Celia

[Scion_of_Darkness]

While I have loved the recent comics I have to say one thing has been bothering me. Ever since comic 529 Celia has been acting dumber and dumber. This is not the same type of stupid that characterizes Crystal or Thog, rather it is a type of ditzyness that has her:

• Clueless about human physiology
• Clueless about metaphors
• Despite arguing that destroying a dungeon full of monsters was right by virtue of being necessary (in the Azure City Trial) is unable to accept killing hobgoblins to escape Azure City
• Ignores warnings about avoiding the city (did we ever get a name for it?) from Haley
• Doesn't have any ability to read subtext (or plain text for that matter) in fliers
• Constantly distracted by irrelevant details ("A room for wigs", the chocolate bar, etc.)

The part that makes it more striking is that in 269 through 282 Celia is the Order's lawyer, and a good one at that. Her closing argument there was well thought out and effective.

[Hands_Of_Blue]

Ignores warnings about avoiding the city (did we ever get a name for it?) from Haley

Greysky City.

[Liwen]

I believe she appeared smart and usefull at the trial because it is her field of expertise. The truth is, to win a case you most often remove from your mind and argumentations the principles by which you go by in life to actually make it sound like it was ok for thr Order to blow up that mountain. She knows laws extremely well, but she never experienced field work that much before. I mean Durokan Sigle Guardian job seem more like a desk job than and actual guardian of something important you should defend with your life job.

I also have another theory. Rich has intended to show us how a real present day in our reality person would react if thrown in a medival life or death conflict between a buch of no lawful people. (I believe she is the ONLY character in Greyshy city who hasn't expressed chaotic behavior.) Celia a always been a very contemporary character. She wears suits and pink pyjamas, she is a girl studying in a field who used to be exclusive to males only a few decades ago. Hell, in her first apparence, she talkinh in a freaking CELLPHONE!

So yeah, I rest my case on that for now.

[Scion_of_Darkness]

While people who are outside their area of expertise may not be good at fighting, few would refuse a weapon to defend themselves in a war zone. And I think the average real person adapts to new situations much better than Celia does. In the very least they wouldn't spend time worrying about someones hair in such a situation.

[Grail]

Hopefully, the Giant kills her off soon. Her writing is the weakest of all the characters, she's not good as the straight man or as the comic.

[FrankNorman]

in her first apparence, she talkinh in a freaking CELLPHONE!

Hmmm... so that's not blocked by Dorukan's "Cloister" effect either.

Not that it would have helped with the characters current problems, as Hinjo's fleet would be way out of network coverage in the middle of the ocean.

[JaxGaret]

Think a little thing like the love of her life dying might have something to do with it? That can be a bit of a distraction, I've heard.

Also, as others have stated, one can excel in a professional field and also be not so competent at other things.

[Scion_of_Darkness]

Think a little thing like the love of her life dying might have something to do with it? That can be a bit of a distraction, I've heard.

Celia got over Roy's death in the same strip she heard about it.

[Grail]

Think a little thing like the love of her life dying might have something to do with it? That can be a bit of a distraction, I've heard.

Not when resurrection is plentiful. She even said so herself.

[Tempest Fennac]

I made a coment in another thread about how I disagreed with the ida that she's stupid good, but I'm inclined to retract that statement based on how she would apparently sooner soo Haley get killed then use violence in self defence (if "Good" would honestly apply to someone like that). It was especially laughable when Haley was willing to take most of the that when Celia claimed that she couldn't be raised (I think a Lesser Wish would take care of the lack of remains) considering how it was Celia's fault they were in the situation in the first place. I know that most of us would have similar problems in the scenario which Celia is in, but she really isn't helping herself by doing things like ignoring Haley about avoiding Greysky City (also, Celia can at least cast (up to at least) level 3 spells, so she is better equipped then we would be (unless Reiki would somehow be converted to infinite Touch of Vitality useage in D&D ).

[RosesOnConcrete]

Book smart, common sense deficient. I'm a college student, I'm surrounded by these types.

[Tempest Fennac]

That could be the case, Roses. The fact that Celia failed to notice what was going on when she first enteredGS is worrying, though: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0574.html . What would the DC (if any) be to spot all that anyway?

[Nof]

About the hair thing:

It's pretty common when you're stressed or panicked to focus your mind on a trivial subject in order to think to something else. I know I tend to do this.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=23

[TheRagi]

Well, Celia is an outsider, with almost no knowledge about human's habits, society and yes, phisiology. The only thing in common she has with mankind apparently is the legal system (and dating), she has no combat training, she's not an adventurer and works really well in pinpointing the controversy of the good characters being murderers and looters, while regular folk, well, aren't.

[Zordrath]

I agree with the OP. While Celia is not as absurdly dumb as Thog or the MitD, at least these characters never lecture other characters about how incredibly right and important their opinions are. That's what's most annoying about Celia to me. She's girly, stupid, incompetent and useless, but still has to tell others all the time how what they did was wrong. Celia is one of the very few characters in OOTS that hasn't got a single laugh out of me, and that's saying something.

On the other hand, I also thought a few strips ago the Giant had taken all the fun out of Belkar So I'm willing to see where he's going with Celia. I'm sure she's on board for a reason, but I don't see her staying forever.

[Tempest Fennac]

If Celia has faske character development, what do you think she'd be like?

[Greep]

Book smart, common sense deficient. I'm a college student, I'm surrounded by these types.

^This

It's not bad writing when "Celias" really do exist. We just think they're dumb ;)

[Optimystik]

Two words:

Damsel Scrappy.

[Scion_of_Darkness]

Book smart, common sense deficient. I'm a college student, I'm surrounded by these types.

As am I. However my problem is that they are practically making Celia into an Idiot Savant. She is a genius laws and legal affairs but she basically can't do anything else.

[gjp]

No offense but, you guys seem to really need some "serious character" / concrete thing going on... I take OOTS for what it is, a good story with plenty of humor aimed at D&D stereotypes...

it seems like you people expect some type of serious novel-esque fantasy book which is not what I interpret the author's intentions to be...

one of the big points of humor / stereotyping is juxtaposing some real positive / awesome point of a character to some other trait that isn't so good... it just so happens that it's funny because the opposing traits conflict with each other.

In other words, I think (Although I only understand the BASICS of AD&D which is enough to understand and appreciate this comic), that when you roll an optimal character you sometimes have to dump a stat (ie, charisma or something) in order to have better STR, WIS, INT, etc...

So, maybe stuff like this is Rich's jab at that fact..

[JaxGaret]

Not when resurrection is plentiful. She even said so herself.

Celia got over Roy's death in the same strip she heard about it.

Did I say that she was distracted because she was mourning him? No, I said that she was distracted by Roy's death, in that she is so focused on getting him back alive that it is affecting her judgment.

[Ave]

Hopefully, the Giant kills her off soon. Her writing is the weakest of all the characters, she's not good as the straight man or as the comic.

I still like her. I'm sure she will do better when Roy is back.

[Fri]

In my opinion, it's almost like Miko all over again. Giant accidentally, or inaccidentally, flanderize her. It's the act of taking a single (often minor) aspect of a character and exaggerating it more and more until it's huge and cartoonish and almost entirely consumes the character. Now we even somewhat already got the Celia lover/hater dichotomy, like with Miko previously.

[Quorothorn]

I made a coment in another thread about how I disagreed with the ida that she's stupid good, but I'm inclined to retract that statement based on how she would apparently sooner soo Haley get killed then use violence in self defence (if "Good" would honestly apply to someone like that). It was especially laughable when Haley was willing to take most of the that when Celia claimed that she couldn't be raised (I think a Lesser Wish would take care of the lack of remains) considering how it was Celia's fault they were in the situation in the first place. I know that most of us would have similar problems in the scenario which Celia is in, but she really isn't helping herself by doing things like ignoring Haley about avoiding Greysky City (also, Celia can at least cast (up to at least) level 3 spells, so she is better equipped then we would be (unless Reiki would somehow be converted to infinite Touch of Vitality useage in D&D ).

Hey, I personally would be a medium-level Bard/Ranger in OotS-land. STR 10, DEX 14, CON 12, INT 16, WIS 12, CHA 14. Or something.

...[*]Despite arguing that destroying a dungeon full of monsters was right by virtue of being necessary (in the Azure City Trial) is unable to accept killing hobgoblins to escape Azure City
...

In case you hadn't noticed, the Order was seriously worried that they might end up EXECUTED at that trial. I fail to see the problem in Celia employing whatever verbal gymnastics she felt were necessary in getting them acquitted. Your argument there is rather lacking in context.

[David Argall]

Hopefully, the Giant kills her off soon. Her writing is the weakest of all the characters, she's not good as the straight man or as the comic.

Well, he is unlikely to kill her off, but once Roy is raised, she may decide they have incompatible lifestyles.

But no, Celia is a fine character. She may not match Belkar for laughs, but she is good for the story.

[planswalker]

i think she's what i would call a "desk bumpkin". one who knows her job but when it actually comes to practical experience goes into mental shock. i've actually seen real life cases of this, though none quite so comedically thorough. I predict character growth for her as she becomes lest "bumpkinized".

[Assassin89]

There are plenty of potential lawsuits for Celia to file, which would devastate Bozzok further, if he doesn't die first.

1) Lawsuit against Grubbwiggler, which could impact the insurance policies.
2) Harassment suit against Yor? Bozzok could be liable as the employer

[Grail]

But no, Celia is a fine character. She may not match Belkar for laughs, but she is good for the story.

Everyone's tastes differ. I find her a tedius character who detracts from rather than adds to. Oh well, each to their own.

[Liwen]

There are plenty of potential lawsuits for Celia to file, which would devastate Bozzok further, if he doesn't die first.

1) Lawsuit against Grubbwiggler, which could impact the insurance policies.
2) Harassment suit against Yor? Bozzok could be liable as the employer

Something tells me that relying on law in this town isn't exactly the best call. We may only have seen the dark side of Greysky, maybe somewhere there are lawful people, however, is it extremely unlikely that they reprensent a dominant fraction of the overall population. Giving that this is still supposed to be a medival themed campaign, Greysky City and the surroundings follow the regional laws established by the people of the city itself.

I can see only a few reasonnably acceptable rules of conduct that you're are exactly obligated to follow, but a usually good tips on how to get along i.e. : how to not get yourself killed by pissed off the wrong peoples.

Such "laws" include :

1.Listen to the 18th level rogue with a huge sword a truly horrible puns "To make you cry!"

2. Stay away from anyone with an intelligence score off -infinite and a funky dagger as big as a short sword.

3. Double-cross, bribe, steal, murder all you want, but make sure that your actions are approved and favor the winning side of any bloody confrontation. And don't go back on the scene of the battle for no good reasons while the fight is still on.

4. If you are dumb enough to actually fall for one of the adds distributed by the psychopaths, at least have some kind of universally function backup plan like a teleportation scroll or a high level friend when you do realise you have screwed up completly.

5. Never say the following lines (or close variations) : "it's much sader here!" "I don't think we'll have any problems" "I AM INVINCIBLE" Your just asking for a Shoeless God to kill you.

6. and so on. This is starting to look like and overlord list, so I'll stop here.

The point is, they are no lawfully organised institution that actually tries to maintain law in this town. The police exist only to maintain a faint illusion of hope and keep the common folks under control. That's what the bribes are for.

[Scion_of_Darkness]

Something tells me that relying on law in this town isn't exactly the best call.

While I suspect that Assassin 89 was being sarcastic, you completely overlooked the complications involved with trying to sue a carrier criminal.