Barbarian Berserker with One DnD Exhaustion Rules, thoughts?

[Wardog442]

Hi all, I'm playing a Half-orc Barbarian in about a month. We're starting at level 3 and with a free feat; I'm taking Orcish Ferocity. Given that the DM has decided on using the new One DnD rules (-1 on Attacks, Saves, Ability Checks per exhaustion level) I feel like I've been given the opportunity to once again play what comes closest to my beloved Frenzied Berserkers (3.5E). That being said, the exhaustion rule still limits the amount of times I can Frenzy, the level 10 feature is god-awful, and then other barbarian sub-classes, do less attacks but are able to take GWP, increasing their damage and potentially getting a free attack on their bonus action if they get a killing blow, which should be pretty often considering you could do 1d12+16 at level 3, at the cost of -5 to hit.

That being said, from a optimization stand point, what are your thoughts on a Path of the Berserker Barbarian in a campaign that uses the One DnD exhaustion rules (detailed above)? How would it compare to other builds, such as a Path of the Zealot Barbarian? Lastly, I'm open to playing other sub-classes like the Bear Totem or Wild Magic. Combat aside, I've got a great concept for roleplay, which is what at the end of the day matters most, but I also love to meet the middle ground and be able to crush enemies in combat.

Thanks!

[Kane0]

There was a One DnD berserker in the same playtest set, round 7 i believe. The fear effect got changed to a bonus action and the BA attack with exhaustion became a straight once per turn extra damage. Some other minor things too i think?

[Psyren]

1) To answer your main question - yes, if you use the OneD&D exhaustion then the 2014 Berserker becomes somewhat less painful, since you can go above 2 exhaustion levels without functionally crippling your character in combat. (For most characters, 3 levels of exhaustion or more you might as well sit out the combat.)

This is not to say that -3 to every d20 roll you make is a walk in the park either, let alone more - but depending on the difficulty level of your encounters and your buffs/items, it'll usually be a bit more manageable than permanent disadvantage, half-HP or being immobile.

2) I second Kane0's post - if your table is okay with using playtest rules, just go whole hog and dump the 2014 Berserker entirely in favor if its 2024 counterpart. The fact is that the Berserker's primary benefit, a repeatable bonus action attack, was viewed as dangerously powerful back when the game was released (hence all the restrictions on e.g. the Monk) but the game's power level and overall design are such that it isn't really a big deal - and as you noted, available from other sources - so the 2024 subclass being reworked to provide different benefits makes sense.

[Wardog442]

There was a One DnD berserker in the same playtest set, round 7 i believe. The fear effect got changed to a bonus action and the BA attack with exhaustion became a straight once per turn extra damage. Some other minor things too i think?

Unfortunately, its a no-do for playtest content from One DnD. The DM for the most part only likes to use 5E and UA (even tho its virtually the same thing).

[Wardog442]

1) To answer your main question - yes, if you use the OneD&D exhaustion then the 2014 Berserker becomes somewhat less painful, since you can go above 2 exhaustion levels without functionally crippling your character in combat. (For most characters, 3 levels of exhaustion or more you might as well sit out the combat.)

This is not to say that -3 to every d20 roll you make is a walk in the park either, let alone more - but depending on the difficulty level of your encounters and your buffs/items, it'll usually be a bit more manageable than permanent disadvantage, half-HP or being immobile.

2) I second Kane0's post - if your table is okay with using playtest rules, just go whole hog and dump the 2014 Berserker entirely in favor if its 2024 counterpart. The fact is that the Berserker's primary benefit, a repeatable bonus action attack, was viewed as dangerously powerful back when the game was released (hence all the restrictions on e.g. the Monk) but the game's power level and overall design are such that it isn't really a big deal - and as you noted, available from other sources - so the 2024 subclass being reworked to provide different benefits makes sense.

I wish, but the option is out. And honestly I'd go for Zealot Barb at this point, but then my party of 6 doesn't have any ****ing class that can cast Revivify at level 5 lol. Closest thing will be the ranger at level 9 assuming he doesnt multi-class, effectively negating one of the Zealots features he can capitalize on.

[Psyren]

In that case, to answer your other questions:

3) Even with the less punishing exhaustion drawback - Zealot, Totem/Wildheart and Wild Magic (and Beast/Giant) are superior to 2014 Berserker. All you need to defeat Berserker's primary benefit is to pick up PAM or TWF Style or even GWM, and from there the othters blow it away. (Skip Dual-Wielder, it's arguably a trap - use light weapons like Scimitars instead.)

4) While I don't know what roleplay concept you have in mind, chances are that it can be made to fit with one or more of the other, better subclasses instead. Berserker is, after all, the most generic/boilerplate Barbarian of the lot; it was the one chosen for Basic for a reason.

[Kane0]

Dont forget Beast and Giant barbarian too, both good options

[Psyren]

Dont forget Beast and Giant barbarian too, both good options

Added them in while I was fixing a typo

[Wardog442]

Thanks for all the feedback you two. I'm definitely going to roll with something else. While looking at alternatives, I recalled an old character concept I was unable to play thoroughly due to the campaign ending abruptly and early. Simply put, it was a Centaur Elk Totem Warrior, with Mobile as the free Feat. He could move 65 feet per round at level 3, run 30 feet into an enemy and attack twice (first with your weapon, second with hooves if you landed the first hit), and then run away (w/o provoking AoO thanks to mobile) and gain distance before attacking again in the next round. I'm debating whether or not to swap Mobile with Crusher; you lose 10 move speed, but gain the +1 STR (so 18 STR since day 1 of the campaign), the ability to push the enemies away after hitting them with either my weapon or hooves (to avoid AoO). Level 4 would be Athlete to remove the penalty Aquine Build gives (Climbing doesn't cost you extra movement), and level 8 likely Skilled to cap off STR at 20. Alternatively I could go with Mobile to start, then Athlete for 18, and +2 STR ASI at level 8 to reach 20. It's obviously not optimized for damage, but rather hit and run tactics like a Cavalier.

Besides that I've also thought of:
-Zealot with GWP: the downside to this is that, while it is a great combo, we do not have anyone in the party that can cast Revivify until LEVEL 9 (a Ranger), which means the level 3 feature doesn't receive any use should I die.
-Classic Bear Totem Warrior for its tankyness w/ GWP. The only thing I don't like about it is that while its arguably the most played barb subclass, it is only the one we've seen most at my table, so I kinda didn't wanna do a repeat.
-Wild Magic - What I don't like about it is its lack of scaling, as well as annoyance of potentially having to ask for saves depending on the effect I roll, as well as the damage being typically 1d6.
-Beast - it's awesome with its 2 claw attacks, but things like not being able to use magical weapons in the future is a down side to it. You could grow a tail or a jaw, but it kinda loses its magic at that point.

[Kane0]

You could use a lance with the piercer feat, that would be pretty funny on a centaur barbarian

[Dr.Samurai]

Hi all, I'm playing a Half-orc Barbarian in about a month. We're starting at level 3 and with a free feat; I'm taking Orcish Ferocity. Given that the DM has decided on using the new One DnD rules (-1 on Attacks, Saves, Ability Checks per exhaustion level) I feel like I've been given the opportunity to once again play what comes closest to my beloved Frenzied Berserkers (3.5E). That being said, the exhaustion rule still limits the amount of times I can Frenzy, the level 10 feature is god-awful, and then other barbarian sub-classes, do less attacks but are able to take GWP, increasing their damage and potentially getting a free attack on their bonus action if they get a killing blow, which should be pretty often considering you could do 1d12+16 at level 3, at the cost of -5 to hit.

That being said, from a optimization stand point, what are your thoughts on a Path of the Berserker Barbarian in a campaign that uses the One DnD exhaustion rules (detailed above)? How would it compare to other builds, such as a Path of the Zealot Barbarian? Lastly, I'm open to playing other sub-classes like the Bear Totem or Wild Magic. Combat aside, I've got a great concept for roleplay, which is what at the end of the day matters most, but I also love to meet the middle ground and be able to crush enemies in combat.

Thanks!

I actually like the Berserker, warts and all.

If you're okay not having your 3rd level feature in every encounter, that goes a long way in coming to terms with the subclass. And as someone that has played a long term Bear Totem barbarian, I can assure you that there will be many encounters where your 3rd level feature does not come into play at all because there is no energy damage. So if you are okay with that, then keep the Frenzy for encounters that you are pretty sure are going to be tough and challenge your mobility in particular, and that's because you can use your Action to break free from restraints or Dash as needed and still attack with your Bonus Action. So you either have a guaranteed bonus action attack, or the freedom to move around despite difficult terrain and other obstacles and still attack the enemy.

The level 6 feature is a life-saver when it is relevant, and I think it's one of the stronger level 6 features across barbarian subclasses. This is a major weakness for barbarians so covering that up reduces the pool of "things that can ruin your day" to an even smaller group of monsters.

The level 10 feature is great out of combat, as it imposes Disadvantage on key skills during social encounters (Perception, Insight, Deception). In combat it can still be useful, as you don't need a big charisma modifier for monsters to fail their save (not every monster is rocking a big wisdom save modifier), and unlike most other Fear effects the enemy doesn't get to save against it each round. So long as you use your Action each turn you keep them Frightened, which can keep a big melee monster out of combat and with Disadvantage on whatever paltry ranged attack it might have, and you can still attack as a Bonus Action if you're Frenzying. Combined with the Mobile feat, you can harry an opponent that can't move forward to hit you back, and has to either resort to a (likely weaker) ranged attack or readying an action to attack when you close in, either with Disadvantage, and the Readied Action doesn't allow for Multiattack.

And the level 14 feature is practically another guaranteed attack and use of your Reaction.

If you're using the 1D&D Exhaustion rules, I would definitely give the Berserker a shot. I still wouldn't spam Frenzy, but it's a little easier to deal with than Disadvantage and moving at half speed. I'm not sure if I prefer the penalties to rolls over the OG Exhaustion honestly, have to play around with it.