The Gamer

[Spojaz]

"The gamer DLC: Love and War" Ha ha ha! This chapter is the best this comic has ever been. The send up of rogue likes "so that's what that feels like" is my favorite part.

[Yuki Akuma]

This chapter's translation is much less 'the translator doesn't speak a word of English and is just using Google Translate'. Good.

[Flickerdart]

If there is DLC...are there mods?

[danelsan]

Oh, lord. Damn it, just about anyone reading this comic already knows what a DLC is! Stop ruining your pacing explaining unnecessary things!

Also, hey main-character-that-talks-so-much-about-your-high-INT, if you wanna get through the walls, how about you remember that Earth Elemental of yours, huh? And oh, what, a few seconds of battle and you already forgot about the break the walls idea? This dude is so wishy-washy it gets annoying.

[Flickerdart]

Obviously, the dungeon is enchanted to prevent sequence-breaking.

[Olinser]

Interesting thought with the dungeon. I would like to point out to everybody the inherent danger of the dungeon - namely, that he HAS NO WAY to level up if he is confronted with an enemy that he can't beat.

I'm sure we've all come across that one boss that we just couldn't beat, and had to go level up, change equipment/skills/party members, or just do it 50x times until we finally executed the sequence perfectly.

However, since he is effectively playing on Hardcore (death = permanent), he can't save scum pass a boss. He can't go level up his skills because he can't escape the dungeon.

Frankly if I were him I'd never set foot in a dungeon again after clearing this single level.

[Flickerdart]

However, since he is effectively playing on Hardcore (death = permanent), he can't save scum pass a boss. He can't go level up his skills because he can't escape the dungeon.

Is he, though? He hasn't tried to save the game yet.

[Lethologica]

Also, there's a possibility that he can tunnel around an unbeatable mob. (That said, it wouldn't surprise me if some game contrivance stopped him--an Invisible Wall or similar.)

[Ibrinar]

I think he thinks that he can use his escape skill to leave in the worst case despite the can't leave before clearing the floor message.
Anyway he is a acting bit cocky here. No summon out and I don't think he has used his full assortment of buffs, he doesn't seem to expect running into anything on his strength level. Probably right based on the enemies being low level but you take pre cautions in case something unexpected happens not for when everything goes as expected.

[Olinser]

Also, there's a possibility that he can tunnel around an unbeatable mob. (That said, it wouldn't surprise me if some game contrivance stopped him--an Invisible Wall or similar.)

Whether such a method actually gains him anything has yet to be seen.

There are quite a few games where you cannot complete or progress past a level without killing EVERYTHING on it.

And of course there is the classic 'boss death = gate unlock', where presumably the unbeatable mob would be the boss, who also unlocks the gate/stairs to the next level. And since he can't leave without finishing the level, that puts him squarely back in the 'totally screwed' category.

Although since we have seen him distance communicate with Lolikeano before, logically he COULD just scream for help like a little girl with a skinned knee. But that wouldn't make a good story.

[Olinser]

I think he thinks that he can use his escape skill to leave in the worst case despite the can't leave before clearing the floor message.
Anyway he is a acting bit cocky here. No summon out and I don't think he has used his full assortment of buffs, he doesn't seem to expect running into anything on his strength level. Probably right based on the enemies being low level but you take pre cautions in case something unexpected happens not for when everything goes as expected.

Which is quite dumb, given his knowledge of games.

A great example is the original Final Fantasy I. The single deadliest monster in the entire game wasn't the final boss, Chaos. It wasn't the pseudosecret side boss, Warmech. It wasn't even one of the lesser bosses. It was the normal encounter Sorcerer (the complete bane of single character runs). They only had about 100 HP (when most monsters on the same levels were rocking 300+) and could be 1 shot by any melee focused character with laughable ease. They had two simple abilities - an AOE paralyze, and an instant kill, UNBLOCKABLE melee attack, and they could show up in packs of 7 in the final dungeon.

It was 100% possible, likely even, for a party that could defeat Chaos to be killed by a group of 7 Sorcerers before they could even attack. If you get Surprise Attacked by a group of Sorcerers you may as well just hit the Reset button because you had an incredibly small chance of surviving. And this is a mob that first showed up at the halfway point in the game!

He deserves to learn a hard lesson in always cautiously approaching any new enemy, even if you think you can 1 shot them with ease.

[Flickerdart]

He deserves to learn a hard lesson in always cautiously approaching any new enemy, even if you think you can 1 shot them with ease.

Yeah, but on the other had that would be super boring to read about.

[Olinser]

Yeah, but on the other had that would be super boring to read about.

Nah the protagonist receiving an asskicking is always good story.

[Flickerdart]

Nah the protagonist receiving an asskicking is always good story.

No, I mean the whole "inch down every corridor one step at a time, poking every surface with an 11 foot pole" strategy you recommend Jee Han take. We already have enough panels that are just him going "Buff X! Buff Y! Buff Z!" and not enough panels of plot happening.

[Dragoa]

New Chapter!

More dungeon crawling, and d'aww :3

[Ibrinar]

I wonder what the explanation will be for there to be a damn traditional dungeon he just finds and it being labeled as dlc.

[Dragoa]

I wonder what the explanation will be for there to be a damn traditional dungeon he just finds and it being labeled as dlc.

It wasn't part of initial release, so by lieu of it being added after the fact, it's DLC Probably also explains the hiatus, had to download and install all these updates.

[Olinser]

I wonder what the explanation will be for there to be a damn traditional dungeon he just finds and it being labeled as dlc.

It also may have been created by somebody/something other than his Gamer ability, hence its tagging as 'DLC' due to not being part of the original ability.

[Flickerdart]

I suspect it's DLC because it's a new type of dungeon, completely unlike the Illusion Barrier dungeons we've encountered thus far.

[Dragoa]

New Chapter!

More dungeon crawling goodness. I'm liking this nice little interlude so far, although I think the week-week pacing is going to kill it. It feels like it will read fine in a finished group, but with the large delays between chapters it sort of feels glacial.

[danelsan]

Gnome is adorable in this one. Makes me wish that if she has some sort of evolution trigger to each level 100, it doesn't make her look grown up (and specially I hope she is not made into some weird romantic interest. Between knowing her when she was kid-like and Jee-Han having control over her, it would be super creepy).

I seem to recall that, levels aside, she was a basic Elemental or something like that. Maybe she will become an Advanced Elemental and reset to level 1 or something?

[Olinser]

Gnome is adorable in this one. Makes me wish that if she has some sort of evolution trigger to each level 100, it doesn't make her look grown up (and specially I hope she is not made into some weird romantic interest. Between knowing her when she was kid-like and Jee-Han having control over her, it would be super creepy).

I seem to recall that, levels aside, she was a basic Elemental or something like that. Maybe she will become an Advanced Elemental and reset to level 1 or something?

Most games that have Evolution of summons/monsters/party members have specific triggers or items that have to be fulfilled, and then they have basically four types - full reset, carryover, multiplicative leveling, or single max level - all dependent upon what level the Evolved subject is (and of course they may learn certain abilities only at specific levels in certain evolutions).

Full reset is simple - when it evolves, regardless of previous level, it resets to the same base stats upon evolution. Whether it was level 1 or level 100 when it achieved its evolution condition, it resets to base stats for the new evolution and can now level up/evolve again.

Carryover can be a little more complicated - when a creature evolves, it resets to level 1, but carries over stats and abilities from its previous evolution level (this may be a full carryover or it may be a percentage). For instance, say that Gnome's current stats are 100 across the board, and that her evolution has base stats of 20 across the board at level 1. If she were to evolve at level 1, she'd still be weak, BUT she carries over all stats from her previous levels, so now her second evolution starts at 120. This may be only a percentage of stats carryover, i.e. she only gets half of her previous stats carried over (so on evolution she'd reset to 70 across the board). It is completely possible that upon evolving the initial creature is weaker than the lower evolution max level, but higher evolutions are almost always better after leveling them up as well.

Single max level is the Pokemon variety. Essentially, every creature has a max total level they can evolve to. The stat bonuses per level are dependent upon its evolution level, while attacks and moves can be learned only by specific evolution levels - i.e. if Gnome followed the Pokemon theory, she's essentially at max level now, and if she evolves she still won't be able to get past 99.

The final one is probably the most complicated and the least obvious benefit - multiplicative leveling. Essentially, each level the creature's stats increase by a percentage of its previous stats (as evolutions increase the percentage may increase). This method essentially means that it is hugely beneficial to level every evolution up to max before evolving, but the gains from doing so are not really obvious without comparing a max level creature to a non-max level creature, and the gains tend to be EXTREMELY large towards the end of an evolution pathway. Just a few early levels can lead to radically different final power levels.

So if a creature starts at level 1 with 20's across the board and its initial evolution gives it a 1% increase per level, at level 100 its stats will be 54.09 at level 100. If you only level it up to 90 its stats will be 48.97. Not a big difference so far, right?

But say the next evolution levels are a 2% increase per level, and the third evolution levels are 3% per level.

Leveling just to 90 at first and second level before finishing it at max level 100 on the third evolution makes it go from 49.97 to 291.05 and finishing at 5593.60 stats at max third evolution. Pretty respectable stats, right? You only missed 20 levels and you got all of the 3% stat increases from the max evolution.

But looking at a max level 100 creature at every level means that after the first 100 levels you had stats of 54.09, after the second hundred you had 391.90, and after the final 100 you have stats of 7531.94.

Wow, stats go from 5593 to 7531 based on just 20 missed levels out of 300 in early evolutions??? Crap, better restart the game and farm it up to max.



So to recap, Jee Han really needs to be careful about evolution triggers if he hasn't maxed summon levels before that.

[Dragoa]

New Chapter!

Bit of a melodramatic letdown, but I guess the 'let's see Jee Han's new powers' phase is over, and rest was just sort of...eh?

[Lethologica]

Spoiler: New Comic

Show

*reaches League of Legends page*
*buries face in hands*

[Dragoa]

This chapter felt really out of place to me. I kind of get why it's there, but just seems so awkwardly shoehorned in. Even the dialog feels a bit stilted(might just be bad translation, but even in the high level it doesn't make a whole lot of sense)

[Lethologica]

The writer has a persistent tendency to over-narrate. I didn't find this chapter particular different from others in that regard.

[ThirdEmperor]

I'm surprised people are only bringing these things up now. Over narration, stilted dialogue and so forth, these are constant problems with the over all work.
Having given the chapter a look, I think it's one of the better ones, for actually taking time and developing characters - is this chapter really any less impactful than another one full of Han grinding or fighting yet more scrub monsters that can't actually harm him?

[Lethologica]

I'm surprised people are only bringing these things up now. Over narration, stilted dialogue and so forth, these are constant problems with the over all work.

If you look back through the thread, those complaints come up a lot. xD

[ThirdEmperor]

Fair, but I meant more that this chapter is being treated as somehow worse in those regards?

[Dragoa]

Fair, but I meant more that this chapter is being treated as somehow worse in those regards?

To me, it kind of is. This chapter feels like it's wrapping up the last plot arc, after they introduce the new plot hook(being the labyrinth). This chapter here feels like it would be better suited as the one to have before the break, showing the resolution of the last arc, before leading into something new. Instead, it's kind of shoved in the middle of introducing the next arc, which feels super out of place to me. Even if they had done this at the start of this new arc, it would have been better placed.