Why all the hate for Man of Steel?

[Foeofthelance]

I think it was less that giving the Codex to Clark was less, "This will make him the Perfect Kryptonian!" and more along the lines of simply allowing him to see results for his efforts. Going back to the body building example, a normal, limited Kryptonian would never see any change in their body no matter what supplements they took or however many exercises they performed. Clark, on the other hand, would at least see some muscle growth and development, even if he wouldn't be able to win the Kryptonian equivalent off a body building contest.

[Avilan the Grey]

Terraforming Mars is not unfeasible. What is unfeasible is the time required (a few thousand years, probably). And the money of course.

[Coidzor]

Fighting Over something that doesn't even exist in real life. :) But funny how everyone is taking it personally like Super man is their buddy in the neighborhood.

Cultural icons are like that.

[Anteros]

Terraforming Mars is not unfeasible. What is unfeasible is the time required (a few thousand years, probably). And the money of course.

And also the fact that we don't have the knowledge or technology to do it. Like I just explained in great detail with multiple sources.

[Shinken]

And also the fact that we don't have the knowledge or technology to do it. Like I just explained in great detail with multiple sources.

I really don't see how that is relevant. We don't have that tech, but Krypton clearly does. You don't even have to terraform Mars to start a colony there.

[Metahuman1]

So apperently he get's a new costume in the next moive thay's a brighter shade of blue.

Wish they'd found a way to throw a smig more red in there to fix the color balance problem though.

[Anteros]

I really don't see how that is relevant. We don't have that tech, but Krypton clearly does. You don't even have to terraform Mars to start a colony there.

It's relevant because people keep using "Krypton can obviously do it because even we have the ability to do it!" as an argument.

Which is:
1. Incorrect.
2. A baseless assumption about technology we know nothing about.

That said, I don't care any more. You guys win. Everything is terrible forever. All of the complaints are valid. Even the ones that are irrelevant to the movie and the ones that make no sense.

[Scowling Dragon]

Your correct on that. We can't base the assumption of wether or not they can colonize a dead planet off of only our own universe.

But you (Poorly) attempt to explain away every other assumption that we make based on things IN THE MOVIE.

You insist that rather then this being a plot hole or lazy writing (Which is what upsets everybody LAZY WRITING), Kryptonians sent colonizers to planets they could not colonize and would die in. Or thats not a plot hole too. because they where storing it there...despite having no reason too. But it wasn't them just being stupid (A stupidity caused by your theory). It was invasion or Plauge that was never referenced in film or mentioned in any way.

You create this insane chain of logic to get away from 1 simple point: Zod attempted to colonize earth for (At best) weak reasons.

[Anteros]

Your correct on that. We can't base the assumption of wether or not they can colonize a dead planet off of only our own universe.

But you (Poorly) attempt to explain away every other assumption that we make based on things IN THE MOVIE.

You insist that rather then this being a plot hole or lazy writing (Which is what upsets everybody LAZY WRITING), Kryptonians sent colonizers to planets they could not colonize and would die in. Or thats not a plot hole too. because they where storing it there...despite having no reason too. But it wasn't them just being stupid (A stupidity caused by your theory). It was invasion or Plauge that was never referenced in film or mentioned in any way.

You create this insane chain of logic to get away from 1 simple point: Zod attempted to colonize earth for (At best) weak reasons.

His reasons are entirely in keeping with his characterization (in both the movie, as well as the comics for the last 50 years). My explanations are a direct result of responding to the completely baseless assumptions you keep making in an attempt to be overly negative and nit-pick every little detail about the movie. You cherry pick the stupidest possible explanation for everything, and then get mad at me when I point out that there are other possibilities. You're correct that my explations are not part of the movie. You neglect to realize that your own fabrications that the Kryptonians die out of sheer stupidity, or that they could have just terraformed another planet are also not supported.

Just because a director doesn't treat you like a child or an idiot, hold your hand, and explain every trivial, irrelevant detail of a movie in giant letters across the screen, does not mean you should assume the worst possible explanation you can imagine just because it lets you be extra negative on the internet.

All that we're told is that the colonies died out. A reasonable person would take this information and say "There must be more to this story that we don't know." You on the other hand say "Oh my gosh, they died of pure stupidity because they couldn't push a button." You're the one fabricating explanations for things that aren't in the movie. You're the one creating your own story to fill in the gaps. You're simply upset at me because I refuse to participate in the overly negative fantasy you've created where the only possible interpretation for events we aren't given the full details of are yours.

As for terraforming the Earth. Even if your idea for Zod to go somewhere else was possible...who freaking cares??
THIS JUST IN: SUPER VILLAIN PLOT NOT ENTIRELY PRACTICAL. MOVIE LITERALLY UNWATCHABLE.
You act like it's a flaw for MoS in particular instead of...virtually every fictional movie ever made.

[Scowling Dragon]

Why are my explanations the worst? I go off of things that actually ARE in the movie, and are have actually shown to have happened. I don't need some plague, or some storage depot reason for a empire that doesn't exist and has shown not to exist at all. I just point to things that are in the movie and point out how the end result is stupid.

Why are your rationalizations correct? Why are my points only nitpicks? Why are my points that the events that led us to other events in the movie are contrived and stupid? Resulting in even more contrivance and sloppy writing.

Also nice use of the black or white fallacy at the end there. Discounting tone of the story, effect of the plan, and wether or not the plan is a good one at all.

And didn't you just argue that his plans DID make sense? So did they or not?

edit:

OK So you have gone around full circle. Let us not forget. its not ME who is arguing that they die out of stupidity. Its YOU WHO IS ARGUING THAT.

The movie says the colonists died out because of a lack of support which is stupid, but its different.

Its YOU who argued that they sent their colonists to planets they could not colonise to store them there (And die there).....For no reason.

I actually have EVIDENCE on my side. The planet Zod took the mining machine out of was a failed colonizing attempt. If you argue that they failed because the machine could not work there then you are agains supporting that the Kryptonians are stupid and thus sent out a thing that wouldn't work.

And again you get to cherry pick what is contrived and what isn't. Certain things don't have to be explained. But even if they are not, the movie should be structured in such a way that it explains itself through implication.

You are going AGAINST what the movie is saying and substituting your own reality.

[Anteros]

Why are my explanations the worst? I go off of things that actually ARE in the movie, and are have actually shown to have happened. I don't need some plague, or some storage depot reason for a empire that doesn't exist and has shown not to exist at all. I just point to things that are in the movie and point out how the end result is stupid.

Why are your rationalizations correct? Why are my points only nitpicks? Why are my points that the events that led us to other events in the movie are contrived and stupid? Resulting in even more contrivance and sloppy writing.

Also nice use of the black or white fallacy at the end there. Discounting tone of the story, effect of the plan, and wether or not the plan is a good one at all.

And didn't you just argue that his plans DID make sense? So did they or not?

edit:

Sorry didn't see your edit yet, replying.

I argued that we didn't have enough information to make a judgement about his plans. Simply because I engaged you in a hypothetical scenario where his plans don't make sense does not mean my stance changed.

As for rationalizations, mine are almost certainly incorrect, but so are yours. My argument the entire time has been "we don't know what happened, there are lots of possibilities, we shouldn't base our judgement on something so trivial we don't have enough information about." Your's has been "no, they died because they are dumb and the movie is dumb because of it."

Also, I didn't mean "worst" as an insult to you. I meant worst as in "the most negative".

ok, edit: I don't remember them saying it was a failed colonization attempt. I simply remember them saying they gathered the world engine from somewhere. Maybe you're right, I don't know where it was in the movie, and I'm not re-watching the entire 3 hour affair just to debate this one point.

That said: If it is correct that they gathered it from a failed colonization attempt, that doesn't mean the only possible explanation for failure was that the Kryptonians were too stupid to survive. That's still a completely baseless assumption on your part. We know they were cut off from Krypton, and we know they died out. Anything past that is baseless assumption on your part.

[Scowling Dragon]

You also didn't remember the Skeletons inside protective suits located at the area. Maybe your just misremembering the movie?

And the Kryptonians are stupid regardless. Remember stupid comes from bad actions. Not from something that has to be established.

If the movie says "This character is stupid!" but the character is smart and rational then the movie is wrong.

For one of my examples of Kryptonian stupidity, they spent their last days doing nothing. Worse then nothing. Saving the lives of criminals whilst dying themselves. Do you need me to elaborate why this was stupid?

But never-mind that. What in the movie WAS flawed in your opinion?

Edit:

And I called dying off from that point stupid because It seems to be remarkably easy to colonize a planet. Zod (Almost) did it with a Prison ship and gathered materials from other planets in like a day. How did colonizers fail to do so on their own?

[Math_Mage]

The colonizers succeeded in a bunch of places--and then the colonies failed for other reasons. At least, that's how Jor-El's dialogue reads to me. Seems odd if none of the places they terraformed was less livable than Mars.

[Avilan the Grey]

The colonizers succeeded in a bunch of places--and then the colonies failed for other reasons. At least, that's how Jor-El's dialogue reads to me. Seems odd if none of the places they terraformed was less livable than Mars.

Not to derail the whole thing but for some reason I read the first part of your post in the voice of the Big Brain.
"And now I shall leave Earth and never return FOR NO RAISIN! Hahahahaha!!!"

[Kitten Champion]

I don't really care about the fate of the Kryptonians. They exists to be killed, and unless that's going to be changed by this reboot in some meaningful fashion the particulars don't interest me. They could have cut the beginning Krypton portion of the film out and it would make no difference, the script explains all the pertinent details later anyways and the whole thing would have been better with Zod left in the shadows while giving more time to develop Clark's early life. I didn't really want a space opera, I'd rather just get to know the frickin' protagonist.

I don't care about Zod's plan either. Both because it's a comic book movie and threatening a large population is going to happen at some point, and because Zod wasn't a rational actor capable of making obviously logical decisions when blinded by hate regardless of what those alternatives might be. He's the same character as Nero from Abrams Star Trek (2009), he fits the necessary tropes (killed father, alien zealot, loose sanity, revenging himself against the universe, core of followers, gunna blow up Earth) that the movie needs but isn't going down in the annals of any film buff's best villain list unless they really like Michael Shannon... or Eric Bana for that matter. Hell, he's Ronan from Guardians of the Galaxy.

The issue is that the film wanted to weigh down these events and characters with heavy-handed significance but... well, doesn't really put the effort into making it work. Krypton's fate is this tragedy but it's so poorly presented it just makes them seem trivial. Zod's just a generic villain, he needed to be there for the levelling of Metropolis and they didn't care much as to how.

Man of Steel is like if Carly Rae Jepsen's "Call Me Maybe" was covered by Angela Gheorghiu in Italian with the backing of the London Philharmonic. It's amusing in some ways but its massive waste of everyone's talents at the end of the day because they're singing about... I think it's angst over sudden infatuation? It puts a lot of effort into elevating a screenplay which isn't worth it.

[SiuiS]

I think it was less that giving the Codex to Clark was less, "This will make him the Perfect Kryptonian!" and more along the lines of simply allowing him to see results for his efforts. Going back to the body building example, a normal, limited Kryptonian would never see any change in their body no matter what supplements they took or however many exercises they performed. Clark, on the other hand, would at least see some muscle growth and development, even if he wouldn't be able to win the Kryptonian equivalent off a body building contest.

Pretty much. Jor-el allowed him to function like a normal creature.

[t209]

So about Kryptonians not colonizing other planets? So are there any Kryptonian space colonies in the comic-verse?

[Foeofthelance]

So about Kryptonians not colonizing other planets? So are there any Kryptonian space colonies in the comic-verse?

Yeah, depending on what's currently going on there is Argo, Kandor, and Daxam. Argo may or may not have been blown up, Kandor is trapped in a bottle, and Daxam, which is a xenophobic dystopia that likes to pretend the rest of the galaxy doesn't exist.