LGBTAitp - Part Thirteen

[KenderWizard]

Awwww.
Awwww.

That video is definitely worth a Crowning Moment of Heartwarming. Also, Irish accents are sexy.
*snip*

Yay! In the current economic climate and all, it's good to have something to be proud of!

I finally got brave enough to ask a stranger (female) if she had a boyfriend or girlfriend, instead of just boyfriend, as part of getting-to-know small talk. Usually I'm worried the other person will turn out to be super-conservative and it'll get all awkward. But I've decided if they take offence, I'd rather get to know someone else. And she didn't take offence so, success!

[Serpentine]

For the majority, maybe.

The question was asked why anyone would have sex without the emotional connection. I was explaining that. Asexuality has nothing to do with it - if you don't like sex anyway, then it's all irrelevant.

Maybe not, say the archaeologists....
b) no reason to assume the person is homosexual. May be transgender.

I said that. Seriously. Again: That's why I said "queer", not "gay".
The rest, I'll read that later. Be interesting to see a proper article, not a NineMSN one.

[golentan]

Whoo SMBC!

That is all.

[Coidzor]

^: Still, I don't think he'll ever come anywhere close to the brilliance born of trolling that website that direct linked to his.

But my original argument was more directed at the idea that everybody got the same from sex under the same circumstances. Asexuality show that at least some don't get it from those or any other circumstance. I think.

Ok, I think I see what you were getting at now. However, you can't say that someone who is asexual can actually encounter the same circumstances for having sex as someone who is not asexual. Even if you isolate every other variable, the biggest one is still pretty much set in stone as going to dominate the flavor of the context.

The unspoken assumption of the scenario as it was put forth, IIRC, indeed that the scenario hinges upon, is freely chosen, desired sex.

[Mina Kobold]

The question was asked why anyone would have sex without the emotional connection. I was explaining that. Asexuality has nothing to do with it - if you don't like sex anyway, then it's all irrelevant.

Ok, I think I see what you were getting at now. However, you can't say that someone who is asexual can actually encounter the same circumstances for having sex as someone who is not asexual. Even if you isolate every other variable, the biggest one is still pretty much set in stone as going to dominate the flavor of the context.

The unspoken assumption of the scenario as it was put forth, IIRC, indeed that the scenario hinges upon, is freely chosen, desired sex.

I was just trying to say that if you have some who enjoys both apples and oranges and some who hate both then it sounds logical to me that some may only like one or the other. ._.

Is my logic really that flawed? I mean, it makes sense on the scale of bisexuality (with homosexuality and heterosexuality as the extremes here) so why not whatever-you'd-call-this-axis?

You're probably right, since I know very little about it. But I still think there are degrees and differences in people's enjoyment of the same things (I dislike a popular candy, for example)

[Serpentine]

Put it this way, I was ultimately responding to this question:

But why settle for sex when all of you seem to agree lovemaking is that much better. I personally cannot understand this. Why do anything with someone if you don't have that emotional connection. That would be like hanging out with people you really don't like just because you felt kinda lonely.

If you don't like sex either way, it's a moot point. If you do, that was why people have - and enjoy - sex-without-emotion. There's nothing wrong with your logic, it's just not relevant to my point.

[Asta Kask]

I said that. Seriously. Again: That's why I said "queer", not "gay".
The rest, I'll read that later. Be interesting to see a proper article, not a NineMSN one.

Yeah, I know, sorry. It's just that the original article said gay.

I say we can't be certain we have a queer caveman until we find someone buried with rainbow pigment.

[Mina Kobold]

Put it this way, I was ultimately responding to this question:If you don't like sex either way, it's a moot point. If you do, that was why people have - and enjoy - sex-without-emotion. There's nothing wrong with your logic, it's just not relevant to my point.

This is what I don't get, why does enjoying sex-with-emotions mean that one has to enjoy sex-without-emotions? Wouldn't it just be part of their orientation? That they like sex with x group and that group is people they love?

Unless I still read it wrong, I think I may. Sorry if I do, I did not intend to be this bothersome.

[Serpentine]

When did I say that enjoying sex-with-emotions means you must enjoy sex-without-emotions? In fact, I flat-out stated that it's possible to enjoy any mix of it. If you're taking issue with my "1. Sex is fun. 2. Sex is blah blah blah", well, that's from the point of view of someone for whom that is true, presumably the sort of person at whom the original question was directed.

[Mina Kobold]

When did I say that enjoying sex-with-emotions means you must enjoy sex-without-emotions? In fact, I flat-out stated that it's possible to enjoy any mix of it. If you're taking issue with my "1. Sex is fun. 2. Sex is blah blah blah", well, that's from the point of view of someone for whom that is true, presumably the sort of person at whom the original question was directed.

I see, I have a problem of reading stuff to literally.

I read that as "Sex is fun. Period." instead of "Sex is fun to do".

Sorry.

[SMEE]

Well, I have reviewed the other messages Jacklu didn't post and will post them now, along with two others we got the last few days.

Greetings, fellow Playgrounders. So...I'm gay and have known it for a while, but have stayed closeted up until now. I'd like to come out to my friends and family, but I'm not sure whether I should, and if so, to whom. Apologies for the wall of text, but I really have to get this off my chest. Here's the situation:

1) I've known my best friend back home (I'm a university student) all my life, and we're practically joined at the hip. We have all the same interests, we've gone to the same schools, and so on. I'm closer to him than I am to my brother. Here's the problem: when I visited him and met his friends, the conversation turned to matters gay marriage and such; one of his friends basically started reciting anti-LGBT talking points and my friend was nodding along. Now, he never insults gays and is a very tolerant person generally, so I'm fairly sure he was just agreeing to fit in with his less tolerant friends..but I'm not *completely* sure he doesn't actually feel that way. I can't exactly ask him "So, best friend, how would you feel about me if, hypothetically, I were to turn out to be gay?" without making him a teensy bit suspicious, but if I came out to him and he found it objectionable and I lost him as a friend I'd never be able to forgive myself.

2) My best friend at university is bi and very flirtatious, so you wouldn't think he'd have any problems with my being gay. However, he says suspects another of our friends of being gay and makes frequent jokes at his expense along those lines, he brags about his "perfect gaydar," and makes frequent use of the F-word, in a joking sense rather than a pejorative sense, if that makes any sense. He sends very mixed signals.

So...basically my question is, How would I go about "testing the waters" to figure out if these people would be okay with my coming out without being too obvious about it? Any tips or analysis you can provide would also be welcome as to whom to come out to, as well. If something isn't clear, ask and I'll try to answer, but I'm not sure how well I can convey the situation through text. Thanks, Playground; I know I can count on you.

So I am currently a closeted person in high school. I've been thinking about coming out for a while, but haven't really thought up of a good occasion, or time to do so. I would have to say that this year, my junior year, of high school was probably my worst when dealing with this issue, even resulting slipping in and out of depression and several days of constant, physically painful panic attacks.

I only live with two members of my family, my mother and a brother. I'm not honestly sure of my mother's view on homosexuality, other than the fact that she finds it odd. My brother has actually guessed, and texted this guess to one of his quick-fling girlfriends, but currently doesn't think that I am gay.
From all I have seen, he is a homophobic person, and if we ever venture near the topic of homosexuality he always expresses hate and disgust. I believe he may actually exaggerate it at times and that he actually knows, trying to keep me from doing anything about it.

While I have decided on a date finally, sometime during the summer, I fear that I may avoid it or put it off till it just doesn't happen. I don't plan on coming out to the public, as I live in a very conservative area which doesn't have a LGBTA, a Straight Gay Alliance, or anything remotely similar in structure.
I'm also aware that a good number of my friends have shown some signs of homophobia, but those who do also show that it is mostly through misconception, flangerization of false sterotypes.

I suppose one of the good things is that I'm a "straight" gay, in that I don't naturally have any campish attitudes or mannerisms. Well, other than the fact that I couldn't care less about sports or cars, but I and most others just chalk this up to my nerdyness.
Any case of, normally supposed or rumored, homosexuality is often treated with ridicule from the school.

I suppose my biggest problem is that I just have to much fear holding me back from actually telling the truth to my family.
I swear, if I didn't have a journal for my thoughts I would probably have gone insane or something... But that's just rambling now.

To be honest, I don't really even know what sending this anonymous email will do for me. Maybe I just want to write my thoughts down and will never send this? Maybe I expect to be patted on the back or something, and I'm just whining. *Sigh* I honestly doubt that my mother would ever kick me out, as she is normally proud of what I do, how I accomplish things, and so forth.

I just kick my self every time however, as everyday I see her it just hurts that I have to hide something from her, or give her one of my fake smiles and expressions that I oh so often do for the general public.

It's also getting harder to hide it. I'm eighteen now, and I've never had a date with a girl. I frankly don't care much for the opposite sex, and I just barely dodged a bullet a month ago when my friends thought about setting me up with someone.

Ironically, (Would that be using that term right?) that conversation got derailed when one of my friends, who is friends with two other girls, said that maybe they should look for a guy instead of a girl as a date for me.
Anyway, I am on Giants in the playground, but I don't wish to connect my internet handle with this issue yet, as some of my friends are aware of it, and I do monitor the LGBTAitp occasionally when I'm alone.

*deep breath*

I'm a guy but I've had long periods of not being comfortable being male and identifying as female. At this point if I think of myself I don't really think of my gender at first, though it's probably a bit of a mix right now. But that's not why I'm typing this.

I have a crush on someone I got to know via an online game. She's physically male, but identifies as a female. I've never really thrown aside the idea of me having feeling for guys, but it's still kinda confusing to actually have a crush on one. (And her gender-identity only adds to the confusion.)

Thing is, I really like her. She's a great friend and very understanding. (I've been complaining about not really feeling that well lately.) Now, I'm not sure if I should tell her about my feelings. Fact that we both live in different continents doesn't help convincing myself that it won't be completely pointless to tell her. I also don't want to ruin our friendship by making things awkward between us. But on the other hand, I feel I kinda have to tell this, since otherwise I'm just going to keep brooding about it, which isn't good, because I have the tendency to lock away my feeling deep inside until they start eating at me. And I feel I should share just what has been (part of) the stuff that's been upsetting me lately.

So I succeeded in getting dumped, and while I feel incredibly bad at the moment. I'm sure that no longer having to to put up the charade will make me happier in the future.
So when peoples start again with how I couldn't possibly be happy unless I'm in a relationship. I can safely say that I'm just not interested in a relationship, because I had one, and it did nothing for me that I couldn't get from giving change to a bum. And that comes with a whole lot less strings attached to it.

Sorry for the delay. Work has been taking all my time lately.

[Serpentine]

I hate this topic and wish it'd go away, but there's a question in the R'ships thread for LGBT types.

[Coidzor]

So I succeeded in getting dumped, and while I feel incredibly bad at the moment. I'm sure that no longer having to to put up the charade will make me happier in the future.
So when peoples start again with how I couldn't possibly be happy unless I'm in a relationship. I can safely say that I'm just not interested in a relationship, because I had one, and it did nothing for me that I couldn't get from giving change to a bum. And that comes with a whole lot less strings attached to it.

While your logic is flawed due to the fact that a sample size of one is, well, a sample size of one. You're out of it, which is the important thing, though the fact that you couldn't think of any way of ending it other than getting dumped is a tad worrisome.

Anon3: Well, you just said that you have no other way to cope and you'll just do nothing but beat yourself up about it if you don't tell the object of your affections about them. So what do you want from us? Suggestions as to how to go about it with as little friction as possible?

[Danne]

Today has been really crappy. Spent most of the day in the ER (I'm okay now) but whenever I get down like this I fall into a slump where I just really, really hate my stupid wrong-gendered body. Compounded by the fact that my stupid breasts that I shouldn't even have are making my already painful chest pain even worse.

Sometimes being a writer doesn't help me with things like this, because I live so much of my life in Make-Believe Land that I end up forgetting that I'm not actually going to find a magical genie who can fix the problem, or that I don't live in a super-duper high tech sci-fi world where SRS is a no problem surgery that's actually 100% successful. Times are I think I can handle this, because I know it'll get better, but then I end up waking up and have to remember that, no, it's not going to get better, because even if I man up and go the SRS route it's not as good as we might wish it.

I can haz hug? (Only gentle-like, 'cuz of the chest pain and stuff.)

[unosarta]

*one hundred million billion trillion quadrillion etc etc hugs*

Seriously. That sucks. Hard. *hug*

[Mystic Muse]

I can haz hug? (Only gentle-like, 'cuz of the chest pain and stuff.)

*Pony hug*


I really hope things work out well for you. I know things aren't quite as good as we'd like them.

[cycoris]

I can haz hug? (Only gentle-like, 'cuz of the chest pain and stuff.)

*gentle hugs*

If you want someone to talk with, rant at, act as a hug dispenser, whatever you need, feel free to PM me.

EDIT: Dammit ninjas.

[Mina Kobold]

I can haz hug? (Only gentle-like, 'cuz of the chest pain and stuff.)

*Hugs*

The world can be very cruel at times, but I hope you get better soon.

[golentan]

Anon #1: I recommend bluntness. A good way to "test waters" would maybe be to find an article on line about... I don't know. Gay marriage. Someone coming out. The death of don't ask don't tell. And just ask "what do you think of this?" when they walk by.

Anon #2: Yeah... I recommend not closeting. I realize how bad ridicule can get (when I was about your age I was the class punching bag for gay jokes, ridicule, and punching bags because I was sexually assaulted by another student back before I realized I had same sex feelings). . And yeah. It can get bad. About as bad as what you were talking about with panic attacks and depression. But at least you'll be being yourself without the stress of being someone you're not. And any friends who stick with you will be friends of you rather than some guy you're pretending to be, which believe it or not makes a huge difference. And you'll have an easier shot of finding a date. Especially, since you'll soon be moving to college or into the job market (I think you said you're 18), outside of high school, weeeelll.... I'll let others say it for me.

Anon #3: I'm sorry I have no real advice for this sort of scenario. In general, I'd say your gender identity stuff and other feelings are something that you'll have to work through yourself. As for the relationship questions? It sounds to me like you want to share your feelings. And that you want someone to confirm that you should. I can't do that on its own merits because I don't understand these sorts of problems, but I can give my single biggest piece of advice. The piece of advice that friends have threatened to shoot me over if I give it to them again I have so overused it. *Do what you think is best.*

Danne: Gentle hug to avoid chest pain.

[rayne_dragon]

Today has been really crappy. Spent most of the day in the ER (I'm okay now) but whenever I get down like this I fall into a slump where I just really, really hate my stupid wrong-gendered body. Compounded by the fact that my stupid breasts that I shouldn't even have are making my already painful chest pain even worse.

*non-chest-involving hug*

Awww... you have my empathy on the gender issues. And I know a ton of people have already offered, but if you ever want to talk about stuff I'm always willing to listen.

On the subject of SRS - it certainly is not perfect or easy by any means. But I thought it might help you if I pointed out that there are a lot of people who transition without the surgery and still manage to feel contented with themselves on the whole (and everyone, not just transfolk, will have crappy days some of the time). The key seems to be finding a stage where you can be happy with yourself, and different people need different things to reach that point. Still, even if things aren't good enough for you to be completely satisified, doesn't every bit help a little?

[Coidzor]

Sometimes being a writer doesn't help me with things like this, because I live so much of my life in Make-Believe Land that I end up forgetting that I'm not actually going to find a magical genie who can fix the problem, or that I don't live in a super-duper high tech sci-fi world where SRS is a no problem surgery that's actually 100% successful. Times are I think I can handle this, because I know it'll get better, but then I end up waking up and have to remember that, no, it's not going to get better, because even if I man up and go the SRS route it's not as good as we might wish it.

Maybe then, as a writer, you should investigate the raw data of your own life and experience rather than create them new from wholecloth. Pain, suffering, hardship, these all shape us at the personal level just as much as joy or adventure. Escapism and no meat makes Jack a dull boy, after all.

[Miscast_Mage]

Anon #1: I recommend bluntness. A good way to "test waters" would maybe be to find an article on line about... I don't know. Gay marriage. Someone coming out. The death of don't ask don't tell. And just ask "what do you think of this?" when they walk by.

Seconding golentan here(didn't I second golentan before with being blunt with the last batch of anonymail?). A good topic to bring up would be this, as previously mentioned earlier in the thread.

Also, just making this a short post and ignoring the sex-with-emotions vs sex-without-emotions as I am exhausted with multiple projects and tests for college. I had the date I mentioned... what, six pages back now? after reschedualing once again due to a nasty cough. It was alright, though a bit of a disappointment, really. May post details later if I don't snap and curl up in a ball during my next lecture.

*pat on the head for Danne as my hugs can break ribs even when I'm not as frustrated as I am now*

[bluewind95]

An article I read a bit ago.

Just thought I'd share. I think this is a positive bit of news.

[Kneenibble]

Danne --

In better news... you're a writer. That's pretty cool.

[Danne]

Danne --

In better news... you're a writer. That's pretty cool.

I think so. Certainly keeps life entertaining.

*hugs and snuggles with everyone*

[Nerocite]

My GSA is handing out buttons for Day of Silence this week, and I just got my fancy new button!

[Beelzebub1111]

Hey guys, Long time no speak. I'm in kind of a rut right now. And I'm kind of crushing on one of my co-workers, but he's straight and kind of a jerk so I think ignoring it is the best option. Validation?

[unosarta]

Hey guys, Long time no speak. I'm in kind of a rut right now. And I'm kind of crushing on one of my co-workers, but he's straight and kind of a jerk so I think ignoring it is the best option. Validation?

Just don't. I have been crushing on a straight class mate; long story short, he is basically an *******, and not worth it. If they are absolutely sure in their sexuality, it isn't worth it. Honestly. And if their personality is that bad, it means that they probably wouldn't even mean that much to you.

Also; I am watching Torchwood right now. Such a great show (even without all of the homoerotic tension- I swear, I think just about every non-alien/time related problem they have could be solved with one big... slumber party).

[Kneenibble]

For me, it helps to allow myself, in my own mind, to play out the most depraved, indulgent fantasies out of the most turpid barrel-scrapings of the deepest cellar in my heart with the unattainable person. Rather than ignore the feelings, give them so much air that they wither up like a cave mushroom in the summer sun. It helps if they're a jerk too, it makes the exercise easier.

[Coidzor]

^: Just remember never mention it to anyone who can ever find out who you are, because it can't really fail at sounding like something supremely sketchy. And by sketchy I mean the first impression I got was something extremely unflattering. :/

Just don't. I have been crushing on a straight class mate; long story short, he is basically an *******, and not worth it. If they are absolutely sure in their sexuality, it isn't worth it. Honestly. And if their personality is that bad, it means that they probably wouldn't even mean that much to you.

If they're a horrible person and you'll get nothing but pain from them even if you did sleep with them, it's probably still not worth it as well. And it probably wouldn't even be the enjoyable kind of pain either, just the regular old vanilla, boring variety.