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Thread: One Piece -- Discussion
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2012-03-15, 08:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Luffy is also a pirate and a supernova.
So ... Shibukai.
Mihawk (Former Bounty: ???)
Doflamingo (Former Bounty: 340M)
Kuma (Former Bounty: 296M)
Hancock (Former Bounty: 80M)
Law (Former Bounty: 440M)
What do people think Mihawk's former bounty range was? Above Law, below Law but above Doflamingo, or below Doflamingo?
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2012-03-15, 08:19 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Luffy is also a pirate and a supernova.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-15, 08:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
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2012-03-15, 08:42 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
I've no idea but given that Mihawk seems to be on par with the Yonko for pure infamy I'm going with either the biggest we will ever see... or essentially non-existent. Like nobody even survived to report his crimes so they had to be pieced together and he was offered Shichibukai without ever accruing a bounty.
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2012-03-15, 11:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Excuse me? Luffy has broken into several Marine facilities, hijacked Marine vessels, mowed down Marines who were just doing their job, broken a host of high-profile criminals from the world's highest security prison, waged war against the World Government and physically assaulted leading nobles of the world. "Pirate" is an understatement - "Public Enemy #1" would be more like it.
Or would be, but his daddy is #1.
If your forget Nami's antics, he and his crew are pretty mild on "take their stuff" equation of "beat people and take their stuff" piratism, but they still have a mile-long criminal record.
... just to think of it, there aren't many unambiguously good guys in One Piece, are there? Even Luffy doesn't consider himself a hero, and what he did to save Ace was pretty questionable all things granted."It's the fate of all things under the sky,
to grow old and wither and die."
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2012-03-15, 11:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Excuse me? Luffy has broken into several Marine facilities, hijacked Marine vessels, mowed down Marines who were just doing their job, broken a host of high-profile criminals from the world's highest security prison, waged war against the World Government and physically assaulted leading nobles of the world. "Pirate" is an understatement - "Public Enemy #1" would be more like it.
Or would be, but his daddy is #1.
If your forget Nami's antics, he and his crew are pretty mild on "take their stuff" equation of "beat people and take their stuff" piratism, but they still have a mile-long criminal record.
... just to think of it, there aren't many unambiguously good guys in One Piece, are there? Even Luffy doesn't consider himself a hero, and what he did to save Ace was pretty questionable all things granted."It's the fate of all things under the sky,
to grow old and wither and die."
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2012-03-15, 11:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2009
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Excuse me? Luffy has broken into several Marine facilities, hijacked Marine vessels, mowed down Marines who were just doing their job, broken a host of high-profile criminals from the world's highest security prison, waged war against the World Government and physically assaulted leading nobles of the world. "Pirate" is an understatement - "Public Enemy #1" would be more like it.
Or would be, but his daddy is #1.
If your forget Nami's antics, he and his crew are pretty mild on "take their stuff" equation of "beat people and take their stuff" piratism, but they still have a mile-long criminal record.
... just to think of it, there aren't many unambiguously good guys in One Piece, are there? Even Luffy doesn't consider himself a hero, and what he did to save Ace was pretty questionable all things granted."It's the fate of all things under the sky,
to grow old and wither and die."
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2012-03-15, 01:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2006
Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Excuse me? Luffy has broken into several Marine facilities, hijacked Marine vessels, mowed down Marines who were just doing their job, broken a host of high-profile criminals from the world's highest security prison, waged war against the World Government and physically assaulted leading nobles of the world. "Pirate" is an understatement - "Public Enemy #1" would be more like it.
Or would be, but his daddy is #1.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-15, 03:48 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-15, 03:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Precisely.
"It's the fate of all things under the sky,
to grow old and wither and die."
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2012-03-15, 07:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
He's a criminal and he lives on a boat. What more is there too it?thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-16, 01:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
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2012-03-16, 03:20 AM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-16, 05:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
First of all, they're islands. Dry they may be, but they're also surrounded by water. Second of all, so what? Pirates can't have boarding missions (that at times involves storming countries)? What of the Baratie arc?
But if we ignore his acts of rebellion (who should be going towards his title of rebel #2, then he has only just about done enough to be called aThiefTreassure hunter.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-16, 09:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Um... pirate can rob people who are on land. Pirates aren't some mystical race of aquatic creature that lose their status whenever they step on dry land. They're pirates. Outlaws who travel around in a ship and do generally naughty things.
Outlaw + Ship = Pirate.
Luffy = Pirate.
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2012-03-16, 10:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Well, the Straw Hats are pirates in that they're pretty big enemies of the Government. They don't exactly go around raiding villages but they do piss off the wrong people.
A well-placed bullet can stop anybody with an oversized sword.
In real life that is.
Everywhere else, you're screwed.
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2012-03-16, 11:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Um... pirate can rob people who are on land. Pirates aren't some mystical race of aquatic creature that lose their status whenever they step on dry land. They're pirates. Outlaws who travel around in a ship and do generally naughty things.
Outlaw + Ship = Pirate.
Luffy = Pirate.
Also, your equations are wrong.
Outlaw + Ship = Outlaw who likes sailing.
Luffy = Rebel & Thief.
edit.
Well, the Straw Hats are pirates in that they're pretty big enemies of the Government. They don't exactly go around raiding villages but they do piss off the wrong people.Last edited by lord_khaine; 2012-03-16 at 11:19 AM.
thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-16, 11:28 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Your argument is not only completely semantics, it's also bad semantics.
Your definition of pirate is either extremely specific or wildly inaccurate.
While admittedly the focus in One Piece isn't on the actual robbery, the crew of One Piece regularly beats up marines and other pirates and takes their treasure to fund their own coffers (though admittedly most of the stealing is done by Nami), it's just most of that is either off-screen or during the credits.
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2012-03-16, 03:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Your argument is not only completely semantics, it's also bad semantics.
Your definition of pirate is either extremely specific or wildly inaccurate.
But since you are so overconfident in your claims, then why dont you then find me just a singel case of the OP crew violently assulting a merchant ship of some sort, to take their cargo?
While admittedly the focus in One Piece isn't on the actual robbery, the crew of One Piece regularly beats up marines and other pirates and takes their treasure to fund their own coffers (though admittedly most of the stealing is done by Nami), it's just most of that is either off-screen or during the credits.
And besides that, firstly theft isnt the same as piracy, and the independent actions of one crewmember can not be aplied to the entire crew, or they would all be archeologist as well.
But anyway, i can find tons of examples on them being sailing rebels, but i would really like to see where they are doing some piracy now.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-16, 04:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-16, 04:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Your definition of piracy, not that you actually seem to have given one, is someone who "violently assults" specifically a merchant ship to take their cargo. Like I said, extremely specific. By that definition, there aren't any pirates in One Piece, or most of pirate-based fiction for that matter. Sure, numerous self-proclaimed pirates attack and raid marine bases and ships as well as other pirate ships and their treasure, but that apparently doesn't count. Jack Sparrow? Not a pirate, clearly. He never once violently assults a merchant ship to take their cargo. Sure, he outwits law enforcement, steals a prized navy vessel, lies, cheats, and cons pretty much every other character in the movies, but it's the violence against merchant ships that count.
Historically, pirates would rarely directly assault merchant ships, opting instead to sneak on board and steal goods, mostly because suffering damages to the ship and losses to the crew is costly.
(EDIT: Also, unnecessary risk to the ship and crew was against the Pirate Code, which is apparently a real thing and one of the earliest forms of democracy. Damn I love my anthropologist fiance.)
Regardless, trying to apply the historical definition of a pirate to One Piece is like trying to apply the historical definition of a ninja to Naruto or applying the historical definition of a wizard to Harry Potter or Fairy Tail. Defining a pirate as someone who commits unlawful actions with the aid of a seafaring vessel is a logical conclusion to make on the series. He can't be classified as Rebel because his actions have no political motivation. He, and the rest of the pirates in the series, are purely self-serving.
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2012-03-16, 05:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Bing definition:
1.
robber at sea: a robber who operates from a ship on the ocean.
This is the real life definition. And it loosely covers the straw hat crew (not all that loosely when you think of the cost to the food supplies of all the countries they visit. )
The Oda definition seems to be seafaring criminal with a bounty on their head and a crew behind them. Which fits them to a T.Avatar Credit: the very talented PseudoStraw. Full image:Spoiler
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2012-03-16, 08:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-16, 08:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
The Law fought the Law and the Law Won!
In One Piece isn't piracy defined by the Marines as literally flying a Jolly Roger. You do it and you are a pirate, end of story. That whatever else you do or do not do, you are a pirate that has abandoned the law and should be brought to justice. Its not like the Marines don't love being stupidly specific on these sorts of thing.
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2012-03-17, 04:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Oda says they're pirates, so they're pirates. Done deal.
Your definition of piracy, not that you actually seem to have given one, is someone who "violently assults" specifically a merchant ship to take their cargo. Like I said, extremely specific. By that definition, there aren't any pirates in One Piece, or most of pirate-based fiction for that matter. Sure, numerous self-proclaimed pirates attack and raid marine bases and ships as well as other pirate ships and their treasure, but that apparently doesn't count. Jack Sparrow? Not a pirate, clearly. He never once violently assults a merchant ship to take their cargo. Sure, he outwits law enforcement, steals a prized navy vessel, lies, cheats, and cons pretty much every other character in the movies, but it's the violence against merchant ships that count.
And i dont care about what Jack does, what counts here is what Luffy does, and im still waiting for you to put your money where your mouth is, and actualy give some examples of Luffy doing some robbing.
Regardless, trying to apply the historical definition of a pirate to One Piece is like trying to apply the historical definition of a ninja to Naruto or applying the historical definition of a wizard to Harry Potter or Fairy Tail. Defining a pirate as someone who commits unlawful actions with the aid of a seafaring vessel is a logical conclusion to make on the series. He can't be classified as Rebel because his actions have no political motivation. He, and the rest of the pirates in the series, are purely self-serving.
Sorry but that doesnt stop him from being a rebel, since his goal apperently seems to be to declare his independence from the world gouverment.
This is the real life definition. And it loosely covers the straw hat crew (not all that loosely when you think of the cost to the food supplies of all the countries they visit. )
In One Piece isn't piracy defined by the Marines as literally flying a Jolly Roger. You do it and you are a pirate, end of story. That whatever else you do or do not do, you are a pirate that has abandoned the law and should be brought to justice. Its not like the Marines don't love being stupidly specific on these sorts of thing.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2012-03-17, 09:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
I could cite the numerous times Nami's made off with piles of money and treasure, but you're just going to say "That's not Luffy so it doesn't cound." You want a ridiculously specific example, despite the fact that it's not actually relevant to Luffy's pirate status? Fine. Skypeia. Even after befriending the natives and overthrowing their god, they proceed to make off in the night with a huge load of their treasure. Sure, the Skypeians would have outright given it to them along with more treasure, but the only one to ever realize that was Nico Robin.
Ohh, so we can twist the Modern definition of pirate undtil it fits the SH crew, but he cant be a rebel because he is mainly acting in the interest of his crew and friends? Sorry but that doesnt stop him from being a rebel, since his goal apperently seems to be to declare his independence from the world gouverment.
Originally Posted by One Piece Wiki Mythbusters FAQ
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2012-03-17, 01:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
Let's not forget the vast amount of meat that has been taken! He isn't sharing either. He wants to eat all the meat.
Avatar Credit: the very talented PseudoStraw. Full image:Spoiler
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2012-03-17, 01:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
And the bane of all heroes.... property damage!
Seriously how many places have the Strawhats wrecked on their voyage?
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2012-03-17, 01:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-18, 12:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: One Piece -- Discussion
I don't know but let's face it, but touching off a Buster Call should probably count for like three islands. Sure it wasn't their fault exactly, but lets face it wouldn't have happened either without the Straw Hats interference.