Erfworld 49

[Theodoxus]

Nice imagery... No idea what it meant though. /sigh

[Ranis]

Umm....what?

[Imrahil]

I didn't think it was possible for this comic to get even classier, but including a Shakespearean sonnet...It just makes me respect this work even more.

[Emperor Demonking]

I have to say I dislike it.

[SteveMB]

Nice imagery... No idea what it meant though. /sigh

Hmmm... I'm pretty sure Parson has thought of some sort of exploit involving the day/night cycle of the sides' turns, but booped if I can see what exactly he has in mind.

Very interesting images. Wanda looks so cute holding her skull . Ansom looks rather thoughtful (and Vinnie apparently sleeps in a coffin, but at night). Jillian looks rather sad, and the limited light sets off our limited view of her expression and body language nicely.

[jindra34]

He has a plan... at last we see a spark of the genius within Parson...

[happyturtle]

Serpentine shape to Wanda. And loyal Bogroll, sleeping in the library rather than risk not being near when Parson needs him.

But the dragons asleep in the treetops? Sublime!

[JoshuaZ]

Hmmm... I'm pretty sure Parson has thought of some sort of exploit involving the day/night cycle of the sides' turns, but booped if I can see what exactly he has in mind.

I'm not convinced that's what his exploit is. Has last comment is about "the little battle" which suggests that the exploit has to do with battle size. One thing I don't quite understand though is given a simple set of rules why the basic exploits wouldn't already have occurred to people who are much more familiar with Erf's physics and other rules than Parson is and have had much more time to think about them.

[TheLamentation]

It has been far too long since I saw a quotation used this appropriately. Good job.

[ryos]

This page brings us another merchandise idea: the Deluxe Plush Teddy Skull (with wings!).

Yeah, I have nothing to add. I don't really grok Shakespeare, but I thought it set the mood so perfectly. I'll have to read again and see if I can figure out what the Bard is saying.

[gooddragon1]

The same way that the British decided to fight honorably (taking cover was beneath them)... its because Parson fights to win that he wins. Exploits are just too dirty for them to think of doing so they don't even think of it. Now getting Stanley to allow it will be the interesting part. Shouldn't be too hard to sugar coat however.

[jindra34]

The same way that the British decided to fight honorably (taking cover was beneath them)... its because Parson fights to win that he wins. Exploits are just too dirty for them to think of doing so they don't even think of it. Now getting Stanley to allow it will be the interesting part. Shouldn't be too hard to sugar coat however.

Sugar Coating: If it works, YOU WIN, and has no side effects on failure...

[Fuzzy_Juan]

I am not sure about 'the little battle', that may be a 'commander fight' sorta tradition where no other unit can attack and just the commanders are allowed to duke it out...but I can't be sure...

The exploit may be about when one ends the turn. If you don't end your turn when your opponent does, then it may be possible to do battle and other things when the opponent is unable to do as such. Only thing that I can think of given what we know of erf world.

Why noone has ever exploited it before? Well, perhaps because it was just the way things always were and they never thought of doing it another way. Just like when a new person comes to the playgroup, they use rules slightly different and think of things that noone ever thought of doing, either because it was too cheesy for a friendly game, or they just didn't go there for whatever reason. Perhaps 'the little battle' is a battle entry of a moment when someone did just that...perhaps Stanly commited regicide in that manner and was just too dense to realize that he found an exploit.

I wonder if units 'need' to sleep, or if they just do it to pass time in between turns...they apparently eat, but it is unclear if they NEED food. They heal magically at the start of each turn...I wonder if they also get rejuvinated as if they slept at the start of a turn...If Stanly started ending the turn just before dawn and then starting the new turn right away, it is possible that they can act with impunity...

or...if they can start and stop turns at random, or at set times...they could move their start/stop time to a point in the middle of battle...that way all their units heal and then continue the attack mid battle. There are all sorts of ways such a 'glitch' can be exploited if that is in fact the glitch.

[SteveMB]

I'm not convinced that's what his exploit is. Has last comment is about "the little battle" which suggests that the exploit has to do with battle size.

You could be right; I was inferring a clue from the quotation that may not be intended.

In the preceding Klog, Parson talks about "the little battle" (apparently the original ambush plan, or a plan to hit one portion of Ansom's force while it's still divided) and "the big battle" (presumably the main attack on Gobwin Knob). He seems to have some sort of idea connected to the former.

[Twilight Jack]

I'm not convinced that's what his exploit is. Has last comment is about "the little battle" which suggests that the exploit has to do with battle size. One thing I don't quite understand though is given a simple set of rules why the basic exploits wouldn't already have occurred to people who are much more familiar with Erf's physics and other rules than Parson is and have had much more time to think about them.

Largely, it seems to me that since the Erf natives accept the game rules as the laws of physics/reality which govern their existences, they are less likely to view their world as a game system to be hacked/exploited. Parson, on the other hand, sees their "reality" in a context which allows him to ruthlessly exploit the idiosyncracies of the "mechanics" in ways that should/would never occur to Stanley, et. al.

In contrast to OotS, in which all the characters inherently understand the arbitrary nature of the game rules which govern their world, it would seem that in Erfworld, the natives take it all for granted. Please note the ways in which both Stanley and Wanda have dismissed Parson's comments on the ways in which his own world functions differently. It's inconceivable to them that things could function differently, so it could never occur to them that the "rules" could be exploited or that the very system of laws which govern them could be "broken" with a rules hack.

[pyrofly]

I'm not convinced that's what his exploit is. Has last comment is about "the little battle" which suggests that the exploit has to do with battle size. One thing I don't quite understand though is given a simple set of rules why the basic exploits wouldn't already have occurred to people who are much more familiar with Erf's physics and other rules than Parson is and have had much more time to think about them.

The exploits wouldn't occur to them because they don't think of them as "expoits". To Parson, this is a game world, with rules that can be exploited. To the people of Erf, this is THE world and it's rules are hard and fast ways of life.

"Things are just the way they are. That's how it's always been." -Anon.

[TheLizzaard]

Ninja'd on my first post.

But to add to what gooddragon said, I think it's more that nobody's considered or questioned the physics of the world. I was going to use the British formation fighting as an example as well, but I think it's just as much a matter of them never considering other options as it was that they wanted to fight honorably.

I've been a lurker for well over a year, and a fan of the site for longer. I'm not a huge Shakespeare fan, but using one of his works in this context was beautiful. If nothing else, it got me to register. Well played.

[Fuzzy_Juan]

You could be right; I was inferring a clue from the quotation that may not be intended.

Parson talks about "the little battle" (apparently the original ambush plan, or a plan to hit one portion of Ansom's force while it's still divided) and "the big battle" (presumably the main attack on Gobwin Knob). He seems to have some sort of idea connected to the former.

Ohh, good point...the little battle might refer to the ambush. Perhaps he is planning on starting the turn early and hitting while everyone sleeps with the dragons in the forrest...hmm...

[pyrofly]

Dang, in a matter of seconds I'm beaten to the punch by two other posts! I must be slow today.

[wobbegong]

Stacking...

I wonder if Parson has realised that perhaps he doesn't count against the stacking bonus... In a small fight having one more unit can make a bigger difference than in a big fight. Add in the fact that if the enemy cannot see him from range (because his stats don't show up) then maybe they will not realise that there is a leader with the stack at all and will think it an easy target...

Just thinking aloud (well, in type)

[Bassetking]

We also haven't fully been appraised of the rules of city's creation of units. Were Parson to expend schmuckers to create units during the Night cycle, it's possible their Turn would start during the night, and allow them to attack while the others turns are ended, as has already been suggested.

[Maerad of Pellinor]

I <3 Shakespeare

I'm trying to think of a time in Shakespeare when there's a great strategy used in a battle....In one of the Henry plays, they shout their battle cry to get people to leave their tents and then go rob them....But most of the war scenes are just there for the characters not the battle itself....

The font is great, too :)

And Wanda sleeps with a teddy, er, skull!

Dwagons sleep in trees! :D

[the_tick_rules]

wanda sleeping with skulls. that's cute and morbid simultaneously, only thing that made this strip worth it. that shakespere thing made nearly no sense.

[Krytha]

That was cool.

[SteveMB]

Ohh, good point...the little battle might refer to the ambush. Perhaps he is planning on starting the turn early and hitting while everyone sleeps with the dragons in the forrest...hmm...

The key question there is whether attempting to attack at night would even work in Erfworld, and if it does how does the result differ from the (normal) procedure of attacking the enemy when it's your turn (and not theirs)?

For that matter, if the cycle of turns is the primary time measurement of Erfworld, successfully attempting to start Stanley's turn early may simply cause the sun to rise at that time and the turn to proceed normally from there.

We also haven't fully been appraised of the rules of city's creation of units. Were Parson to expend schmuckers to create units during the Night cycle, it's possible their Turn would start during the night, and allow them to attack while the others turns are ended, as has already been suggested.

Attacks in Erfworld normally happen when it's your turn and the other side's turn had ended:

[Describing the attack that captured Jillian] "She ended turn in the trees, and I pulled together a flight of nearby dwagons."

[Immediately after the spidews attack Webinar's squad] "When our turn begins, we're going to take that road."

Edit: In any case, I don't think creating new units is what he has in mind; according to the last Klog entry, that takes time (probably more time than Team Stanley has).

[tomaO2]

Well...

The ground army looks like it's in a forrest area and all the flying units are in a different group so perhaps they will send the dwagons to attack the ground side and get some massive damage in as a raid to help even the odds down a bit.

[Golem]

I particularly like the imagery as it applies to Jillian. ..Poor barbarian.
Now, though, I really, REALLY want to know what 'Lord Hamster' has cooked up. Erfworld has a very different vibe from most other comics I read, and this one in particular sticks out to me.

[sherlock]

I'm not convinced that's what his exploit is. Has last comment is about "the little battle" which suggests that the exploit has to do with battle size. One thing I don't quite understand though is given a simple set of rules why the basic exploits wouldn't already have occurred to people who are much more familiar with Erf's physics and other rules than Parson is and have had much more time to think about them.

Because so many times (also in real life) you must be somehow "detached" to fully understand the rules of the game?
When you are involved you cannot see things that an "outsider" can see clearly.

Apart from this, ... beautiful! The W.S. citation, the drawings, the cliff-hanger of Parson's idea (upon which I see there's already much speculation ... I rest and prefer to enjoy the surprise).
My congratulations to the authors. I was somehow skeptical at the beginning but now I wait for Erfworld "almost" (heheheeee) with the same deesire as I await for OOTS new strips.

[Gitman00]

Hmmm. Interesting. Parson saying "the little battle," then, "we can salvage this," seems to suggest that he believes he can still pull out a victory in the ambush. Remember, it's not Gobwin Knob's turn yet. They haven't attacked; yesterday was Spacerock's turn. It's Gobwin Knob's turn next, and Parson knows what he has to do. My prediction:

Spoiler

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He's going to attack before dawn. Not only will it be completely unexpected, but any of his units that get damaged will presumably heal at dawn, and it'll still be his turn, so he essentially gets twice the attack power. Spacerock and Co's units may heal, too, but not if they get croaked in their sleep.

EDIT: And Wanda sleeping with the winged skull is just too cute.

[SteveMB]

Edit:

Remember, it's not Gobwin Knob's turn yet. They haven't attacked; yesterday was Spacerock's turn. It's Gobwin Knob's turn next, and Parson knows what he has to do.

I think a day is one turn for each side, not one turn for one or the other. I've expanded on this in my Attempt At A Chronology Of Turns.
/Edit

Spoiler

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He's going to attack before dawn. Not only will it be completely unexpected, but any of his units that get damaged will presumably heal at dawn, and it'll still be his turn, so he essentially gets twice the attack power. Spacerock and Co's units may heal, too, but not if they get croaked in their sleep.

That seems like the most straightforward theory for what he has in mind. Whether or not it will in fact work that way remains to be seen.

Edit: Hmmm... I note that the Archons and some other air units are in the sky above where Jillian is hunched by the campfire, and some of the dwagons are in the air. That seems to suggest that, at least, a certain amount of air observation happens at night.