Mass Effect 3.5B: Taste the Rainbow (Story and Ending Discussion; Spoilers!)

[Luzahn]

It's all about the viewcount for them. Any recommendations on reliable places? I know Giantbomb is usually good.

[Psyren]

It's all about the viewcount for them. Any recommendations on reliable places? I know Giantbomb is usually good.

Escapist is my go-to, even post-Extra-Creditz-Gate. They seem to have been pretty even-handed with this story as well.

[Anarion]

Actually, I'm going to change my opinion and say that the one statement about there being no "A, B, C" ending might be false advertising. Most of the others don't rise to that level (I did a more thorough analysis of this earlier, but suffice to say, they don't). However, the ABC thing is a direct contradiction in a way that doesn't really require interpretation about "art" or whatever. When they said ABC, they mean "a point in the game at which your ending is decided by a selection of three choices, arrayed before you in a way that you must select only one and have no other decisions" and that's exactly what they put out.

I hope they don't get slammed for it though, it would be a huge waste of money.

[Trazoi]

I'm also a bit curious if people are still as angry in light of the whole DLC thing. I agree with a lot of the recent complaints, but I also don't think that an ending that is conceptually sound but lacks explanation that will be forthcoming in free DLC is worth returning a game over.

Yes, because the game shouldn't have been written with that ending. I don't care what specific promises Bioware people made before ME3's launch - I didn't listen to them. But what I was promised purely by buying the third Mass Effect game was an adaption of the Hollywood three-act formula to a space opera RPG/FPS that ties together and closes up the trilogy. Even if they patch that up with DLC, the fact that they didn't provide that on launch means I no longer have faith in their writing team to deliver.

This blog post (All That Matters Is The Ending, Part 2: Mass Effect 3) sums everything up in detail (found via Sluggy Freelance). What gets me is that ME3 was actually pretty close to providing a powerful Hollywood three-act. But you can't throw something like a starchild-outta-nowhere right while the tension is still high and then provide no proper resolution like that.

Edit: I don't think it's worth returning the game over, as 95% of the game is still really good. But it is worth reconsidering buying any more story-heavy Bioware games. I'm certainly having second thoughts about Dragon Age 3 (and I liked Dragon Age 2, including its ending. Well for the most part.)

[Aotrs Commander]

*finishes game*

Spoiler

Show

BIIIOOOOWARRRRRREEEEE!!!!!!

...

...

I had all readied myself up for a post in which I would go into Humorous Denial, praise the ending as being awesome and recount why as a steadily increasingly Stupidly Awesome series of made-up events. (Including, but not limited to, Garrus shooting the bullet that was to kill Anderson out of the air, Blasto showing up at the last minute, being in fact a real character of whom the movies were a plausible deniability scheme to hide its real operations, Tali and Liara teaming up to "assume direct control" of Harbinger to duff up its fellow Reapers while it screeched in disbelief), and Garrus and Shepard using the Crucible to turn the entire Mass Relay network into giant super-light-speed mass accelerator sniper rifles, and taking it in turns to headshot Reapers throughout the galaxy, and Mordin showing up as the Six-Billion Credit Salarian after the Krogan found him barely alive in the ruins and had the technology to rebuild him.)

This has been somewhat pre-empted by the fact that, up until the end of the Thanix Missiles, it WAS good. The starship battle was AMAZING, the mission was pretty tense, and the final worss with your squad were great.

WAS.

And then.

Annnnnnd then.

Then the rush towards the beam tower, and it all went Horribly Wrong.

...

*sigh*

...

Before I get to it, I would just to say something first.

Some time ago, I said I thought I had figured out the Big Bad.

Also, I think I just figured out who the big bad is. I'm not going to say anything (since I don't want anyone to confirm it for me), but I think I just twigged what's going on - what's really going on - and the secret of the cycles.

Trust me, you didn't.

Post-Thessia-Thoughts (cont.)
Oh, my speculations have nothing whatsoever to do with Cerberus (at least not as anything more than a symptom) - it's what was said before Kai Sue showed up that has made me suddenly extremely suspicious. I could be wrong of course - and not much more time will tell - but we'll see... (I may have played a few too many Bioware games to be blindsided by the eleventh hour Plot Twist...) We'll see.

Just be sure to let us know what you thought was going on after you see for yourself. I'm a bit curious, though no less confident that whatever you think it is, you haven't guessed the ending.

I would like it on record that I was extremely close.

Because I was expecting the Crucible to be the BBEG, from the very second the VI said it wasn't the Protheans who made it, and that had been manipulating everyone for cycle after cycle, was controlling the Reapers to do whatever it's evil ends were, and was somehow fooling everyone into building it an improving it each new cycle, using the Reapers a catalyst to force everyone into building it anew each time.

I hadn't considered the Citidel, but I was very nearly on the money in any case.



So. I had lowered my expectations pretty low; had a pretty shrewd idea of what would happen (not missed the word "sythensis" being bandied around, despite my efforts), but the full Stupid of those last five minutes rally just is something you can't quite prepare for, is it? Now matter how you brace yourself, you can't quite prepare yourself for how mind-staggeringly stupid it is.

So. The choice is:

a) Kill all synthetics in the galaxy, including one of your squadmates and an entire race due to the choices of one stupendously narrow-minded petty arrogant bigot - and no, it gets no excuses, it doesn't matter if it pulls the form of a dead child out of Shepard's subconciousness in a plee for sympathy, it could have appeared as Liara or Garrus or Tali or Fluttershy or Optimus Prime or a fraking cheese-and-ham-sandwich and it would have CHANGED NOTHING; it is a vile, bigoted arrogant entity fully deserving to be spirit-bound into mindless screaming agony for all eternity (oh, and this is "best" ending, in which you get to maybe not die).

b) Do exactly what the not-a-proper-BBEG¹, was going to do, and merely send the Reapers away or

c) Forcibly fuse all organic and technological life in the galaxy of somecrap like that.

And in the former and latter cases, cause untold damage, suffering and death on a massive scale either due to the explosion or horrible, lingering, wasteful deaths for any world/system not self-sufficient that relies on the Mass Relay network.

I choose c, because it seemed the least murderful option that a paragon would have gone for.

Though I REALLY don't get what Joker was smiling for, given that apparently he, Liara and EDI are the only survivors of the Normandy and are stranded on a strange planet, having seen their best mate/bond-mate explodinate, not too mention the thousands of casualties.

I think that was probably the worst part, that that was it, whoop-de-doo, everybody's apparently dead, who cares about the rest of the universe? Yeah, that was VERY obviously rushed out at the last minute, or if it wasn't the sheer LAZINESS of the writer is astounding. It is second only to the ending to NWN2's ending, but that at least had the decency to put probably the best end-of-game fight in ANY Bioware-style RPG (because you got your WHOLE PARTY) involved.

And then, seriously Bioware, you dump me out post-credits, back into the Normandy's bridge, so that I can play through any extra DLC you dain to release, set before the ending?! Really? You couldn't even be bothered dump me back to the main menu and ask to make a new save? Really? Hey, you finished that game, now we put you so you can play your DLC and go through that crap again, or get the hollow satisfaction of just playing to the ending of the DLC, which will inevitably not have a good conclusion (as, say, Shadowbroker did) as it will be part of the story to which you have already seen? REALLY?!

No, that was pretty unbelievably poorly executed. Not only a choce of three really crappy endings - because no, I only barely tolerate cataclysmic endings when done well, and this was NOT (and frankly, I don't give a flying frak about how arty or philosphy it is, because, y'know, actually, I don't WANT arty in my frag-damn action-base-space-opera's conclusion, or social commentary or any of that crap - there's a place for everything, but the end of an action-RPG space opera is NOT ONE OF THEM), but abrupt and lacking any kind of the effort that was put into the rest of this game and any of the prior ones. By far the worst ending of any Bioware game (and second only to Obsidian's NWN2 ending), and frankly, Bioware's record on endings is not a good one from the start.

It SHOULD have been much better and I frankly don't see any excuses, from Bioware, from the writers, and most especially from EA, with whom the buck ultimately stops. THEY are the ones who have the ultimate quality control, they're the ones who release the game, so ultimately, it's their problem for either rushing Bioware or not putting their foot down on the writing. (Because I think for once, some editorial mandates might actually have helped, as they hardly could have made it worse.)

...

...

In other, entirely unrelated news, I am organising the Bleak Despair sector fleet to take a little wander, no reason, through a couple of alternate dimensions, possibly with a bit of time-travel, with our energy weapons (with their range of an orders of magnitude greater than maximum mass accelerator range, including PD and fighter weapons who's maximum range is comparable to maximum mass accelerator range if being generous), railguns (which are approximately 300 times as powerful as a dradnought's mass accelerator, given our kinetic weapons discharge at up to 3-4 lightspeed) and our anti-matter warheads (with a two-million kilometer range, with shields and armour, ECCM and advanced evasive programming), all of which are quite good, at say, murderising low-tech starfleets from a safe distance in an entirely one-sided battle, plus our teleporters (suitable for, say, accessing the interior cores of stations, especially those with only laughable kinetic shields) and sensors (for the looking inside of interior cores of stations for place to, say, teleport to) and a rather large a heavy object, possibly a giant wrench, or possible a SK-series Snake Launcher (for the purposes of, say, forcefully inserting into delicate internal machinery with extreme violence...)

No reason, like I say, just a quick wander, nothing to worry about...



I hope, SiuiS and Anarion, since you two were the ones who egged me on to complete the game in it's current state to see my reaction, that it was entirely worth it... (And yes, rest of thread, this rant is entirely their fault.)



¹What, the end of the trilogy doesn't even involve a proper boss fight? Really? Because no, fighting another round of the exact same monsters in waves does not constitute a boss fight, Thanix Missile mission, nor does three husks and a marauder.

[MCerberus]

Anger

There is actually a giant psychotic fake fan thing with enough cynacism and ridiculousness to describe what you went through. His name is Marauder Shields, the last enemy you kill in the game. He tries to kill you to save you from the bad ending.


Anyway, Bioware gets a big jar of conclusion once a year. After ToR ate it up in 8 chunks (oddly in a game that does not conclude, where all the characters will at some point have more story), there was none left.

[Aotrs Commander]

There is actually a giant psychotic fake fan thing with enough cynacism and ridiculousness to describe what you went through. His name is Marauder Shields, the last enemy you kill in the game. He tries to kill you to save you from the bad ending.


Anyway, Bioware gets a big jar of conclusion once a year. After ToR ate it up in 8 chunks (oddly in a game that does not conclude, where all the characters will at some point have more story), there was none left.

He tried hard enough, poor chap; it took me three tries to get past him.

And now I feel guilty for shooting him, when he was clearly only trying to help...

See, this sort of thing is exactly why you shouldn't judge anysentient at face value, whether they are organic, technological, corporeal, incorporeal, alive or Undead, regardless of their method of creation.

Well, except for vampires, Shi'Ar and Gladiator and now the Citidel.

[Luzahn]

Noo! You picked the one ending where it is entirely plausible for the Reapers to just decide to start killing us again!

Control forces Shepard-will on them, preventing attack.
Destroy murders their Cephalopod lazer-faces, preventing attack.
Synthesis leaves the Reapers with full faculties, just deciding to leave us alone.

[Pronounceable]

angry

From now on everything you ever see that bashes Bioware/ME3/EA will make you disproportionately happy. Welcome to the club.

[MCerberus]

From now on everything you ever see that bashes Bioware/ME3/EA will make you disproportionately happy. Welcome to the club.

Oddly enough I had never been exposed to the term 'ToRtanic' until after the ME3 launch. A lot of hate going around, and it's not even the same Bioware studio.

Also, I think the ME3 ending is going to hurt the upcoming C&C game released by the new 'Bioware in name only' studio.

[Trazoi]

Because I was expecting the Crucible to be the BBEG, from the very second the VI said it wasn't the Protheans who made it, and that had been manipulating everyone for cycle after cycle, was controlling the Reapers to do whatever it's evil ends were, and was somehow fooling everyone into building it an improving it each new cycle, using the Reapers a catalyst to force everyone into building it anew each time.

Me too. Or at least the Crucible to be the final level, with hints being dropped about what it actually does getting stronger all the way up until Shepard steps foot into it. It made sense the moment it was introduced - the third Big Space Station to run around in for an epic showdown.

The Citadel again was so dumb in so many ways. I assume everyone has beaten to death about how making the Citadel the boss of the Reapers completely breaks the entire plot of Mass Effect 1?

[Zevox]

Noo! You picked the one ending where it is entirely plausible for the Reapers to just decide to start killing us again!

Control forces Shepard-will on them, preventing attack.
Destroy murders their Cephalopod lazer-faces, preventing attack.
Synthesis leaves the Reapers with full faculties, just deciding to leave us alone.

Um, no. Synthesis fuses organic and synthetic life into a new life form. The Reapers are synthetic life, they're going to be a part of that, completely changed by that ending as well - or perhaps even gone, used for the synthetic parts that are getting added to organic species. It's not entirely clear how it'll work, but it certainly doesn't leave the Reapers untouched.

Zevox

[Tome]

Synthesis leaves the Reapers with full faculties, just deciding to leave us alone.

The Reapers don't decide to just leave us alone.

They're running in terror, because the whole galaxy is now partially Commander Shepard.

[Luzahn]

I was being partially facetious, but the Synthesis ending in its current state seems to do the least in ensuring a final defeat for the reapers. Supposedly it depicts the reapers just flying off in the same way as control, but without the Shepard influence.

[Aeryr]

long post

Yeah that's a pretty normal reaction to the ending. And that is not taking into account that after that you youtube the rest of the endings and they are colorful, that is a joke, but the same.

EDI can survive destroy ending it is possibly a bug though but it happened on my playthrough, probably due to her being on my squad during the last mission.

Also it is maybe since English is not my native language but for me Synthetic means something (or someone) made by combining two "things" into one, normally implying that it is not a natural combination. So Synthesis turns everyone in synthetics, that in the catalyst own words are the pinnacle of evolution. Of course the cycles started in order to prevent the synthetics to wipe all organic life from the galaxy so it is just completely logical that they will end when all organic life is wiped from the galaxy, turned into synthetic life.

Edit: So basically as I understand things either you are synthetic or you are not, being half "synthetic" and half "organic" is synthetic.

[Calemyr]

Me too. Or at least the Crucible to be the final level, with hints being dropped about what it actually does getting stronger all the way up until Shepard steps foot into it. It made sense the moment it was introduced - the third Big Space Station to run around in for an epic showdown.

The Citadel again was so dumb in so many ways. I assume everyone has beaten to death about how making the Citadel the boss of the Reapers completely breaks the entire plot of Mass Effect 1?

Actually, I just came up with an explanation that could work on that. The kid was always there, but he was neutered by the Protheans and remains powerless even now. Notice that the kid doesn't even take credit for the tile that lifts you up to face him. The kid is absolutely powerless, but he understands the situation enough to manipulate you into resolving the stalemate.

Think about it. If the kid is effectively cut off, the Reapers have no direction - they'll operate according to their own will. They may not leave, or they may not come back, or they may do something completely unexpected. The kid is powerless to do anything, and his best tools are now loose cannons that are beyond his control. Whatever option you choose neutralizes them.

Another point for Control, in that case. Not only do you not commit genocide, not only do you not destroy the relays, not only are you the only ending-related casualty, you bring a dangerous element back under control.

[Drascin]

I was being partially facetious, but the Synthesis ending in its current state seems to do the least in ensuring a final defeat for the reapers. Supposedly it depicts the reapers just flying off in the same way as control, but without the Shepard influence.

Personally, I watched it as a loophole deal.

Reapers' programming is to kill organics so that they don't make synthetics.
After Synthesis, there are no organics nor synthetics.
Hence, they have no real reason to kill anyone else, so they just shrug and go away.

[kamikasei]

Personally while I expected the Crucible to turn out to be a trap or trick or something the main twist I expected was that the Catalyst would be revealed to be Shepard. Hence the dream where you burn with the child - you yourself have to be sacrificed to save the galaxy. No idea how it would work but that's what I thought they were building up to.

Aeryr: generally "a synthesis" means a combination of multiple things to make something new, while "synthetic" is broadly synonymous with "artificial" though it derives from the same root.

[Aeryr]

Interesting, in Spanish it definitively has a strong artificial connotation. So... which word would be appropriate to describe the result of synthesis?

[Drascin]

Interesting, in Spanish it definitively has a strong artificial connotation. So... which word would be appropriate to describe the result of synthesis?

"Synthesized", I think. "Sintetizado" in spanish... in the biologically-used sense. Much like a plant synthesizes new stuff from raw materials, the new people are basically the result of taking organics and synthetics as raw materials and creating something new from them.

[Trazoi]

Personally while I expected the Crucible to turn out to be a trap or trick or something the main twist I expected was that the Catalyst would be revealed to be Shepard. Hence the dream where you burn with the child - you yourself have to be sacrificed to save the galaxy. No idea how it would work but that's what I thought they were building up to.

For the first half of the game, I thought the twist was that Cerebus planted the plans for the Crucible on Mars to get the Alliance to build it for them. They'd found the plans somewhere else, and were secretly building their own Catalyst to control the Reapers for humanity instead of whatever the original function was. Then Thessia happened and the whole plot started to crumble. I was still expecting a showdown on the Crucible.

I've also read a rumour that originally the twist was going to be that the Reaper's purpose was to forestall some galactic calamity that would otherwise destroy everything that for some reason needed sentient biomass to fuel it. It needs some explaining but it sounds like it could have worked - the Paragon ending would be to destroy the Reapers and risk everything eventually falling apart in a few millennia, the Renegade one would be to sacrifice some of the population of the galaxy to the Collector base to keep the galaxy around for another spin. (I'd recommend sacrificing the hanar. )

[Aotrs Commander]

This blog post (All That Matters Is The Ending, Part 2: Mass Effect 3) sums everything up in detail (found via Sluggy Freelance). What gets me is that ME3 was actually pretty close to providing a powerful Hollywood three-act. But you can't throw something like a starchild-outta-nowhere right while the tension is still high and then provide no proper resolution like that.

Having read back and seen (and followed) that link, it raises some very good points.

I am officially assuming that the Indoctrination Theory happened.

(NEXT time, when the DLC comes out, I might pick the "destroy" option...)



Nice of Bioware not to give you a save even close to the ending, wasn't it, by the by?

Also, I think the ME3 ending is going to hurt the upcoming C&C game released by the new 'Bioware in name only' studio.

Probably not as much as C&C4 did...

But, of course, as soon as you realise that it's "Bioware in name only" you should be suspicious anyway...

Me too. Or at least the Crucible to be the final level, with hints being dropped about what it actually does getting stronger all the way up until Shepard steps foot into it. It made sense the moment it was introduced - the third Big Space Station to run around in for an epic showdown.

The Citadel again was so dumb in so many ways. I assume everyone has beaten to death about how making the Citadel the boss of the Reapers completely breaks the entire plot of Mass Effect 1?

You know, until I read that aforementioned article, it hadn't even occurred to me how stupid that was.

The ME3 ending is, like, the FATAL of endings; every time you look at it, you see something new; underneath the outer stupid, there is more and more stupid, layer on layer of inept idiocy...

The Reapers don't decide to just leave us alone.

They're running in terror, because the whole galaxy is now partially Commander Shepard.

You know, Shepard-turns-Madara-Uchiha/The-Master might even have been worth it.

...

Maybe that's what happened, and Joker smiles and the end because it's really Shepard, and EDI's Shepard, and everyone is Shepard and Shepard is now everyone in the galaxy...

Creepy.

EDI can survive destroy ending it is possibly a bug though but it happened on my playthrough, probably due to her being on my squad during the last mission.

Still not best pleased about having to cold-bloodedly murder an entire race of allies, especially after all that hassle - and Legion's sacrifice - getting them to stop fighting and join us...



New theory, based on Indoctrination Theory: if we take the post-game return to Normandy at face value, perhaps it's that Shepard has finally cracked under the enormous stress at the eleventh hour, and she just keeps having nightmarish hallucinations every time she tries to launch the attack on Cerberus Headquarters, and can't bring herself to do it...



I think I'm going to go and see what sort of fanfic has been written around the ending, because even with the horrendous signal-to-noise ratio, there are bound to be better endings...

(If I find some really hilarious parody ones, I'll bring some links...)

[Derthric]

From now on everything you ever see that bashes Bioware/ME3/EA will make you disproportionately happy. Welcome to the club.

You will also engage in some schadenfreude wheneversomeone comes out and says how depressing/terrible/horrible/strangely emasculating the ending was. Knowing you are not alone is a very weird balm to sooth that ending.

The Reapers don't decide to just leave us alone.

They're running in terror, because the whole galaxy is now partially Commander Shepard.

Maybe this makes Synthesis less of a horribly twisted body horror ending with poor philosophical grounding.



Thinks about


Nope still entirely composed of herp-de-derp.

Yeah that's a pretty normal reaction to the ending. And that is not taking into account that after that you youtube the rest of the endings and they are colorful, that is a joke, but the same.

Here you go I wish the music at the end was like this an not that piano.

EDI can survive destroy ending it is possibly a bug though but it happened on my playthrough, probably due to her being on my squad during the last mission.

Not a bug. Patrick Weekes has been quoted as saying she makes it. The reason? Just cuz they said so.

Also it is maybe since English is not my native language but for me Synthetic means something (or someone) made by combining two "things" into one, normally implying that it is not a natural combination. So Synthesis turns everyone in synthetics, that in the catalyst own words are the pinnacle of evolution. Of course the cycles started in order to prevent the synthetics to wipe all organic life from the galaxy so it is just completely logical that they will end when all organic life is wiped from the galaxy, turned into synthetic life.

Edit: So basically as I understand things either you are synthetic or you are not, being half "synthetic" and half "organic" is synthetic.

A better word would be Metamorphosis. Its somehow part of a final evolution of life, because evolution has a goal*. And is presented as the growth of life from its present binary form, organic synthetic, into a new form with no distinction between the two.

I often wonder how a sentient on some world in their classical age reacts to Synthesis occuring. I can see it as someone marching off through their version of Athens or something ready to debate if stars are the eyes of the Gods or holes in the Celestial realm. And then BAM green light. Now you have just be fundamentally altered, darn those gods are finicky.

*It does not. Someone at Bioware went to the Brannon Braga school of poor scriptwriting.

The ME3 ending is, like, the FATAL of endings; every time you look at it, you see something new; underneath the outer stupid, there is more and more stupid, layer on layer of inept idiocy...

Can I use this in my signature?

[Opperhapsen]

Escapist is my go-to, even post-Extra-Creditz-Gate. They seem to have been pretty even-handed with this story as well.

Eh, maybe the escapist itself has been decent, but several of their staff have been complete ***** about ME3.

"Moviebob" was out in full force insulting people on twitter, and Jim Sterling claimed everyone who didn't like ME3 was a homophobe.

[MCerberus]

I often wonder how a sentient on some world in their classical age reacts to Synthesis occuring. I can see it as someone marching off through their version of Athens or something ready to debate if stars are the eyes of the Gods or holes in the Celestial realm. And then BAM green light. Now you have just be fundamentally altered, darn those gods are finicky.

*It does not. Someone at Bioware went to the Brennon Braga school of poor scriptwriting.

I think enlightenment era would be funny, if we're going on cultural analogs. You know, science if finally getting around to figuring out how stuff works AND BAM.

[Luzahn]

Having read back and seen (and followed) that link, it raises some very good points.

Nice of Bioware not to give you a save even close to the ending, wasn't it, by the by?

I made sure to save upon getting into the citadel during the ending. Or do you mean how the last playable save is pre-Cerberus base?

Also, the Geth owed us after they didn't bother to take care of the Heretics.
And joining the Reapers en-masse in 3. Filthy Legion-crucifying traitors.


I'm still holding out hope that the Destruction-pulse just disables their reaper code and brings them back to the lovable old hive-minded Geth.

[Aotrs Commander]

Can I use this in my signature?

By all means!

[GloatingSwine]

Though I REALLY don't get what Joker was smiling for

He has a hot robot girlfriend and a brand new USB penis?

[Erik Vale]

I recently finished Mass Effect 3 and I must say, I think I have an unusual complaint:

Hey! Directions nextg time!

The game doesn't tell you which turn is for which ending, and once you walk so far you can turn around.
And I was stuck with Destroy.....
Good thing I plan on replaying with that shep.

[Tome]

I recently finished Mass Effect 3 and I must say, I think I have an unusual complaint:

Hey! Directions nextg time!

The game doesn't tell you which turn is for which ending, and once you walk so far you can turn around.
And I was stuck with Destroy.....
Good thing I plan on replaying with that shep.

Don't worry, you didn't actually miss anything. The only thing that changes is the colour of the explosion.