OOTS #874 - The Discussion Thread

[SaintRidley]

What's the casting time on a "Raise Dead" and what effect would that have on a Vampire that hasn't been "re-killed"?

1 minute and zero effect on undead creatures, ambulatory or destroyed.

[Commander672]

I'm a bit confused about this "War of Attrition" Thing. Because didn't Malack just use a bunch of spells as well as Durkon? And what's this Vampiric Gaze? When did he use that?

[luc258]

"It works only on the weak willed"

Elan probably falls into this category
Roy does not, sice Durkon would like him here
Belkar seems to fall to every hold/charm spell or ability

But how would Haley do? Especially since she has (or at least used to have) silver arrows.

[Wizard]

I'm just loving the update speed right now.

Good comic, as always.

[luc258]

I'm a bit confused about this "War of Attrition" Thing. Because didn't Malack just use a bunch of spells as well as Durkon? And what's this Vampiric Gaze? When did he use that?

Durkon used a lot more spells than Malack as a result of his vampiric gaze.
He does it while hanging from the ceiling in that dark corridor.

[Shale]

If you meet a vampire's gaze, you must succeed on a Will save or fall under his complete mental control (assuming he chooses to use the power). It's not a spell, he doesn't have to declare it, and there is no limit on how many times it can be used per day. Durkon wasted three spells because of the gaze - Remove Paralysis, Hold Person and Cure Critical Wounds. Meanwhile, the exchange didn't cost Malack anything he can't do a thousand times in an hour if he wants.

[glissle]

I thing it refers to the fact that 200 years being a vampire you become a completely different person from who you were before, people change all the time.

It also refers to losing the mental stat boosts. Personally, I would be very reluctant to give up a boost to my wisdom, intelligence and charisma.

This also helps explain why he would see Belkar as a suitable child - he likes the idea of lifting up a barbarian with vampire stat boosts, and Belkar revealed that he had barbarian levels when he shouted his attack.

[SteveDJ]

So, some people are hoping that V makes an appearance ... to save the day.

Well, let's suppose that V does indeed appear... with Red Squiggly Eyes! Bwa ha ha ha!

(...hey, it could happen...)

[Adeptus]

Belkar would have had a chance to shine, but alas his horrible will-save means he is just one more threat for poor Durkon.

The suspense! It burns!

[Peelee]

I'm a bit confused about this "War of Attrition" Thing. Because didn't Malack just use a bunch of spells as well as Durkon? And what's this Vampiric Gaze? When did he use that?

Vampiric Gaze is first seen used in panel 6 - Malack's eyes are all red and wonky, and it's an over-the-shoulder shot of Belkar, indicating that Belkar can see it (and thus can potentially by affected by it).

The effect itself works as Dominate Person:

You can control the actions of any humanoid creature through a telepathic link that you establish with the subject’s mind.

If you and the subject have a common language, you can generally force the subject to perform as you desire, within the limits of its abilities. If no common language exists, you can communicate only basic commands, such as “Come here,” “Go there,” “Fight,” and “Stand still.” You know what the subject is experiencing, but you do not receive direct sensory input from it, nor can it communicate with you telepathically

The "War of Attrition" is that Malack's use of Vampiric Gaze (which is unlimited) has forced Durkon to use two extra spells - Hold Person and Cure Critical Wounds - while still not having access to any help from Belkar. Malack only started the war of attrition after the Heal spell. He is wearing down Durkon's spells, as once Durkon can no longer cast anything, Malack can win in a straight fight.

[SlashDash]

This just gets better and better :)

Sorry, haven't read the whole thread, but if I'd have to bet...


I'm guessing that the earlier comment on Mr.Scruffy being protected by the death ward will come into effect. And I don't think that V or anyone else would show up due to Durkon's last sentence...


Hmmm...


Is it possible Mr. Scruffy would jump (or Durkon would throw him) on Mallack to block his line of sight so that Belkar would not fall for his gaze?
It could give Durkon enough time to get away to step outside the 30 feet range of the domination. Then possibly cast some buff on Belkar?

[Adeptus]

the exchange didn't cost Malack anything he can't do a thousand times in an hour if he wants.

No he can't, there's only 600 battle rounds in an hour

[Needle]

Although - I am curious why a high enough level Cleric to create a spell powerful enough to protect a vampire from the sun AND with the resources of a top government minister didn't already make a wondrous item to keep that protection 24/7 instead of relying on casting it daily...

Clearly he considers the item slot more important, it's not that rare for it to be the case, neither in actual play nor in OotS, where Xykon maybe casts Overland Flight each morning despite being the highest level caster we know (and we know he crafts items as the protection from fire thingie he used against V). Maybe he now has that item, but who knows, either way it makes things more interesting as Dispel Magic would ruin him, but... V usually prepares that, not Durkon

Second, I'm clearly delighted at the pace, not wanting to think too much on outcomes as well as pretty happy to read a thumb update, hoping there's no stop on its recovery from now on

[Raineh Daze]

If you meet a vampire's gaze, you must succeed on a Will save or fall under his complete mental control (assuming he chooses to use the power). It's not a spell, he doesn't have to declare it, and there is no limit on how many times it can be used per day. Durkon wasted three spells because of the gaze - Remove Paralysis, Hold Person and Cure Critical Wounds. Meanwhile, the exchange didn't cost Malack anything he can't do a thousand times in an hour if he wants.

Four. There's a 'Cure Moderate Wounds' in there, too.

[Brom]

Aha! THERE it is! That's what I was wondering about, and now Malak finally shows the cunning he's displayed in a tactical use.

Insidious. Most insidious. We'll see how this works out for Malak; I'd lend credence to the 'spartan kick outside the temple,' idea...though I half wonder, given the rationality of it, if Malak doesn't actually own a crafted protection from sunlight item, either as a redundancy or as a mislead to make enemies think they can dispel his protection to kill him. Normally I wouldn't be so...conspiratorial? yet Tarquin and his ilk DO love their lies.

Also, the prophecy about Durkon dying and visiting ruin on his homeland makes me think we might not just see the hero win. And this leaves plenty of room for the battle of wits and philosophy, for symbolism and drama.

I'm not sure if I can think of what could have made this strip more exciting =D

[Shale]

the CCW got rid of both stab wounds - the CMW would be to deal with injuries from Flame Strike, which makes that a one-for-one exchange of spells.

[Roland Itiative]

Question for all you D&D gurus... previous threads discussed that when someone is converted to a Vampire, they are under the control of said Master until they are 'released'. My question is: Could such "release" be imposed before completing the conversion? That is, if Durkon did indeed sacrifice himself, could he make the condition that he has to be a free-willed vampire before allowing himself to be turned into one?

Not really. The only way, according to RAW, for a vampire to be born free is if their master already has a number of vampire "slaves" that fills their limit (which we know not to be the case, as Malack currently has no vampiric offspring). Otherwise, he will be turned as a slave, and only Malack would be able to free him (either willingly, or dying).

Anyway, great comic, again. Absolutely loving this fight. I wonder if Malack's origins are a hint at some future development...

[Peelee]

Four. There's a 'Cure Moderate Wounds' in there, too.

Durkon was already damaged beforehand. He could have cast a Cure regardless to beef himself back up

[Pokonic]

Dat update pace.

Anyway, nice fighty strip.

[Adeptus]

The gaze has a range of only 30 feet? Nine meters... that is nothing. Malach is risking getting annihilated by a second blast of lightning, or just rushed if Durkon had spotted him moogling from the corridor.

[LordofNaught]

Well this fight is starting to get a little creepy. And more awesome! Thank you increased budget.

[Raineh Daze]

The gaze has a range of only 30 feet? Nine meters... that is nothing. Malach is risking getting annihilated by a second blast of lightning, or just rushed if Durkon had spotted him moogling from the corridor.

He's back to full health, if Durkon even has one of them prepared.

[Feddlefew]

Not really. The only way, according to RAW, for a vampire to be born free is if their master already has a number of vampire "slaves" that fills their limit (which we know not to be the case, as Malack currently has no vampiric offspring). Otherwise, he will be turned as a slave, and only Malack would be able to free him (either willingly, or dying).

Anyway, great comic, again. Absolutely loving this fight. I wonder if Malack's origins are a hint at some future development...

Well, since the vampire's new child-vampire or spawn takes at least 24 hours to "wake up" if slain by energy drain, it's possible that the parent-vampire could be destroyed before then, creating a free vampire.

[TaiLiu]

The gaze has a range of only 30 feet? Nine meters... that is nothing. Malach is risking getting annihilated by a second blast of lightning, or just rushed if Durkon had spotted him moogling from the corridor.

Durkon's a Dwarf; he only has a twenty feet move speed.

[TitusDrakeson]

So I'm fairly certain that Malak counts as having been dead for 200 years. But I can't seem to find any specific rule that says that anybody know where i could find that rule?

[Tulya]

I can appreciate reflexively disabling a deadly threat rather than acting on the indirect threat - the domination - especially with Belkar involved. Plus, the fluff of Protection from X is dissonant with the mechanics in this kind of usage - it seems rather awkward to try to ward an unwilling creature by tracing a 3 foot diameter circle of powdered silver around them as a standard action.

[Balance]

Durkon does have a defense that I think is being overlooked. Vampires can be repelled with a strongly presented holy symbol (or a mirror, but it's the holy symbol that's relevant here). This is distinct from Turn Undead, has different effects, and requires no roll to take effect.

These things don’t harm the vampire—they merely keep it at bay. A recoiling vampire must stay at least 5 feet away from a creature holding the mirror or holy symbol and cannot touch or make melee attacks against the creature holding the item for the rest of the encounter. Holding a vampire at bay takes a standard action.

This should enable Durkon to neutralize any melee threat from Malack.

Also, a casting of Owl's Wisdom should give Belkar another save against Malack's domination, right? It would also counter his negative modifier on the save (since it's known to increase his Wisdom enough to cast spells), and probably give him a bonus. It's only a 2nd level spell; Durkon could have it prepared.

[Mr. Pants]

Shame that Durkon probably can't cast his Holy spell again...that would rather helpful considering who he's dealing with...

[Once a Fool]

Durkon is going to die. Very soon. It is heavily foreshadowed.

The last frame calls our attention to this strip, which also has this gem of a conversation:

If the power of Death were truly Evil, it would take only the pure and heroic, wouldn't it?

Aye, well, after awhile, it starts to seem like tha's exactly the case. Only tha Good die fer good, they say.

[The Pilgrim]

Belkar, showing once more that he is more a liability than an asset.