Arena Tournament, Round 35: Llince vs Grushnak

[Uthug]

Sorry for interrupting here but there was something I thought I should point out. Since Grushnak is being threatened by Llince, shouldn't he receive a +5 bonus on his will save, which means that he passes it and is not charmed?

[LtKeen]

Well the charm spell happened when we reestablished LoS, and we weren't really within each other's threat range, or even attacking when LoS was established. Also nothing else was in LoS. Whether or not Grushnak is being threatened by the definition of Psionic Charm Person though, would be up to a ref. I assumed it wasn't, given the circumstances.

I'll go fetch a ref though, just in case.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

I don't believe there's any strict ruling one way or the other on "threatening" someone. As this is an arena and the goal is to rip each other's face off and commit acts of nature on one another... I would say that... yes, you would get the +5 to your will save. There may be precedent ruling the other way, so if you are unsatisfied with my ruling, we can get another ref in here to weigh in on it.

[FlyMolo]

The question is what threatened means in this context. It does have a very specific meaning in combat.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

For the sake of simplicity, do you guys want to just keep playing it out as is... it seems as though you both are ok with the way it was going... even LtKeen defended the failure...

[Bayar]

High Ref Sam

I don't believe there's any strict ruling one way or the other on "threatening" someone. As this is an arena and the goal is to rip each other's face off and commit acts against nature on one another... I would say that... yes, you would get the +5 to your will save. There may be precedent ruling the other way, so if you are unsatisfied with my ruling, we can get another ref in here to weigh in on it.

Fixed it for you. Wow, my quotes are popular around here

Threaten means holding a weapon in a threatening mode, being in an adjactent square to another enemy and wielding a weapon does that. Threatened squares, remember ?

[FlyMolo]

"Okay, look. I don't really want to fight you, you don't really want to fight me. It hurts. Toss me your xbow and I'll meet you by the haystacks for a rousing game of Rock Paper Scissors."

Best of all, we're still in the middle of my turn.

[LtKeen]

From here
Speak
In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn’t your turn. Speaking more than few sentences is generally beyond the limit of a free action.
A few sentences, a few sentences =)

"I don't know about you, but I'm a goblin. We live for combat. How else do we stand out from our millions of brothers and sisters? Silly tall folk."

Finally, lol at Bayar's sig

[FlyMolo]

That's okay, I really just wanted to link to Tv tropes.

"Well, come the hell down and play some rock paper scissors! We can even play War if you've got cards on you."

[LtKeen]

I don't think that Grushnak would regard the emberling as friendly.

"Not now, I'm supposed to be fighting you.... though I can't bring myself to do it now. That moving crossbow eater, however..." clenching his fists a bit more tightly around his weapon, "He must be taken care of."

[Talic]

There is an arena precedent for Charm Person.

@refs:

Spoiler

Show

In the first match charm was used to win, the +5 bonus was denied because the caster had taken no threatening actions. By the SRD entry, I'd interpret "being threatened" beyond the "in a square that the player threatens". It should also include: Previously attacked this match, brandished weapons, intimidate, and the like. Posting by Chilligod in aforementioned match seems to support the brandished weapon directly.

[LtKeen]

so what's the ruling?

[Talic]

@refs:

Spoiler

Show

Actions which qualify as Llince or his ally acting in a threatening manner were taken in post 67 of this thread.

Grushnak gains the +5 bonus to his saving throw, on account of having been threatened/attacked by Llince or his ally this match.

[LtKeen]

that would make the overall result 19 (13 result, +1 compulsion, +5 circumstance), meaning the charm would've failed. The attempting charming happened on Llince's turn, which was after Grushnak's 10th Turn, so we should continue competing on whatever actions Llince will make for the remainder of his turn

[FlyMolo]

I resign. This isn't working, and I'd rather not drag this on longer than it needs to.

Good luck with Talic's Bobo. He's a beast.

The real question. Wipe the char and start over as a kineticist, or shoot for level-up?

[LtKeen]

This is getting pretty drawn out. I'm a bit eager to compete against someone with as much study into the game as Talic undoubtably has, and it was great match, Flymolo. If we ever meet in the Arena in the future, hopefully it won't be as tedious

Lessee, I used up all 3 tattoos, 2 potions of CLW, and 4 bolts, I'll update them when this match is declared


As for the question, I personally believe that you should just make a warmage. The orb spells don't require saves, only attack rolls. I'm not overly familiar with psionics, but I do know their strength shows at the higher levels, and all I see with a level 1 psion is complication. Maybe Wilder if you want to stay psionic, for the extra manifester level.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

Grushnak is the winner by way of forfeit.