Concerning X-Men (fans read)

[Tomb_Raven]

Well the fur disapreared in the movie and beast was reverting back to the standard human template. Maybe it rebuilds the bodies of the thing or regresses them back to the original coding of the genes? In which case the kid is the cure for cancer and all that stuff. Also how could the kid have a gene that cures the gene if the gene is par tof the gene than cures the gene. So if he has the gene then he doesnt have it, but if he doesnt he does ??? a bit too paradoxical for me.

And as to where the matter goes i think the most likely place is a sub dimension which stores colossus' "metal skin". Colossus gains weight from somewhere when he goes metal so maybe thats where all this reverted matter goes :P.

Oh and about the claws... how do they retract? If muscles can only contract then the muscles attached to the tendons than would pull out the claws would have to be on the "palm side" of his lower arm... and then you would need more muscles to pull them back :/ these would have to be big in order to hold the claws in place.

[Nerull]

Imagine the claws are anchored half-way between a tendon. When he pops his claws, muscles in the wrist area pull the claws up...notice his hands are closed most of the time, giving the impression of a clenched muscle. When he wishes to retract them, muscled near the elbow flex and pulls them back in. This would be considered the "relaxed" state that he doesn't have to consciously think about to maintain. He needs to make the initial effort to snap them back, but not hold them there. Think of a smile...it takes effort and initiative to form one, but takes no effort to be deadpan, or neutral.

[Tomb_Raven]

if the relaxed state is with them in then he must have his muscles contracted to have the claws out right? So... in order to keep them out and be able to stab things without them retracting the muscles would have to be pretty impressive.

If you had razor blades on ur hands and were fighting would you make a fist? or would ou risk your fingers?

EDIT: the retraction muscles would have to be on the other side of the wrist to where the claws come out as muscles cant push. this meas that the tendons would have to curl around the wrist which would act as a fulcrum to extract the claws. All im saying is he must have mighty forearms. with loads of complex muscles in them. Also wouldnt the claws compromise on his turning movement? As they would prolly get in the way of the radial bones (i think thats what they are called).

his claws arnt like cats where they flex their hands to pull back the skin... so thats out...

[Nerull]

if the relaxed state is with them in then he must have his muscles contracted to have the claws out right? So... in order to keep them out and be able to stab things without them retracting the muscles would have to be pretty impressive.

Well, yeah...keep in mind that the guy cuts through steel bars. Part of that might be attributed to really sharp blades, but the guy is strong. Besides, if he's stabbing things, I would wager that your flesh would part far way before his muscles would give in, assuming that the blades are anchored in a useful way to his muscles...just as a lions claws are anchored or a bulls horns are anchored to be useful. Sure they might skip off bone going in, but the stabbing part wouldn't be NEAR as stressful on his side I bet.

If you had razor blades on ur hands and were fighting would you make a fist? or would ou risk your fingers?

That entirely depends on where the blades are attached, right? If I were Lady Deathstrike, with razor edged FINGERTIPS, then a fist would be foolish to make. If I were Sabertooth, with claw tipped FINGERS, then again, I would slash with an open hand. If I had a series of knives extending EXACTLY parallel to my arm bone that shoots out from between my knuckles or slightly above my knuckles, then there is no WAY I would keep an open hand. Your fingers would be directly parallel with extremely sharp knives, for goodness sake, and would probably split them like hotdogs. I'd keep my hand out of the way at all times in the form of a fist. But that's just me.

...wouldn't you?

Maybe I didn't understand the question?

EDIT: the retraction muscles would have to be on the other side of the wrist to where the claws come out as muscles cant push. this meas that the tendons would have to curl around the wrist which would act as a fulcrum to extract the claws. All im saying is he must have mighty forearms. with loads of complex muscles in them. Also wouldnt the claws compromise on his turning movement? As they would prolly get in the way of the radial bones (i think thats what they are called).

his claws arnt like cats where they flex their hands to pull back the skin... so thats out...

You're right...muscles can't push, which is why I never said that they could. Let's do an experiment. Let's take an elastic rope and tie an object directly in the middle of it. Now, you stand on one side and I'll stand on the other. Pull the rope. The object comes towards you, right? Now let it go slack and I'll pull my end. The object comes towards me right? Does the fact that the object comes towards me indicate that you pushed it? Not at all.

Imagine 2 muscles. One located near the elbow area, one located in the wrist. The brain, of course, controls these muscles and allows them to work in concert with one another. Wolverine gets attacked. Brain tells wrist muscles to PULL the blades forward and stay there as long as he flexes them, while at the same time telling the elbow muscles to relax and let the blades go. Wolverine get through the fight. Brain tells writs to release so that elbow muscles can PULL the blades back.

No muscle pushing at all.

And again, of course he has a different physical makeup, including the requisite musculature and skeletal system to accomodate his mutation. I can imagine a mutant that might be similar to Wolverine in some instances but in the most important aspects...lack of muscle mass, ineffective skeletal system, no healing factor...he/she is utterly unprepared and is essentially just handicapped as opposed to being a subject of heroic action stories.

[Tomb_Raven]

That entirely depends on where the blades are attached, right? If I were Lady Deathstrike, with razor edged FINGERTIPS, then a fist would be foolish to make. If I were Sabertooth, with claw tipped FINGERS, then again, I would slash with an open hand. If I had a series of knives extending EXACTLY parallel to my arm bone that shoots out from between my knuckles or slightly above my knuckles, then there is no WAY I would keep an open hand. Your fingers would be directly parallel with extremely sharp knives, for goodness sake, and would probably split them like hotdogs. I'd keep my hand out of the way at all times in the form of a fist. But that's just me.

...wouldn't you?

Maybe I didn't understand the question?

I agree here i was being ironic seeing as you said that he has his fists clenched and it seemed as if that was part of your argument. I merely meant to point out that it was common sense.

About the muscles. Im sure we are saying almost exactly the same things :P Im just trying to show how absurdly ineficient the system would be, which is why it isnt used overly much in nature. Except amongst insects hmmm... im gonna read that up in a moment (like bea stings).

In essence i think we are saying the same thing tho...

Raven

PS: this makes me think of this commic strip...
http://archive.gamespy.com/comics/no...ffn/ffn164.htm

Edit: nope not even stings are retracted as such. The abdomen is pushed up allowing the sting to stick out. (in bees anyway)

[Nerull]

That's a great link...sums us up pretty well. ;)

Sure, we might not see that kind of stuff in nature, and it may be very inefficient. Consider this, though: Depending on your view of the origins of mankind, might it be considered inefficient to have the bodies we currently have as opposed to being a single celled organism that lives off of the suns rays like algae?

It's inefficient to have a variety of dietary needs, for example, when we could stay at such an elementary state that movement isn't ever required.

[Tomb_Raven]

Hehe yeah thats true but then... it might also be efficient for a different single cell to engulf the first. And from there we move on to competition which starts evolution ;)

[CelestialStick]

I don't think that she'll forgive that easily. Or that he'll take her back. Remember that after he abandoned her she betrayed his whereabouts.

WARNING: SPOILER INFORMATION FOLLOWS.


That's right. I wonder if they'll put her in the new movie at all. The thing is that she seems to be evil and have it in for normal humans, which makes her a natural ally for Magneto. If she gets her powers back, won't she revert to her evil, anti-human self? Maybe she will work independently against mankind.

Or maybe Magneto's betrayal of her will change her character so that she becomes a good-guy. Has she ever been good in the comics?

[Tomb_Raven]

Peronaly i think we should/will have sentinels in the next one if any.

Raven

[CelestialStick]

Peronaly i think we should/will have sentinels in the next one if any.

Raven

Who or what are sentinels?

[Nerull]

Sentinels are basically robots programmed to hunt mutants created in response to increased fear of mutants by "normal" people. They stand about 40 feet tall and are armed to the teeth.

[CelestialStick]

Sentinels are basically robots programmed to hunt mutants created in response to increased fear of mutants by "normal" people. They stand about 40 feet tall and are armed to the teeth.

Hmm. That sounds vaguely familiar. Did they appear in some cartoon series version of X-Men?

Incidentally, how do machines distinguish mutants from regular humans? I mean, only twins have identical DNA.

[Godhand]

IF anyone has not seen the third X-men movie then skip this post. Thank you and sorry if it's a bit off topic.

Two things about X3.

1. Great movie, but what was the point of Angel or Rogue being there? Crazy new writers...

2. So Mr. Mag gets the cure, but you can't find one to use on Phoenix? Why didn't they just bring the cure kid in and have him give Jean a power draining hug? Or does his inhibition field only stop mutants within it not powers being thrown at him from beyond it? So confusing.

[Tomb_Raven]

Not sure they prolly can locate the x gene or whatever. Perhaps they can tell and get the info from the same place colossus gets his extra mass when he goes metal.

Imo sentinals ar ethe next logical step cos the humans were on the edge before and now after that whole ruin the bridge and beat the crap out of each other and humies showing how much power and crap tactics they have there should be a majour panic. Which would make the project more plausible.

Also sentinals were cool.

Raven

EDIT: i think the kid would have been incinerated before he got any where near close enough, i mean the human soldiers just went poof and dissapeared. Also the kid would have got lynched by the bad guys if he was any where near there. Angel is important in that... erm.... he ... erm ... was always pointless? ... and then became death as one of the 4 horsemen. bad choice. I mean angel what can he actually do? I think even jubilee with her pretty sparks was more powerfull.

[Godhand]

Well the kid had to have passed by Phoenix on the way out, she was pretty much in front of the bridge. Unless Shadowcat took the kid swimming in frigid waters he could've had a chance to walk up and stop Phoenix.

Gah! I over analyze this stuff too much. Of course, we all know none of the important characters are really dead, because according to comic book law, no famous character can die and stay dead. I mean look at Magneto, the man just doesn't die and stay dead.

Edit: And where the heck was Gambit? He name was seen in X2 on a computer right above Magneto's (His name is Remy btw). For being one of the most popular characters along with Nightcrawler and Wolverine it was very surpising to leave out the crazy French guy.

[Nerull]

Hmm. That sounds vaguely familiar. Did they appear in some cartoon series version of X-Men?

Yeah, they did. Big purple guys. I don't know what Marvel comics fixation is on huge purple guys(Galactus, Sentinels) but there you go.

Incidentally, how do machines distinguish mutants from regular humans? I mean, only twins have identical DNA.

I'm not sure how it actually is supposed to function, but I imagine it's based on the detection of radically different DNA from a given "norm". I believe a computer can tell the difference from a gorilla and a human, for example. Now just imagine a mutant being a more evolved form of homo-sapiens...homo-superior I believe Magneto called it. A computer could probably tell the difference.

That's just a guess, though.

[Tomb_Raven]

And leave out Nightcrawler... he had the coolest scene in the whole x2 movie... Right at the beggiing after that it went downhill... though not too much.

Raven
EDIT: this is in referance to erm... the guys whos avatar i did... hmmm Godhand.

As to purple guys... purple is cool. :P In x3 when they were in the traiing simu i thought it was an actual battle and when logan came with the robotic head i held my breath, i thought there were going to be sentinals in this already. :( but there wernt :(

[CelestialStick]

Yeah, they did. Big purple guys. I don't know what Marvel comics fixation is on huge purple guys(Galactus, Sentinels) but there you go.


I'm not sure how it actually is supposed to function, but I imagine it's based on the detection of radically different DNA from a given "norm". I believe a computer can tell the difference from a gorilla and a human, for example. Now just imagine a mutant being a more evolved form of homo-sapiens...homo-superior I believe Magneto called it. A computer could probably tell the difference.

That's just a guess, though.

Yeah, I think that's just all mutant propaganda. I think they're humans with slight mutations, like someone with cancer. The sentinels would have to go around killing people with cancer too. :D

[AmoDman]

You were talking about how maybe Beast + Wolverine may have been from a tribe of people like them, I was saying that wouldn't work because they already have histories, and Beast had his fur as a newer thing, so there wouldn't have been a tribe of big furry beasts. Unless that's not what you meant...

Not at all, no. I was saying that it has been suggested that both Woverine and Sabretooth might, in fact, not be normal mutants at all, but, rather, descendants of "pure" humans that escaped being affected by the insertion of "X-gene," making them the "natural" evolutionary humans (in the X-men world), rather than "mutants" caused by the X-gene. Also, they are both descended from opposing "tribes" of humans, causing a natural animostiy between them. I saw this idea in some internet character bios, *shrugs*. Don't remember what comic it comes from (obviously, some X-men related one :P).

p.s. Beast was a typo before (probably from having just referred to him), my bad.