General Exalted Discussion Thread VII: Playground Eternal Essence

[Mr.Bookworm]

Exalted is pretty badly designed, yeah. The system wasn't that good to begin with, then Exalted really kind of took it to places it was never meant to go, and then it had a bunch of junk slapped on it...

Calling it the Superman 64 of games is a wee bit harsh, though. There are dozens of better games, but there are plenty of worse games, too.

What I've been tempted to do several times is convert Exalted to the Storytelling system (what the nWoD uses). That keeps a lot of the same basic mechanics, but simplifies the **** out of it. I don't really have the systems knowledge to do that, though.

[TheCountAlucard]

Of all the systems I've played or read, Exalted's system is the most elegant one I've found.

If I knew them, I would say that I find that the rules for Paranoia are probably the best out of any system I've yet seen.

I'd share them with you, if I knew them, but knowing the rules is treason, and treason is punishable by summary execution. Remember, the Computer is your friend.

Have a nice daycycle.

What I've been tempted to do several times is convert Exalted to the Storytelling system (what the nWoD uses). That keeps a lot of the same basic mechanics, but simplifies the **** out of it. I don't really have the systems knowledge to do that, though.

...I'll be honest, I've been considering this exact same idea for some time now, and with much the same reason for not doing so.

[Lord Raziere]

Game theory video. interesting.

now I understand things whole lot differently. it was enlightening.

paranoia combat is a nash equilibrium. pretty obvious now that I know.

I took notes, might have to watch the video again, take more notes…but I think I have some better understanding of a lot of things now….

[Drascin]

What other games have you played?

When things like "dice pools" and "not having to figure out level appropriate encounters" are revolutions in game design to someone, I can't help but assume their experience is mostly with D&D and its associated children - d20, White Wolf, GURPS, M&M, Shadowrun, etc.

These games condition you to accept mediocrity. To think things like imbalance, house rules, long prep times, fiddly math, and broken mechanics are just things you have to live with to roleplay. That's not true. Most games don't have those things. You just have to see them.

...bwuh. Just going to say, as a GM, the idea of comparing the easiness for "making stuff up on the fly" between M&M and Exalted sounds like someone trying to convince me that his 18-wheeler trailer can totally fit into his garage door. I can pull a full M&M session out of my ass in ten mnutes easy (have had to do so a lot of times, in fact), while in Exalted even as a player in a PbP game I need to continuously get up and go reference my books every time I post. One of the reasons I know I'm probably never actually going to ST Exalted. This game hates its GMs with a fiery passion that dwarfs Malfeas's.

[Lord Raziere]

for some reason I don't care about that…..now I'm visualizing a game in my head where everyone is a narrator, and there is a deck of cards and you basically trade each other the cards for narrative powers, like say I trade one card to be able to narrate things for six turns, but the other person now has this card with a special narrative power on it that when played will overrule me on a certain thing the player wants to happen.

it would be a game about narrative deals and cooperation to make a good story…….dice almost wouldn't be involved….

[Xefas]

for some reason I don't care about that…..now I'm visualizing a game in my head where everyone is a narrator, and there is a deck of cards and you basically trade each other the cards for narrative powers, like say I trade one card to be able to narrate things for six turns, but the other person now has this card with a special narrative power on it that when played will overrule me on a certain thing the player wants to happen.

it would be a game about narrative deals and cooperation to make a good story…….dice almost wouldn't be involved….

That's actually a really cool core idea for a game. I think I underestimated you.

Just going to say, as a GM, the idea of comparing the easiness for "making stuff up on the fly" between M&M and Exalted....

I guess it's a good thing I didn't actually do that then? M&M and Exalted have other failings that they share, though. Mostly in the department of extraneous mechanics, lack of meaningful choices, and the way they deal with narrative authority. However, that said, I'd say M&M is probably the best (or close) of D&D's babies, but if you want to see a step up from that, the same designer (Steve Kenson) made a more recent superhero game, 'Icons: Superpowered Roleplaying', which he states takes everything he liked about M&M, gets rid of the chaff, and does it all better. Having played it, I agree. Maybe check that out and compare.

[Lord Raziere]

That's actually a really cool core idea for a game. I think I underestimated you.

yea well….that only came about after I watched that video. I guess I need some knowledge in something before I can design stuff well for it…..

also I'm thinking of this social combat system where a fight is called an "Argument" and in Arguments, you basically make a starting roll to determine how good your beginning argument is. Then you have to achieve one of two win conditions: your argument reaching this 100 percent mark, or your opponent reaching this 0 percent mark, 100 percent means you have made your argument so well that they are convinced that your right and 0 meaning that your argument is so destroyed that you might as well go along with the other guy because you can't come up with anything better.

things like evidence and such can help or hinder arguments, and making rolls to bolster your argument as well or attack the other argument would all be apart of the Arguments.
the methods can range anywhere from honest persuasion to lies and threats to interrogation and intimidation, but doing stupid things like resorting to fallacies or stuff like that count as failing. and of course different methods are more appropriate for different social situations- you are going to have a far harder time of it resorting to more rough and dirty form of tactics in noble courts and such fancy posh places while remaining polite in places like street gangs marks you a coward.

performing music would probably have similar system but one-sided, and some adjustable things depending on how appropriate it is for the situation…
or something like that...

[Xefas]

also I'm thinking of this social combat system...

You might want to look at the Duel of Wits from Burning Wheel for some inspiration. It's a pretty involved social combat system, although "winning" an argument doesn't necessarily change the other character's mind (that's up to their player), it just stumps them to the point where they submit to the terms the two players set at the beginning of the duel ("You said you'd help me break into the Baron's mansion!", "Fine, whatever. But I won't like it.").

edit: The pdf I linked isn't the whole game - just an excerpt they put up for free on the site as a preview.

[Lord Raziere]

I see, will have to check that out. but then again there was a nagging thought that since I heard of Burning Wheel before they probably already came up with that. but then again….I came up with it without ever actually knowing they came up with it. great minds think alike sometimes.

now I'm thinking of making the best system by taking the best magic system, the best social system, the best combat systems in all the world and finding some way to make a character creation system so that they could become good at any of them, but then again that probably wouldn't work….

instead I'll try and work on the narrative cooperation game…..

[Xefas]

I see, will have to check that out. but then again there was a nagging thought that since I heard of Burning Wheel before they probably already came up with that. but then again….I came up with it without ever actually knowing they came up with it. great minds think alike sometimes.

Well, I wouldn't let similar ideas out there discourage you. There's something to be said for 'standing on the shoulders of giants'. Burning Wheel itself adapts concepts from Sorcerer, Inspectres, My Life With Master, Dogs in the Vineyard, and others besides. Dogs in the Vineyard in turn borrows from Sorcerer, Universalis, The Riddle of Steel, and more. Hell, some great games, like The Dictionary of Mu, and The Dresden Files RPG, are just straight up hacks of another system (Sorcerer and Fate, respectively), albeit extensive and thoroughly developed hacks.

[Lord Raziere]

except now my mind is basically overloading itself with ideas about ways to design rpgs and how combat should work and such and its complete chaos.

hm. Fate, I've heard a lot of people trying for Exalted Fate-hacks. I have some kind of version of Fate and I can see how I could make my own, but I never got around to it….bothersome.

[Mr.Bookworm]

All of the best everythings steal from everywhere. That is in fact, the secret (except not a secret) to successful design, taking various things stolen from other places, mashing them together (note that this doesn't have to be intentional, and you'll likely do it in your head without realizing it), and creating something relatively new and interesting. If anyone ever tells you they had a completely original idea, call them a filthy liar (except me, as all of my ideas are completely and totally unique, DO NOT STEAL).

[Drascin]

I guess it's a good thing I didn't actually do that then? M&M and Exalted have other failings that they share, though. Mostly in the department of extraneous mechanics, lack of meaningful choices, and the way they deal with narrative authority. However, that said, I'd say M&M is probably the best (or close) of D&D's babies, but if you want to see a step up from that, the same designer (Steve Kenson) made a more recent superhero game, 'Icons: Superpowered Roleplaying', which he states takes everything he liked about M&M, gets rid of the chaff, and does it all better. Having played it, I agree. Maybe check that out and compare.

I am checking it a bit, few pages in now. Doesn't seem to be off to a very good start, because I have an admittedly irrational but nonetheless immense dislike of d6s as roleplaying dice, and I really don't like randomly rolled character sheets for anything intended to last more than a single session. I expect there'll be an option to make characters yourself somewhere after, at least.

[Xefas]

I really don't like randomly rolled character sheets for anything intended to last more than a single session. I expect there'll be an option to make characters yourself somewhere after, at least.

As a general rule, I don't like random character generation either. I despise it. I have emotional scars from years of 2nd edition D&D.

That said, I still had fun with Icons. I think they do it well.

This is an explanation from the designer, given in an interview about Icons, if it helps:

Spoiler

Show

Random Character Creation … Really?
Yes, really. If you’re allergic to random character design in RPGs, I’ll just ask you to bear with me to the end of this article before you decide that I’m crazy, having thrown away years of RPG design “evolution” (which is a debate for another time) for the retrograde throwback that is (shudder) random superhero creation.

Like I said earlier, ICONS draws upon the “pick-up game” style of superhero gaming. The idea isn’t to lovingly craft a character precise in every detail, but to be able to throw together a “good enough” kind of “character sketch” and get playing right away, while not sacrificing the creativity and imagination that make RPGs so much fun.

So, ICONS follows the example of prior generations of RPGs with tables where you can, with a handful of die-rolls, whip up a character. (Hell, with a modicum of programming skill, you can probably set it up so you can do it all with one click of a mouse!)

The creative aspect of it comes into play with that aforementioned Determination section. Sure, now you’ve rolled-up your super-strong guy who has some kind of damaging aura, but now you’ve got to ask? Who is he (or she) and what makes this character tick?

The reason I use this specific example is that it has come up twice (randomly, mind you) in various playtest games I’ve run, but produced two totally different characters. On the one hand, you’ve got Volcano, the exiled prince of the Magma Men, who is a super-strong guy made of igneous rock, able to heat up enough to melt metal. He’s imperious, proud, a noble warrior. On the other hand there’s Saguaro, the Man-Cactus, transformed by a scientific accident into a giant, humanoid cactus with superhuman strength and enough sharp spines to make most foes think twice about grabbing him! He’s from the desert southwest (of course).

How many other names and backgrounds can you think up for that thumbnail description of traits? Both Volcano and Saguaro’s players said they would not have come up with those characters on their own if simply instructed to “make-up a superhero.” Part of the fun of the system was it gave them a set of conditions and then they had to invent a hero to go around them! Plus both were able to roll up their characters and play all in the same demo-game session! Not bad, huh?

Now, if that doesn’t sound cool to you, don’t worry; ICONS also includes a short and simple point-based system of character design for those who really prefer that approach. It’s still fairly simple, but it hands all the choices over to the players and starts everyone out with an equal budget. (Who says we don’t deliver on what the people want?)

So, that’s ICONS in a nutshell. I could go on, but honestly, much more than the summary here and I’d literally be recapitulating whole chunks of the game. That’s one of the other things; ICONS is pretty slim, going back to the days when you could put in an entire RPG in a single booklet.

So, look up to the skies! Or at least keep an eye on your website and Twitter feeds for more about ICONS.

If you want an example of the random generation in Actual Play, I believe this episode of the Walking Eye podcast has them gearing up for their Icons campaign.

[Mr.Bookworm]

I am checking it a bit, few pages in now. Doesn't seem to be off to a very good start, because I have an admittedly irrational but nonetheless immense dislike of d6s as roleplaying dice

Man, what are you on?

d6s are the best roleplaying dice, because everyone at least has some Yahtzee dice or whatever they can grab, and everyone is familiar with them. Makes introducing people to roleplaying games a lot simpler, because you don't have to spend an hour explaining what kind of black witchcraft powers your 20-sided die.

[Story Time]

"...the quality of the dice experience is proportional to the quality of the rules that they are rolled by..."

[Mr.Bookworm]

"...the quality of the dice experience is proportional to the quality of the rules that they are rolled by..."

Says the man who has never tried to create a character in FAT-ooooookay I see what you're saying.

[aetherialDawn]

Says the man who has never tried to create a character in FAT-ooooookay I see what you're saying.

That was going to end in an E-system. It was.
Are there any particular dice rollers one could get on a generic smartphone for Exalted? Generic because it's not mine, it's my ST's, and I know very little about it for now!

[Lord Raziere]

…..Whats wrong with FATE? It looks pretty well thought out to me. Seems more like clay to mold to make whatever system you want rather than something you actually with as originally written however.

[golentan]

What's wrong with FATE? Nothing. But that sentence was going to end in -AL. The armpit/nether region of games, the one that all other games make sit in the corner because it smells funny and keeps looking at them and their children in a creepy way. The game that makes Wizards of the Coast say "Guys, the Book of Erotic Fantasy was a mature and appropriate addition to our lineup and we should have embraced it."

That's what's wrong with it.

[Lord Raziere]

Oh right. I had purged my memory of ever hearing about the system.

and now I have to purge it again. excuse me for a few minutes *gets out a nuclear powered flamethrower, begins torching own mind*

now that I have purged my memory whatever I can't recall….

my ideas for music for certain places and eras!

Time of Glory

Primordial War (I know, overused, but in this case I think it appropriate. )

First Age

Autocthon/Autocthonia (sums up the guy pretty well)

The Usurpation

The Shogunate

The Great Contagion (also good theme for Abyssals in general)

The Balorian Crusade- Believe it or not, THIS was the hard one to figure out a good piece of music to set to. and I'm still not sure whether or not it fits.

The Age of Sorrows

The Scarlet Empire

The Underworld

Malfeas- though it could double as an Infernal ascending to Devil Tiger as well, or triple as the Reclamation succeeding.

The Death Lords- Cause hey, is any Death Lord really that serious about destroying everything?

also, a good theme when your Infernal starts their transcendence, or completes it:

A Devil Tiger Howls

[Kyeudo]

What other games have you played?

When things like "dice pools" and "not having to figure out level appropriate encounters" are revolutions in game design to someone, I can't help but assume their experience is mostly with D&D and its associated children - d20, White Wolf, GURPS, M&M, Shadowrun, etc.

These games condition you to accept mediocrity. To think things like imbalance, house rules, long prep times, fiddly math, and broken mechanics are just things you have to live with to roleplay. That's not true. Most games don't have those things. You just have to see them.

Yes, my experience with other roleplaying systems in mostly limited to various types of d20 and Exalted, but I can never quite see the gaping holes some people claim are in the rules. Exalted's problems aren't big things, like Wizards completely dominating every other class if played intelligently, but a million small things adding up with a giant tsunami of destruction.

Take Paranoia Combat as one example. The whole reason for 2/7 filters and perfect spamming isn't really for any single cause. The simple answer is that they exist because you can't survive a solid hit, but the reasons are really more diverse than that. There's the existance of grand killsticks, the general guarantee that most attacks will hit you, the expense of getting lots of health levels, wound penalties means the start of the death spiral, perfect defenses therefore becoming the only viable defenses against strong attacks, motes becoming the new health levels because of this, ways to bypass perfect defenses exist, ways to bypass the ways to bypass perfect defenses exist, you can only use one Charm a turn, Combos become necessary for survival, stunting becomes about delaying mote attrition, reactor Charms get involved, and so on until you finally have all of these restrictions that force high-power combat to take a certain shape.

I actually like some of the imbalances, just because they tend to favor a simulationist mindset. Dexterity is king just because it gets used everywhere you expect being fast to matter instead of seeing Strength or Stamina used to calculate attack pools or defense pools.

I guess I'm saying that I don't care if other systems are mechanically better than Exalted's current system. Those other systems aren't the game I love and the game I have handwritten hundreds of pages of notes, story ideas, and homebrew for. I want to make this one work better by starting to dismantle those million little things that cause the big problems.

So, back to the original question. Does it really make that much sense to require bonus point expenditures for dots 4 and 5? Only Artifact, Manse, and Ally seem like they really give you enough bang to charge alot for and even then Ally has alot of strings attached.

[Drascin]

As a general rule, I don't like random character generation either. I despise it. I have emotional scars from years of 2nd edition D&D.

That said, I still had fun with Icons. I think they do it well.

This is an explanation from the designer, given in an interview about Icons, if it helps:

Spoiler

Show

Random Character Creation … Really?
Yes, really. If you’re allergic to random character design in RPGs, I’ll just ask you to bear with me to the end of this article before you decide that I’m crazy, having thrown away years of RPG design “evolution” (which is a debate for another time) for the retrograde throwback that is (shudder) random superhero creation.

Like I said earlier, ICONS draws upon the “pick-up game” style of superhero gaming. The idea isn’t to lovingly craft a character precise in every detail, but to be able to throw together a “good enough” kind of “character sketch” and get playing right away, while not sacrificing the creativity and imagination that make RPGs so much fun.

So, ICONS follows the example of prior generations of RPGs with tables where you can, with a handful of die-rolls, whip up a character. (Hell, with a modicum of programming skill, you can probably set it up so you can do it all with one click of a mouse!)

The creative aspect of it comes into play with that aforementioned Determination section. Sure, now you’ve rolled-up your super-strong guy who has some kind of damaging aura, but now you’ve got to ask? Who is he (or she) and what makes this character tick?

The reason I use this specific example is that it has come up twice (randomly, mind you) in various playtest games I’ve run, but produced two totally different characters. On the one hand, you’ve got Volcano, the exiled prince of the Magma Men, who is a super-strong guy made of igneous rock, able to heat up enough to melt metal. He’s imperious, proud, a noble warrior. On the other hand there’s Saguaro, the Man-Cactus, transformed by a scientific accident into a giant, humanoid cactus with superhuman strength and enough sharp spines to make most foes think twice about grabbing him! He’s from the desert southwest (of course).

How many other names and backgrounds can you think up for that thumbnail description of traits? Both Volcano and Saguaro’s players said they would not have come up with those characters on their own if simply instructed to “make-up a superhero.” Part of the fun of the system was it gave them a set of conditions and then they had to invent a hero to go around them! Plus both were able to roll up their characters and play all in the same demo-game session! Not bad, huh?

Now, if that doesn’t sound cool to you, don’t worry; ICONS also includes a short and simple point-based system of character design for those who really prefer that approach. It’s still fairly simple, but it hands all the choices over to the players and starts everyone out with an equal budget. (Who says we don’t deliver on what the people want?)

So, that’s ICONS in a nutshell. I could go on, but honestly, much more than the summary here and I’d literally be recapitulating whole chunks of the game. That’s one of the other things; ICONS is pretty slim, going back to the days when you could put in an entire RPG in a single booklet.

So, look up to the skies! Or at least keep an eye on your website and Twitter feeds for more about ICONS.

If you want an example of the random generation in Actual Play, I believe this episode of the Walking Eye podcast has them gearing up for their Icons campaign.

Not sold at all on random chargen by the description, I'm afraid. It's good for single-session pick-up-and-play, yes, but hell, it's hard enough getting people to roleplay when they actually make their characters as they like! Random dudes, generally, just get treated as Warcraft toons or caricatures that the players do not particularly invest themselves in - it's like getting a pregen character for a module, you'll be more focused in solving the module than in portraying a character you don't particularly know or care about. This is funny for single session or humorous games, but really makes it pretty hard to run a decent Justice League arc, not to mention use it for the myriad other things I've used M&M for (as M&M is pretty much my go-to generic, it really works for nearly everything).

Man, what are you on?

d6s are the best roleplaying dice, because everyone at least has some Yahtzee dice or whatever they can grab, and everyone is familiar with them. Makes introducing people to roleplaying games a lot simpler, because you don't have to spend an hour explaining what kind of black witchcraft powers your 20-sided die.

I'm on nothing. I just find d6s to be aesthetically uglier than a frankenstein monster crossed with a deep trench fish and entirely unsatisfying to roll. I should know, I used to play Warhammer, I rolled a lot of d6s in my time, and there's nowhere near the same satisfaction in even a bucketful of d6s than in a single d10 or d20 . D6s feel to me like you're playing parcheesi.

[Xefas]

I guess I'm saying that I don't care if other systems are mechanically better than Exalted's current system. Those other systems aren't the game I love and the game I have handwritten hundreds of pages of notes, story ideas, and homebrew for. I want to make this one work better by starting to dismantle those million little things that cause the big problems.

Y'know, when it comes down to it, I think what bothers me is stuff like this post. You clearly have some understanding of what a good mechanic would look like. I know you have an admirable work ethic capable of actually getting something done (Szoreny charmset, Warstrider fix), in stark contrast to all the half-assed and half-done projects out there.

I just wish you were focusing that on something other than trying to slap bandaids on the guy missing his head. Because, it's not about imbalance. It's not about lethality. Dexterity being a clearly superior stat is not a meaningful hole in the game. Neither is lethality. (The tier system is not the problem with D&D. Those people are missing the forest for the trees.) These things don't matter. The problem is that from its most basic mechanic, the system does not do a coherent job representing what it's meant to represent. I'm talking from the Attribute+Ability die pool upward, Exalted has already failed.

And I do believe in my heart of hearts that you could see that if you expanded your knowledge of roleplaying games. The mechanic you're talking about in the linked thread? Take a look at how Burning Wheel handles traits and artha. It seems to me it's exactly what you're looking for. And that gives me hope, because I'm not spending the time to type this just to belittle something you like. Far from it. I don't want you to stop liking Exalted, or to stop trying to fix it. I don't want that for anyone. I just want you to have the tools to actually do it, rather than wasting time slapping bandaids on the guy missing his head.

Not sold at all on random chargen by the description, I'm afraid.

Well, that's okay. The random generation isn't the main selling point of the game (which is why they have a non-random setting for it).

[Dragnar]

Hmm... Well Xefas, you seem to have experience with a decent variety of RPGs. So, which one(s) do you think are the best put together mechanically? Just curious.

[Kyeudo]

I just wish you were focusing that on something other than trying to slap bandaids on the guy missing his head. Because, it's not about imbalance. It's not about lethality. Dexterity being a clearly superior stat is not a meaningful hole in the game. Neither is lethality. (The tier system is not the problem with D&D. Those people are missing the forest for the trees.) These things don't matter. The problem is that from its most basic mechanic, the system does not do a coherent job representing what it's meant to represent. I'm talking from the Attribute+Ability die pool upward, Exalted has already failed.

You aren't doing a good job of selling me on this point. I look at Exalted and see a guy who needs some major surgery to be healthy. You look at Exalted and see a corpse. I don't see how you can say Exalted fails at the most basic level, because Exalted is supposed to simulate this epic fantasy universe. What's wrong with using Strength + Athletics to see if I can heft the boulder? What's wrong with Dexterity + Stealth to see if the guard can hear me?

My own games have had few problems getting the system to do what we want. The only time I felt there was a major problem was when I had a Dragon-Blooded fighting some demons with perfect attacks. I had to have those demons hold back or I had a dead player on my hands. The encounter was perfectly fine for the Abyssal and the Solar, but the Dragon-Blooded was crippled by the fact that all his splat's defensive Charms either sucked or were buried 5 Charms in. This doesn't take a super-genius to fix, just someone dedicated enough to actually do the work of rearranging an entire Charm set. I don't see what's wrong with doing it.

[Lix Lorn]

I'm on nothing. I just find d6s to be aesthetically uglier than a frankenstein monster crossed with a deep trench fish and entirely unsatisfying to roll. I should know, I used to play Warhammer, I rolled a lot of d6s in my time, and there's nowhere near the same satisfaction in even a bucketful of d6s than in a single d10 or d20 . D6s feel to me like you're playing parcheesi.

Maybe you find them uninteresting BECAUSE you've rolled so many of them?

[Lord Raziere]

Ok Xefas, you want me to try and make system to play Exalted, then me try.

and that system to use….FATE. Duh.

First, the Aspects: Motivation, Caste, Great Curse, Anathema, Urge, Lunar Tattoos, Arcane Fate, Resonance and so on, they are aspects.

skills will be the same, FATE has a similar scale anyways it is a difference of of 2 more than 5 or 3 less than 10 depending on your perspective. the FATE change is that the scale stops at 7.

only problem I see right now: how to fit in Lunars and Alchemicals? they go with attributes not skills, which FATE has no attributes.

combat system will be replaced by FATE combat system. better.

I'd keep backgrounds, but change the effects of the backgrounds to be better.

I don't think I could remove Essence mote pools without removing what makes it Exalted. or willpower. or charms themselves, but individual charms can be taken out, like those annoying perfect defenses now that we have the FATE combat system. excellencies would be confined to only giving +1 bonuses however.

artifacts methinks would be all be at least great level extras, while any mundane item would be good or below extras.

Fate points: Celestial Exalted probably get more than Terrestrials. Sidereals probably get the most, they chosen of fate, should get most Fate points.

still figuring out how sorcery would work, but then again it might be one of the few things we don't have to change. already works pretty well to my way of thinking, and I'm pretty sure FATE already has a spellcasting system similar to it.

and of course Intimacies would be the same, they are basically secondary aspects.

and I think thats everything yes? do you like, don't like?
sorry, me sometimes randomly speak in fake accents sometimes, mostly cause its fun.

[aetherialDawn]

Autocthon/Autocthonia (sums up the guy pretty well)

I've never heard of this song, but it's quite good. And yes, Autochthon does have remarkably similar problems to Wheatly as far as "I pull off an astonishing win by enabling the right faction, and then I shoot myself in the foot."
Would need lyrics removed somehow to serve as proper background music, if that's the aim.

Malfeas- though it could double as an Infernal ascending to Devil Tiger as well, or triple as the Reclamation succeeding.

Wouldn't Malfeas-the-place have an enormous variety of music? I seem to recall the Yozis having incredible appreciation for music. First Circle demons being superior to any mortal musician, and the Yozis being superior to the Incarna (Unconquered Sun not excluded!)

(It is a very nice piece, though, and good background music.)

also, a good theme when your Infernal starts their transcendence, or completes it:

A Devil Tiger Howls

I don't know how I feel about this. Is background music appropriate to a single event?.... Probably. There are ways to make it not, but they're not the simplest ways, so this will generally be good.
Still bugs me in some way I can't quite place.

still figuring out how sorcery would work, but then again it might be one of the few things we don't have to change. already works pretty well to my way of thinking, and I'm pretty sure FATE already has a spellcasting system similar to it.

Exalted Sorcery is not actually that amazing as a whole - though the system works just fine for one mitigating factor. A few examples:
Combat Sorcery uses a system which results in your doom when placed in context of the Exalted Combat System in most cases.
Imbue Amalgam. Just imbue Amalgam is enough to break a game, in only a handful of uses. Custom-designed from the ground up mini-exalts with no permanent costs, who are coincidentally 100% loyal and can't be countermagic'd without having the statue. Co-incidentally, unless you want to turn them back, I don't recall that statue needing to stay.

The reason it 'works' is that there's no real prerequisites for spells except for the X Circle Sorcery charms. So as opposed to normal charmsets one can just steer around what one doesn't want, and cherry-pick the spells that work/are overly powerful. There's no chance of 'Well, I'd take War or some other arbitrary, but the charms for it are useless...' because it stems from just Occult. There's no chance of 'Well, this is a good charm, but the eight before it are useless...' (Sidereal Craft Tree, thank you for pointing this out Drascin) because again, there's at least a few good spells at each level, and no prerequisite trees (just the XCS charms.)

However, the saving grace of Sorcery, as with all of Exalted, is that it enables truly amazing and awesome things.
Water from Stone and Summoning the Harvest have so little combat utility, but with a boulder and a plot of land you can establish a city anywhere you please and feed it with your own sorcerous might.

[meschlum]

Core Book for the 2.718... Edition

The Raksha neither understand nor approve of the workings of Creation, though it is full of fascinating experiences (and soul buffets). Accordingly, they have sought to codify their knowledge of this realm, setting down the rules learned through madness and experiment, seeking to make nonsense of its warped perfection and delightful flaws.

The result was the Core Book, which those who have perused it claim is an ideal representation of Creation, its inner workings, its people, and the powers that inhabit it - from Sol to pond scum. The concentrated power of the belief invested in the Book has allowed it to transcend reality and affect other planes of existence, spreading across alien worlds that consider themselves 'Modern' or "Web-enabled' - both signs that they contain pale reflections of the Second Age and of Fate.

Unfortunately, for all its arcane power, the Core Book appears to be singularly useless for any Raksha visting Creation, or meeting Creation-born. On the other hand, it makes for entertaining games among the Shaped Raksha - and even some of the Unshaped.

2-dot Adjuration: "2.718... Edition is the best, most accurate and most enjoyable Edition!"
Imposition of Law - barring Charms or stunts, someone committed to the Core Book will always perfectly convince others that the Edition is the best ever.

Rumors in the deep Wyld suggest that a 3.14... Edition is in the works, equally transcendent and accurate, if not more. The Raksha are enthusiastically looking forward to Edition wars, or even committing to both Editions being the best at the same time.


The Games of the Wyld

Why bother with Creation when its sole, ultimate purpose is to play the Games of Divinity - and there are much better games out there anyway? From this thesis (influenced by radical heretics, or heretical radicals, of the Edition wars to come), the Fair Folk resolved to create Games that were far superior to the tiresome efforts of the Primordials - and had actual mechanics underlying them.

The Games are played wherever the Fair Folk congregate, and are open to all. They are at their most brilliant in the Wyld, but have been played and delighted their audience even in the Underworld. Participants are imbued with pure creative power, and can form entire worlds as part of their move, then perform other, more fascinating and complex works.

4-dot Oneiromancy
Assumption of Dreams and Passion - the Games are played around a table woven from quintessential enjoyment.
Assumption of Wood Form - it's a table. And I had a spare point. Damn the outward facing Oneiromancy costs anyway, what with needing Mad God Mien and all.
Curse of Definition - players of the Games cannot notice anything else.
Mad God Mien - Counter magic? What counter-magic? Can't you see we're playing here?

2-dot Oneiromancy
Assumption of Dreams and Passion - the Games include dice with incredibly comforting shapes and numbers.
Fall of Night Shadows the Truth - no, really. Thou Shalt Not Recall Anything But the Games.
Mad God Mien - you're really telling me you think sorcery will help you here?

2-dot Oneiromancy
Assumption of Dreams and Passion - the Games are played with sheets of paper that are Utterly Realistic.
Shiftless Untamed Beauty - yes, yes, it's addictive.
Ordinary Object Conjuration - creates bottles of celestial dewdrops collected in the highest mountains. Works like Celestial Wine, and takes care of such details as needing food, drink, sleep, and so forth.
Emotion-Weaving Style - if run by a sufficiently skilled ST (high Essence Raksha), any non-Exalt (Incarnae included) will find their Motivation is now "Play the Games at any cost".
Mad God Mien - please.

4-dot Oneiromancy
Assumption of the Land's Heart - the Games manifest in an area around the players.
Ordinary Object Conjuration (x4) - creates miniature worlds, tiny automata, and other game components. Substitute in Subversion and Transformation Artifice and Behemoth Forging Meditation as needed. If this isn't enough, add a staff of Workers, Entertainers and Diplomats with the requisite Charms.
Mad God Mien - what did you expect?