General Exalted Discussion: There's a God for that! Except for Sorcery, of course.

[a_humble_lich]

I'd say the Marukan in the East might fit the cowboy idea also: salt of the earth types, value independence, live on isolated ranches, love horses. The book even uses words like "pioneer," "varmint," and "on the range" when describing them. They are said to wear chaps, overalls, and wide brimmed hats. And the circuit riders are basically sheriffs. All they need are more firearm-analogues and Clint Eastwood would fit right in.

[Jokasti]

What's that? An updated list of current Exalted games, recruiting right now? Yes please.
{table=head]Name|ST|Exalt Types|Description
Empire in the Canyon|GryffonDurime|Solars, Lunars, Abyssals (PM ST for others)|Nation-building the Empire of Wyrwane.
The Dark Knights|Neon Knight|Solars, Lunars|Celestials protecting the Scarlet Empire
The Scarlet Dawn|The Rose Dragon|Celestials and Terrestrials|Scarlet Empress returns.
The Fall of the Realm|Sanguine|Solar-tier, Lunars|A First Age circle has come together to destroy the Realm. Starts in Meru.
Alchemicals (working title)|Undecided|Alchemicals|Alchemicals. Nuff said. [/table]
You're welcome.
APPLY NOW LOYAL AUTOCHTHONIAN CITIZEN

[Toptomcat]

Damn. Rpg.net has the big reputation for Exalted love, but I don't think I've ever seen that many Exalted games recruiting there over a three-week period, let alone at once.

[Xefas]

Thank you tomcat, and humble lich for the info. The next Exalted game that starts up for me IRL may have to venture to one of those places.

And also thank you, Jokasti, for the diligent work you do to selflessly benefit us all.

[Jokasti]

Oh, so selfless. A paragon of selflessness, some might say. A martyr, even.

[Kyeudo]

Oh, so selfless. A paragon of selflessness, some might say. A martyr, even.

That she's attempting to play in half those games has nothing to do with it at all.

[Jokasti]

That she's attempting to play in half all those games has nothing to do with it at all.

Fix'd
No, I really do want more people to try Exalted, and applying is the second step after reading the books.

[NeoRetribution]

What is the collective reaction of a Player demanding that the S.T. make a new type of Exalted?

Also, you are amusing, Jokasti.

[Jokasti]

What is the collective reaction of a Player demanding that the S.T. make a new type of Exalted?

Also, you are amusing, Jokasti.

A new type of Exaltation, like what Ganurath is doing?
Or a new type of Exaltation, like, a new Caste or something?

And I try~

[NeoRetribution]

Yes, like what Ganurath is doing. It is along the lines of the wish or expectation to play a new and different kind of Exalt character. This includes independent castes for that type and flavor to go with it.

[Jokasti]

Yes, like what Ganurath is doing. It is along the lines of the wish or expectation to play a new and different kind of Exalt character. This includes independent castes for that type and flavor to go with it.

And he's demanding it? Never give in to demands.
If he asks, really nicely, maybe take some time with him to figure out what he wants. What type of characters does he usually take on? You could make it a community project, here, and have a lot of people contribute, or do it yourself to make sure everything is balanced.
Usually Exalt types are aligned with a magical material, so you could do Adamant, and do the Chosen of the Sky or something, I guess.

[Xefas]

Meh, I guess it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing, but why? You could play 10,000 rpg campaigns with just bog-standard human characters and still have it be interesting each and every time. Our own, decidedly mundane, world is filled with more drama and intrigue than could ever be consumed in a single lifetime.

An nth new variety of superpower isn't really necessary, and that sort of thing is a lot of work to be 'demanded' of someone.

[NeoRetribution]

The demand was a friendly one. I should have stated that more clearly.

A community project...unsettles me, but I do believe that there is a kind of prudence which comes from many counselors. Yes, I am aware that types of Exalted attune to those special materials.

The reason that I ask the question is more to gauge whether others have had the same experience and finished with a positive result. It is much work and consideration to make such a thing. I do not mind doing so, but I would like to know if there are any success stories of such.

I would also like to know if there are any pieces of wisdom which were learned through such a process so that I might avoid similar errors.

Additional Edit:
Chosen of The Sky? As in...Manual of Exalted Power: Aerials?

Xefas, I appreciate your opinion. You are exactly correct. But I like to be permissive toward my players.

[Kyeudo]

Creating your own complete brand of Exalted is a massive, time-consuming process best left to paid professionals and those with no lives. A complete Charm set comprises an average of 200 Charms, with usually three or four Exalt-specific Backgrounds, a smattering of artifacts, and sometimes a subsystem of some sort.

Creating the concept of a type of Exalted and making up only as many Charms as are necessary? It's the work of an afternoon once you have the general idea of what that Exalt type is worked out. You only need about 10-15 Charms to start with, maybe a special Background, and an idea of general power level.

[Toptomcat]

Creating your own complete brand of Exalted is a massive, time-consuming process best left to paid professionals and those with no lives. A complete Charm set comprises an average of 200 Charms, with usually three or four Exalt-specific Backgrounds, a smattering of artifacts, and sometimes a subsystem of some sort.

Creating the concept of a type of Exalted and making up only as many Charms as are necessary? It's the work of an afternoon once you have the general idea of what that Exalt type is worked out. You only need about 10-15 Charms to start with, maybe a special Background, and an idea of general power level.

The work of an afternoon for Jon Chung or hls, maybe. Designing balanced, functional, interesting Exalted homebrew of any sort is an astoundingly difficult exercise.

[Jokasti]

Chosen of The Sky? As in...Manual of Exalted Power: Aerials?

I was thinking Manual of Exalted Power: Zephyrs or Empyreans.
As stated above, huge project though. Huge. But rewarding.

[a_humble_lich]

He didn't say it would be balanced, functional, or interesting, just that you could do it. Since you're creating it for people you know interesting shouldn't be too hard, but it most likely will not be balanced/functional. However, if strict balance is what you're looking for Exalted may not be the game for you anyways

More seriously, if you do it, be prepared to have balance issues. Best would be to talk to the player before had and get an agreement that you have the power to change the mechanics at any time if you don't think things are working. I'd also recommend learning from the Abyssal book and stealing charms from other Exalted types.

[NeoRetribution]

Kyeudo, thank you for your advice. The abstract enormity of the request has not escaped me, but it is also nice to have the affirmation.

TomCat: Yes, that is the kind of opinionated answer that my initial question requested.

That is an interesting concept, Jokasti. I think that the matter of the reward is partly on my mind. Constructing something like a separate Exalted type intrigues me. However, I think that what is expected is that such a thing can be completed in one evening or a small few of them. And the reinforcement that it takes time is helpful.

As for interest that is usually not difficult for me. Balance, as a concern, is important...but at this stage a coherent reasoning in the setting itself is a little more important. Also, the idea itself for what kind of Exaltation. Is there another manual along with Abyssal that might serve as helpful for balance?

[Kyeudo]

Exalts are balanced internally against themselves. Only Solars, Abyssals, and Infernals are cross-balanced against each other, with Solars slightly favored in those matchups due to Holy Charms. Other Exalts are worked towards a particular power level, with Lunars being almost-Solar powerful but with generally shorter term effects, Sidereals being above Terrestrials but below Lunars, and Terrestrials being above only God-Bloods and low Essence spirits in terms of power.

[Jokasti]

Kyeudo, thank you for your advice. The abstract enormity of the request has not escaped me, but it is also nice to have the affirmation.

TomCat: Yes, that is the kind of opinionated answer that my initial question requested.

That is an interesting concept, Jokasti. I think that the matter of the reward is partly on my mind. Constructing something like a separate Exalted type intrigues me. However, I think that what is expected is that such a thing can be completed in one evening or a small few of them. And the reinforcement that it takes time is helpful.

As for interest that is usually not difficult for me. Balance, as a concern, is important...but at this stage a coherent reasoning in the setting itself is a little more important. Also, the idea itself for what kind of Exaltation. Is there another manual along with Abyssal that might serve as helpful for balance?

I am thinking my initial idea of a community project would be more and more balanced and interesting with many people checking for balance and providing ideas. If you could get someone to do the charms for a specific attribute or ability or virtue, it would go much faster than if you alone did it, with the aforementioned benefits of balance checking, idea providing, and community support.

As Kyeudo said, it really only needs to be balanced with itself, and even then that's iffy. Not many choose charms from Awareness or Stealth unless they fit thematically, but nigh every combatant will have Seven Shadow Evasion.
As long as they are roughly stronger than some and weaker than others, it should be fine.

[Drascin]

So, you know, I'm realizing I seem to have a massive dislike, irrational perhaps, for Perfect Defenses for some reason. I was drafting a little character concept for the Alchemicals game mentioned in Jokasti's post, and Kyeudo, helpfully, gave me a couple pointers, including the suggestion to get Precalculated defensive Equation, like, yesterday. And I find that my reflex reaction is of disgruntlement and disgust, and of trying to find absolutely any other way to have a decently dodgy swordsman, even if it's horribly convoluted and Charm intensive and would gimp my character from here to Mars, just so I don't have to hide behind the "nope.jpg" button.

This is going to be rather problematic, as Exalted pretty much assumes that everyone that wants to get into combat will get at least one Perfect after a certain point...

[The Rose Dragon]

So, you know, I'm realizing I seem to have a massive dislike, irrational perhaps, for Perfect Defenses for some reason. I was drafting a little character concept for the Alchemicals game mentioned in Jokasti's post, and Kyeudo, helpfully, gave me a couple pointers, including the suggestion to get Precalculated defensive Equation, like, yesterday. And I find that my reflex reaction is of disgruntlement and disgust, and of trying to find absolutely any other way to have a decently dodgy swordsman, even if it's horribly convoluted and Charm intensive and would gimp my character from here to Mars, just so I don't have to hide behind the "nope.jpg" button.

This is going to be rather problematic, as Exalted pretty much assumes that everyone that wants to get into combat will get at least one Perfect after a certain point...

Preaching to the choir, brother.

But yeah, Exalted as a system is so horribly borked that you basically need a perfect defense to survive in most combats after a while. Things like grand goremauls and their 20L damage make sure that you don't want to get hit even by someone who only uses an Excellency to attack you.

[Rhyvurg]

True. There are various ways to mitigate the need for perfect defenses, like boosting hardness and soak (A certain soulsteel option for celestial battle armor is GREAT at it), but it's to easy to build high-damage combos and you can't rely on your soak to be able to handle it. In the end, in a high-power game all soak does for you is protect you from mortals and force the real threats to use those high-damage (and high cost) combos, which in turn require perfect defenses.

[Toptomcat]

So, you know, I'm realizing I seem to have a massive dislike, irrational perhaps, for Perfect Defenses for some reason. I was drafting a little character concept for the Alchemicals game mentioned in Jokasti's post, and Kyeudo, helpfully, gave me a couple pointers, including the suggestion to get Precalculated defensive Equation, like, yesterday. And I find that my reflex reaction is of disgruntlement and disgust, and of trying to find absolutely any other way to have a decently dodgy swordsman, even if it's horribly convoluted and Charm intensive and would gimp my character from here to Mars, just so I don't have to hide behind the "nope.jpg" button.

This is going to be rather problematic, as Exalted pretty much assumes that everyone that wants to get into combat will get at least one Perfect after a certain point...

You *can* play a character that doesn't need to perfect *often*: PDV monsters, DDV monsters, and to a lesser extent soak monsters are possible that will be able to get through a lot of combat situations without needing to perfect, unless against a particular Exalt who makes a habit of using grand goremauls, soul-fall-off, or grand goremauls. You just need to shop around a little for the right artifacts, hearthstones, and Charms.
But yeah, having the ability to perfect is pretty much mandatory to have as a capability after a certain point, even if your combat capabilities center around high passive defenses.

[Kyeudo]

I've been slowly working my way towards a total revision of Exalted's Charm sets and what not (yes, I am one of those people with no life), and it has become somewhat obvious to me that there is not enough distance between the most basic of defensive Charms and the pinnacle of defense. Shadow Over Water, a very basic DDV refresher, is the only prerequisite for Seven Shadows Evasion, the absolute maximum of defense.

Where's the middle ground, where you can boost your DV greatly enough to be safe in most cases, yet still be vulnerable to someone who pulls out all the stops and gets lucky?

[The Rose Dragon]

Where's the middle ground, where you can boost your DV greatly enough to be safe in most cases, yet still be vulnerable to someone who pulls out all the stops and gets lucky?

That would be a Dodge Excellency, which is exceeded in efficiency in all regards by a perfect defense.

[Yuki Akuma]

Where's the middle ground, where you can boost your DV greatly enough to be safe in most cases, yet still be vulnerable to someone who pulls out all the stops and gets lucky?

That's called "A Dodge Excellency".

Just like there aren't Melee charms that add dice to your melee attacks - there are excellencies for that.

Maybe perfect defenses should all require an excellency as a prerequisite, though. At least, the ones that don't already.

[Kyeudo]

That would be a Dodge Excellency, which is exceeded in efficiency in all regards by a perfect defense.

I'm talking about an efficient Charm that would put your defense that high. That way using a Perfect wouldn't always be the best choice of defense.

[Yuki Akuma]

I'm talking about an efficient Charm that would put your defense that high. That way using a Perfect wouldn't always be the best choice of defense.

Well, there are MA charms that increase your DVs. Generally Form charms. Fire Dragon Style is nice for increasing your Dodge.

[The Rose Dragon]

I'm talking about an efficient Charm that would put your defense that high. That way using a Perfect wouldn't always be the best choice of defense.

You dodge all attacks you could dodge in the first place for 3 motes. How much more efficient can you get?

Oh, with Refinement of Flowing Shadows, anytime someone attacks you more than twice in one tick, you can get even more efficient by spending 3 more motes.