Puzzle & Dragons 7: Puzzleball Z

[Soepvork]

The Harpie demon is probably the least essential of the set, I just wanted somethign which would help me get trough the trash waves.

[Feistylady]

Oh I get that. The thing I'm trying to do is just use some team that worked. I put together the worst teams sometimes thinking they will be great. Tried the king ruby last night and didn't make it past the third level. I thought it would be simple lol There isn't enough stamina to give it a good 2nd try and fix your mistakes. I'll look through my monsters and see what else has a low cool down

[Red Fel]

For dungeons that have extremely high armor bosses, like supers, neptune, etc. I often plug in an armor breaker or poison. But I don't use that monster every time, because I generally have higher stats elsewhere if I don't NEED the breaker for a specific dungeon. By all means plug in Droid for situational dungeons, but the advice to drop him is, I believe, more for everyday use.

Hmm. That's actually a really good point. Think I'll play with some teams for a bit...

Any normal dungeon from Hyperion Lava flow onwards is 'good' grinding at 500 exp/stam. Starlight sanctuary gets special mention because it's 5x harder and gives 800 exp/stam. Keep in mind grinding is an actual grind - you won't see results from running it 10 times. But if you can manage 30x a day for a week or two, you'll go up a good 30 or 40 ranks. This is why a good farm team will save your sanity, a 2 minute team will save you an hour and a half per day over a 5 minute team.

Ahh, good to clarify expectations. Okay. So basically, just plug away at some of the higher end ones until I get enough cost. I can do that.

Re: teams. B/G Karinx2 + ADK (evolved mystic green) + CDK (evolved mystic dark) + Draggie (2.5x dragon) + dragon orochi (delay) is very solid. Drawn Joker can be used in dungeons where you need the RCV/hearts.

Hmm. I can keep an eye out for ADK and CDK the next time I fail at godfest. Draggie... I've never actually cleared that dungeon, mostly because my 10-cost teams are made of elegant failure. And I didn't think Orochi's Dragon ult was available in NA yet... Is it? Still, I see what you did there - B/G/D Dragon team, very classy, do like. But it'll take more than farming to get lucky (or unlucky) on REM pulls.

[Erloas]

Hi I need help.
Problem: Legendary Seaway
Solution 1: 1 stall turn needed for poison. Poison turn charges skill. Autoheal could help, and orb time will help. 1312 dark damage.
Solution 2: 2 stall turns needed for bane. Bane turn does not charge skill. 1228 light damage, but is physical for extra 2456 light damage on bubblie turn.
Solution 3: No stall needed to menace tama. 54 pings needed in 5-7 turns with 11 pings on team. Lose menace on boss but extra 30% gravity. 1354 blue damage + 405 dark damage.
Recommendations+reasoning?

Well you are usually much better at the math, but I'm thinking with those teams and bubblie that the gravity isn't actually needed at all? You already have the 2 Kirin gravities and with a one 75x attack and at least 7 rounds to kill them it should be fairly trivial without the extra gravity.
Since you should be able to fairly easily tank the red dragon's attacks to make sure the blue is dead first and you clearly have the firepower to take out the blue in one, maybe 2 rounds, it should be fairly easy either way.
So I would go with Lilith, less stalling, but also more RCV for the hits you will take if you get a bad board. That with the much better awakenings seems like the way to go. I would actually be willing to bet you could drop the bubblie for a lot more powerful sub (you have many options) and still take out the blue in plenty of time and have more safety for bad boards or flubbed moves earlier in the dungeon.

Final count 22 naga farmed up. Went 1/15 on my first three feedings, then 1/1 on a random one naga, then 3/5 on my last feeding. Max skilled, and one left over to use for low cost. Great luck, although I was despairing halfway through the day.

I stopped counting Nagas, but after the 2x drop rate it felt like I got fewer Nagas from the dungeon than I did before. Luckily I did get Erl's Echidna fully skilled up earlier in the day but Lor's just wouldn't go. I got all of 1 skill up on her the entire event and it was on the first day. I know I ran the dungeon at least 16 times (2 stones) at increased drop rate, and probably closer to 18-20 with normal stamina refresh too.

Seriously? Past 2 times, I was averaging 1.5 to 2 per run. Way better than t5 ever was to me. Took me 3 stamina refills before I had a run without 1 or more.

It never seemed that great to me either. For 30 stamina you get 2.5 runs of Oceans of Heaven or 3 runs of the earlier levels, so while you might not get a + every time you would only need to get 1 every other run to come out about the same.

Plus it seemed like every 2-3 runs I would get to the Chimeras at the end both on a first turn timer and one or both would double hit and kill me.

then i proceeded to use my remaining stamina on green mystic dragon.... I TOOK MY HAKU TEAM... forgot theres no fire. I cleared the normal stage with pure row enhancement and mad orbing... saved up my haku actives and actually beat him lol... kinda proud that i can still orb when i need to. though... it is a 5 color dungeon...

I took my Horus team into one of the tri-color dungeons a few times but managed to make it through by just happening to have Vamp or Valk on the team.

Of course when I ran Mystic Painted Dragon on legend this time I purposefully took my devil team. Just changed out Hera-Ur for Baal and left RSonia as the leader. Plenty of black and then when it came to taking him out I had the active for reds.



Also speaking of grind teams, I forgot to mention that when I was traveling this last weekend I decided to grind out Zeus in SS with my GrOdin team again. I got him to about 10% left and as I was starting to make my move we hit a bump and I dropped the orb and he whacked me.... I decided it wasn't worth doing that again so I just stoned it and finished him off.

[Sallera]

Well, that's five Heras, and I think I'm about done with that until I can do it with a farm team. One stone for stamina, one rank up refresh, and one stone for an embarrassing continue 'cause I spaced out and moved an orb without matching, and sod redoing fifteen or twenty minutes of watching poison tick. First time I've used stones for either, but probably worth it for getting started.

[Fax Celestis]

SiuiS if you're still having trouble with Nazca, I just did it with Bastet//Bonia/Verche/Echidna/Hera//DQXQ. You could try something similar? Or maybe five color healer? WB Metatron//DD Lilith/RR Echidna/WG Valkyrie/W King Shynee//WB DQXQ has five (well, four, but plus hearts) color coverage, 14x mod, 42x burst. Just don't use DQXQ's active because it'll screw up your multiplier. You could pull Echidna if you're worried about damage and put in Tornado Holy Dragon or Unicorn.

[Academia]

@jasmine: kirin/echi/echi/green/blue/kirin

you dont need 75x. the no rcv part boosts your damage quite a bit. delay tamandra, delay boss. sweep everything else. its actually the orb trolls on normal stages thats hard.

[Fax Celestis]

Also I am dying for another Snow Globe gift. I need a blue one so badly.

[Erloas]

@jasmine: kirin/echi/echi/green/blue/kirin

you dont need 75x. the no rcv part boosts your damage quite a bit. delay tamandra, delay boss. sweep everything else. its actually the orb trolls on normal stages thats hard.

Why take a second Echidna over Lilith though? They are fairly similar in stats, with lilith actually being better (considerably better since the second Echidna is in the second form) and Lilith makes the Tamadra effortless where as Echidna still has quite a bit of work to do to kill them.


Although I forgot it didn't have hearts at first, that wasn't marked right in the pad.wikia page, but it does say it in the text. It is too bad the pad.wikia pages seem to be falling out of date. I greatly prefer their dungeon layouts to PADX but PADX has a lot more news a lot more quickly so I've been spending most of my time there lately. Having the quick look at the entire monster upgrade path in every stage is a lot nicer on PADX though.

I got my RK and now I have Freyja ultimated up and ready to start maybe running a balance team again. Although she still needs a lot of levels. And the total lack of friends that lead with balance leaders any more...

[Otravyat]

Pink Dragon REM starts tomorrow at noon. Anything worthwhile?

I imagine that the Valks and Blue Metatron are going to be very low chance?

[Fax Celestis]

Pink Dragon REM starts tomorrow at noon. Anything worthwhile?

I imagine that the Valks and Blue Metatron are going to be very low chance?

Sticker Girls are getting their new ults shortly, and they're pretty solid.

I want to roll because I want Snow White and Ruka, but I am teh brokez. Already have Mitsuki and Kurone, so I'm pretty okay there.

[Erloas]

Pink Dragon REM starts tomorrow at noon. Anything worthwhile?

I imagine that the Valks and Blue Metatron are going to be very low chance?

It looks like they've expanded the pink egg machine by quite a lot.
While I would like Blue and Green Valk (well Green mostly because it is brand new, green healers aren't hitting my healer teams any time soon) and the new blue Metatron would be really cool I already have all of the sticker girls (several of each in many cases), dark valk, and several of the fairy tale girls there is just too big of a chance of getting multiples.

Of course for someone without the sticker girls there are a lot of good options. While the sticker girls aren't all that universal in use, the niches they fill are otherwise very hard to fill. I know Fuu was a very wanted addition to Siuis Healer team last time the machine was around.

I would say for most people a pull or two would be worthwhile, and if you are really wanting a healer team there is nothing better.

As for chances, last time it had the Chinese incarnation gods and they were I think estimated at about a 10% drop rate. Of course with the Fairy Tale girls and all 3 versions of the sticker girls it is hard to say what is going to be happening. I think the old estimate was chance of getting a Valk or Metatron was less than getting any god out of the REM during a Godfest but a lot better at getting a specific one.

[tyckspoon]

Hmm. I can keep an eye out for ADK and CDK the next time I fail at godfest. Draggie... I've never actually cleared that dungeon, mostly because my 10-cost teams are made of elegant failure. And I didn't think Orochi's Dragon ult was available in NA yet... Is it? Still, I see what you did there - B/G/D Dragon team, very classy, do like. But it'll take more than farming to get lucky (or unlucky) on REM pulls.

Ideally you'd never see a Mystic Knight come from the REM, as they're all farmable elsewhere (they've all got special feature dungeons, they show up in Hera's descend, and sometimes they have event where they can appear in Castle of Satan) but they're not bad booby prize pulls if you haven't already got them.

[Jasmine]

Hmm. I can keep an eye out for ADK and CDK the next time I fail at godfest. Draggie... I've never actually cleared that dungeon, mostly because my 10-cost teams are made of elegant failure. And I didn't think Orochi's Dragon ult was available in NA yet... Is it? Still, I see what you did there - B/G/D Dragon team, very classy, do like. But it'll take more than farming to get lucky (or unlucky) on REM pulls.

Like tyck said, ADK and CDK are farmable, and reasonably easy at that - you just have to wait for the respective dungeons to come around (their red counterpart, the MFK, starts tomorrow, but he's not a dragon) I only had 2 REM mons for the first 6 months of my PAD life, so my team suggestions tend to be not rely on REM. Make sure you skill them up when they're around - a 5 turn orb change is WAY more powerful than a 9 turn orb change.

Draggie isn't too hard on Master, but the drop rate could screw you over. Non Ult tyrannos, 2nd tier gigas, 2nd tier echidna, 2nd tier MFK, and maybe red riding hood, with a friend nonult tyrannos. Level them up, max skill the gigas via samurai goblins and you should be good to go. MFK and echi skillups are nice but not essential.

Orochi ult isn't out yet, but it probably will by the time you get a draggie + levels + preferably some skillups too. And you don't need to stay on dragon type until you get him.

Well you are usually much better at the math, but I'm thinking with those teams and bubblie that the gravity isn't actually needed at all? You already have the 2 Kirin gravities and with a one 75x attack and at least 7 rounds to kill them it should be fairly trivial without the extra gravity.
Since you should be able to fairly easily tank the red dragon's attacks to make sure the blue is dead first and you clearly have the firepower to take out the blue in one, maybe 2 rounds, it should be fairly easy either way.
So I would go with Lilith, less stalling, but also more RCV for the hits you will take if you get a bad board. That with the much better awakenings seems like the way to go. I would actually be willing to bet you could drop the bubblie for a lot more powerful sub (you have many options) and still take out the blue in plenty of time and have more safety for bad boards or flubbed moves earlier in the dungeon.

Yeah..no rcv like you found out later :P That's why I made a big deal about that 1 extra needed for charging and the extra turn that poison charges for. So the thing is, I'm not sure gravities/bubblie will be up by the boss unless I use menace on the tama. Bubblie is less of being 25x as bringing 2 skill boosts to make sure echi/poison are up in time...

@jasmine: kirin/echi/echi/green/blue/kirin

you dont need 75x. the no rcv part boosts your damage quite a bit. delay tamandra, delay boss. sweep everything else. its actually the orb trolls on normal stages thats hard.

Isn't it hard to stall in there? Bubblie brings 2 skill boosts, and staying physical with GGY gives me another 2. Did you somehow have 3 skillboosts on your green and blue subs? And yeah, like Erloas noticed, my 2nd echi is still playing low cost duty. I thought about it...but those stats...


I think the major question I'm asking is, how many turns would I expect to be able to stall on the first 5 floors? Right now I'm in the mindset of not being able to stall at all, but the 'best' setup could change if I could grab 2 or 3 turns of charging.

[Red Fel]

Ideally you'd never see a Mystic Knight come from the REM, as they're all farmable elsewhere (they've all got special feature dungeons, they show up in Hera's descend, and sometimes they have event where they can appear in Castle of Satan) but they're not bad booby prize pulls if you haven't already got them.

Funny story - I just cleared my first Hera a few minutes ago, and I got a Mystic Nightlight. Amusingly, Light is the one of them I needed least, and now I have one. At least I also got Hera out of it... And she's apparently obviated by my Ult Hades. But at least I got a stone out of it... And it cost me two to clear Hades, because I stupidly decided to save up skills for Hera, and that reaping bastard hits like a truck.

So, yeah. I think I've earned my booby prize.

But I learned something today! I learned that my Karin/Yomi/Cu/Siren/Echidna team works pretty well with Shining Odin as backup. And I learned that I'm not yet up to farming Hera. So it's back to the salt mines for me.

Like tyck said, ADK and CDK are farmable, and reasonably easy at that - you just have to wait for the respective dungeons to come around (their red counterpart, the MFK, starts tomorrow, but he's not a dragon) I only had 2 REM mons for the first 6 months of my PAD life, so my team suggestions tend to be not rely on REM.

Yeah, I really didn't want to rely on REM either. Because the "Yay, I got my DKs" would be intermingled with "Really, no gods again?!" And nobody needs that.

Draggie isn't too hard on Master, but the drop rate could screw you over. Non Ult tyrannos, 2nd tier gigas, 2nd tier echidna, 2nd tier MFK, and maybe red riding hood, with a friend nonult tyrannos. Level them up, max skill the gigas via samurai goblins and you should be good to go.

Hmm. There's an idea. I've been looking for a use for this Tyr. It'll be nice for him to not just be a benchwarmer. I'd have to farm up a Naga, though. And a Phoenix Knight. I knew evoing him was a bad idea...

Orochi ult isn't out yet, but it probably will by the time you get a draggie + levels + preferably some skills too. And you don't need to stay on dragon type until you get him.

Hmm... On the other hand, he does require some fairly nasty materials (Jewel and Blue Fruit). That's going to be tough, at least for awhile. But you're right, chances are that by the time he's out, I should be somewhat better prepared.

[SiuiS]

Pink Dragon REM starts tomorrow at noon. Anything worthwhile?

I imagine that the Valks and Blue Metatron are going to be very low chance?

They may have increased chances. Unsure yet. Still, there is now nothing in the Girly gatcha that I don't want, so I may give it a roll.

I'm thinking about trying Perseus for Nazca. The problem I'm running in to is I don't have any way to reliably get high health or to heal fast. I want to bring maybe Goemon as a sub but that doesn't work either... Maybe I should lead with beelz? A devil 2/5/2.5 team can do some nasty damage if I try. And if I could stall that's two gravities, meaning I only need to do one million, which is totally feasible.

[Erloas]

It's a fair cop. With the exception of Yomi, it's all Devil, and that works fine. Really, it's a Dark Devil team, but the concept is valid. Now, if I understand your suggestion, it's to go with Dark proper, which means choosing the best Dark monsters that ensure Dark combos. And you're right, Vamp's (or Batman's) 2x ATK and RCV for Dark types (incl. Yomi) is probably better than Lu Bu's 1.35x HP and 3x ATK for Devil types (excl. Yomi). Lu Bu's active is similarly situational. And this would open things up for me to use non-Devil Dark types.

Going back a bit, I saw this then forgot to respond.
While I love Yomi, I don't think her active nor awakenings are worth going off-type for. While both are amazing for a rainbow/combo team they are really not needed at all for a mono-color team. You shouldn't have any trouble matching dark orbs to need the 10 second move active nor the increased normal time. Considering that you are loosing 15% of your damage for every monster off-type (unboosted attacks are hardly worth considering) I wouldn't do that unless it is vital.

In general I hate mono-color teams. They aren't bad if you have really skilled up orb changers but the chance of being orb screwed is just too high otherwise. Especially when there are so many dungeons where an easily killed monster can be a big danger if left alive and if you don't have the orbs you need... Besides with a devil team going mono-black you are missing out on RSonia and there is a very good chance most of your friend devil leaders will be RSonia with Hera-Ur and Lu Bu as a far second option. You also generally need RSonia's RCV boost for a devil team.

While you don't have any other red devils right now they are fairly common REMs and Hera-Ur isn't too bad to get either.

Yeah..no rcv like you found out later :P That's why I made a big deal about that 1 extra needed for charging and the extra turn that poison charges for. So the thing is, I'm not sure gravities/bubblie will be up by the boss unless I use menace on the tama. Bubblie is less of being 25x as bringing 2 skill boosts to make sure echi/poison are up in time...

...

I think the major question I'm asking is, how many turns would I expect to be able to stall on the first 5 floors? Right now I'm in the mindset of not being able to stall at all, but the 'best' setup could change if I could grab 2 or 3 turns of charging.

Well if you get lucky two Pengdra could easily show up not on 1 turn timers, and while all the rest are 1 turn timers I think it is possibly for them to show up on 2 turns.

While they probably wouldn't be up in time, both Asgard and Midgard would make stalling a lot easier, of course if you had to stall to get them up then that doesn't help.

I'm actually thinking your best best is Jade Oracle, Parvati. She is the right color, she has 1 skill boost, her auto-recovery would help, and she makes hearts. She should make stalling much easier. Granted making hearts means you can't activate Kirin, but for an early stage stall that should be acceptable. Especially if you end up with 1 on a first turn and another on a second turn timer, only take 1 hit the turn you make the hearts and then you should be able to wipe them the next.

Lilith+Parvati would be 1k auto-recovery, and hearts by the first or second stage. Take a hit the first round, let the 1k auto-recovery bring back almost all of that by the time you get to the end, and hearts if you need to. With both you should have enough RCV to take at least 1-2 hits stalling early on.



And for myself... I now that I got Freyja to balance I decided to make my balance team again. And then I remembered I have Loki and he now has a balance option too.
So is there anything I'm missing or is there no reason at all to take Loki to his original Ultimate instead of the new one (except the mask is hard to get)?
He is a devil type both ways, and the loss of god type is a non-issue. No one runs 4/2/2 or 4/4 teams any more and better devil leader skills are easy to find.

Freyja//GrOdin/DL Vamp/Yomi/Cu Chu//X is my current team. Loki could easily fit there as a sub or a leader, it would actually be hard to decide what is the weakest link and either Freyja or Loki could be the leader. Although I think the best place for him is a friend leader.

[SiuiS]

No one runs 4/2/2 or 4/4 teams any more and better devil leader skills are easy to find.

Maybe I should lead with beelz? A devil 2/5/2.5 team can do some nasty damage if I try. And if I could stall that's two gravities, meaning I only need to do one million, which is totally feasible.

[Erloas]

I'm thinking about trying Perseus for Nazca. The problem I'm running in to is I don't have any way to reliably get high health or to heal fast. I want to bring maybe Goemon as a sub but that doesn't work either... Maybe I should lead with beelz? A devil 2/5/2.5 team can do some nasty damage if I try. And if I could stall that's two gravities, meaning I only need to do one million, which is totally feasible.

Are the preemptives really that big of a deal? They are at most 7k and a Metatron team should have >14k HPs fairly easily? (especially with a friendly I&I which I always have up)

Or what about the classic balance team? A 9x team such as Cu Chu should do it fairly easily. I had no problems at all running it with my devil team, and it had a red (RSonia) and Baal (off-color from everything else on the team, but still a good devil) and I had no problems at all.
I was also able to clear it with my GF's Isis team, I even did quite a bit of grinding on him and didn't take any stones to do it. He even hit me twice with the gravity, but since he didn't have the increased attack up when he did the Titan hit I was able to recover enough between hits. Having the increased attack up when Titan hits is fairly hard to do, takes some bad luck on your part.
You can still recover and he isn't that bad until below 30%. So you should be able to wear him down quite a bit before doing a big hit.

[SiuiS]

Nazca is for some reason my nemesis. The wood dragons always elude me...

My healer team is usually 12k, and my devil team isn't able to heal back fast enough to stall and if I skyfall my way to the 14k from the two evolved centaurs.

I'll try I&I. It's slow going because I don't want to stone for it yet, and I only need one so part of me is saying just wait until 2x drop and trample master.

[Red Fel]

Going back a bit, I saw this then forgot to respond.
While I love Yomi, I don't think her active nor awakenings are worth going off-type for. While both are amazing for a rainbow/combo team they are really not needed at all for a mono-color team. You shouldn't have any trouble matching dark orbs to need the 10 second move active nor the increased normal time. Considering that you are loosing 15% of your damage for every monster off-type (unboosted attacks are hardly worth considering) I wouldn't do that unless it is vital.

In general I hate mono-color teams. They aren't bad if you have really skilled up orb changers but the chance of being orb screwed is just too high otherwise. Especially when there are so many dungeons where an easily killed monster can be a big danger if left alive and if you don't have the orbs you need... Besides with a devil team going mono-black you are missing out on RSonia and there is a very good chance most of your friend devil leaders will be RSonia with Hera-Ur and Lu Bu as a far second option. You also generally need RSonia's RCV boost for a devil team.

While you don't have any other red devils right now they are fairly common REMs and Hera-Ur isn't too bad to get either.

Well, whole reason I put together the mono-Dark team was advice in the prior thread. And looking at the stats of the team, it doesn't impress all that much, I admit. I was told that mono-teams were vital for somethingsomethingIhavenoidea.

I do like my Yomi. I cause so much destruction with her. But I realize that she's not the most potent tool unless I have to line up a bunch of combos (e.g. a Karin or Horus team). I suppose I could rethink a Devil team in more detail... As it is, even if I wanted to use my mono-Dark, I don't have the cost to fully utilize it. So I'd be going with my Karin team anyway.

I think at this point my best bet is to sit back, grind ranks, try for some descended dungeons and work on some Godfests, and come back to the issue once I have a slightly more comprehensive selection.

[Erloas]

Nazca is for some reason my nemesis. The wood dragons always elude me...

My healer team is usually 12k, and my devil team isn't able to heal back fast enough to stall and if I skyfall my way to the 14k from the two evolved centaurs.

I'll try I&I. It's slow going because I don't want to stone for it yet, and I only need one so part of me is saying just wait until 2x drop and trample master.

Well I know my healer team has more than that but I also know it is fairly REM heavy and I don't take the big hit in stats from the Big Shynee.

I don't know what you have for a devil team right now (I know it has been mentioned before but not having a Padhereder I can't check back on that sort of thing). I know you have Hera-Ur as a leader sometimes... I've never had a problem healing up with a devil team so long as one of the leaders is RSonia. I would think Hera-Ur/4x dark devils/RSonia should handle it fairly easily, thats close to what I used.

[SiuiS]

Well, whole reason I put together the mono-Dark team was advice in the prior thread. And looking at the stats of the team, it doesn't impress all that much, I admit. I was told that mono-teams were vital for somethingsomethingIhavenoidea.

Despite what has been said about rainbow teams and orb trolling, monocolor teams are mathematically more solid. Most successful rainbow teams are in fact slantwise mono-color; a large amount of the monsters on the team are one color and that's their primary damage output with the others providing support.

That's why Noah's dungeon is so novel; it's actually harder because you can't have more than two primary color monsters.

*

Luck of the draw, took out Nazca by having everyone bind echidna instead of actually hurt me XD

Now I need to run it for griffon and get my stuff in order for tengu – not for getting a tengu but for getting a hamahime, which I need for Reasons.

[Erloas]

Despite what has been said about rainbow teams and orb trolling, monocolor teams are mathematically more solid. Most successful rainbow teams are in fact slantwise mono-color; a large amount of the monsters on the team are one color and that's their primary damage output with the others providing support.

That's why Noah's dungeon is so novel; it's actually harder because you can't have more than two primary color monsters.

Is that really the case though? I know I've heard it occasionally on Chinese girl teams, but even that doesn't seem to be that common because most people don't have all of their strongest monsters as a single color.

And looking at Marade, Starwulf, Jasemine, and my Horus teams they all have different primary colors for at least 4 of their colors and red is only strong by the fact that Horus is a stat beast and there are always 2 of them.
I don't have a PADHerder for Obryn to say about his, but from what I can remember of it he has at least 3 primary colors to his RA team.

Luck of the draw, took out Nazca by having everyone bind echidna instead of actually hurt me XD

Now I need to run it for griffon and get my stuff in order for tengu – not for getting a tengu but for getting a hamahime, which I need for Reasons.

Congrats. That was Legend right?

I hate invades with a passion and wouldn't bother trying for them again in all but the rarest cases. I know I tried and tried for a Phoenix and never got one as an invade and then a week later got one to drop from Noah. Which is one thing that is nice about her dungeon as well, all 5 of the mythical beasts rotate in and have a chance of dropping. Probably not an easier farm, but she isn't too bad if you happen to have a rainbow team.
Or Pal points.

[Jasmine]

But I learned something today! I learned that my Karin/Yomi/Cu/Siren/Echidna team works pretty well with Shining Odin as backup. And I learned that I'm not yet up to farming Hera. So it's back to the salt mines for me.

Hmm. There's an idea. I've been looking for a use for this Tyr. It'll be nice for him to not just be a benchwarmer. I'd have to farm up a Naga, though. And a Phoenix Knight. I knew evoing him was a bad idea...

Hmm... On the other hand, he does require some fairly nasty materials (Jewel and Blue Fruit). That's going to be tough, at least for awhile. But you're right, chances are that by the time he's out, I should be somewhat better prepared.

Honestly once you get a few more levels on that team, double Karin should make quick work of the dungeon. You need something like 13154(?) hp to tank hades with odin if you want the grind, but with 12.25x you should be able to kill him in a turn or two even without blowing actives.

Think of the 2nd naga/knight as future tamas after you're done with them :P Well, if you're into the low costers (draggie, tengu, RO Ace), it might be nice to keep around anyways. Evoed but non ulted ones work well in gaia and xuanzhang.

Once again, you'll prob roll them out of the PAL egg machine by the time you need it :P Although PAL is a finicky thing ; it really makes having luck a lot more important than having skill, which is kind of disappointing.

Well if you get lucky two Pengdra could easily show up not on 1 turn timers, and while all the rest are 1 turn timers I think it is possibly for them to show up on 2 turns.

While they probably wouldn't be up in time, both Asgard and Midgard would make stalling a lot easier, of course if you had to stall to get them up then that doesn't help.

I'm actually thinking your best best is Jade Oracle, Parvati. She is the right color, she has 1 skill boost, her auto-recovery would help, and she makes hearts. She should make stalling much easier. Granted making hearts means you can't activate Kirin, but for an early stage stall that should be acceptable. Especially if you end up with 1 on a first turn and another on a second turn timer, only take 1 hit the turn you make the hearts and then you should be able to wipe them the next.

Lilith+Parvati would be 1k auto-recovery, and hearts by the first or second stage. Take a hit the first round, let the 1k auto-recovery bring back almost all of that by the time you get to the end, and hearts if you need to. With both you should have enough RCV to take at least 1-2 hits stalling early on.

I'd prefer not to rely on luck for an 88 stam dungeon :P Asgard/Midguard don't help because at max skill, their CD is the same as my slowest CDs. Not sure if Parv will be worth 3 or more turns of stall - she loses 2 skill boosts compared to GGY, both have autoheal, and the 3000 quickheal on GGY is only slightly worse than heartmaking.

Despite what has been said about rainbow teams and orb trolling, monocolor teams are mathematically more solid. Most successful rainbow teams are in fact slantwise mono-color; a large amount of the monsters on the team are one color and that's their primary damage output with the others providing support.

That's why Noah's dungeon is so novel; it's actually harder because you can't have more than two primary color monsters.

Now I need to run it for griffon and get my stuff in order for tengu – not for getting a tengu but for getting a hamahime, which I need for Reasons.

Depends what you mean by reliable. You'll be clearing more on color orbs over time, but damage output is spiky whenever orb changers are used. Ra/Kirin/U&Y have huge activation/nonactivation differences, but for the weaker rainbow gods Horus/DQ/Isis that have near 100% activation, there's not really much difference in damage between 3 red/1 everything else and a 3 green/1 everything else, whereas with a Parvati team that's a huge difference.

Noahs dungeon is annoying for Horus users because you can't take 2 Horuses and an Echidna. And personally with Herais and Kirin being my + egg targets, I can't take Isis/U&Y/Kirin/DQ/ or Ra as friends either, leaving Bastet and Okunishi(ha) as my only choices. For any other rainbow lead, this dungeon should be cake, since Echi won't clash with the leads.

Oh, I just rolled PAL and got my first griffin :)

Is that really the case though? I know I've heard it occasionally on Chinese girl teams, but even that doesn't seem to be that common because most people don't have all of their strongest monsters as a single color.

And looking at Marade, Starwulf, Jasemine, and my Horus teams they all have different primary colors for at least 4 of their colors and red is only strong by the fact that Horus is a stat beast and there are always 2 of them.
I don't have a PADHerder for Obryn to say about his, but from what I can remember of it he has at least 3 primary colors to his RA team.

I know the top tier Kirin/U&Y/DQ teams are very light/blue/light heavy, but those are also very REMmy and out of reach of most players. Obryn said earlier his usual team is Ra/Echi/Susano/Herais/Yomi, which covers all colors. And yeah, Horus and Echi are both attack powerhouses, which makes throwing a gigas on there kind of fun sometimes. That team has 8238 red attack...With a red odin and a green/blue as your last sub you could push 10281 red damage...

[SiuiS]

Is that really the case though? I know I've heard it occasionally on Chinese girl teams, but even that doesn't seem to be that common because most people don't have all of their strongest monsters as a single color.

Every uniting factor in a team makes it stronger. These factors are type and attribute, generally, and every team will want some manner of boosting damage proportionally. The default is either a king slime or a Norse god; triple type damage or half again attribute damage. Attribute damage gets an additional bonus from row enhancements (there are no "physical attacks get a boost when" awakenings, for example) and enchanted orbs, giving you a slightly more potent boost, conditionally (triple for slime versus 2.244 multiplier for one row, full enchantment, and Norse boost, but easily more).

Note that for basic mathematical functions both a delay and a gravity qualify as force multipliers; using a single gravity is like having a 1.3x multiplier for one floor, or 2x multiplier with two (because they have half health) and menace gives you two free turns, a potential +200% for a functional triple damage.

Every rainbow team uses something to enhance their output, and usually it's something straightforward like orb enchantment and multiple combos of a single color.

And looking at Marade, Starwulf, Jasemine, and my Horus teams they all have different primary colors for at least 4 of their colors and red is only strong by the fact that Horus is a stat beast and there are always 2 of them.
I don't have a PADHerder for Obryn to say about his, but from what I can remember of it he has at least 3 primary colors to his RA team.

Their sub colors provide an extra boost though, don't they?

It's not about maximum theoretical output. That's identical across all formations. It's about ease of use. It's much easier to routinely generate 5x3 on color with a 3x lead than to routinely generate 3x3 and activate a 5x lead. Once you can you're good, but across a career and when able to focus, focus fire does come out better.

Congrats. That was Legend right?

I hate invades with a passion and wouldn't bother trying for them again in all but the rarest cases. I know I tried and tried for a Phoenix and never got one as an invade and then a week later got one to drop from Noah. Which is one thing that is nice about her dungeon as well, all 5 of the mythical beasts rotate in and have a chance of dropping. Probably not an easier farm, but she isn't too bad if you happen to have a rainbow team.
Or Pal points.

It was legend, indeed. I found out what was happening; the centaurs kept shutting down my heart orbs.

Griffon is for a theorycraft attacker Perseus team; sasuke Mari griffon and another wood type attacker, and either Perseus or lieu Bei friend lead. Has added benefit of rows out the tuchis. It's not mandatory to get, but I want to level and eventually evolve my three remaining Amitan for awakenings, so a green dungeon is a good choice.

Although I should probably finish kapybara and also try for a tama there. I need at least two; both Valkyries are better than the original monsters because they get row enhancement alon with heartbreak and neither Siegfried nor vampire do.

[Starwulf]

Well, my thought experiment of taking on Hera with my Lmeta Team for faster farming then Horus was.....a complete success! I annihilated that dungeon in about 3 1/2 minutes flat, I didn't have to stall but once, and that was right after neptune since I burned Angelion/Valk together so I could save King Shynee for Hera. I just mindlessly matched orbs against hades for 5 turns so they were back up, and still nearly killed him(at one point I dished out 160k dmg with Echidna....). Hera came up, I delayed(just in case), popped Shynee/Angelion/Valk and wiped her out in a single round. That was absolutely amazing, once I gain 10 more ranks(and thus 120 stamina), I'll be farming the hell out of her, so likely the next time she comes around, that way I can finally get the skill-ups necessary to make Hera viable on shorter descends/descends with no hearts for stalling.

[obryn]

Star Vault talk...

Spoiler

Show

5 runs, 10/25 monsters with +'s so far, or one per 15 stamina.

[Fax Celestis]

I did about 10 runs (maybe 8 or 9? A bar and a third of stamina...) on OoH today and got 12 +eggs, so IDK if star vault is really worth it.

On that note, my Bonia is now +47 and Raphael is at level 44. Once he hits max, I can immediately evo then ult him: I got the last bits of material I needed today off a rainbow keeper run.

[Starwulf]

So, I can't remember if this had been announced previously, but apparently Skill-up cards, one for each element(light/dark/wood/etc) has been released and as long as it's fed to the same element, it's a guaranteed skill-up. So between this and feeding max level creatures to the same creature granting a guaranteed skill-up, it looks like skill-ups will become wickedly easier now :)