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2011-05-15, 03:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
From my understanding from reading peoples posts on the subject. Back in First Edition there were two published adventure scenarios of the Autochthonians invading Creation. One the Locust Crusade, in the Time of Tumult book and the very first mention of Alchemicals, was in fact actually very good. The other the Locust War, in the Exalted: The Autochtonians, portrayed them as stupid Captain Planet villains and the pawns of the Deathlords besides. Also apparently a single Autochthonian factory could kill the entire Western ocean down to a mile under the surface within a year. This was largely reviled; especially by one of the main men behind Second Edition Alchemicals Holden Shearer. Now having never read either of these adventures I can't say for sure how accurate this is.
Last edited by Sanguine; 2011-05-15 at 03:29 PM.
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2011-05-15, 03:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Yeah, I got them mixed up (been a while since I read about it). The Locust Crusade was okay, the Locust War turned everyone into the dumbest people and completely ignored every single bit of logic and reason in both the setting and the real world.
There's Blacktog, where the fans extrapolated it's growth rate and found it would completely cover Creation in a matter of months. There's an expositive bit where the Perfect opens up talks with the Autochthonians by throwing his scepter at them. There's the bit where the Kukla is so damn good that anything less then most of the entire Exalted host might as well not even bother. There's the part where the Sidereals spend the entire scenario just twiddling their thumbs. There's the part where the Autochthonians beat people in naval battles.
tl;dr, everyone is horribly, horribly OOC, many stupid, setting-breaking things happen, and an idiot ball the size of a million Daystars gets dropped onto the setting.Last edited by Mr.Bookworm; 2011-05-15 at 03:59 PM.
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2011-05-15, 08:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
If FAFL was going to do anything to the seal, it'd be to unlock it, at least in my opinion. There's just so much loot there, ripe for the taking.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
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2011-05-15, 08:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
How does FaFL know about the loot, though?
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2011-05-15, 08:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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2011-05-15, 08:52 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
So they would also know he makes stuff from his being?
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2011-05-15, 08:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Not really. Autochthon is undoubtedly the one being Solar craftsmen never surpassed, but there were only a few things he made that they couldn't have reproduced.
Not to mention, that's Autochthon, not the guys inside of him. Though even a Shogunate-level society would make some stuff that people in Creation would find interesting.
Hm? What do you mean? The Alchemicals? The Eye?
Also, it appears that Faffles is already fighting the Autochthonians, so they've breached the Seal at the very least.Last edited by Mr.Bookworm; 2011-05-15 at 08:57 PM.
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2011-05-15, 09:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Well, as far as Creation knows, Autobot never succumbed to robo-cancer. So, you have the greatest craftsman of all time, who has thousands of years without interruption to build stuff. That'd be worth cracking open the Seal to see what's inside. And while most of his stuff could have been duplicated, in present-day Creation countries have gone to war over "mere" 5 dot artifacts.
And that's not even considering the juiciest prize of all - Alchemical Demiurges. If FaFL gets his hands on the prerequisite five component implementers of the Alchemical formula, he can start mass producing Celestial level exalts; the only other things he'd need are magical materials and souls, two things a Deathlord has in abundance.
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2011-05-15, 09:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Faffles is an ex-First Age Solar who's building a Titan-replica in his backyard. Not to mention, it's kind of implied that the Seal is already cracked, because he has forces fighting the Autochthonians.
And that's not even considering the juiciest prize of all - Alchemical Demiurges. If FaFL gets his hands on the prerequisite five component implementers of the Alchemical formula, he can start mass producing Celestial level exalts; the only other things he'd need are magical materials and souls, two things a Deathlord has in abundance.Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.
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2011-05-15, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
What if you had five deimurges and Nova, though?
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2011-05-15, 10:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Not quite the same thing.
Though, regarding the seal; it might still only allow being to pierce it from one direction. Sure, if FAFL managed to capture the city that houses the portals it would be fine, but that would require unimaginable amounts of stupidity on the part of the Autochonians. Getting the keys and piercing the seal from his side sounds much more doable.
Oh, there's also the sweet bonus of the combined powers of a being equal in power to the Incarna.He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
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2011-05-15, 10:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Couple things. Nations in present day Creation will go to war over lower rated Artifacts then 5; for instance a Sky Mantis Tower would be enough to convince many to go to war if they had the requisite hearthstone or could easily get it.
He wouldn't just need magical materials and souls. He also needs the reagents for the catalyzing broth as well as the special clays that make up an Alchemical's body.
The souls Fafl has are seperated from their Pos and thus useless for the process of Alchemical Exaltation. Not to mention they would first need to be placed in Soul Gems.
While he couldn't make Alchemicals himself he could get the Demiurges to make them for him. This is explicitly stated as a possibility.
Using the keys to pierce the Seal from his side sounds like something he would do. As for the Keys making you as powerful as an Incarna where is this said?Last edited by Sanguine; 2011-05-15 at 10:13 PM.
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2011-05-15, 10:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
If the Seal is broken, it's broken. Faffles could just build his own gate now.
Oh, there's also the sweet bonus of the combined powers of a being equal in power to the Incarna.
Really? Don't remember that line.Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.
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2011-05-15, 10:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Last edited by Sanguine; 2011-05-15 at 10:42 PM.
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2011-05-15, 10:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
The reagents are available in Creation, though, and for purchase even. Souls are trickier, but the soulgems at least are only Artifact 2.
In any case, those are just details, and not even ones that FaFL necessarily knows. After all, just because the book states the specific ingredients doesn't mean it's common knowledge. What he would know, though, is that the people living on Autobot can build Exalts, and learning how they do it would be beyond priceless.
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2011-05-15, 10:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
I'm pretty sure that one option is for piercing the seal, not breaking it. People on the inside can make portals that go through it, but people on the outside cannot.
If you have all of the keys gathered and attuned(though they can be attuned to different people), then you can use all of the powers of the God of Locks. I thought he was on the same level as an Incarna, but on review it isn't explicit. There's also a post on a different forum that goes into a bit more detail on what these entail. Essentially, anything that could be described as open, close, lock, unlock are valid. I believe closing someone's mind was explicitly stated as an option.He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
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2011-05-16, 05:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
The ability to open minds could single-handedly fix the setting.
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2011-05-16, 05:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Really, it looks like the best person to use the Keys would be a linguist.
Personally, I'd not make the definition quite so arbitrary, but given that this is a comic and not a game, I suppose it works.
Meh, all that requires is a sharp object and the First Melee Excellency.Last edited by Weimann; 2011-05-16 at 05:23 AM.
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2011-05-16, 05:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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2011-05-16, 05:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Recent Homebrew: The Socialite | The Crystalline: Memory Altering Construct Race | Sanguine Hand, a ToB Discipline of blood and cruelty
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Thanks to all my avatar artists, especially to Paisley for my avatar of Vivian, cowardly cryophoenix.
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2011-05-16, 05:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Please note opening someones mind is almost definitely Mental Influence and thus Perfect Mental Defenses like Elusive Dream Defense or Duck Fate would prevent them from having their minds opened.
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2011-05-16, 05:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Please note opening someones mind is almost definitely Mental Influence and thus Perfect Mental Defenses like Elusive Dream Defense or Duck Fate would prevent them from having their minds opened.thnx to Starwoof for the fine avatar
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2011-05-16, 07:20 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Last edited by Mr.Bookworm; 2011-05-16 at 07:23 AM.
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2011-05-16, 07:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Actually yes the Keys can bypass perfect defenses if you have all 5.
No, this wouldn't work in a game.
Protip: this is not a game. It's a story. Jukashi does not care one wit about game balance.
See also: Secret, Ten and Misho in the same circle.
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2011-05-16, 07:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Or the fact that someone(Nova) is making proto-exaltations. That shouldn't be anywhere near possible, if this was a game. But since it's a story, it doesn't matter as much.
He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
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2011-05-16, 07:58 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
I have all kinds of problems with something overcoming Perfect Defenses on a story level, not a game balance one, however it's nine in the morning right now and I still haven't gotten any sleep so I can't articulate them coherently. I'll bring it back up later. I don't however have a problem with the proto-exaltations. I also would totally allow someone to make their own Exalts in a game, whether or not it would be a good idea is another matter entirely.
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2011-05-16, 08:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Yes, I know.
The problem is doing so without punching a giant hole through the entire setting.
Not to mention that he has statted out the Keys, and the comic does pretty explicitly run on Exalted mechanics. So they do need to at least mechanically work.
See also: Secret, Ten and Misho in the same circle.Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.
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2011-05-16, 09:12 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
The five Keys together are the only thing capable of punching through Perfect Defenses.
Until just recently, there weren't even five Keys. And no one has ever gathered even four of them.
No one has ever broken a Perfect Defense before.
See where this is going?
Nothing about the setting has been broken.
(Also the problem with Misho, Secret and Ten all being in the same circle is the fact that Misho is a Essence 5-ish Solar, Secret is an Essence 2-ish Abyssal, and Ten is an elder Terrestrial. The whole point is that Ten has far too much XP. )
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2011-05-16, 09:34 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
Not quite. Yeah, it's based on the rules, but the author has said that it's only loosely based on them. Most recently in this post.
Actually, they do have a point; the keys simply give access the the powers the god of Locks had. So, yeah, that would be a kink in the setting.He fears his fate too much, and his reward is small, who will not put it to the touch, to win or lose it all.
-James Graham, 1st Marquess of Montrose
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2011-05-16, 09:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Keychain of Creation 6: Now You're Playing With Elder Exalted!
The Keys give you the power of the God of Locks, ergo, the God of Locks could break perfects. The God of Locks was a loyalist who worked for the Primordials.
Unless Jukashi has posted an explanation for this, the setting is broken, and this needs to be fixed.
I also have a problem with the God of Locks being that powerful, but that's just me bitching.
(Also the problem with Misho, Secret and Ten all being in the same circle is the fact that Misho is a Essence 5-ish Solar, Secret is an Essence 2-ish Abyssal, and Ten is an elder Terrestrial. The whole point is that Ten has far too much XP. )Awesome Cyborg Doom Monkey avatar by Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins. Offer up your robo-bananas to him.