More 2024 PHB Revelations from the GameInformer Article

[Millstone85]

Especially with Half-Elves, who they can't even try to argue redundancy with.

Because there are too many types of elf anyway? If so, do note that the half-elf is not just a +1 but potentially a x2. Are you half-drow, half-high, half-wood, half-sea, half-eladrin, half-shadar-kai, half-astral, or maybe half-avariel, half-lythari, half-...?

[Theodoxus]

Re: half-breeds, I'm kinda with Psyren on it. One doesn't mix Red and Blue paint and expect chartreuse. 2014 Half-elves having a few traits from elves and then mysteriously having double the skills, as well as getting a +2 to Charisma that neither parent has... it's just odd. Half-orcs are worse, getting something completely new that neither parent provides... it's weird enough that races are so homogeneous when it comes to racial traits; that the intermingling of two disparate species would result in wholly new attributes that 1) are ALWAYS present without fail, regardless, and 2) are completely outside the genetic norm of their parents? Makes no sense.

Now, if HOrcs and HElves were actually unique races that were simply named as such because they LOOK like they might have been descended from human/orc or elf breeding, sure, you'd have a case (and I'd much prefer that, as it fits with the dynamic of 'halfling'). Personally, I'd then go about giving them entirely new racial names, with "half-x" being a racial slur. (I'd be shocked if someone hasn't done this already.)

[t209]

So, any idea how they might run “hybrid” system aside from memes about “humans aren’t the only one with inability to keep having babies with anyone and anything”.
Kinda funny when TSR’s refusal to have good Orcs (but good Drows are okay because Drizzt is cool and Greenwood made wholesome Eilistraee worshippers) led to them along Half Orcs (even with ugly backstory if you remember OOTS), which that issue led to…Genasi, Half Elf, Half Dragon, Half Ogre, and Tieflings.

[Theodoxus]

So, any idea how they might run “hybrid” system aside from memes about “humans aren’t the only one with inability to keep having babies with anyone and anything”.
Kinda funny when TSR’s refusal to have good Orcs (but good Drows are okay because Drizzt is cool and Greenwood made wholesome Eilistraee worshippers) led to them along Half Orcs (even with ugly backstory if you remember OOTS), which that issue led to…Genasi, Half Elf, Half Dragon, Half Ogre, and Tieflings.

The UA at least, laid it out as essentially you get the attributes on one race, and the look of another. So, a half dwarf/elf might get dwarven traits but look elvish, or vice versa. It's a bit less than what should happen genetically (you'd ideally get a stocky elven look with shorter pointed ears (or other random smashing of the two characteristics).)

WotC didn't want to go through the trouble of creating a 'Chinese Menu' of options for every race (choose a few items from column A and a few from column B) - and rightfully so - that way leads to cookie-cutter supremacy - and that defeats the idea of diversity and equality everyone fought about during Covid.

[Millstone85]

So, any idea how they might run “hybrid” system aside from memes about “humans aren’t the only one with inability to keep having babies with anyone and anything”.

I am sure it will be up to DMs to decide what species have a reproductive barrier or not.

I think elves, dwarves, gnomes, halflings, humans and orcs will end up with many babies, including a half-elf/half-halfling who everybody mistakes for a gnome, or a half-gnome/half-orc who gets called a goblin.

Meanwhile, complicated chimeras will be a harder sell, such as a centaur who is also part leonin and part minotaur (aka a lynel from The Legend of Zelda).

Someone in my gaming group had a character from a line of planetouched. Aasimar, axani, cansin, genasi, tiefling, you name it. I found that to be a great idea.

[RedMage125]

Half-elves exist because they're a big deal in Tolkien (althought they're a big deal specifically because there's only a handful of them).
Half-orcs exist because orcs were considered Always Chaotic Evil several decades ago.

...yeah, I think we can do without those as explicit "races". I excluded them from my own homebrew setting a looong time ago (substituting full orcs for half-orcs). I'm okay with individuals being of custom lineage, but I don't like making a whole race and culture out of a specific half-human-hybrid.

I'm wondering how this is going to affect future printings of Eberron, wherein Half-Elves (called "Khorvar" in the setting, "children of Khorvaire") actually are their own distinct race. Most Khorvar in the setting couldn't find the original Elf/Human pairing in their own genealogy going back 50 generations, almost all of them are descended from other Khorvar (a Human/Elf pairing will still result in a Khorvar, but have no chance of a Mark of Detection or Storm).

[Witty Username]

I dislike the rules implicitly removing the concept of species mixing to create wholly distinct things (Muls being the robust human sized Dwarf is fun).
Apart from that, meh, it won't change my play habits much.
I have been drifting orc as opposed to half-orc and fits a head Canon I made. Half-elf is functionally unchanged in what I wanted to use from it. It also allows a bit more things like Narnia style half-dwarves and such. The only thing is I don't like Tiefling and Assimar within that model. A tiefling-human is unclear how that is different from a tiefling, and an elven Assimar would reasonably be very different from a human.

[Amnestic]

I'm wondering how this is going to affect future printings of Eberron, wherein Half-Elves (called "Khorvar" in the setting, "children of Khorvaire") actually are their own distinct race. Most Khorvar in the setting couldn't find the original Elf/Human pairing in their own genealogy going back 50 generations, almost all of them are descended from other Khorvar (a Human/Elf pairing will still result in a Khorvar, but have no chance of a Mark of Detection or Storm).

Either they'll have a section for Half-Elves that reiterates the standard 5.5e mechanics but gives you their specific lore, or they'll have a section for them with unique mechanics specific for Eberron (as all Dragonmarked have).

[Millstone85]

Thinking back on ardlings, it would be great if tieflings kept that playtest's infernal/chthonic/abyssal division, with aasimar getting the matching heavenly/idyllic/exalted subtypes.

I know aasimar were originally derived from angels specifically. But it has been a while since angels were called aasimon and I think MotM did right by connecting aasimar to "a spark of the Upper Planes".

[Witty Username]

There's way more uniqueness to her than having wings. I doubt you could slap just any Aasimar into a binding circle and render the wizard who did so both immortal and invulnerable. So the game presenting that as just a thing you can do with Aasimar was a miss on Larian's part.

You could probably do that with Elminster (if he let you anyway) though and he is a human, hence why I included the Chosen of Mystra bit.


--
On tools, I would need to see the new options in more detail. If they are like the Xanathar's ones I will likely have similar notes (still mad about not being able to make poisons with a poisoner's kit).

[EggKookoo]

Now, if HOrcs and HElves were actually unique races that were simply named as such because they LOOK like they might have been descended from human/orc or elf breeding, sure, you'd have a case (and I'd much prefer that, as it fits with the dynamic of 'halfling').

That's basically what they are in my setting. But I kill all sorts of sacred cows with regard to PC races.

[MoiMagnus]

Now, if HOrcs and HElves were actually unique races that were simply named as such because they LOOK like they might have been descended from human/orc or elf breeding, sure, you'd have a case (and I'd much prefer that, as it fits with the dynamic of 'halfling'). Personally, I'd then go about giving them entirely new racial names, with "half-x" being a racial slur. (I'd be shocked if someone hasn't done this already.)

I had an homebrew world were Half-elves were a draconic conspiracy. They were the preferred form for dragons shapshifting into humanoid (look like a human, but can explain their eternal youth by "I'm an half-elf", can explain their extra Charisma by "I'm an half-elf", and the fact that they don't know cultural norms of humans and of elves by "I'm and half-elf"), and there was no "true" half-elf, only dragons and their descendants with humans while shape-shifted.

[Witty Username]

Part of the issue with 5es half-orc and half-elf is they draw stats from the cultural positions of them.
+2 charisma is because in prior editions half-elves were regularly used as mediators in disputes between elves and humans (partially the age and perspective, half elves occupy that center space so have some capacity to relate to both better).
As for half-orc, they have an in built drive to excel since it helps deflect accusations of weakness or savagery.
Neither of these have a place in current designs thinking. For a little bit for worse and a lot for better, in my humble opinion.

[Envyus]

You're doing a great job of supporting my anti-Core point, actually.
You just dropped two very setting-specific justifications. I agree with them in regards to Faerun.
Now what explains a higher tiefling population on Oerth, where DiA didn't happen? And why are there Dragonborn stats at all, considering they don't exist there?

So you chose bad examples here by using Greyhawk one of the settings that assumes near all D&D things are in it.

Teiflings would probably be more common on Oerth than most D&D settings as the Empire of Iuz, Great Kingdom, and Horned Society exist and all three call in tons of Demons and Devils. Iuz is noted for having a very high population of Cambions which would in turn result in large numbers of Tieflings.


Dragonborn were first introduced in 3e which's assumed Greyhawk as the default, the origin there is they were humanoid worshipers of Bahamut, who did a ritual to transform them into dragon people.

[Psyren]

We just got the 2024 2025 Monster Manual cover preview, courtesy of IGN:



A beholder as predicted, and the humanoid figures appear to be Minsc alongside the new Blackstaff of Waterdeep, Vajra Safahr.

What's really cool though is the back cover. That's quite the rogues gallery!

[t209]

Part of the issue with 5es half-orc and half-elf is they draw stats from the cultural positions of them.
+2 charisma is because in prior editions half-elves were regularly used as mediators in disputes between elves and humans (partially the age and perspective, half elves occupy that center space so have some capacity to relate to both better).
As for half-orc, they have an in built drive to excel since it helps deflect accusations of weakness or savagery.
Neither of these have a place in current designs thinking. For a little bit for worse and a lot for better, in my humble opinion.

YEAH...I was wondering why Half Orcs didn't have flexibility as Half-Elf. Like maybe +2 Con or Str and +1 anything.
That and sometimes it kinda overlap with Orcs in terms of "Heavy Hitter" idea.

We just got the 2024 2025 Monster Manual cover preview, courtesy of IGN:

Spoiler: Size

Show

A beholder as predicted, and the humanoid figures appear to be Minsc alongside the new Blackstaff of Waterdeep, Vajra Safahr.

What's really cool though is the back cover. That's quite the rogues gallery!

Neat, for some reason some of them have "Baldur's Gate 3" synergy; especially the Mind Flayer, Hag, and Minsc.

[Agthor]

I have no idea what you're talking about Tieflings will be core.

The 10 races now confirmed are:

1. Aasimar
2. Humans
3. Dwarves
4. Dragonborn
5. Halflings
6. Elves
7. Gnomes
8. Goliaths
9. Orcs
10. Tieflings

Nice write up. Orcs will probably be banned at our table for being Uruk-hai style evil in our campaign world. Maybe we change them to Neanderthals 🤔and keep the stats.

[t209]

Nice write up. Orcs will probably be banned at our table for being Uruk-hai style evil in our campaign world. Maybe we change them to Neanderthals 🤔and keep the stats.

So Warcraft style?
I mean they are pretty big and they are other exposure of Orc archetypes other than LoTR and Warhammer.

[Oramac]

Neat, for some reason some of them have "Baldur's Gate 3" synergy; especially the Mind Flayer, Hag, and Minsc.

BG3 did win basically every possible award for a whole year. WOTC would have to be abnormally stupid to ignore that, even for them. Personally, I like it. I'm not a huge fan of beholders, but otherwise I think the art looks fantastic.

[Psyren]

A Beholder was all-but guaranteed for this cover given that (a) it's both iconic and product identity for them, (b) it's on the 2014 MM too, and (c) none of the other covers have one, so this was going to be the best spot for it.

Nice write up. Orcs will probably be banned at our table for being Uruk-hai style evil in our campaign world. Maybe we change them to Neanderthals 🤔and keep the stats.

You could always revert them to being "half-orcs" if that's your bag. Personally, I'm excited about Orcs finally being core after decades.

[Oramac]

A Beholder was all-but guaranteed for this cover given that (a) it's both iconic and product identity for them, (b) it's on the 2014 MM too, and (c) none of the other covers have one, so this was going to be the best spot for it.

Oh I get that. And it definitely makes sense. I just don't personally care for beholders much. /shrug

[Darth Credence]

Half-elves exist because they're a big deal in Tolkien (althought they're a big deal specifically because there's only a handful of them).
Half-orcs exist because orcs were considered Always Chaotic Evil several decades ago.

...yeah, I think we can do without those as explicit "races". I excluded them from my own homebrew setting a looong time ago (substituting full orcs for half-orcs). I'm okay with individuals being of custom lineage, but I don't like making a whole race and culture out of a specific half-human-hybrid.

Re: half-breeds, I'm kinda with Psyren on it. One doesn't mix Red and Blue paint and expect chartreuse. 2014 Half-elves having a few traits from elves and then mysteriously having double the skills, as well as getting a +2 to Charisma that neither parent has... it's just odd. Half-orcs are worse, getting something completely new that neither parent provides... it's weird enough that races are so homogeneous when it comes to racial traits; that the intermingling of two disparate species would result in wholly new attributes that 1) are ALWAYS present without fail, regardless, and 2) are completely outside the genetic norm of their parents? Makes no sense.

Now, if HOrcs and HElves were actually unique races that were simply named as such because they LOOK like they might have been descended from human/orc or elf breeding, sure, you'd have a case (and I'd much prefer that, as it fits with the dynamic of 'halfling'). Personally, I'd then go about giving them entirely new racial names, with "half-x" being a racial slur. (I'd be shocked if someone hasn't done this already.)

This is why I have no half anything in my campaign. Half-orcs are Orcan, half-elves are Daikini, halflings are Nelwyn, and calling someone half-something is a slur. I have no problem with mechanical benefits of those races. I have no problem with romantic relationships between different races if that's where things go. I just don't want a significant chunk of the world to be considered half of something, rather than full beings.