So did Hel know how the gods would vote?

[Shale]

Now that we've seen Hel's master plan, it turns out that, in theory, she didn't necessarily need Durkon after all -- if the Gods collectively vote "yes" and destroy the world, she collects every Dwarven soul and ascends to be the most powerful member of the Northern Pantheon. Unless she's lying or eliding a critical step in this process, she didn't have to actually be there to claim that victory. And casting a single vote out of 18 was no guarantee that she'd win. So did she (and presumably the other gods) knew well in advance how the vote was going to play out? Is there any reason for this plan if she didn't?

[SavageWombat]

She counted the votes based on her knowledge of the gods in question. Much like we can usually anticipate the votes of our own politicians.

She obviously guessed correctly.

[Ornithologist]

I can only imagine that she has had plenty of time to figure out and guess at how the votes will fall. Heck, if the vote ahd gone her way, she could have just stayed quiet and and gloated about it when the souls settled out.

[Eno Remnant]

Well, Hel had to do something when she wasn't plotting revenge, and it's not like she had a lot of mortal affairs to attend to. She probably spent years watching the other gods, memorising their personality traits and habits to a point of predictability.

She could just estimate, with reasonable accuracy, what their responses would be. Even if she got some wrong, the margin could easily have gone in her favour.

On a more mechanical point, the destruction of the world causes a lot of deaths in the Northern Pantheon's worshippers. Therefore, the vote is part of her portfolio, and she can anticipate how the other gods would vote through her portfolio sense.

Either way, it's not overly far-fetched.

EDIT: Partly Swordsage'd. But my point about portfolios stands.

[Cirrylius]

Considering X-thousand years experience, nigh-omnicogniscence, and ordinary political clout, I imagine that every god of every pantheon knew the outcome before it happened- the weight of obligations and experience is too great for them not to vote predictably, at that point. Only a total coup, like a goddess choosing to vote for her pantheon for the very first time, could have upset that knowledge.

...she simultaneously pulled a party-level conspiracy*, a multi-national conspiracy, and a deific conspiracy all at the same time.

Hel is effing BRILLIANT.


*provided the conspiracy didn't just come down to "predictable death of Thundershield, of course".

[The Giant]

As was pointed out in #998, the gods have held this exact vote before, during the Order of the Scribble's day. Between that and knowledge of their personalities and priorities, it is not unreasonable that a hyper-intelligent being would be able to count votes ahead of time. Maybe there were one or two that were uncertain, but that's why she had Durkon wait until it was over.

[Cirrylius]

*glances up*

Is it... do I get in trouble if I squee?

[Psyren]

Now that we've seen Hel's master plan, it turns out that, in theory, she didn't necessarily need Durkon after all -- if the Gods collectively vote "yes" and destroy the world, she collects every Dwarven soul and ascends to be the most powerful member of the Northern Pantheon. Unless she's lying or eliding a critical step in this process, she didn't have to actually be there to claim that victory. And casting a single vote out of 18 was no guarantee that she'd win. So did she (and presumably the other gods) knew well in advance how the vote was going to play out? Is there any reason for this plan if she didn't?

What you have to keep in mind is that deities in D&D settings (and mythology in general for that matter) are generally pretty predictable. It's a side-effect of having each one advocate for/exemplify one virtue or aspect of reality above all others.

For instance, knowing that Freya - the goddess of creating life - would vote against snuffing it all out, should be be as easy to deduce as voting that the god of monsters would be in favor - after all, his own creations get slaughtered all the time. Similarly, the god of secrets' vote should be easy to guess, because nothing keeps a secret better than oblivion, while the gambler god voting no and letting the chips fall where they may should also be easy to guess.

[Akal Saris]

There's a few gods where I would guess that their responses might be hard to predict (though with a prior vote you could reasonably expect where the votes would go). The two that stick out for me are:
- Tyr could just as easily say "never give up without an epic fight!"
- Loki as a champion of keeping the world alive, given that he's, well, Loki. I guess he's more fire than evil here, but still - you'd think he might be down with seeing the world go in flames and starting over.

Overall I liked that this wasn't a decision based on alignment so much as a spectrum of caution to optimism.

[Synesthesy]

There's a few gods where I would guess that their responses might be hard to predict (though with a prior vote you could reasonably expect where the votes would go). The two that stick out for me are:
- Tyr could just as easily say "never give up without an epic fight!"
- Loki as a champion of keeping the world alive, given that he's, well, Loki. I guess he's more fire than evil here, but still - you'd think he might be down with seeing the world go in flames and starting over.

Overall I liked that this wasn't a decision based on alignment so much as a spectrum of caution to optimism.

I always saw Loki as a God of Chaos rather then a God of Evil.... As fire is.

[Psyren]

I always saw Loki as a God of Chaos rather then a God of Evil.... As fire is.

Fire isn't intelligent/sapient though, while gods are. When you devote yourself to chaos to the point that you're willing to hurt/destroy life for the fun of it, that's when you slip from CN to CE. Unseelie fey are much the same - their pranks cross the line from mischief to outright malice.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Similarly, the god of secrets' vote should be easy to guess

He's not very good at his job, is he?