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2012-03-15, 12:58 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
In a bit of a pensive mood. Read a fair few fanfics lately and didn't really find anything I liked. They're also after the point of publishing and thus kinda past the point where I can suggest corrections.
I'm going to finish this essay (not really itself a comfort given how astoundingly politically incorrect the works I'm discussing are) and then catch up with the Mare in the Mirror. Are there any other fics in the works that people would like feedback on? I'm in a bit of a reviewing mood.
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2012-03-15, 02:12 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Have you played Persona 4? I have a crossover fic that's on hold at the moment because I'm busy with school. That and...well, something feels wrong about it to me. I'm pretty happy with what I have so far, but seems to be lacking something.
I'd appreciate it if you'd take a look.
http://www.equestriadaily.com/2011/0...t-chapter.htmlLast edited by RdMarquis; 2012-03-15 at 02:13 AM.
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2012-03-15, 02:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2005
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
hey thanqol, you ever decide to go through with that goofy pony mafia fic?
a tiny space dedicated to a beloved grandpa now passed. may every lunch be peanut butter-banana sandwiches.
i has 2/4 an internets.
old avatarsSpoiler
gnome_4ever:
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2012-03-15, 02:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Never played Persona. I'll give this a blind review though!
It's stewing. My mind is in a different alignment right now. It'll either be harvested for jokes or spun out into a complete work mentally. I feel like I'm making psychic progress on Easy as Lying so that stands a good chance of happening first.
I know how I'd structure it, I'm just not yet sure if that structure is any good or tells us anything we haven't been told before. Thanks for the reminder!
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2012-03-15, 03:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
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2012-03-15, 04:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Derby, UK
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2012-03-15, 06:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
The Midnight Chapter Review:
Spoiler
I got smoke in my soul and pistols on the drawer. Let's do this.
The opening feels weird. At a guess, this is going to be a bit that makes way more sense to people familiar with your source material. I'm not able to get much from it, but it didn't turn me off.
Twilight wound the scroll closed, feeling utterly dejected. The unicorn hated to question the judgment of somepony she respected so much (Twilight had made no attempt to avoid her move to Ponyville),
The train arrived at Ponyville Station in the early evening. As soon as she got off the train, she was greeted by a cheerful voice.
Twilight twisted her face into a scowl. “I hate it. As far as I’m concerned, the sooner I get to bed, the sooner it will be over and I can see the sun.”
Artemis’s eyes shone with tears, and her lower lip quivered. “W-why would you say that?”
“AHA!” Twilight cried triumphantly. “I knew it! You’re Princess Luna!
“I felt it was high time a certain nephew of mine learned about the responsibilities of the title he seems so eager to flaunt.”
Disregarding his breeding and inborn telekinesis,
I also feel really sympathetic for Blueblood in this, and that Celestia's been needlessly cruel. He's a nice guy in these paragraphs, even going so far as to thank somepony, so I sympathise with him. I feel like a moment to establish he's still a jerkwad, such as a brief scheme of taking over, would make the comedy funnier.
Far away, in a place shrouded by thick fog, something was watching the three ponies. It laughed, delighted that not even Celestia suspected anything was wrong with their present situation. To trot out an old cliché, everything was moving along as exactly as planned.
Overall p1 thoughts: I'm not convinced this story stands on it's own. You buy yourself a lot of slack by invoking creepy dream logic but you haven't fully capitalised on it. If it's reality, Celestia and Luna's actions don't make sense. If it's a dream, a cut to something as mundane as Blueblood abuse doesn't make sense.
P2:
The rest of the evening passed quickly. Tomorrow would be the first day of school, and Celestia wanted Twilight to get to bed early (wishing no offense to her little sister). Dinner, a simple affair of take out from a local restaurant, was interrupted by a message for the princess. The scroll, which teleported into the room, came from the Ponyville Police Department. Through means unknown to Twilight, Celestia obtained a post as one of their detectives. Evidently, during her stint as the town’s librarian, she had fallen in love with mystery novels and resolved to try her hand at this profession. Besides, this job presented an opportunity for a more hands on approach to maintaining peace within the borders of the nation.
I'm also really, really thrown by this paragraph. You've glossed over a lot of important stuff and conversations really fast. Again, I'm forced to conclude that this makes sense with the Persona setup but you haven't successfully applied ponies to the Persona setup here.
“Where am I?” Except for the red blocks beneath her hooves, all she could see was endless fog. Lacking any other options, Twilight decided to walk in a direction which felt “right”. Hours seemed to pass before she reached some sort of portal standing where the blocks ended. Plunged into the ground before it was a sword.
Dreams are complex things. Parts of your mind which don't normally work together function in tandem. Emotion blends into senses, senses blend into thoughts. There's no way to just have fog in a dream; it's tangled with fear, isolation, the desire to scream and being unable to. There's no way to have 'some sort of portal' in a dream. Some parts of it will be freakishly focused and some parts, like the monster emerging from it, utterly irrelevant even as they eat you alive.
I really dislike dull, blunt description for dreams like this. It kills the mood for me instantly. I recommend the Sandman comics, and the Mage: The Awakening sourcebook Astral Realms for a better understanding of writing dreams.
I'm utterly disengaged moving on as a result of this. I find the villainous voice the most nonthreatening thing. I said as much to Deadly, but there is literally nothing as nonthreatening as a monologue. Fluffy kittens are more threatening than a monologue. By having your villain monologue you've placed him firmly in the category of ineffectual Inspector Gadget villains.
“Teehee, no problem. It happens a lot, actually. I’m a little clumsy.”
Inside the classroom, her hopes for a teacher as kind and patient as Princess Celestia were dashed.
“swooning over each other like love-struck baboons”,
“I’m not here to comment on her politics, but if you’re the best she can dump into our laps, Her Majesty would be better off teaching kindergarten!”
Twilight glared at her. “Don’t talk about the princess that way.” It took quite a bit of effort on her part to avoid referring to Celestia as “my teacher”. But the unicorn knew she couldn’t risk anyone finding out the royal family had taken up residence in town.
Everypony fell silent as the two locked eyes in an impromptu staring contest. The sneer on Tongue Lashing’s face deepened. “Hmph. That’s it. You’re on my list, effective immediately.”
Her suitor did not handle rejection gracefully. “…Fine!” He stomped off, leaving the four ponies dumbfounded. One of the spectators added a tally to the halfway filled board he carried around. He then contemplated the piece of chalk in his hand and his cutie mark (a broken heart behind the yellow pegasus’s silhouette). What would happen to him if Fluttershy started dating? When she started dating? A terrible thought entered his head. If she never found love, his life’s purpose would main secure, wouldn’t it? But…could he do something so cruel?
“…Hi.” Twilight wasn’t about to complain about her new friends. But if Carrot Top suddenly declared herself one as well, she would have no choice but to subject herself to some tests and learn whether she had some innate friend attracting aura. “I’m Twilight Sparkle.”
Following Applejack’s example, Twilight chose Harry Trotter and the Philosopony’s Stone. The moment the clock struck midnight, she opened the book and began reading. Sure enough, the first chapter was not entitled “The Colt Who Lived”, but “Unrequited Enmity”.
Overall: Despite all my critiques, I can tell that you're a reasonably skilled writer. There's a lot of stuff here that's okay and passable, but I hold everything I read to the standards I hold myself to - which is the highest standard I can possibly imagine.
And above all, what you do wrong is description. You avoid it with an almost unsettling determination. I keep not knowing which scenes are important because they all kind of get glossed over until ponies start talking at which point they slow down and I'm forced to scroll back up to remember where we actually are. Don't be afraid of description. You need description. Long moments of description are where you draw the reader in, get them focused, and the short paragraph timeslip gloss deliberately forces them out so you can communicate less intense long term information and give them a chance to breathe.
I'm planning on really exploring the reality distorting effects of dreams sometime soon, so it's a topic I feel quite strongly about. As always, this is something you can practise - you've just got to be sure you've got the right source material to study from. Again, the books I recommended before are worth reading (even if you don't know Mage at all, Astral Realms is still a fantastic resource). Do some practise long form descriptions; focus on images that are important. Little drops of poetry in amongst the sentences.
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2012-03-15, 08:06 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2008
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Oh! I actually didn't realise you got it published on EqD. Congratulations!
Thanqol, if you're still in the mood, how about reading the write-off that ponychan recently concluded and giving your votes. Or apply to be a judge.
http://www.ponychan.net/chan/fic/res/88413.html
Mind, any of you guys would be welcome to weigh in with your votes and comments as well.
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2012-03-15, 08:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Le Response:
Spoiler
I'm making good headway on the re-write for Flowers for Twilight, but I'm not quite to the point where ponies should be looking at it. Should have something around Saturday.
Ooh, I'll definitely give them a look. It's still the start of term, so I haven't lost all my free time to schoolwork yet.I'm developing a game. Let's see what happens! Complex.
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2012-03-15, 09:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2009
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2012-03-15, 09:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Last edited by Grif; 2012-03-15 at 09:28 AM.
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2012-03-15, 09:28 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
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2012-03-15, 09:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
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2012-03-15, 09:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
It was just a curiosity really. I like to think I can at least separate good and bad writing. And particularly over reliance on certain universal fanfic cliche's practiced pan-fandoms. I don't really have time to be a judge though.
Last edited by Soras Teva Gee; 2012-03-15 at 09:52 AM.
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2012-03-15, 09:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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- Where?
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2012-03-15, 10:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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2012-03-15, 10:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
I had the sneaking suspicion that you two knew eachother, and probably at least good RL friends, so on the very first picture I just went, they are related. Still, it was an epic reveal.
Bravo, good sirs! Bravo!"Winning with friendship means winning at life!"
-Mako Mankanshoku
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2012-03-15, 01:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2010
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- Usaki City, Syona
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
Homebrew Signature | NEW Homebrew Collection
Thanks to all my avatar artists, especially to Paisley for my avatar of Vivian, cowardly cryophoenix.
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2012-03-15, 02:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
I guess the question is, which one of them is the Celestia and which is Luna of the sibling relationship?
BTW, ponythread is awfully quiet today.Last edited by Kairaven; 2012-03-15 at 02:12 PM.
"Winning with friendship means winning at life!"
-Mako Mankanshoku
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2012-03-15, 02:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Well, as the younger fellow, I can say with certainty that I've never been banished to the moon. Or anywhere else remote and desolate. And I definitely never went crazy and tried to shroud the land in darkness eternal.
I mean, at least I hope I'd remember something like that.Last edited by TheAmishPirate; 2012-03-15 at 02:29 PM.
I'm developing a game. Let's see what happens! Complex.
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2012-03-15, 02:52 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2007
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
So what you're saying is your about to launch your plan to shroud the land in darkness eternal, (risking banishment to the moon) any day now?
There's only one proper response.
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2012-03-15, 03:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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- Where?
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2012-03-15, 04:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2009
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- San Francisco
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Assuming you're both still on this planet at day's end, I have only one response to this whole thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qHJ-xcMQ7Y
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2012-03-15, 04:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2009
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- The cyberpunk present
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2012-03-15, 04:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Derby, UK
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2012-03-15, 05:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2008
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
Perry the Platypus is tops, yo.
So, again, something that I presume was covered in spoiler boxes back when the episode was first aired... In The Super Speedy Cider Squeezy 6000, Applejack says that if they took up the deal with Flim and Flam, they'd not turn enough profit and would have to lose the farm. That... Doesn't add up. The farm that we now know of as Sweet Apple Acres predates the founding of Ponyville, so unless Princess Celestia is levying a property tax on the land she gave to them (which, I guess, isn't too far-fetched considering some interpretations of her methods), the family really does own the farm proper. Maybe they bought surrounding land on credit? Do credit cards exist?
I mean, they grow their own food, so the major expenses they face are stuff that is determined by the quantity of the harvest. The only other routes I can think of is that some sort of mafia protection money is involved, but the brothers being unicorns and the family being earth ponies means that I can't think of a mafia that would be involved without there being a conflict of interest somewhere. Or... They needed to take out a mortgage to send Applebloom to school.
Alternatively, I'm spending too much though on a children's cartoon, but that's just ridiculous."Okay, so I'm going to quick draw and dual wield these one-pound caltrops as improvised weapons..."
---
"Oh, hey, look! Blue Eyes Black Lotus!" "Wait what, do you sacrifice a mana to the... Does it like, summon a... What would that card even do!?" "Oh, it's got a four-energy attack. Completely unviable in actual play, so don't worry about it."
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2012-03-15, 05:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
I'm developing a game. Let's see what happens! Complex.
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2012-03-15, 06:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2009
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- San Francisco
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
I think the suggestion at the time is that upkeep and property taxes would be higher than the money that they would earn just from selling apples. It seems to be the case that a lot of the profits were in turning the apples into cider, so if someone else got that part of the business, it would make the farm unprofitable when taking into account upkeep costs.
Of course, that doesn't explain why the Apple family didn't just buy the machine from the Flim Flam brothers and then sell twice as much cider each day, considering the sheer amount of demand based on that line. But, just accept that they didn't think of that before getting pressured into that contest and the episode does kind of make sense.
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2012-03-15, 06:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2010
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- Usaki City, Syona
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Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
So...
Amish is a pirate, and Idos is a captain.
Same ship?Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
Homebrew Signature | NEW Homebrew Collection
Thanks to all my avatar artists, especially to Paisley for my avatar of Vivian, cowardly cryophoenix.
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2012-03-15, 06:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
Re: My Little Pony XXXIX: There is no Pegasus Mafia!
SpoilerOk. A lot for me to work on, then. I really should have suspected that the problem was that I basically lacked any descriptions. Just by how abrupt or empty some of the fic sounded in my head. I'm pretty sure my biggest mistake was having a video walkthrough of the game open in another tab while I was writing some of this. I intended to use it as a reference, but I think I ended up just ponifying what I was listening to.
When I was typing the first chapter, I was trying to write this as a comedic fic. Clearly that idea fell flat. And then I basically abandoned any attempts at making this funny in subsequent chapters. So, I'm thinking I'll need to start over to get a more consistent tone.
I was actually pretty doubtful about including Luna and Celestia. To tell you why I decided to do that, I need to give you a quick summary of the first 20 minutes of Persona 4. The protagonist's parents have to go overseas on business, so they send him to the country to live with his uncle, who is a detective. He is a widower with a daughter. The night after the main character arrives in town, he runs into the supernatural for the first time. Rather than saying Twilight had an unknown aunt or uncle and cousin somewhere, I decided to try and fit the princesses into the role. As contrived as the reasons behind them abandoning their posts would be.
I think the problem is that when I can't explain, I joke. Badly. Which would explain the first chapter.
Do you think I should start over from the beginning? Maybe after I work on my descriptions (I think this problem has spilled over to my roleplaying, actually) and do a better job of planning the chapters out in advance?