LGBTAitp - Part Nineteen

[Arachu]

Looking it up, the insult usage dates back to he nineteenth century while the usage as odd, not quite right or strange is centuries older.

On a related note, is it just me or do words that temporarily become insults against gender and sexuality have a tendency to force away the old meanings?

I am probably mistaken, but I thought I would ask.

What did it imply when it was originally insulting? It could be used to mean 'not quite right (in the head/mannerisms/etc.)'.

Come to think of it, that may have been the cause of its use as an insult... If it was, it's even less of one to me than it already was.

How queer...

Indeed, rather. :monocle:

Personally, I'm a Taurus. We don't believe in that mumbo-jumbo.(I really don't, but I've been sitting on that line for months

It seems that I'm a Virgo. I don't think I've ever wanted to headbutt my monitor before today.

Interestingly enough, the description for Virgo matches my ethics and the description for Pisces fits my personality (when I'm being nice). Eh, my worldview's too entropic to place much gravity on it.

[golentan]

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

[SiuiS]

Asexuality not a gender identity

Actually, "asexual" is also a term to indicate a being which has no sexual characteristics, and therefore is neither male or female. (I'm talking of sex and not gender; when talking about gender, the proper term is agendered.) While this is extremely unlikely to be found IRL, it is a semantically viable hypothetic "third gender".

I've actually been wondering the last few days. Do you suppose that the term and concept 'asexual' straddling so many semantic lines could be seen as fuel against there sing a difference between gender, sex and sexuality?

Miscellaneous

On New Year's Eve I went dancing in a gay club* with my friends & boyfriend! It was an extremely fun experience, completely different from what some "bigoted" members of the local gay community tried to convince me it was. Care to share your opinion on such things?

* Actually, it was a generic club which happened to hold a gay event

I'm curious; what did these bigoted community members try to convince you of?

What did it imply when it was originally insulting? It could be used to mean 'not quite right (in the head/mannerisms/etc.)'.

Come to think of it, that may have been the cause of its use as an insult... If it was, it's even less of one to me than it already was.

That's pretty much on the nose. As an insult, it is literally "I find you strange and incorrect as a human being." which is of course utter hogwash.

Indeed, rather.

Fixed 'er for ya ;3

It seems that I'm a Virgo. I don't think I've ever wanted to headbutt my monitor before today.

Interestingly enough, the description for Virgo matches my ethics and the description for Pisces fits my personality (when I'm being nice). Eh, my worldview's too entropic to place much gravity on it.

[Pseudoscience] [Theoretical]

Spoiler

Show

As a random tangent, and presupposing there is any actual value in astrology; most people tend to be bad scientists and dismiss the art based on sla small sampling of terrible evidence.

A person's astrological make-up consists of the entire sky system, and how they intercorrelate at the time of birth. A full star chart is a rather extensive document and while the sun sign is most visible, it's not the end all be all. The relationship between stars and planets is actually more important than any individual location.

Even though it's purposefully vague to allow leeway, a lot of full star charts tend to be surprisingly accurate. It's mostly coincidental I'm sure, but there is always value in noticing patterns and cycles, and working to change them for the better. Astrology is interesting as a paradigm that can be used when convenient, as a lens through which to examine trends. It's all in the presentation.

[Lord Raziere]

I'm a Gemini Water Rooster. got my astrological sign read by a guy who knows his astrological signs very well, mostly because he is well-versed in occult and mythological stuff in general, both western and eastern.

[Kindablue]

[Pseudoscience] [Theoretical]

Spoiler

Show

As a random tangent, and presupposing there is any actual value in astrology; most people tend to be bad scientists and dismiss the art based on sla small sampling of terrible evidence.

A person's astrological make-up consists of the entire sky system, and how they intercorrelate at the time of birth. A full star chart is a rather extensive document and while the sun sign is most visible, it's not the end all be all. The relationship between stars and planets is actually more important than any individual location.

Even though it's purposefully vague to allow leeway, a lot of full star charts tend to be surprisingly accurate. It's mostly coincidental I'm sure, but there is always value in noticing patterns and cycles, and working to change them for the better. Astrology is interesting as a paradigm that can be used when convenient, as a lens through which to examine trends. It's all in the presentation.

I use goat entrails, personally, but I've heard good things about star charts.

[Lix Lorn]

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

Well I'd say that courage and bravery are the same thing, and her last point is correct for different reasons.

It's not bravery, because bravery requires a CHOICE. It's always felt to me that I'm not choosing to be trans. I just am. The choice I have is whether to live wrong or to be brave enough to deal with the mess of changing things.

Of course, some people are okay with living as the wrong sex, so lucky them. xD

[noparlpf]

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

It seems like a decent FAQ on transsexuality (at least for transwomen, so far).

Edit:

Well I'd say that courage and bravery are the same thing, and her last point is correct for different reasons.

It's not bravery, because bravery requires a CHOICE. It's always felt to me that I'm not choosing to be trans. I just am. The choice I have is whether to live wrong or to be brave enough to deal with the mess of changing things.

Of course, some people are okay with living as the wrong sex, so lucky them. xD

I was going to nitpick #7 because I think it does take some bravery to come out or transition. In my opinion, courage is being scared poopless and doing it anyway. There are people who don't come out or transition because it's too scary (fear of rejection, abuse, etc.), even if being in the wrong kind of body is painful. There are some things that are too scary to do no matter how bad the alternative. For example, stick me at the top of a cliff. Stick, say, a zombie (or a horde or zombies for good measure; I could take one or two) up there with me. Actually wait I don't know where this is going because I'm not sure whether my fear of heights or my aversion to undead things is stronger. Okay, scratch that. Then torture me with physical pain (hot irons, knives, manual stimulation of free nerve endings, whatever) unless I jump off the cliff (say there's some way of surviving the jump, like water fifteen or twenty meters down or a bungee cord). I wouldn't jump.

[Arachu]

[Pseudoscience] [Theoretical]

Spoiler

Show

As a random tangent, and presupposing there is any actual value in astrology; most people tend to be bad scientists and dismiss the art based on sla small sampling of terrible evidence.

A person's astrological make-up consists of the entire sky system, and how they intercorrelate at the time of birth. A full star chart is a rather extensive document and while the sun sign is most visible, it's not the end all be all. The relationship between stars and planets is actually more important than any individual location.

Even though it's purposefully vague to allow leeway, a lot of full star charts tend to be surprisingly accurate. It's mostly coincidental I'm sure, but there is always value in noticing patterns and cycles, and working to change them for the better. Astrology is interesting as a paradigm that can be used when convenient, as a lens through which to examine trends. It's all in the presentation.

True. There's no good evidence against it, and it's as complicated as the EMR spectrum. I should probably check into it at some point, give that quantum stuff a break.

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

I just get a message warning me that I'm "leaving Facebook".

[Mutant Sheep]

I just get a message warning me that I'm "leaving Facebook".

Take the url it gives you on that page and use that. (or say continue. That works too.)

[Anethiel]

I've actually been wondering the last few days. Do you suppose that the term and concept 'asexual' straddling so many semantic lines could be seen as fuel against there sing a difference between gender, sex and sexuality?

I think that (at least in Italy) most people's knowledge of LGBT labels consists in "gay", "lesbian", "transsexual". Maybe "bisexual" if you're lucky.
If you use the word "asexual" (without elaborating), the possibility of the listener knowing its biological meaning of "sexless" will be greater than the possibility that the listener knowing the intended meaning, leading to probable confusion.
I don't know if this would help defending the thesis that there's no difference between gender/sex/sexuality that much. Semantically-based arguments are universally considered pretty weak, after all.

I'm curious; what did these bigoted community members try to convince you of?

They told me that gay clubs were indecent places, populated with only vain flamboyant f-words almost engaging in sexual acts in public.
While there was a minority of effeminated peoples (which didn't bother me in the slightest), and the event was a bit less chaste of your local church's raffle, that was clearly not the case. (By the way, I was pleasantly surprised to see that cisgendered males only composed 70% of the guests, tops.)

[Arachu]

Take the url it gives you on that page and use that. (or say continue. That works too.)

*dramatically slaps forehead*


I forget to mention; yesterday I was celebrating New Year's at my cousin's house, and I told my second cousin about my gender. She almost immediately started talking with my first cousins about names, and I was soon dubbed Trixie.

I like it.

[Lix Lorn]

I was going to nitpick #7 because I think it does take some bravery to come out or transition. In my opinion, courage is being scared poopless and doing it anyway. There are people who don't come out or transition because it's too scary (fear of rejection, abuse, etc.), even if being in the wrong kind of body is painful. There are some things that are too scary to do no matter how bad the alternative. For example, stick me at the top of a cliff. Stick, say, a zombie (or a horde or zombies for good measure; I could take one or two) up there with me. Actually wait I don't know where this is going because I'm not sure whether my fear of heights or my aversion to undead things is stronger. Okay, scratch that. Then torture me with physical pain (hot irons, knives, manual stimulation of free nerve endings, whatever) unless I jump off the cliff (say there's some way of surviving the jump, like water fifteen or twenty meters down or a bungee cord). I wouldn't jump.

I think I said that. I meant to say that. I said the opposite of that.
It's 3am and I've been a pale quadrant for the last two hours. X_x

[Serpentine]

Just saw "Police Academy" from 1984. Wow. Casual sexism and homophobia were really though of as funny back then.

Just shows how the morality of the time moves, I suppose.

And yet racism was a major theme So incogruous...

Sometimes I spontaneously start crying when I'm angry (or at any other time of high emotion) and that's super annoying. "You are not making me 'upset'! These are not tears of sadness! You are making me homicidally enraged!!"

Ugh, yes! I'm all "take me seriously, dammit! These tears are making me seem less serious, but I really am pissed off!" And it also gets me paranoid that the person making me angry, especially if they're male, will be all "quit turning on the waterworks just to make me the bad guy!" - and my last boyfriend actually confirmed that for me, I had to explain to him that I don't make myself cry, and if I could I would stop it because, as I said, it means I don't get taken seriously.

Did you free her? I'm oddly curious.

Of course. And it was her fairy nobles who imprisoned her and sent us off on a suicide mission, so she was pretty pissed.

I was wondering that as well, and whether or not the story was written down and had a chance of being shared.

Ooh, story! I vote for getting to read it too! :3

But but but that would mean having to write it out, and not only would it sound really dumb, it'd be really hard and time-consuming!
I might've put a summary in a thread I made a while ago about in-head-stories, though. If you like I'll do another overview, but it's pretty silly...

[Ashen Lilies]

Personally, I'm a Taurus. We don't believe in that mumbo-jumbo.(I really don't, but I've been sitting on that line for months

Yeah? Well I'm a... a... Libra. v.v

*shuffles uncomfortably out of thread*

[Mystic Muse]

I'm a Zergpony.

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

Thanks for the link! This might be very useful.

[Nix Nihila]

[Pseudoscience] [Theoretical]

Spoiler

Show

Even though it's purposefully vague to allow leeway, a lot of full star charts tend to be surprisingly accurate. It's mostly coincidental I'm sure, but there is always value in noticing patterns and cycles, and working to change them for the better. Astrology is interesting as a paradigm that can be used when convenient, as a lens through which to examine trends. It's all in the presentation.

Well, as someone who used to do quite a bit of cold reading, I can tell you that people tend to overestimate the accuracy of vague statements, often by a lot. You do have a point though.

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

I think I'm going to bookmark that. I even think I agree with her last point, although I think her analogy wasn't quite right.

[Skeppio]

So, skepchick did a nice article about transwoman myths. Thought I'd get your opinions.

Heh, I thought you meant me by "skepchick" when you posted that and thought "Odd, I don't recall posting an article like that..."
Isn't that a neat coincidence?

[Mutant Sheep]

Heh, I thought you meant me by "skepchick" when you posted that and thought "Odd, I don't recall posting an article like that..."
Isn't that a neat coincidence?

I thought the same thing for a minute or two.

[Coidzor]

Heh, I thought you meant me by "skepchick" when you posted that and thought "Odd, I don't recall posting an article like that..."
Isn't that a neat coincidence?

You hadn't heard of skepchick before?

[Worira]

I do like the idea of referring to any given woman by the first part of her name with -chick appended to it, though. We can do the same thing for men, but with -dude instead.

[Worira]

I do like the idea of referring to any given woman by the first part of her name with -chick appended to it, though. We can do the same thing for men, but with -dude instead.

[Skeppio]

You hadn't heard of skepchick before?

No, I haven't actually heard of it before, hence my confusion.

[Coidzor]

No, I haven't actually heard of it before, hence my confusion.

Hmm, need to make the rounds then.

[Astrella]

Second part is up as well. I found both parts to be really well written and I should probably memorize these points.

I do like the idea of referring to any given woman by the first part of her name with -chick appended to it, though. We can do the same thing for men, but with -dude instead.

A friend of mine does this, but with -kins instead of -chick.

[Anethiel]

I do like the idea of referring to any given woman by the first part of her name with -chick appended to it, though. We can do the same thing for men, but with -dude instead.

Aren't there enough problems with pronouns? This system would make referring to genderqueer people even more challenging! Though I suppose they would get to chose their own suffix.

[Little Brother]

I have an off-topic question:
How do people here feel about "owning" slurs? I know some people who dislike the idea, but I also know a guy(Trans-dude) who calls himself a "tranny" all the time, and several other people who do similar. I, personally, frequently refer to myself as a "flaming ***."

How do you people feel about it? Do you people do that?

[Reluctance]

In theory, I approve. Largely because I disapprove of the sorts of people who try to pare language down to nothing by getting their panties in a twist about word after word.

In practice, it depends on intent and company. Calling yourself a flamer with friends/people you reasonably expect to understand the context of, it's not a problem. If there's a reasonable risk of souring someone's day, which there generally is in unknown public spaces, keep it under your hat.

[Ashen Lilies]

It makes me vaguely uncomfortable. There's another queer dude in my year who, when I kinda-sorta-not-reall 'came out', would continuously refer to the both of us as '****' in the affectionate manner, until I told him to stop. I hear it too often used seriously to be able to take it in good humor.

Milder ones are okay though, as are the more lyrical ones like 'arsebandit'. 'Cause you know, they sound kinda funny.

But '***' pushes too many buttons to be bearable.

[Heliomance]

I do like the idea of referring to any given woman by the first part of her name with -chick appended to it, though. We can do the same thing for men, but with -dude instead.

What do you do about non-binary peeps then?

[Anethiel]

Such slurs only bother me when used derogatorily (as in, "that guy is such a f-word!") or as if they have an innate negative connotation (as in, "that's so gay"). This applies both to straight and queer people, even though when the culprit is straight I inform them that, while I'm not offended by his usage of that word, other people may be more sensitive to it and therefore they may want to avoid using it.