, then.
Xihirli/CaoimhinTheCape/Dakrsidder
My gut has an answer to the question of which of those three I should shoot. I don't know if I should trust my gut here.
Oh, huh, just remembered I'm still voting Merel.
unvote.
Will vote once I've decided and announced who I'm shooting.
- - - Updated - - -
Skimmed through Athedia.
Have a fairly confident guess for her Name. Will note if I'm right it doesn't exactly guarantee she's town given [redacted] but given the claim of being attacked N1 (which I think? is likely to be wolves' doing unless we have anyone other than Persolus who received a major injury or [also redacted]) I'm definitely okay with putting her in the "can be town until we have strong evidence existing POE is wrong" pile.I'm writing stuff, come and read it!
Werewolf games won: 24
Werewolf games lost: 14
Games as town: 23.5
Games as neutral: 5.5
Games as wolf: 9
Games narrated: 1
Deaths: 17
Extended Signature
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2024-04-11, 04:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2013
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- Canada
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
According to you. I'm giving this the same weight I'm giving Athedia's claim - a good deal, but not absolute. Especially if what Caedorus says is true, he took a wound protecting flat last night - meaning that two people were attacked. Very possible in a game where wolves don't have an immediate kill.
I realize I'm supposed to be convincing you not to kill me, but still. It'd be remiss if we treated this as absolute.
Don't shoot me because a) I got Caedorus to townside (for now, at least) b) I was able to help validate Cultist's power usage c) I made a mistake D1 but I am town and I am still learning from the experience d) I am being solvy enough to be useful even if you think I'm suspicious and d) I really want to do the dramatic thing later. Three of the five hints I've given pertain to what this dramatic thing is, in a way.
I've given a pretty extensive explanation of my reads. Of those, AV and Cao are really skating by here. Dakrsidder would be my third pick - "let it random D1 when a wolf is on the line" is risky but not above suspicion, especially if there was vote manipulation in play that wasn't sufficient. Xihirli would have meant that wolves were totally unconcerned with a W/W wagon until 1.5 hours before the end of D1, which I just don't see happening.
In regards to your ISO, that last line is why I think Xihirli is town. I think it's very solid logic but I have zero mechanical evidence to back it up.
I think Merel has a deeply suspicious name, and if for whatever Flat isn't healed, she should be the next Yeet.
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Speaking of which, flat? Know you're busy, but anything to report on the boost side?Last edited by Let'sGetKraken; 2024-04-11 at 04:42 PM. Reason: Spellcheck
Loser of Total War: Rise of Kingdoms
as
The Astral Collective
Winner of Total War: Hanrui 3
as
The Four Courts of Hanrui/The Equinox League
Plausible Victor of Total War: Pricipia
as
The Chrysaorian Hegemony
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2024-04-11, 05:08 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2023
- Location
- #30228, ifMUD; USA really
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Book reports to me that the powers only resolve at the end of a phase, and I have to use them one at a time. So I am on heal now, strengthen at night. The heal will take effect when night starts.
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2024-04-11, 05:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2022
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- Surely not here?!?
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
...I'm not entirely sure what you're talking about, but the wolves' target was very likely protected because it seems likely that my major injury didn't appear all out of itself
Still on the fence about whether the aspect I stole directed the damage to me or the wolves just went "oh he's protecting who we want to kill let's kill him instead"Quotes
I play W/W Mafia! I still claim I was Town all along! Believe me!
Spoiler: Idea stolen from Snowblaze
W/W games lynched d1: 3
W/W games played (excludes spectating) total: 10
W/W games won: 6
W/W games lost: 5
W/W games narrated: 0
W/W games spectated: 4
W/W games as wolf: 2
W/W games as Town: 6
W/W games as Neutral: 2
W/W games as Other: 0
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2024-04-11, 05:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Sorry, I mean that N1, if we have a roleblocker or voider, they probably targeted the confirmed wolf who was not dead. Knowing this, I don't know why the wolves would have Persolus carry the kill. But it's possible they did and it was blocked, so Athedia could safely claim to be attacked. Is that likely? No. But certainly possible.
Loser of Total War: Rise of Kingdoms
as
The Astral Collective
Winner of Total War: Hanrui 3
as
The Four Courts of Hanrui/The Equinox League
Plausible Victor of Total War: Pricipia
as
The Chrysaorian Hegemony
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2024-04-11, 06:05 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2015
- Location
- Behind you. RIGHT NOW.
- Gender
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
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I post short stories in the middle of every month, and if you want to follow my novels as theyre edited and written, you can join as a patron!
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2024-04-11, 07:34 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2017
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Sorry, I haven't been paying as much attention to the game as I should have. Doing my catch up with this post, but first impression is that I don't like the idea of suspecting someone for their role name. If the game were set up that way, it would give an advantage to anyone who has read the source material and would make the game really easy to solve (without fake claims).
- I honestly don't have any good reason I can give you. I know I'm town, but I also don't really have anything to point at in thread to convince you of that.
- Out of those 5 names, AV and Dakrsidder. It's mostly process of elimination. Kraken just seems town from posts. I must have missed why you're suspecting him. Xi gets points for being the wagon opposite Persolus for a while. Less confident on Xi than Kraken. I don't really have a feel for the other two this game - Dakrsidder being new plus I don't remember much of what they had for reads. AV has been AV, which hasn't necessarily turned into town points for me.
- of the above names, Town read Kraken due to what I feel are good posts.
- I would have to have reads/a handle on the game for that. No one in particular jumps out at me. I'm keeping an eye on Merel but that will likely resolve soon anyway.
I don't have any more in me right now, but I'll see if I can read over the thread in the morning.Avatar by AstralSeal
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2024-04-11, 08:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2011
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
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2024-04-11, 10:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2010
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- Canada
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Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Alright, so I mean based on this post it's probably safe to say Kraken and Cao aren't W/W. It's a soft unpairing, but I don't think a wolf would go this far to alleviate suspicion on a fellow wolf, especially when the one doing the speaking hasn't really been under the microscope. Overall, I read this post as hedgy. Shrugging and saying 'I'm town' means nothing, but there is no real analysis here. They say they're busy, but I am getting a vague gut sensation here.
(Keep in mind that my gut is wrong about 110% of the time)
I've also had quite a busy few days and haven't had the time to get into more solving since my claim. To help those good souls putting in an effort, my general reads list with a few supporting details:
Townreads: Snowblaze (barring a real bastard mechanic, she is cleared for me), Kraken (if he's a wolf, he's been doing a damn good job since the start of the game), Merel (waiting to be resolved, if the powers don't go through she's almost certainly scum), flat_footed (town-cleared by flip), 3SecondCultist (hi).
I need to go back and read through Kraken's posts to figure out what Name he seems to be hinting obliquely at. If I can do that and the pattern holds, it's a good look for him. A softclaim from D1 would do a lot to alleviate my suspicions - since that requires some setup that would be risky for a wolf to pull off - but I wouldn't put it past wolf!Kraken to think that far ahead and anticipate that only about 1/3 of the active players have an in-depth knowledge of Guide as a serial.
Neutral: Caedorus. I believe the Thief claim more now upon reviewing his posts. While the Thief does have a Villain name, it's the kind of role in a mafia game that would best as a Neutral. The Aspects I believe he has make sense from a mechanical standpoint.
Needs further review: Cazero (I can see Caz as a wolf, any chance you want to comment on the evidence you found to exonerate him Snowblaze?) AV, Athedia, Xihirli (someone else do this one please),
Wolfreads: Dakrsidder, Cao, Persolus (may he never return).
A note for posterity: this post feels pretty scummy. At first I couldn't figure out why, but looking back I think it's because it splits up the POE of some of folks' wolfreads into two groups, leaving open some options and telling town to 'put pressure' on them without actually voting for either of the people they claim are the 'best options'. It's a great post for a wolf to point at later and say they drew suspicion to a flipped buddy without actually starting a wagon.
I'll put my vote onCaonow so that there's an actual wagon. If Cao flips wolf, Kraken is likely just town and Dakrsidder will have some explaining to do.
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Okay I read through all of Kraken's posts and I have a super vague, half-formed notion as to what he might be. But I'm definitely wrong.Last edited by 3SecondCultist; 2024-04-12 at 07:21 AM.
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An ongoing web serial about politics, vengeance, and miniature lizards. Go check it out!
"Life is to be lived, not controlled; and humanity is won by continuing to play in the face of certain defeat."
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2024-04-11, 11:10 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Day one, visitor.
My fate: minor injury.
No other effect.
Night one, visitors.
One is the same as before,
But also two more.
They bring injury,
But I could not be sure who.
No other effect.
Day two, nobody.
My fate: as of yet, unchanged.
My concerns abate.
Night two, visitor.
The same from first day and night.
But no injury.
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Cazero's Graduates Of Hope's Peak - Danganronpa Mafia
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2024-04-11, 11:24 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2022
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
I have pretty much answered these in earlier posts
I didn't vote because it seemed more scummy for me to wagon when my actions were only marginally less suspicious, hence why I listed myself as the next best option; don't have much else to offer
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2024-04-11, 11:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: A Small Wager A Practical Guide to Evil
Spoiler: D1 VotesOriginally Posted by EoD1 Wagons
Based on Persolus,
Unlikely that my own wounds
Due to votes/wagons.
Based on my info,
One visitor is town vig
With a night power.
Night power is safe.
They visited on both nights,
But I was hurt once.
Basic conclusion:
Day injury from dayvig.
Night injury, not.
Other visitors
Caused the second injury.
But just one of them.
I know which one harmed,
Because the other just watched,
But saw Snow instead.
They're looking for me,
But I had hidden myself
Away, behind her.
That means injury
Is from the third visitor.
...but are they below?
I think they're above,
But mama didn't raise no snitch.
Secret's safe with me.
Night two, I hide again.
This time, behind the player
Who visited me thrice.
If their night power
Does no harm to their target,
They would find themself.
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Cazero's Graduates Of Hope's Peak - Danganronpa Mafia
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew