OOTS #1126 - The Discussion Thread

[Rogar Demonblud]

Why do people keep saying Belkar has his dagger back? He's holding one dagger and one stake, not two daggers.

He threw one of his daggers last strip. People seem to keep forgetting that with one hand holding the stake, he has a spare dagger at the moment (perhaps many).

[SilverCacaobean]

Or, because we don't know the whole story, it might be a whole lot more complicated than that. My money is on this, right now.

Well, I'm sure Durkon will eventually succeed magnificently, because so many panels spent on the memory without awesome effect would instantly break Elan's heart!

Mine too.

Wow, that phrase turned out to be unexpectedly efficient.

Kudzu isn't human! Stop oppressing dwarfen culture, you anthrocentric stretch!

*anthropocentric. I know, I know, I'm annoying.


I think we're one comic away from learning in what context Sigdi gave that "doing your duty especially when it makes you miserable" line. Can't wait. Then again, I thought the same thing about this one.

Also Thirden said something about subtext when he told Durkon about his dad's death, so it's likely he knew more than he said and Durkon might figure out what the subtext was now that he'll hear the whole story.

[nocoolnamejim]

Vampiric domination works like Dominate Person, and thus does not end with the death of the vampire. The closest it gets is that a dead vampire cannot spend 1 round per day concentrating on keeping the domination going, thus granting the subject a saving throw that day.

"If you don’t spend at least 1 round concentrating on the spell each day, the subject receives a new saving throw to throw off the domination."

(There are other ways a subject can be granted a new save, none as directly related to the timely demise of the vampire)

GW

Question for clarification.

If you kill the spawn, they can no longer give orders though, right? And since the dominated person won't act without orders, shouldn't the PCs that were controlled by underlings stop acting since they aren't getting orders?

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Wow, what a strip! Kudos to a) the people who deduced correctly that Sigdi had made a large donation, and b) the folks who predicted that bringing Kudzu to the fight would indeed prove to have consequences. Although, I do have to wonder if this gambit by the High Priest of Hel will backfire with Hilgya eventually being able to snap out of the spell. Also, incredibly annoyed at how the High Priest of Hel dismisses the memory. I want to find out what Sigdi will say, Thordamnit! (Loved her line about handouts too!)

Also, Dominated Elan is a very humorous touch to anotherwise very heavy strip.

[Peelee]

Haven’t you ever played table top D&D?

PCs always get thrown weapons back at the end of every round, except under two rare circumstances:

1) the DM is keeping track of who threw what, or
2) another PC is a being a jerk and tells the DM.

In all other cases, the PCs always get their weapons back, in the same way they always have enough arrows, they always have spell components, and they always have 5,000 feet of rope and enough ten foot poles to build a small barge (and enough small sacks to sew together a sail for that barge).

Arrows are tracked. Spell components (at least, those not in the pouch, which are explicitly enough for your general spellcasting) are tracked. Thrown items are tracked. Inventory is tracked, and in-game shopping is a thing.

Do y'all not count spells per day or HP either?

[Jay R]

This is a story, not a game; there are no dice.

"A successful saving throw against Domination is never late. Nor is it early. It arrives precisely when the author means for it to."

I thought the Area for that spell was a 10-ft.-radius emanation, centered on the caster.

And An emanation spell functions like a burst spell, except that the effect continues to radiate from the point of origin for the duration of the spell.

A burst spell affects whatever it catches in its area.

The Giant has made it clear that the rules of D&D will not interfere with his story.

Interesting...assuming wealth by level rules were in play, Durkon's mom either:

1. Was level 8 when she retired to raise Durkon, or

2. Was able to combine her husband's WBL with her own at level 6 when he died (minus any equipment on his physical body), ...

... or WBL levels weren't allowed to interfere with the story.

[Peelee]

"A successful saving throw against Domination is never late. Nor is it early. It arrives precisely when the author means for it to."

This was a BS answer and they both knew it.

[Fyraltari]

This was a BS answer and they both knew it.

Gandalf keeps missing everybody by a few days/hours and then claims to always be on time. Come on, Olorin, you're better than this.

[Matt620]

It took me a second to release that the Antilife Shell wouldn't be collasped, as Greg is not using it to push out Hilgya or Kudzu. But it is a little weird that the baby would cry immediately.

I am curious what will happen next, though. That is good.

[Jasdoif]

... or WBL levels weren't allowed to interfere with the story.

Or Sigdi's an NPC, and not intended to be held to PC wealth-by-level expectations.

[eilandesq]

A small baby isn't a very effective shield--even in the sense of "the attack will hit the baby and go through without reducing damage at all"-- for a low Dex character wearing (apparently) unenchanted robes. If Roy takes a moment to focus, he can keep throwing his sword at uncovered areas with a very small chance that Durkula can move Kuzdu in the way of the attack (and if he's keeping his word to Durkon, he won't even try to do that, which Roy will notice after the first time). Simply giving up (and conceding the destruction of the world) in the face of such a crappy tactic would be a major Stupid Good moment.

[Resileaf]

A small baby isn't a very effective shield--even in the sense of "the attack will hit the baby and go through without reducing damage at all"-- for a low Dex character wearing (apparently) unenchanted robes. If Roy takes a moment to focus, he can keep throwing his sword at uncovered areas with a very small chance that Durkula can move Kuzdu in the way of the attack. Simply giving up (and conceding the destruction of the world) in the face of such a crappy tactic would be a major Stupid Good moment.

Oh, sure, that's easy to say from your side of the keyboard, but until you've had to throw a greatsword at a baby, you have no leg to stand on.

[Jay R]

"A successful saving throw against Domination is never late. Nor is it early. It arrives precisely when the author means for it to."

This was a BS answer and they both knew it.

Red herring duly noted. Meanwhile, back at the discussion, the saving throws against Domination will arrive precisely when the author means for them to.

Arrows are tracked.

Are they?

... Spell components (at least, those not in the pouch, which are explicitly enough for your general spellcasting) are tracked. Thrown items are tracked. Inventory is tracked, and in-game shopping is a thing.

Do y'all not count spells per day or HP either?

: Geez, what is it with that guy and needing to figure out all the fiddly little details?

-------------------

He's obviously Xykon, I mean, come on, it's all but confirmed.

No, not at all. It's kind of a convoluted situation, but once you realize what species the Monster in the Darkness is, and what Vaarsuvius's gender is, then the current whereabouts of Durkon's father is obvious.

[nocoolnamejim]

It took me a second to release that the Antilife Shell wouldn't be collasped, as Greg is not using it to push out Hilgya or Kudzu. But it is a little weird that the baby would cry immediately.

I am curious what will happen next, though. That is good.

My theory on that is that the baby isn't used to being held by anyone but Hilgya.

[Dion]

Arrows are tracked. Spell components (at least, those not in the pouch, which are explicitly enough for your general spellcasting) are tracked. Thrown items are tracked. Inventory is tracked, and in-game shopping is a thing.

Do y'all not count spells per day or HP either?

When you play on a computer, they’re tracked.

When you play face to face, they’re “tracked”.

The only thing I’ve ever seen a real face-to-face DM actually track were the number of slices of pizza left in the box.

Belkar got his dagger back because that’s just how the D&D universe works.

[Jasdoif]

I've got it. Evil Durkon is Durkon's father.

I seriously doubt it. Realistically, it makes less than no sense; dramatically, it's too obvious to be a twist.

[luagha]

I thought Durkula was Lawful Evil and agreed to let Durkon's family live. This... does not seem to be him upholding his end of that bargain.

He hasn't harmed a hair on little sprout's head.

And since Roy never had a chance to pick up Point Blank and Precise Shot, well, he's not even going to try to make the shot.

[Larsen]

Belkar got his dagger back because that’s just how the D&D universe works.

In 1125, just after the throw we see belkar drawing a new dagger (grey handle in his left hand).

[Ironsmith]

It took me a second to release that the Antilife Shell wouldn't be collapsed, as Greg is not using it to push out Hilgya or Kudzu. But it is a little weird that the baby would cry immediately.

Well, I seem to recall somewhere that animals (i.e. dogs, cats, livestock, etc) tend to be nervous/skittish around undead creatures... maybe that same thing applies for very young children?

[Peelee]

Are they?

When you play on a computer, they’re tracked.

When you play face to face, they’re “tracked”.

The only thing I’ve ever seen a real face-to-face DM actually track were the number of slices of pizza left in the box.

Belkar got his dagger back because that’s just how the D&D universe works.

Jay R. has the right answer; Belkar got his dagger back because that's how the OotS universe works*. The D&D universe has a nice little tracking area on the sheet for your arrows. Your houserules don't equate to how the game works.

Also, Jay, less of a red herring than a gripe about people who use that line to talk about how Gandalf was awesome. I love Gandalf and all, but that was pure and utter snark, and it gets taken at face value way too often. I did enjoy your use of it, but still wanted to take a swing. I die on hills.

*Even then, in this case, it's been pointed out he draws a new dagger. Cheers to Larsen for finding that!

[/end grumpy old man rant]

[Resileaf]

In 1125, just after the throw we see belkar drawing a new dagger (grey handle in his left hand).

Huh. I hadn't noticed at all he was drawing something. Good catch. You have better eyes than I do.

[Jasdoif]

I die on hills.

So if Operation Plains-Or-Mountains-But-Never-Inbetween is a success, you'll live forever?

[AlurenDarkfire]

Hilgya will break the domination first. High Will save, and just the fact that Durkon had her hand over Kudzu to him has got to force at least ONE reroll, let alone using him as a living shield.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Question for clarification.

If you kill the spawn, they can no longer give orders though, right? And since the dominated person won't act without orders, shouldn't the PCs that were controlled by underlings stop acting since they aren't getting orders?

Nope, they'll continue to follow previously given orders to the best of their ability. Once that's no longer possible, then they'll just stand around doing the absolute minimum needed to keep themselves alive (that is to say, breathing and occasionally taking a drink of water).

[warmachine]

So Hilgya, a high level Cleric, fails a Will save to be Dominated, then fails a Will save to attack an ally who's attacking someone she utterly, utterly hates, then fails a Will save to hand her loved child to someone she utterly, utterly hates. Unless we go with Hilgya is merely putting on an act of self-deception and she really loves Durkon.

[Peelee]

So if Operation Plains-Or-Mountains-But-Never-Inbetween is a success, you'll live forever?

[Dion]

The D&D universe has a nice little tracking area on the sheet for your arrows.

Right. Sometimes the player controlling the PC has a character sheet with a smudged up little box to track arrows. Sometimes the player controlling the PC even makes random little squiggles in that box during play.

Heck, sometimes the player writes and erases squiggles in that box so often that it wears through the paper.

But no player I’ve ever played with has ever run out of arrows, and I can’t imaine a DM that has actually ever tracked arrows for a player, like you are claiming that DMs do.

[ThePhantasm]

Jay, less of a red herring than a gripe about people who use that line to talk about how Gandalf was awesome. I love Gandalf and all, but that was pure and utter snark, and it gets taken at face value way too often. I did enjoy your use of it, but still wanted to take a swing. I die on hills.

Sort of. In context it was snark. In storytelling terms, it was foreshadowing of all the times in LOTR that Gandalf shows up in precisely the nick of time (a bit like the Mechane).

[Ironsmith]

Sort of. In context it was snark. In storytelling terms, it was foreshadowing of all the times in LOTR that Gandalf shows up in precisely the nick of time (a bit like the Mechane).

Foreshadowing or lampshade hanging?

[Peelee]

Right. Sometimes the player controlling the PC has a character sheet with a smudged up little box to track arrows. Sometimes the player controlling the PC even makes random little squiggles in that box during play.

Heck, sometimes the player writes and erases squiggles in that box so often that it wears through the paper.

But no player I’ve ever played with has ever run out of arrows, and I can’t imaine a DM that has actually ever tracked arrows for a player, like you are claiming that DMs do.

Eh, I'm not saying all DMs track arrows. You, however, are saying all DMs don't track arrows (and material components, and hundreds of feet of rope or poles, and whatever else y'all don't track), and that's how the universe is built. If y'all play like that and enjoy it, more power to you. But if you're going to make claims about the comic based on your houserules, don't be surprised if you're called on it.

Sort of. In context it was snark. In storytelling terms, it was foreshadowing of all the times in LOTR that Gandalf shows up in precisely the nick of time (a bit like the Mechane).

Ha! Never thought about it like that. Because yeah, the number of times Gandalf arrives almost too late (especially in The Hobbit, which I'm rereading right now) is shockingly high.