Let's Read A Song of Ice and Fire

[SaintRidley]

So I've been hearing about A Game of Thrones for a while now, but my knowledge until the other day has pretty much been limited the South Park episodes from this past winter, knowing there's a guy called Joffrey, that there's a dwarf named Tyrion, there's this event called the Red Wedding, and that lots of people die so don't get attached to anyone.

The Prophet picked up the ebook last month and finished earlier this week, then just bought a box set. So now that I have a paper copy in front of me (I'd have started reading earlier if I could find the copy I already had, but it disappeared on me) I figure it's time to read the series. I didn't really know much of anything about it, really, aside from what I said above and what I could guess from the title before I started reading. I'm expecting lots of intrigue.

Table of contents:
1. Pages 1-~200 of GoT
2. Pages ~200-~300 of GoT
3. Pages ~300-~400 of GoT
4. Pages ~400-~500 of GoT
5. Pages ~500-~600 of GoT
6. Pages ~600-~700 of GoT
7. Pages ~700-end of GoT
8. Pages 1-~100 of CoK
9. Pages ~100-~200 of CoK
10. Pages ~200-~300 of CoK
11. Pages ~300-~400 of CoK
12. Pages ~400-~500 of CoK
13. Pages ~500-~600 of CoK
14. Pages ~600-~700 of CoK
15. Pages ~700-~800 of CoK
16. Pages ~800-end of CoK
17. Pages 1-~100 of SoS
18. Pages ~100-~200 of SoS
19. Pages ~200-~300 of SoS
20. GoT S01xE01
21. Pages ~300-~400 of SoS
22. Pages ~400-~500 of SoS
23. Pages ~500-~600 of SoS
24. Pages ~600-~700
25. GoT S01xE02
26. Pages ~700-~800 of SoS
27. Pages ~800-~900 of SoS
28. Pages ~900-~1000 of SoS
29. Pages ~1000-end of SoS
30. Pages 1-~100 of FfC
31. Pages ~100-~200 of FfC
32. Pages ~200-~300 of FfC
33. Pages ~300-~400 of FfC
34. Pages ~400-~500 of FfC
35. GoT S01xE03
36. GoT S01xE04
37. Pages ~500-~600 of FfC
38. Pages ~600-~700 of FfC
39. GoT S01xE05
40. GoT S01xE06
41. GoT S01xE07
42. Pages ~700-~800 of FfC
43. Pages ~800-~900 of FfC
44. Pages ~900-end of FfC
45. Pages 1-~100 of DwD
46. Pages ~100-~200 of DwD
47. Pages ~200-~300 of DwD
48. Pages ~300-~400 of DwD
49. Pages ~400-~500 of DwD
50. Pages ~500-~600 of DwD

Threads to look at eventually: This one, this one, and this other one. Also these resources and these more different resources.


Anyway, I figure I'll give ~50-100 page updates on my progress, my impressions, my hazards at guessing what will happen. I'm about two hundred pages in thus far, so first I'll just give my impression of that.

I. A Game of Thrones
First ~200 pages (Prologue to the time Littlefingers brings Ned to see Catelyn)

I've got to say right off the bat that I rather like Martin's prose. It's crisp with a bit of chew to it, although there's one point in the next section where I think it falls on its face by saying in the narration that someone looked like they had a stick up their butt. It's not overdone, but it's not bleakly minimalist either.

What's happened so far has been interesting. Bran getting thrown from the tower was not exactly shocking, given what he saw, though I was surprised with Catelyn when we learned who the dagger belonged to. I'm reserving judgment on Tyrion for later as a result of that - he's hard to read and his family does him no favors.

The king and queen, well the king's a naive buffoon. He's somewhat likable, until you get on the subject of Targaryens and realize that if he feels you're his enemy, he'll do anything. Some of that may be due to the queen's influence.

The Starks are interesting folk and generally interesting. Catelyn's no simple character, and she shows some moxie in going to get Ned information about the Lannisters, so I hope she continues to do stuff. Points off for how she treats Jon Snow - I like him, unreservedly so far. Arya's easily my favorite character, and I fully expect her to become a warrior. Bran just woke up, which is good news. Wondering if he'll remember what he saw, though. That vision he had hints that he might have magic? Robb seems okay, but we don't really have enough of him for a clear picture yet. Sansa seems a bit insipid. I did feel sorry for her when Lady was sentenced to die. Going to keep an eye out for sightings of Neymiria.

Regarding the Targaryens... Not too much to work with right now. Dany seems smart, but her brother... Don't like him. He's kind of completely terrible.

Stuff that seems important
* Bran woke up. So far he's only named his wolf. What else will come of it?
* Dany's bride gifts included the traditional weapons and dragon eggs. The eggs, obviously, will hatch at some point for her. The weapons are for Drogo, but I think they'll find their way back into her hands.
* Jon's up at the Wall. I'd guess he eventually takes charge up there
* The dagger used in the attempt on Bran belongs to Tyrion.
* What Bran saw was the queen and someone who was not the king. Running guesses are either her father, her brother Jaime, or Joffrey (probably not Joffrey, but he's an idiot so it's possible). Nobody else seems likely. ETA - it has been pointed out to me that I missed a key word in that scene: sister. So Jaime.
* Nymeria is out there somewhere. When that reunion happens, Arya's going to be a force to be reckoned with.
*Whatever those things in the prologue are - the Others? - they seem to turn people into them when they kill.

Predictions pulled out of nowhere
* The Red Robin Wedding will be Sansa and Joffrey's wedding. Sansa, the King, and perhaps Ned will die there.
* The "Others" are massing an army north of the Wall and waiting for winter (also gladly letting the petty squabbles of the nobility south of the Wall weaken any potential resistance).
* Catelyn made it down to Ned, but I'm not so sure about her making it back up to Winterfell.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Oh, this is gonna be splendid.

Winter is coming.

[Pokonic]

Oh, this is gonna be splendid.

Winter is coming.

It is known.

[Grinner]

I've got to say right off the bat that I rather like Martin's prose. It's crisp with a bit of chew to it, although there's one point in the next section where I think it falls on its face by saying in the narration that someone looked like they had a stick up their butt. It's not overdone, but it's not bleakly minimalist either.

It does draw you in, doesn't it? I recently finished #2, and I hate the idea of starting another thousand page book. Still, I feel confident that if I actually bought #3, I'd have trouble putting it down.

Anyway, I'll be following this intently. I look forward to drinking your tears.

[Gnome Alone]

It does draw you in, doesn't it? I recently finished #2, and I hate the idea of starting another thousand page book. Still, I feel confident that if I actually bought #3, I'd have trouble putting it down.

Anyway, I'll be following this intently. I look forward to drinking your tears.

His prose is very cinematic. It's no wonder they were able to adapt it so well.

Storm of Swords is far and away the best one, in me opinion.

[LordRahl6]

As a person who has read all the books up until now, I can tell anyone reading for the first time after watching the HBO show that there are some pretty major divergences. However, this being said there are also pretty nice surprises as well. Finally, the game changing events are almost constant so be aware of that.

[Tev]

Nice! Predictions are fun, but people are waaaaay overstating how everyone dies there, so don't be too quick to guess deaths (some are obvious, as some of the stuff you pointed out).

And for the love of god STOP reading RIGHT AFTER book 3. Trust me, you'll regret if you won't.

[SaintRidley]

Nice! Predictions are fun, but people are waaaaay overstating how everyone dies there, so don't be too quick to guess deaths (some are obvious, as some of the stuff you pointed out).

And for the love of god STOP reading RIGHT AFTER book 3. Trust me, you'll regret if you won't.

Once I start something I don't really stop. Not even the legendary badness of late series Dexter convinced me to stop.

[Legato Endless]

Nice! Predictions are fun, but people are waaaaay overstating how everyone dies there, so don't be too quick to guess deaths (some are obvious, as some of the stuff you pointed out).

And for the love of god STOP reading RIGHT AFTER book 3. Trust me, you'll regret if you won't.

I don't think that's really fair to state at this juncture, it's the kind of comment that leads to tainted expectations. To offer a vaguely stated counter point, Books 4 and 5 certainly...needed an editor, but there were still some worthwhile developments. Most of the fanbase was disappointed in certain respects, but not worth dropping outright. Book 6 has a very good shot of being quality, when it's released in 2034.

[Tev]

I don't think that's really fair to state at this juncture, it's the kind of comment that leads to tainted expectations.

. . . exactly the thing you need after glorious book 3. Expect the worst from next two and you'll be fine.

Book 6 has a very good shot of being quality, when it's released in 2034.

This cracked me up :D Well played sir.

[Math_Mage]

This should be fun.

[Legato Endless]

. . . exactly the thing you need after glorious book 3. Expect the worst from next two and you'll be fine.

Ah, I see where you're going.

This should be fun.

I don't know Math Mage, we're already 11 posts in and half the posts aren't completely infested with spoiler tags. It just doesn't feel like a proper GITP watch along.

[SaintRidley]

Well, I got another hundred pages in earlier, so I'll give another update.

You know, I'll never be able to get the weiner song from South Park out of my head when reading this book.

Anyway.

Let’s Read A Game of Thrones
Pages ~200-~300

Well, a good bit happened here. Tyrion is slowly gaining my confidence. Littlefinger was kind of sketchy to start, but he’s definitely looking to be up to something (what that is, I don’t know). Anyway, I guess I’ll cover the pertinent stuff from each chapter in this section.

Tyrion – I like the way he and Jon talk. It seems to me that the best people so far are those who don’t fit in with society, either because of some physical (Tyrion, now Bran) or mental (Hodor) “defect,” non-socially approved circumstances of birth (Jon), or due to being unwilling to conform to the traditional rules (Arya). I feel like, having seen what those close to him are capable of, Tyrion is potentially a snake, but he’s acquitted himself quite well so far.
Arya – She, like her father, thinks this whole tourney thing is absurd (Sansa loves the idea, so she’s still on my list of characters who are insipid and potentially going to screw something up. Good on Ned letting her keep Needle, and arranging for her “dance” lessons. Something tells me she’s going to be the family muscle in a few years’ time.
Daenerys – I was not expecting her to fight back against her brother so soon. I figured maybe after a few more scenes, but damn. She got herself some courage with the marriage. Her brother’s going to get himself killed pretty quickly at this rate – he doesn’t seem intelligent enough to understand that while he prattles on about everyone awakening the dragon, his sister is the dragon, and she doesn't take kindly to usurpers. Also, pregnant. I predicted that about a page before it was said, but still, it puts a new piece on the board. As for her brother, the humiliation has only just begun.
Bran – Bran’s a font of good exposition. So the Others are white walkers. Hodor’s a good and gentle giant. Tyrion kept his word and brought not only Jon’s message for Bran, but also a blueprint for a saddle Bran can use so he can ride. The direwolves seem to have an instinctive dislike for him, though. Way I figure, he’s innocent in the “kill Bran” plot, but he’s got something going on in the background. Bran doesn’t remember anything, which, well, makes sense. If he could, he’d end the plot right there.
Eddard – Not too much here. Ned gets a look at the extent of the spy network, and Littlefinger leaves him with probably the most important thing to know about what Ned’s stepped into in being the King’s Hand: distrusting Littlefinger is the wisest thing he’s done so far.
Jon – Jon’s befriending of Samwell continues to solidify my unreserved approval of Jon. This is a guy who could be king and do it well. He’s amassing a good number of people on his side in the Night’s Watch – tensions there might flare.
Eddard – Main thing of note here: Gendry is the bastard son of the king. Not sure how he fits in just yet. Everyone who might have anything to do with the old Hand’s death is gone – and I’m with Ned on the poison hypothesis.
Catelyn – Seems she’ll make it back to Winterfell, with Tyrion in tow. Should prove interesting. Seems his sister may be trying to get him out of the way too.
Sansa – Ugh. She’s insipid, and privileged, and sheltered, and every bit of this comes through in Martin’s writing. She’s taken with the tourney because she’s supposed to be. She can’t be angry at Joffrey because she’s not supposed to be. He’s just perfect (except for, well, everything about him). She hates Arya, which is no way to be liked. We do learn why Sandor Clegane’s face is burned, and at least she has the sense to feel some pity for him. But he has the right of her – she doesn’t have a mind of her own and only parrots back what she’s been taught.

Things that seem important:
* Jon’s growing stable of supporters in the Night’s Watch.
* This Knight of Flowers fellow seems interesting. As does Gendry. Curious how they figure into things.
* The king has spent the kingdom into massive debt. I’m betting this is the doing of the queen and her brother.
* This tourney seems like a really good opportunity to set somebody up to fall and make Ned responsible, since the tourney’s in his honor. The only questions are who’s going to die, and who is orchestrating. Seems like Varys is working under the queen to me.
*Ben Stark is missing beyond the Wall. His return won’t be the pleasant thing Jon expects it to be.
*Arya saved Neymiria by driving her away. She’ll be back, though, but when? Before the end of this book, I wager.

Predictions pulled out of my ass:
* Arya will be killing Joffrey down the line with Needle.
* Daenerys will be involved in her brother’s death.
* The tourney is going to be the first big strike against the Starks. It starts with what Sandor said about his brother – he always places his lance where he wants it. The king declared he wants to fight – good chance to get him out of the way.

[Math_Mage]

Okay, Legato, this is just for you.

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I'm not sure how I feel about the way Let's Watches frequently devolve into plot speculation.

[Dienekes]

Once I start something I don't really stop. Not even the legendary badness of late series Dexter convinced me to stop.

Honestly, the "badness" of books 4 and 5 is overstated. They are not as good as 3, which is one of the best fictional books I have ever read. But both 4 and 5 spend more time developing the world and showing the outcomes of the events of books 1-3. I, personally, like taking time to explore the setting and it was about damn time GRRM really took a look at how the peasant class handled the events of the series. But, it is not as fast paced nor as politically charged as books 1-3, so those who really were focused on that aspect were disappointed. Also, so much of it was just spent setting all the set pieces into play for later books. Imagine waiting 6 years for a book, and once you read it to have several of the most anticipated sections teased in front of you without reaching fruition. It was the literary equivalent of blue balls, and many of the fans did not take it well.

[Legato Endless]

Spoiler: Math Mage

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Mmm, I can see that. On the one hand, watching someone, particularly an observant intelligent reader try to out the pieces together can be quite diverting, and occasionally insightful. The FMA Brotherhood thread is having the time of its life watching the OP try to figure things out. That said, there is much more to a story than merely its plot. Something I find strangely absent in many long reviews of ASOIAF is not noting the third person limited pov, and the restriction of one character per chapter. This defines and informs the rest of the structure of the story, and its usage delineates a fair bit concerning some of the themes. Granted, in fairness, an on going review can't easily encompass certain things like a work's coherence, or the arc of character development, or the focus and such, whereas the plot is always right there within grasp. Well, you can also talk about pacing, but pacing is always the least important part of a work to me.

[Anderlith]

I've read all the SoI&F books so far. & I don't watch the show. But Feast of Crows is easily the weakest book & is incredibly boring. Brace yourself (obligatory "Winter is Coming" reference)

[Shadow of the Sun]

I don't think books 4 and 5 are bad, but I think the pacing is off, which is why GRRM has said that he won't pace things like that again.

[Gnome Alone]

He does over-use certain phrases (that he invented) so flipping much in A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons. I will not mention them, because I guess that is kind of mildly spoiler-y, and I'd prefer not to dwell/bitch on it too much.

Speaking of spoilers, for the OP and any new contestants playing the home game, the only two spoiler boxes so far, by Legato Endless and Math Mage, are not spoilers for the books themselves - just meta-commentary about Let's Watches. So if'n I was y'all I'd feel free to click 'pon them without fear.

[Aedilred]

He does over-use certain phrases (that he invented) so flipping much in A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons. I will not mention them, because I guess that is kind of mildly spoiler-y, and I'd prefer not to dwell/bitch on it too much.

Yes. Although some of the phrases he managed only to use once were enough to have me reaching for the brain bleach.

[Gnome Alone]

Yes. Although some of the phrases he managed only to use once were enough to have me reaching for the brain bleach.

Care to elaborate, mayhap in spoilerbox form? It's actually been a while since I read the books, and I don't hate the last two books, but I also don't think I'm going to read them again for a while.

[Tev]

Honestly, the "badness" of books 4 and 5 is overstated. They are not as good as 3, which is one of the best fictional books I have ever read. But both 4 and 5 spend more time developing the world and showing the outcomes of the events of books 1-3. I, personally, like taking time to explore the setting and it was about damn time GRRM really took a look at how the peasant class handled the events of the series. But, it is not as fast paced nor as politically charged as books 1-3, so those who really were focused on that aspect were disappointed.

I agree on book 3. But in the next two, besides Martell and Greyjoy stuff (and those were clearly the highlight of the books), he is not really "developing" the world. Pacing is also very painful problem in epic tales like this, so trying to screw it up as much as possible does make a hideous book. Combine it with some really bad writing techniques and I don't see how you can call book 4 less than bad.

Book 5 is in comparison with 4 kind of ok, and qualifies as "just a disappointment".

Spoiler: OP's predictions

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I like how close he is getting. It confirms my theory that story of aSoIaF is actually quite simple and predictable, just set in very rich world with very good characters.

[Wardog]

Stuff that seems important
Predictions pulled out of nowhere

Oh, my sweet summer child ...

[Aedilred]

Care to elaborate, mayhap in spoilerbox form? It's actually been a while since I read the books, and I don't hate the last two books, but I also don't think I'm going to read them again for a while.

It is less the spoilery nature that causes me to refrain from quoting them directly, rather their unsuitability for the forum, at least if the context is known.

[Lord Raziere]

Oh, my sweet summer child ...

I basically had the same thought really. Oh yes, what a sweet summer child this one is...

[Gnome Alone]

It is less the spoilery nature that causes me to refrain from quoting them directly, rather their unsuitability for the forum, at least if the context is known.

Ohhhhhhhhhh I think I know now.

[Legato Endless]

It is less the spoilery nature that causes me to refrain from quoting them directly, rather their unsuitability for the forum, at least if the context is known.

The...colorful metaphors associated with the Giant's bane on a certain boat would be an example?

[TechnOkami]

Looking at your current plot speculations...

You Know Nothing SaintRidley.

Also, I'm like a little more than half way through A Dance With Dragons, so that's where I personally am in terms of the plot.

[Grinner]

Looking at your current plot speculations...

You Know Nothing SaintRidley.

Shush. He doesn't need to know these this.

[Seerow]

Tag. This should be fun.