[DSP/PF] Magic of Incarna Playtest Open

[Ssalarn]

I'm curious, what is an Akashic?

Akasha is the energy source powering your veils and Essence :)
An Akashic mystery is a mystery relating to Akasha.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akasha

[PsyBomb]

So, the quickie writeup, from my notes.

Characters:

All three were human. We debated Azurins, but since you didn't put out "official" notes for them we decided against it.

Kali, N Daevic 6 (Wrath). 2+2 veils, 6+3 essence, 2 binds, 2 capacity
Stat notes: 14 Dex, 15 Con, 12 Cha, 20 Str (19 w/ +2 item). Int/Wis dumped
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Power Attack, Chakra Power (2ess), Extra Essence
Veils shaped: Bloody Shroud (2ess), Breastplate of Bloody Conflict, Armbands of the Irked Elephant, Armory of the Conquerer (bound, 2ess). Passion at 2ess.
-Played like your normal melee masher. Noted that the level 7 feat would have been Vital Strike, with Improved at 11. Rarely made full attacks, instead using Charge/Bull Rush/Overrun in combat. Under Power Attack we were looking at 3d6+16 damage (26.5 avg) with a +10 attack modifier... not counting if she got tagged by a Piercing or Slashing attack and started bleeding. Didn't bother binding a second Veil (is assumed that item binding would lead to using the Feet bind), since Passion Veil restrictions meant that he didn't have one in that slot.

Jafar, LN Vizier 6 (Crafter). 4 veils, 6+2 essence, 3 binds, 3 capacity
Stat Notes: High Dex and Int. 14 Con. Dumped rest.
Feats: Improved Initiative, Extra Essence, Craft Wondrous Item, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot.
Veils Shaped: Riven Darts (Bound, 3ess), Stare of the Ghaele (bound), Cowards Boots (bound, 1ess), Ring of the Abjurer (1ess). 3 essence in a Staff of Minor Arcana (CL9)
-Ran buff/debuff mode with a side of blaster. Noted that at level 7 would take Expanded Capacity in half a heartbeat, since Riven Darts at 4 gets threatening. *NOTE* Asks specifically for a note somewhere allowing Viziers to recharge Staves somehow. Could go into the item notes. Also found it odd that this class had only two options as opposed to three from the other two.

Bud, NG Guru 6 (Vayist). 3 veils, 6+2 essence, 2 binds, 3 capacity
Stat notes: 10 Int, 15 Con, pumped Dex and Wis. 7 Str and 8 Cha.
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Extra Essence, Dervish Dance, Treewalker
Veils Shaped: Courtesan's Cloak (2ess), Gloves of the Master Thief (3ess, bound), Coward's Boots (3ess, bound). Gentle Touch empty unless in active use, in which case all 3 from Gloves go into it.
-Was doing a highly effective Rogue impression. Lower max damage out was made up for by not needing to flank. Led off combat by immediately burning two Essence out of the Cloak to Aether Tie the two furthest enemies from the group. Multiaxis threats more or less forced his essence to immediately recover FAST.

4th was a Vitalist, build/stats unimportant. Basically only existed to keep the rest of us alive, and didn't have all THAT much of a job until the last couple of fights.

Notes from this section: Extra Essence is an auto-include in every Akashic build, period. So was Expanded Capacity at least once, until we realized as a group that it required level 7. Good thing, too, 4-essence abilities at 6 were very overpowered. Path of the Crafter vizier felt Artificer-ish, and Jafar's player loved the ability to swap enchantments onto appropriate items. Later plan is to keep some +1 daggers around on the melee characters, using them to steal enchantments and transfer more specific setups to the primary weapon used. Guru would probably have been better as a TWF Sineater, but wanted to do a Dervish Dancer.

Brief session notes:

The theme was very Aladdin-ish. I forget what he originally called the town, we all started calling it Agrabah. In essence (ba-dum-tish), we were rescuing Aladdin and ensuring he achieved his destiny, though with less Genie and more monsters. The irony of a character named Jafar working to rescue an Aladdin-archetype was not lost on ANYONE.

1) DM likes starting off the group against hordes of weak enemies in order to give players the chance to show off and get used to character options. Goblins with the occasional Blue, in this case. Daevic used Overruns to awesome effect, more or less doing Iaijutsu-style slash-throughs. When she got mired down, Vizier would use his Hand Bond ability to make the iteritives dangerous and let her clear the area. Otherwise, masses of Riven Darts took 1-2 out a turn. The Guru fairly reliably dealt with one a turn. Was fun.

2) In the town, the Guru came into his own. Everyone had SOME social capability (we know this DM), but the combination of Treewalker, good skill points, and Bud's veils let him pull of some crazy infiltration to free the prisoner while the others created a distraction. It is worth noting that the DM comes from a long line of Exalted gaming and allows the creative-edit system, Mr. Guru "found" a couple of reasonably-placed date palms around the manor. Gentle Touch was a nice addition, as he was NG and didn't want to kill unnecessarily.

---halfway point, the DM realized that his challenges weren't quite up to snuff and tuned it up a bit---

3) Waiting in ambush at the thieve's den was a Shaitan, melded into stone and waiting for us to drop our gear. THAT was a rough fight, and the Vitalist suddenly wasn't bored anymore. He led off with Rock to Mud and Quickened Glitterdust in the surprise round, blinding the thief and Guru and miring down the others. The PCs got out of the area before he could Mud to Rock us, thankfully, but Kali the Daevic almost went down from focused attacks before we got the situation stabilized. Irony was that she almost bled out before the Vitalist realized it. Fight ended with her unconscious but stable, the thief trapped in Rock, and Bud burning through Essence lightning-quick in order to generate Mirror Images and hold off the enemy until a combination of Gentle Touch (1d6+3d4+3, 14avg) and Riven Darts (3d4+9, 16.5avg though usually only 11-ish due to at least one missing) laid him low.

4) It should say something about that fight that, after dumping the rest of his PP into the party and resting the night, the Vitalist still had to use some power to top us off in the morning. It was off to the palace via a secret entrance the Thief knew about in order to take down the Sorcerer (level 8) and his guards (a pair of Fighter 6 with Glaives). We were expecting AoE assaults and came in scattered. The Empowered Scorching Rays kept the Vitalist busy again, though the guards went down fairly fast. Once they did, the caster soon followed since the party had two VERY strong melee-types, and the Guru did his Veil Sundering stuff and popped a couple of good rolls to end Mage Armor and Shield.

Ending note: This turned out to be more "fun times" than active system-breaking, since we couldn't find any truly major exploits. I do stand corrected on the Vital Strike v Pounce thing, Kali's player showed me the math on what it would be capable of later on when combined with Armory and the various Akashic feats to boost it (I think she showed 4d6+32, avg 46, on a nonmagical greatsword with minimal op and only using one Veil at level 12). Vizier player only realized after we got started that he could use his level instead of BAB on the Teamwork feats, and notes that at level 10 the Seer build explodes in effectiveness once sharing Coordinated Charge. We all loved the system and found it very well balanced, in the T3 range mostly.

If you have any questions or want more detail about anything, just ask.

[Ssalarn]

Psybomb,
That is fantastic! Thank you so much for the playtest notes, it sounds like that's a game I would have loved to be a part of!

I'm excited that someone took Treewalker and got good use out of it, I was a little worried that it might be to situational for someone to consider worthwhile.

[PsyBomb]

Actually, the 15 Con requirement on Treewalker is HARSH. Most of the characters who are interested in it won't have that kind of toughness (the points came out of his Wisdom score for Bud).

EDIT: Having chatted again with the player: 15 of a stat is usually only used in build-defining feats (TWF is a notable example), and Treewalker, while neat, is not anywhere near this metric.

[Ssalarn]

Actually, the 15 Con requirement on Treewalker is HARSH. Most of the characters who are interested in it won't have that kind of toughness (the points came out of his Wisdom score for Bud).

EDIT: Having chatted again with the player: 15 of a stat is usually only used in build-defining feats (TWF is a notable example), and Treewalker, while neat, is not anywhere near this metric.

Thanks for the heads up. I think that one actually slipped by me, most of the Con feats are supposed to be Con X or Veilweaver level Y.

[PsyBomb]

Random note request from my group: they were VERY excited about the Akashic Warrior, and also are looking for a Monk archetype for the system. In both cases, you have the opportunity to bring them up a tier into a much more playable range.

Just for an example, I did a thought exercise on a 3-feat investment on a normal Monk. Shape Soulmeld (force strike Knuckles), Extra Essence, and Access Low Chakra. Together, they add +6 damage per attack (force damage, notably) and +2 AC. This is notable enough that it will pop up on an upcoming thought exercise set I'm writing up, about non-Akashic classes splashing the capabilities.

[Ssalarn]

Random note request from my group: they were VERY excited about the Akashic Warrior, and also are looking for a Monk archetype for the system. In both cases, you have the opportunity to bring them up a tier into a much more playable range.

Just for an example, I did a thought exercise on a 3-feat investment on a normal Monk. Shape Soulmeld (force strike Knuckles), Extra Essence, and Access Low Chakra. Together, they add +6 damage per attack (force damage, notably) and +2 AC. This is notable enough that it will pop up on an upcoming thought exercise set I'm writing up, about non-Akashic classes splashing the capabilities.

I'm hoping to get those archetypes out in the very near future, I know I'm a bit behind on the release. Life unfortunately, likes to mess up schedules something fierce.

[PsyBomb]

I'm hoping to get those archetypes out in the very near future, I know I'm a bit behind on the release. Life unfortunately, likes to mess up schedules something fierce.

I hear you on that. The thought exercise was done from a hospital bed

I'll work out some theory on splashes until then. Do you have any Akashic races or alternate racial traits planned? Even having an Azurin-equivalent will change things up a TON.

[Ssalarn]

I hear you on that. The thought exercise was done from a hospital bed

I'll work out some theory on splashes until then. Do you have any Akashic races or alternate racial traits planned? Even having an Azurin-equivalent will change things up a TON.

**EDIT** - Note added to the Gamla size entry to verify that they have increased reach. Formula for Spit DC adjusted

Still discussing what all will be in the final product, but:

Gamla
The Gamla are a race of bipedal humanoids who appear to be a cross between a half-giant and a camel. These sturdy nomads travel in small communities throughout the deserts they call home, always seeking new sources of water and shelter.
Physical Description: Gamla tower over 8 feet tall, with long, gangly arms and legs and thick torsos. Their backs appear somewhat lumpy and misshapen due to the fatty stores of moisture and nutrients they carry in the humps on their backs
Society: Gamla are nomadic herdsman and traders, always seeking the next horizon. They typically travel in groups consisting of 4 to 5 extended families, each with their own specialty they bring to the tribe. Oftentimes it is the responsibility of younger male Gamla to leave the tribe and seek out a mate to bring a fresh influx of blood and skills into the community.
Relations: Gamla are a calm and good-natured people and get along well with most other races, though the frantic pace of many human settlements is sometimes unsettling to the Gamla, who tend to move at the pace nature dictates.
Alignment and Religion: Gamla tend towards neutral alignments, as their slower-paced upbringing often teaches them to approach everything with a calm and measured mindset.
Adventurers: Many young Gamla who leave their tribes in search of a mate or skillset stumble upon the adventuring life almost by accident. Their large size makes them favored caravan guards, both for their ability to see above crowds and for the intimidation factor provided by their bulk. Others naturally gravitate towards established adventuring groups since the close-knit nature and generally open minds of such people tend to make the gamla feel at home.

Gamla Racial Traits
+2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, -2 Dexterity: Gamla are tough and hardy, with calm and focused natures, but their large and ungainly bodies are somewhat slow and clumsy.
Large: Gamla are Large and take a -1 size penalty to AC, take a -4 size penalty on stealth checks, and gain a +1 size bonus on combat maneuver checks and and to combat maneuver defense. In addition, a gamla's large size give them a reach 5 feet greater than a medium creature.
Speed: Gamla have a base land speed of 30 feet.
Undersized Weapons: The Gamla have crude ungulate hands which make it difficult for them to wield properly sized weapons. As such, Gamla’s ability to wield manufactured weapons is determined as though the Gamla were one size category smaller than they actually are.
Desert Strider: A Gamla moves through nonmagical difficult terrain in desert environments at normal speed.
Endurance: Gamla's ability to store fatty, moisture rich deposits in their bodies allows them to sustain themselves through harsh and extended conditions. Gamla gain Endurance as a bonus feat.
Bonus Essence: Gamla have a natural connection to the unique power of Incarna and start play with 1 bonus Essence point in their pool.
Spit(Ex): Once per hour a Gamla can regurgitate some of the contents of its stomache, spitting the disgusting phlegm that results at a single enemy within 10 feet as a swift action. The target must succeed at a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 level + Con modifier) or be sickened for 1d4 rounds. The Gamla can invest Essence into this ability as though it were a Veil; for each point of Essence invested, the save DC of the spit attack increases by 1 and the duration is extended by 1 round.
Languages: Gamla begin play speaking Common and Sylvan. Gamla with high Intelligence scores can choose from the following: Elven, Giant, Gnome, and Terran.

[danzibr]

Hmm. Now that's an interesting race. Large for no LA, but... that's almost the only perk. Well, some flavorful stuff, and bonus essence. The idea of playing as a camel-person is cool.

[Ssalarn]

Hmm. Now that's an interesting race. Large for no LA, but... that's almost the only perk. Well, some flavorful stuff, and bonus essence. The idea of playing as a camel-person is cool.

He also has natural reach as a result of being Large (which I have realized isn't explicitly spelled out in the entry and probably needs to be) which is why he doesn't get much else that isn't highly situational. The ability to threaten in a 10 ft. radius right out of the gate is powerful, sooo....

It's mostly supposed to be fun and flavorful without being so good that a player would feel like if they want to run an Akashic/Incarna character they pretty much have to choose one of the associated races. Our iconic Vizier is actually a half-elf, and odds are pretty good that even if the Gamla, Sobek-khaliq, and Suqur-kha all end up in the final product, we're going to be very careful to ensure that they are basically exactly as viable an option for a given class as a human. The Sobek-khaliq are crocodilian humanoids with the ability to use Essence to camouflage themselves or enhance their racial bite attack, and the Suqur-kha are a race of falcon people with a racial Glide ability that can be enhanced and improved with Essence

I'm glad you thought the camel person was cool. When I first approached Andreas about doing new races for the product, I pitched the Gamla because I figured "If I can sell a camel man with Essence-infused spit, then the other races should be slam dunks".

[PsyBomb]

The Gamla seems custom-made for Monk or Sineater, since the reduced damage die on manufactured weapons wouldn't apply. Add the Reach for fun times, as long as you're not trying to be sneaky. Endurance really isn't much to write home about and the Spit will be only moderately useful for the first 2-3 levels.

Doesn't matter, though, since Con is a good stat for anyone, Reach is great, and the point of Essence can make the difference for anything even tangentially related to Akashics (think of it as a floating +2 to a skill). It's good in its own situations, and will be used. Maybe not QUITE as often as Human, even where the racials are relevant, but it will be used.

[Ssalarn]

The Gamla seems custom-made for Monk or Sineater, since the reduced damage die on manufactured weapons wouldn't apply. Add the Reach for fun times, as long as you're not trying to be sneaky. Endurance really isn't much to write home about and the Spit will be only moderately useful for the first 2-3 levels.

Doesn't matter, though, since Con is a good stat for anyone, Reach is great, and the point of Essence can make the difference for anything even tangentially related to Akashics (think of it as a floating +2 to a skill). It's good in its own situations, and will be used. Maybe not QUITE as often as Human, even where the racials are relevant, but it will be used.

If we bumped the Spit DC to (10 + 1/2 level + CON), as well as the boost for investing Essence, do you think it would stay viable longer?

I'm okay with it dropping off a little (I can only imagine the look of utter disgust on a GM's face if the party manages to claim victory by the narrow margin created when the Guru spat in an archdevil's eye), but I'd like it to be a neat enough trick that it actually sees use through the first 12 levels of play, with maybe a situational use now and then past that point.


**EDIT**

Since I have been really delayed in getting you all new stuff to play with, you can also take a look at the second akashic race, the Sobek-khaliq. I want to reiterate that at this point I'm not 100% positive if they'll make it into the final document, but if you guys like them and give me some good feedback, it'll raise the chances of that happening.

Sobek-Khaliq
The sobek-khaliq are a race of reptilian humanoids who prefer to live near areas of running water. They are proud and fierce creatures, as at home in the rivers of their native lands as they are fighting in the plains or dunes. The sobek-haliq are a young race, and nearly all of them are born with some facility for manipulating the mysterious force known as akasha.
Physical Description: Sobek-khaliq are stocky, with ridged and mottled skin and short, almost stumpy, limbs. Sobek-khaliq range in coloration from sandy tan to murky green or gray, with their particular coloration usually matching the habitat they were born in. The average Sobek-khaliq stands just over 5 feet tall, though their powerful tails are nearly as long again as their body.
Society: Much of a male sobek-khaliq’s life is spent in engaging in struggles for dominance, both social and physical . The females are often just as fierce as the male, though typically they are more inclined to shame a rival through a clever social manipulation than a show of brute force.
Despite their highly competitive natures, the sobek are a highly social bunch, often living in large closely-knit communities. Sobek-khaliq are fiercely protective of their young until they reach the age of maturity, at which point the are regarded as rivals just as dangerous as any other member of the race
Relations: The sobek are a young race that has only recently devloped relationships with the outside world. They find that they have much in common with proud and war-like races like orcs, though their strictly structured hierarchy is much more disciplined than those chaotic creatures. The sobek also appreciate trade with dwarven tribes, as the reliable and strong nature of that race appeals to them. Humans and elves they view as flighty and inconsistent; gnomes and halflings are viewed with similar disdain, often compounded by deep-seated instincts that tell the sobek that such small, soft creatures are surely prey.
Alignment and Religion: The sobek-khaliq tend towards lawful alignments, always following the strict hierarchy established by their complex and instinctive dominance rituals. A sobek who would seek to overrule another must prove his superiority. The sobek-khaliq have no concept of religion, except in a vague naturalistic philosophy they refer to as the river of existence. This philosophy believes that all energy flows through the various planes and levels of existence and the sobeks are travelers riding its current. When a sobek passes on, they believe that their spirit merely flows on to a new or greater tributary.
Adventurers: The sobek-khaliq are incredibly fierce warriors and rarely have trouble finding employment as mercenaries. Young sobek who disagree with the elders of their communities but lack the strength to supplant them will often leave to acquire experience and strength before returning to take their rightful place as leader. Others will seek to apprentice themselves to particularly skilled members of other races, hoping to learn the martial or social skills necessary to rise to a position of strength and leadership.

Sobek-Khaliq Racial Traits
+2 Strength, +2 Charisma, -2 Wisdom: Sobek-khaliq are strong with forceful personalities, but their predatory instincts often lead them to making rash decisions.
Medium: Sobek-khaliq are medium creatures and have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
Slow Land Speed: Sobek-khaliq are poorly built for moving long distances across the ground and have a base speed of 20 feet.
Water Adaptation: Sobek-khaliq are natural swimmers, with strong tails that help propel them through the water, granting them a swim speed of 30 feet. In addition, a sobek-khaliq can hold their breath for a number of rounds equal to 4 times their Constitution modifier before they risk drowning
Natural Camouflage: A sobek-khaliq chooses one terrain type from the following list: Desert, Jungle, Plains, Swamp, Water. Whenever the sobek is in this environment he gains a +2 bonus to Stealth checks. A sobek-khaliq can invest Essence into this ability the same way they would invest it into a Veil or feat making it even more effective; they gain an additional +2 to Stealth checks for each point of Essence invested into this ability.
Bite: The Sobek-khaliq gain a bite attack dealing 1d6 damage plus his Strength modifier. This bite can be enhanced by investing Essence into it; for each point of Essence invested in their bite the sobek-khaliq gains a +1 enhancement bonus to attack and damage on their bite attacks.
Sweeping Tail: The sobek-khaliq’s powerful tail makes them difficult to sneak up on. Whenever a creature would move into a flanking position, the sobek-khaliq may make a tail slap attack against them as an attack of opportunity. This attack deals 1d6 points of damage plus half his Strength modifier, and if successful, the sobek-khaliq may attempt a free trip maneuver against the opponent.
Bonus Essence: sobek-khaliq have a natural connection to akashic energy and start play with 1 bonus Essence point in their pool.
Languages: Sobek-khaliq begin play speaking Common. Sobek with high Intelligence scores can choose from the following: Aquan, Draconic, Dwarven, Goblin, Gnoll and Orc

[PsyBomb]

Assume CON 16 start with (reasonable for the stats) and not putting level-up points into it, with a +2 item at level 10 and +4 at 15. Also assume non-Akashic class with limited feat investment (maybe one Shape Veil and Extra Essence):

Lvl1: DC 14=10+3+1
Lvl6: DC 18=10+3+3+2
Lvl12:DC 23=10+4+6+3
Lvl18:DC 27=10+5+9+3
Lvl20:DC 28=10+5+10+3

These are reasonable, if a bit low. Might work as a Hail Mary if you're desperate enough and they have some penalty to Fort. Also is EX, so will work in an antimagic field.

Now, same assumptions on a Guru, since he's the most likely to be that close. Expanded Capacity will never reasonably be applied to it, so it won't be assumed.

Lvl1: DC 14=10+3+1
Lvl6: DC 19=10+3+3+3
Lvl12:DC 25=10+4+6+5
Lvl18:DC 31=10+5+9+7
Lvl20:DC 32=10+5+10+7

Slightly but noticeably higher, goes into the mid-range of DCs. Not an auto-loss at any point, but it's reasonable to use proactively instead of just desperation if Sicken is viable (and minimum 8 rounds of a fairly evil debuff is a game-changer if a major threat fails a save).

Would bring it up to useful at all points, actually.

[Ssalarn]

Consider the Gamla's Spit formula to "officially" contain the (+1/2 level) piece in the DC formula then.

[PsyBomb]

I'll do this one line-by-line. For the Sobek-Khaliq:

Stats: The stat mix is really strange. I can't think of anything that takes both Str and Int, and the two penalty stats are both on saves. That by itself will disqual the race very frequently except in niche builds. In the Akashic system, they would most likely go to Daevic by default... but again the mix is odd.

Slow Speed is also harsh, but as evidenced by Dwarves can be worked around.

Might want to rename Amphibious, since they are not actually so. Swim 30 can get useful, and the breath-holding is cool at early levels if the campaign will use it.

Natural Camoflage: Another odd one. Racially, these guys are homanoid crocodiles... but can somehow be born with Desert or Plains camo. A bonus Essence ability is always nice, though again limited to niche campaigns.

Bite: Getting into the good ones, this is a second investment ability on one PC race (which is a first, even for Incarnum). Good damage, and on a Natural Attack Daevic it will be brutal.

Tail Sweep: Bonus AoO generator is always nice, and generating a free Trip attempt gets evil. Thing is... it follows the rules for a standard trip, which will allow them to make an AoO on YOU without a feat investment.

Essence: Always good to have.

Not sure I like these guys, other than the flavor. Although the thought of being able to play a croc is awesome, the stats and abilities are a mishmash. I'd personally prefer a more trim version, something like...

Stats: +2 Str, +2 Cha, -2 Dex. Sobek-Khaliq are physically strong and highly social, but their blocky bodies are often unsuited to more delicate manipulation
Speed: Land 20, Swim 30. Although clumsy on land, they are natural swimmers and their powerful tails can propel them at surprising speeds.
Natural Camoflage: The Sobek-Khaliq's naturally mottled and subdued coloring combines with a natural instinct for stalking to give them an edge while hunting. They receive a +1 on all Stealth checks in natural environments, plus one for each point of Essence invested in this ability
Bite, Tail Slap, and Essence unchanged. Almost asked you to drop the Tail Slap, but since you can't use that one proactively it's just an AoO generator unless you invest feats.

This makes them more of a "Natural Wrath/Dominion Daevic" (and Dominion fits with your flavor text about them wanting to lead the tribe), where the Gamla are much better Gurus. The Int bonus would have been nice for Viziers, but since that class does not use Str and DOES use Dex a lot more, this was less of a change. Holding breath was dropped, since it is mostly unneeded when combined with a swim speed up until after you start getting magic to support it. Camoflage was made much more general in use, so that TWF and Natural Weapon Rangers would look more into it (and a slight reflavoring made it seem much more likely to happen).

Still not entirely sold on them, but then again this is just me instead of my group, so I might be missing something obvious.

[Ssalarn]

Let me know what your group thinks. He hasn't seen as much table time as the Gamla, so I wouldn't mind knowing.

So far I've seen him as a 3rd level Magus, a 5th level Dominion Daevic, a very nasty 10th level Akashic Warrior, and a 12th level Trip master Ninja who messed some encounters up pretty fiercely. I did notice that almost everyone who plays one ends up grabbing at least one of the save-boosting Akasha feats, but I hadn't had many complaints.

[PsyBomb]

I definitely missed the Magus angle, and I normally don't think of an Int race going Fighter (is Int their Veilweaving stat?). Ninja I DEFINITELY didn't expect with a Dex penalty, although someone focused on Tripping would make sadistic use of the Tail Lash.

Two questions:

1) Do you mind if I cross-post the races to Minmax Boards? I know there are a couple of people there who do not frequent GiantITP, and some of them are fans of the system.

2) Since you mention the Akashic Warrior, mind posting the rough outline? My group's next skull session might involve me playing it, since I was the healer for the last one.

[Ssalarn]

I definitely do not have a problem with you sharing any of the playtest materials with people who might have missed out. I'll get the current draft of the Akashic Warrior up as soon as I'm at my computer (most of the posting I do during the day is from my phone and has some limitations in what I can easily access).

On the sobek-khaliq ninja: turns out that the kusari-gama isn't a finessable weapon. Weird right? The build focused on utilizing the kusari-gama's range and trips to lock enemies down and dish out damage while using non-traditional defenses like invisibility and mirror image to make up for his sub-par AC. Strength Ninja was like the ultimate glass cannon, and generally was less likely to take a hit than guys with double his AC.

The Akashic Warrior used the extra Int so he could qualify for maneuver feats and used Will of the Daeva to shore up his poor will save.

[PsyBomb]

I definitely do not have a problem with you sharing any of the playtest materials with people who might have missed out. I'll get the current draft of the Akashic Warrior up as soon as I'm at my computer (most of the posting I do during the day is from my phone and has some limitations in what I can easily access).

On the sobek-khaliq ninja: turns out that the kusari-gama isn't a finessable weapon. Weird right? The build focused on utilizing the kusari-gama's range and trips to lock enemies down and dish out damage while using non-traditional defenses like invisibility and mirror image to make up for his sub-par AC. Strength Ninja was like the ultimate glass cannon, and generally was less likely to take a hit than guys with double his AC.

The Akashic Warrior used the extra Int so he could qualify for maneuver feats and used Will of the Daeva to shore up his poor will save.

That's... actually pretty cool. I rarely think about Dex classes going Str-based, which I probably should at this point (given that I am playing a Treantmonk-style Strength Monk in a slow-running PbP).

I'll go ahead and cross-post the races. Can't wait for the Archetype.

[Ssalarn]

Fighter Archetype- Akashic Warrior
Bonus Feats- The Akashic Warrior can take any feat with the [Akashic] descriptor, as well as the Shape Veil feat, in addition to the standard combat feats. This modifies the Fighter Bonus Feat class ability.

Essence Pool- At 2nd level, the Akashic Warrior gains an Essence Pool equal to ½ his class level.
This replaces the bonus feat gained at level 2.

Akashic Resolve – At 2nd level an Akashic Warrior can fortify his stubborn resolve and determination with Essence. For each point of Essence invested into this ability he gains a +1 bonus to saves vs. fear and Enchantment (Compulsion) effects. This replaces Bravery.

Essential Armaments- Starting at 3rd level the Akashic Warrior gains the ability to fortify his armor with Essence, making it lighter and more responsive. For each point of Essence invested in this ability the Fighter lowers the armor check penalty of armor and shields he wears by 1 and raises increases the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed by his armor by 1. If the Akashic Warrior has at least 2 points of Essence in this ability, he can also move at his normal speed while wearing medium armor. If he has at least 3 points of Essence invested, he can move at his normal speed while wearing heavy armor.
This ability replaces Armor Training.

Steel Bond – At 5th level the Akashic Warrior gains the ability to channel Essence into his wielded weapons, allowing them to strike with greater accuracy and force. The Akashic Warrior gains a +1 insight bonus to attack and damage with wielded weapons per point of Essence invested in this ability.
This ability replaces Weapon Training.

Improved Essence Capacity- At 9th level, the Akashic Warrior increases the maximum Essence capacity of all his class abilities by 1.

[PsyBomb]

That... is actually EXACTLY the assumption I had been working from. Thank you! One thing needs clarifying, does the AkWar count as a Veilshaper class? It is a minor but noticeable difference for feat prereqs and future PrC prereqs.

A question on feats: for the ones like Chakra-Bound Fortitude and Essence of Movement, are you going to add a note allowing them to count as their non-Akashic versions for the purpose of prerequisites? This is already the case for the weakest version of your Toughness-style feats. It will make a serious difference in builds, especially in the AkWar's case.

[Ssalarn]

Yeah, Essence of Movement, at the least, will count as its non-Akashic equivalent.
Currently the Akashic Warrior does not count as a veilweaver class, but I'm open to discussion on that front.

[PsyBomb]

Yeah, Essence of Movement, at the least, will count as its non-Akashic equivalent.
Currently the Akashic Warrior does not count as a veilweaver class, but I'm open to discussion on that front.

Ok. I'll run on the assumption for now that the Save feats will as well, though that is debatable in the long term. The rest can be worked with, putting together a couple of AkWar builds to see how they run. First will be a Greatsword melee version to compare to the Vital Wrath Daevic, then a similar Tengu Blademaster 3 Pouncer to see if it stacks up to the Stormlord Gauntlet trick I tried earlier. After that... going to vary up the amount of Akashic investment, and see if it works for bows as well. Shouldn't take long.

EDIT: Answers to the first two, at least, are yes and yes. Not being able to access Expanded Soulmeld Capacity actually hurts more than you might think on this guy, since he ends on an odd number for his max capacity (unless an item is coming that provides a similar effect, like the Essentia Focus series from MoI). It's kinda surprising just how tight feats get, even when you have 22 to work with.

EDIT2: Not nearly as effective for ranged, although a dip of a couple of feats leads a regular Ranged Fighter to get a couple of ticks more damage than before

[stack]

Trying to build a wrath daevic focused on thf and bull rushing everything but am finding the passion veils painfully limiting. Don't want to go evil, and the bloody conflict works better with more attacks anyway. Don't want claws or a gore, and am not worried much about getting grappled. Seems like armbands of the irked elephant ought to be wrath. It wouldn't be a big deal, but at level five you only get one non-passion veil, which makes for a narrow selection.

The number of veils that aren't on the passion lists also makes it difficult. I hate to leave a bind empty, but with only one non-passion veil it's hard to justify spending it on any of the foot binds.

[Ssalarn]

@ Stack

I was just sitting down to do some work on the Daevic and reviewing the Passion Veils and seeing if I maybe want to make a few changes is towards the top of the list.

@Everyone

I posted the Akashic Warrior up over on the Paizo forums as well and I've had a couple questions PM'd my way. What do you guys think of shifting it so that the Essence Pool replaces the bonus feat gained at 2nd level instead of the one gained at first? There won't be much, if any, difference between the AkWar and a standard Fighter at first level, but that might help make it more likely that you won't end up in a stiuation where you've got Essence you can't use. Thoughts?

[PsyBomb]

@ Stack

I was just sitting down to do some work on the Daevic and reviewing the Passion Veils and seeing if I maybe want to make a few changes is towards the top of the list.

@Everyone

I posted the Akashic Warrior up over on the Paizo forums as well and I've had a couple questions PM'd my way. What do you guys think of shifting it so that the Essence Pool replaces the bonus feat gained at 2nd level instead of the one gained at first? There won't be much, if any, difference between the AkWar and a standard Fighter at first level, but that might help make it more likely that you won't end up in a stiuation where you've got Essence you can't use. Thoughts?

One rapid fix to the Daevic Passion veils is to add a note that Daevic Aspect always counts as a Passion Veil. All three Passions like their version of it.

As for the AkWar, starting it up at second level would make some sense, since that's when the first investment ability kicks in and these guys can't pick up Veils until 5th level.

[Thealtruistorc]

Being a fan of the Incarnum Rules, I like how they are expanding upon them. The Vizier in particular I really like, especially with the mega man-style arm cannon soulmeld.

[stack]

Glad it's under review. Not sure how to work it as it stands, I don't want to push my luck applying to a pbp by asking for too much latitude, just getting it allowed is generous. May just go dominion with a quick draw throwing shield for Captain America action.

Ed- could a half giant shape weapon veils as large size due to powerful build?

[Ssalarn]

Ed- could a half giant shape weapon veils as large size due to powerful build?

I don't believe so, and it wasn't intended. I'll review the racial ability and double-check though.


Also,
I've been meaning to make the adjustment for a while now, but Daevic Aspect will be available as a Passion Veil to all three Passions.

Being a fan of the Incarnum Rules, I like how they are expanding upon them. The Vizier in particular I really like, especially with the mega man-style arm cannon soulmeld.

So, funny story, my first ever Incarnum conversion class, the Chakra Forge, had an archetype specifically styled after playing a Mega Man / Zero style character. Mega Man's ability to shift between his various boss powers was the inspiration for the mechanic that ultimately became veilshifting. Originally it was super different, and had to do with changing the element associated with your veils. The elementalist aspect of my earlier stuff was something I didn't really see matching the idea of the project, though there's some stuff I've got simmering on the backburner that may make use of it if we get to do a second book.