Ridiculous D&D contrivances

[Chronos]

The male-female symmetry never bothered me, because even though there are differences between the typical male and the typical female, adventurers aren't typical. Even if women above X strength are extremely rare, maybe my female barbarian is just one of those extreme rare cases.


You want something really crazy, though? You're a ranger. You find some tracks in the mud, and you want to follow them. No problem: Even the rankest of novices in the ways of woodcraft can pull that off (DC 5). But what if you want to know what kind of creature made those tracks? Sorry, you're out of luck: That's a DC 60 skill check. Obviously, no mere mortal can tell the difference between hoofprints, footprints, and pawprints.

[Harperfan7]

Why a shark, of all things? And if you have a lake of acid, what more defense do you need? Are you afraid of skinny dipping it for for Christ's sake!? How the Hell did you get a body of acid that big in the first place?



They're bred. How the Hell do you breed sharks to breath acid!? It seems like something from a bad spy movie!



I don't see the hate on half-races. Personally, I have no problem with the idea of mating with some saucy Elf babe.

1. It's for people who cast acid immunity spells on themselves. We're saying that if you DO have a lake of acid, why stop there? You have a freaking lake of acid, if you are that bamf, why can't you stock it with magically augmented sharks?

2. You could just as easily say they are created/augmented for that purpose.

3. Hear hear!

[Faulty]

Stop making them sound plausible!

[MeklorIlavator]

Stop making them sound plausible!

Really, would you be this upset if instead of sharks it was just some sort of carnivorous aquatic creature that had an immunity to acid? Cause that's essentially what it is, and there are similar things all over the place if you look hard enough.

[Myrmex]

Obviously, no mere mortal can tell the difference between hoofprints, footprints, and pawprints.

Wolf, Dire Wolf, Worg, Winter Wolf, Shadow Mastiff, Yeth Hound, Blink Dog, Werewolf, Hound Archon, Hellhound Werewolf of a non-medium race, advanced wolves, winter wolves, dire wolves, and worgs, are all canines in the monster manual.

Alright genius, try and tell them apart.

Though, DC60 is a bit high. I think it's more for telling if you're tracking a tiefling or just a really emo half elf.

[averagejoe]

Why a shark, of all things? And if you have a lake of acid, what more defense do you need? Are you afraid of skinny dipping it for for Christ's sake!? How the Hell did you get a body of acid that big in the first place?

Sharks because they are the perfect aquatic predator. I'm not sure why you think any amount of defense is "enough," plus nothing says evil overlord like exotic and ridiculous predators.

Plus it is terrifically decadent. I mean, no evil overlord really needs an elaborate fountain depicting people in pain and weeping real blood, but your foyer just wouldn't be the same without it.

[chiasaur11]

Sharks because they are the perfect aquatic predator. I'm not sure why you think any amount of defense is "enough," plus nothing says evil overlord like exotic and ridiculous predators.

Plus it is terrifically decadent. I mean, no evil overlord really needs an elaborate fountain depicting people in pain and weeping real blood, but your foyer just wouldn't be the same without it.

"Depicting"?

You, my friend, have a very low quality of evil overlords.

[Waspinator]

About racial crosses, this is a way of handling that I like:
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51535

About things like unarmed strike dual-wielding, it's amusing how much the Air Bud clause is being invoked:
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2004/01/...-valid-points/

And finally, I have to agree that trying to model the differences between male and female humans (and near-human races) is a bad idea for three reasons. 1: It's going to offend someone no matter what. 2: I don't think the differences are probably even big enough to show up. A strength of 10 and a strength of 12 are actually pretty different in terms of what it's supposed to imply about physical power and any real-world difference might not even be that much. And 3: I really don't want to see the day where people are min-maxing their characters gender.

[averagejoe]

"Depicting"?

You, my friend, have a very low quality of evil overlords.

Eh, live ones start to stink up the place, and they lack aesthetic. Just because one is evil doesn't mean one has to be tasteless.

[Dilb]

Wolf, Dire Wolf, Worg, Winter Wolf, Shadow Mastiff, Yeth Hound, Blink Dog, Werewolf, Hound Archon, Hellhound Werewolf of a non-medium race, advanced wolves, winter wolves, dire wolves, and worgs, are all canines in the monster manual.

Alright genius, try and tell them apart.

Though, DC60 is a bit high. I think it's more for telling if you're tracking a tiefling or just a really emo half elf.

Wolf - about 5 feet long, 60 to 80 pounds (assuming it's a real world grey wolf)
Dire wolf - 9 feet long, 800 lbs
Worg - 5 feet long, 300 lbs
Winter wolf - 8 feet long, 450 lbs
Shadow Mastiff - "a large dog", maybe 6 feet long, 200 lbs, only 2 feet high at the shoulder (shorter than a wolf)
Yeth Hound - 5 feet tall, but a medium creature, 400 lbs
Blink Dog - no physical stats given, but any sign of teleportation (an abrupt end to tracks, only for them to pick up a little bit later) is a big hint
Werewolf - the whole point is that they turn into wolves, so no luck here
Hound Archon - again, they turn into wolves. The typical environment might be a hint.
Hell hound - 4.5 ft, 120 lbs, but again, the typical environment may be a clue. If they are hunting anything, there should be scorch marks from fire breathing.
Werewolf of a non-medium race - Again, the point is they actually change into wolves. They can shift by 1 size category up or down, so small or large creatures can look like regular wolves. Huge creatures could presumably change into ordinary looking dire wolves.
Advanced wolf - They're bigger than most wolves

These would actually be really easy to tell apart aside from the shape shifters. There's a huge range of lengths and weights, which affects the depth and distance between tracks. There would probably be differences in the shape and size of the paws as well. Heck, they probably have different gaits too, so the relative position of tracks could help distinguish them.

If you had a good set of tracks in fresh snow, I'd expect even a novice tracker would have no problem telling them apart.

[Myrmex]

Wolf - about 5 feet long, 60 to 80 pounds (assuming it's a real world grey wolf)
Dire wolf - 9 feet long, 800 lbs
Worg - 5 feet long, 300 lbs
Winter wolf - 8 feet long, 450 lbs
Shadow Mastiff - "a large dog", maybe 6 feet long, 200 lbs, only 2 feet high at the shoulder (shorter than a wolf)
Yeth Hound - 5 feet tall, but a medium creature, 400 lbs
Blink Dog - no physical stats given, but any sign of teleportation (an abrupt end to tracks, only for them to pick up a little bit later) is a big hint
Werewolf - the whole point is that they turn into wolves, so no luck here
Hound Archon - again, they turn into wolves. The typical environment might be a hint.
Hell hound - 4.5 ft, 120 lbs, but again, the typical environment may be a clue. If they are hunting anything, there should be scorch marks from fire breathing.
Werewolf of a non-medium race - Again, the point is they actually change into wolves. They can shift by 1 size category up or down, so small or large creatures can look like regular wolves. Huge creatures could presumably change into ordinary looking dire wolves.
Advanced wolf - They're bigger than most wolves

These would actually be really easy to tell apart aside from the shape shifters. There's a huge range of lengths and weights, which affects the depth and distance between tracks. There would probably be differences in the shape and size of the paws as well. Heck, they probably have different gaits too, so the relative position of tracks could help distinguish them.

If you had a good set of tracks in fresh snow, I'd expect even a novice tracker would have no problem telling them apart.

You are assuming static sizes. Variation would throw you off, assuming Gaussian distribution, I would expect most of those things to be within a standard deviation of each other. Your error bars are going to overlap.

Props on looking all that up, though.

[Bayar]

Wolf, Dire Wolf, Worg, Winter Wolf, Shadow Mastiff, Yeth Hound, Blink Dog, Werewolf, Hound Archon, Hellhound Werewolf of a non-medium race, advanced wolves, winter wolves, dire wolves, and worgs, are all canines in the monster manual.

Alright genius, try and tell them apart.

Though, DC60 is a bit high. I think it's more for telling if you're tracking a tiefling or just a really emo half elf.

That picture with the werewolf in the Monster Manual...think the artist might have some...inclinations or has been forced to draw that (not that I am misoginistic or anything).

[Ravens_cry]

Breasts on things that have no reason to have breasts.
And it's not like it is impossible to make such a creature attractive to human eyes, as Nip & Tuck proved to at least my satisfaction.

[Godskook]

The male-female symmetry never bothered me, because even though there are differences between the typical male and the typical female, adventurers aren't typical. Even if women above X strength are extremely rare, maybe my female barbarian is just one of those extreme rare cases.

Actually the extreme cases are the worst examples. The men's world record for the bench press is ~1000lbs, where with women, its ~500lbs.

And finally, I have to agree that trying to model the differences between male and female humans (and near-human races) is a bad idea for three reasons. 1: It's going to offend someone no matter what. 2: I don't think the differences are probably even big enough to show up. A strength of 10 and a strength of 12 are actually pretty different in terms of what it's supposed to imply about physical power and any real-world difference might not even be that much. And 3: I really don't want to see the day where people are min-maxing their characters gender.

1.FF Tactics had males being better fighters and females being better casters. I don't think it offended anyone, since the choice didn't promote either gender as being 'better'. The D&D flavor is different, so it'd be harder to do balanced, but if it was, I doubt people would be offended by something realistic like that, except for the same people who're offended by WotC's racist treatment of some elves as being dumber than others or something like that. Of course, that probably is a big if.

2.I building a local Dagorhir chapter in my neighborhood, and some girls actually complain that the larger weapons are 'too heavy'. The guys, not so much. It comes up. On the other side, those girls were also universally more natural at learning how to fight with two weapons, while most of the guys actually did better with one weapon first time out.

3.Honestly, that's the best argument against realism I've ever heard.

[averagejoe]

Yes, but what if, for example, I want to play a bad ass female warrior, but this possibility is gimped just because of some arbitrary str/con penalty? I want to play Constance the bloody Conqueror, not Kathryn-who-is-perfectly-believable.

[lesser_minion]

Well, in theory Constance the Bloody Conqueror could do just fine with a reduced strength score - you could build a version of the same concept running on a less strength-dependent play style.

I think the best solution to portraying a gender difference that exists in your campaigns would be to portray the genders that way - either through single-gender organisations or simply through the NPCs you portray.

[averagejoe]

Well, in theory Constance the Bloody Conqueror could do just fine with a reduced strength score - you could build a version of the same concept running on a less strength-dependent play style.

I think the best solution to portraying a gender difference that exists in your campaigns would be to portray the genders that way - either through single-gender organisations or simply through the NPCs you portray.

Because this:

Spoiler

Show

is bad ass. When I have my guy who can jump fifty feet in the air and one-shot a monster several times their size, I'm not too worried about them fitting into the constraints of humans as we know them. Maybe DnD humans have less sexual dimorphism than real humans. I don't care, I like my lady berserkers, and I have yet to see an actual reason to adjust stats for gender anyways.

[Curmudgeon]

-jumping out of an airplane (which apparently exists in this hypothetical statement) with an antimagic field-belt and surviving the fall because 20d6 is only so much, even with massive damage rule.

Doesn't happen, because there's no such thing as "an antimagic field-belt". Really, think about it: a magic device that stops nearby magic from working? It's immediately self-defeating.

[Paramour Pink]

If I could get a Bluff check high enough...that would be a great item to sell.

[Dogmantra]

If I could get a Bluff check high enough...that would be a great item to sell.

A: "I would like to return this item. It doesn't work."
B: "Why, what's wrong with it?"
A: "Well, it's supposed to stop all magic from working nearby, but it doesn't."
B: "Sir, that's because it itself is a magical item, it will stop itself working."
B's player: "Awesome! Natural 20!"
A: "Oh, okay then, what do you suggest to make it work?"
B: "Put it outside the field generated by it."
A: "Thanks"

[lesser_minion]

Because this:

Spoiler

Show

is bad ass. When I have my guy who can jump fifty feet in the air and one-shot a monster several times their size, I'm not too worried about them fitting into the constraints of humans as we know them. Maybe DnD humans have less sexual dimorphism than real humans. I don't care, I like my lady berserkers, and I have yet to see an actual reason to adjust stats for gender anyways.

I'm not arguing in favour of having the rulebook impose mandatory gender differences, because they aren't major enough to be worth a +1 or a -1 to the numbers. My point was that Constance the Bloody Conqueror has no more reason on face value to need a strength score worthy of Sulik - there is always subtlety.

[RebelRogue]

In D&D, the length of the hypotenuse of a right triangle is equal to the length of the other two sides. The geometry of this world, and by extension the physics, isn't just physically impossible. That I can deal with. You have to for willing suspension of disbelief in fantasy. Magic and monsters and stuff, that's all physically impossible.

There's actually a mathematical metric that mirrors this exactly, so it's not impossible or self-contradictory at all. It's different from what you and I experience everyday, but not impossible!

However, I don't think it's wise to interpret it that hard and fast. It's merely convenience.

[averagejoe]

I'm not arguing in favour of having the rulebook impose mandatory gender differences, because they aren't major enough to be worth a +1 or a -1 to the numbers. My point was that Constance the Bloody Conqueror has no more reason on face value to need a strength score worthy of Sulik - there is always subtlety.

Ah, I misunderstood. Frankly, if it isn't for the bashing and the smashing, I don't see the point. Slicing people in half and charging through walls=good times.

[Callos_DeTerran]

Why a shark, of all things? And if you have a lake of acid, what more defense do you need? Are you afraid of skinny dipping it for for Christ's sake!? How the Hell did you get a body of acid that big in the first place?



They're bred. How the Hell do you breed sharks to breath acid!? It seems like something from a bad spy movie!



I don't see the hate on half-races. Personally, I have no problem with the idea of mating with some saucy Elf babe.

So...wait...You are perfectly fine with mating with some saucy Elf babe and producing a half-each offspring, but your mind rebels against the idea of black dragons(or any acid immune creature) being bred with sharks until they are simply acid immune sharks with each generation having a modified water-breathing spell cast on them each day until it's an inherent ability that eventually becomes natural?

That would also make an awesome low-level adventure, Deep Blue Sea style. PCs are guards for an Evil Overlord funding an Acid-breathing Shark program in a small lake of acid when the super-intelligent half-dragon breeds begin busting out and boring holes in the complex while the lesser mere...acid-breathing version begin flooding in. Not only do the PC's need to worry about escaping the facility without becoming shark chow...they have to worry about the acid slowly filling the place up! (Hrm..maybe not full strength acid. 10 damage a round if fully immersed?)

EDIT: @AverageJoe: Of course one needs taste...that's why you use the tortured souls of your enemy's family and loved ones to make your bleeding fountain while a nice soothing orchestra played by said family and loved one's re-animated and programed bodies. Sends a message, and soothes you after a long days work. Of course all this is surrounded by a pit of acid full of acid-breathing sharks so nobody meddles with your masterpiece.

[averagejoe]

EDIT: @AverageJoe: Of course one needs taste...that's why you use the tortured souls of your enemy's family and loved ones to make your bleeding fountain while a nice soothing orchestra played by said family and loved one's re-animated and programed bodies. Sends a message, and soothes you after a long days work. Of course all this is surrounded by a pit of acid full of acid-breathing sharks so nobody meddles with your masterpiece.

I find that any undead that are purely for decor (and, preferably, those who aren't, but one can't always be picky about minions) must be skeletal. I'm sorry, but rotting flesh just doesn't go with anything, and it's almost impossible to escape from that, "Oh, look, I just got into my father's necromancy set and built my first evil lair, and it is so badass you guys seriously," impression it gives. Yes, yes, I know, people have a strong visceral reaction to their loved ones being reanimated and paraded about, but there's just no class to it.

Now, acid sharks, those are classy. One can, for example, set up a glass tank surrounded by tables in order to entertain guests and provide a pleasant dining experience. This is superior to standard sharks because the acid nicely dissolves the bones and blood, requiring minimal cleaning, and allowing your guests to enjoy subsequent pieces of entertainment without having to constantly be subjected to the previous ones, cleansing the visual palette, if you will. In addition, acid sharks go splendidly with cunningly placed trapdoors, and one can never go wrong with trapdoors.

[chiasaur11]

Eh, live ones start to stink up the place, and they lack aesthetic. Just because one is evil doesn't mean one has to be tasteless.

Gentle repose.

Also helps with using undead to trick heroes into thinking their friends are still alive.

Which, by the way, is both hilarious and pathetic.

Agreed on the skeleton count, though, when a truly lifelike undead is out of the question or unneeded. They ooze class.

Rather than pus, like most undead, which wrecks evil carpeting.

[KazilDarkeye]

Rather than pus, like most undead, which wrecks evil carpeting.

As does ahem, "red wine" that one keeps in the cellar, yesss...

[averagejoe]

I find that, aside from the occasional throw rug made from sentient beings, it's best to stay away from carpeting. Even if it does escape the blood of your enemies/servants/victims, one of your minions with less than desirable foot construction will inevitably scuff it up.

[chiasaur11]

As does ahem, "red wine" that one keeps in the cellar, yesss...

Now, that's wasteful.

I mean, you can sell that stuff to vampire lords or pit fiends for a much better value than drinking it.

[Myrmex]

Yes, but what if, for example, I want to play a bad ass female warrior, but this possibility is gimped just because of some arbitrary str/con penalty? I want to play Constance the bloody Conqueror, not Kathryn-who-is-perfectly-believable.

And what if I want to play Crazim'dul, Orc Battlemage, but don't want to be gimped by some arbitrary int/cha penalty?