Dreamscarred Press - Path of War Expanded! (Thread VII)

[CGNefarious]

Thrashing Tempest of the Solar Dragon Style.

Because, you know, I'm super good at coming up with names.

[Taveena]

Perhaps a feat in the vein of Elemental Current/Electrum Manticores that allows to initiate Thrashing Dragon strikes with thrown weapons (within one or two range increments) while you are in a Tempest Gale stance?

I mean, the main problem is that limiting it to Thrashing Dragon could result in some really awkward problems where the ONLY way to do a TWF thrower is to break the game wide open - and given the intent here is to support ALL TWF ranged styles, that limitation seems a little awkward. Having seperate feats for TWF throwing, TWF guns, and TWF crossbows would just kinda be a waste of pagespace.

A Tempest Gale TWF Thrower actually already manages a TON of damage, but they do it by entirely ignoring a huge part of PoW, as none of their Strikes work. Nothing but Stances and Boosts. And while that's not an UNREASONABLE build, it's obscenely potent (I was told Mystic Gunslinger was slightly stronger) and adding Thrashing Dragon's strikes to that might make it even worse. And in this case Thrashing Dragon strikes are the ONLY option, and results in a lot of weird rulings (like Offensive Roll always provoking AoOs and all the Unarmed/Natural maneuvers only functioning with a Throwing Returning Amulet of Mighty Fists).

It feels like making the various disciplines with Ranged support also support ranged TWF would be a lot easier to handle than making Thrashing Dragon a ranged discipline, while allowing for more potential concepts.

[amberlink]

What category of trait are Unorthodox Method and Practiced Initiator supposed to be?

[Vhaidara]

What category of trait are Unorthodox Method and Practiced Initiator supposed to be?

IIRC, they aren't. Because that i highly restrictive and the devs don't want to do that

[Andreaz]

Combat, most likely. One could argue it to be campaign as well.

[Taveena]

Combat, most likely. One could argue it to be campaign as well.

They are explicitly untyped traits, so they are compatible with all other traits and each other.

[Greenish]

Fear Monger (Ex): The stalker gains Cornugon Smash and Dazzling Display as bonus feats.

This is nice enough, but Cornugon Smash requires you to be using Power Attack to activate, and Dazzling Display requires you to be using the weapon you have Weapon Focus with, so what happens if you don't have those feats?

Well, actually, the art doesn't even say that you get to ignore the requirements, so I guess this doesn't apply. Seems a bit weird contrasted to things like Killer's Implement or Sniper's Tools, though.

[Vhaidara]

That was discussed, and needing the feats is intentional, since the combination is really powerful.

[Greenish]

Is Killer's Implement and Sniper's Tools not working as prerequisites also intended? Because while for the former it's no great loss, the latter really feels it if going for archery focus.

[amberlink]

Which all parts of this have actually been released currently?

[Forrestfire]

Harbinger and Mystic have each had their own mini-release pdfs published.

[Lord_Gareth]

Finally! New Avvie installed, courtesy of Prime32.

[Taveena]

In the Expanded Systems and Use doc, it currently says "When a warlord gets a new tactical presence, he may select one of these at the indicated level" - however, the Warlord does not actually get to CHOOSE which presence they get, simply gaining a specific presence at a certain level (rather like Bardic Performances). It might be necessary to say that these can be taken instead of the listed ones - at the moment the only way they can be taken is with the Extra Presences feat.

EDIT: Also, the Aasimar favored class bonus is "Add 5 ft every 1/2 level to the range of the warlord’s tactical presence". What does this mean? They get 10 ft every level? Shouldn't it be radius rather than range, or are there cases in which the former would be incorrect?

[amberlink]

I don't see anything in Void Prophet preventing the sickened/loss of power points upon a member of the collective dying, simply that they recover maneuvers, is this intentional?

Edit: And a question for the first book, does Discipline Focus count stances? Figured this one out

Edit 2: Does initiator level affect what level maneuvers in regards to the archtypes that get only up to level 6?

Edit 3 (Sorry I keep coming up with more questions): There's always reference to initiation modifier in things like classes and alternate class features, are there ways to change initiator modifier ever or is it simply...in case something else comes out that works with it?

Edit 4: If I take say, Awakened Blade, and had 2 initiator classes before hand, do I add full awakened blade levels to both to determine the initiator level they each have? In addition can I use the new maneuvers and stances for either initiator class each time? Or do I choose one at level 1 of the prestige and have to stick with it? And for something like stance of the Inner eye, which Initiator level do I use?

[Taveena]

Weird thing about Void Prophet - and I'm not sure this is exactly a gamebreaker, but it's weird - but enemies are in a weird position where they can avoid a lot of its effects by simply not resisting. The Life Leech and the Commander don't seem to have this issue. "Creatures forced into your collective using
Unwilling Participant are considered willing members for any collective-related effects unless they succeed on another Will save at the same DC to resist being forced into the collective." also results in some really wonky interactions where they WANT to count as Willing members of the collective.

[DarkEternal]

Awesome product, all in all. I like that you seem passionate about the entire thing and updating it with new stuff. However, I'd like to know if you are thinking about an errata of some things that are frankly too strong and when can we expect that? The things I consider too strong, at the very least for now is the Thrashing Dragon's Vicious strike which for a fairly big DC pretty much instakills any enemy by applying a Daze condition for 1d4 rounds.

Also, concerning Stalker Arts. Combat Precognition seems obscenely strong as it is, but even with that, I really fail to see why any martial class would not take a dip in this class if they have even one bonus wisdom point.

Other than that, thanks for the great work.

[Swaoeaeieu]

Awesome product, all in all. I like that you seem passionate about the entire thing and updating it with new stuff. However, I'd like to know if you are thinking about an errata of some things that are frankly too strong and when can we expect that? The things I consider too strong, at the very least for now is the Thrashing Dragon's Vicious strike which for a fairly big DC pretty much instakills any enemy by applying a Daze condition for 1d4 rounds.

As far as i know they are finishing the expanded book first and then move on to errata the older material. Thrashing dragon is on the list of manouvers that needs to be reigned in a bit. So yes, they will adress it eventually, just not right now.

[tekevil]

I kinda wish they'd do the opposite, that way the disciplines in expanded wont need nerfing errata to be on par with post-nerf Path of War 1 disciplines. It'd reduce the workload on Path of War:E errata later.

[Vhaidara]

I kinda wish they'd do the opposite, that way the disciplines in expanded wont need nerfing errata to be on par with post-nerf Path of War 1 disciplines. It'd reduce the workload on Path of War:E errata later.

The thing is, Broken Blade, Primal Fury, and Thrashing Dragon are all seriously overtuned for damage in a way that the newer disciplines aren't. Black Seraph has one standout in my mind (Strength of Hell is just about the best level 1 boost I've ever seen), but even then, it is strongest when feeding into Broken Blade or Thrashing Dragon.

[EldritchWeaver]

I kinda wish they'd do the opposite, that way the disciplines in expanded wont need nerfing errata to be on par with post-nerf Path of War 1 disciplines. It'd reduce the workload on Path of War:E errata later.

That creates potentially new problems, assuming that the most powerful disciplines are too overpowered to be like that in the game (e.g. causing deaths within two rounds even for boss enemies). Also that doesn't help with the less powerful disciplines of the original PoW. If you don't tone down the more powerful ones, you need to enhance the less powerful ones to bring them on the same level. Overall that strategy doesn't decrease the workload.

[Tuvarkz]

The thing is, Broken Blade, Primal Fury, and Thrashing Dragon are all seriously overtuned for damage in a way that the newer disciplines aren't. Black Seraph has one standout in my mind (Strength of Hell is just about the best level 1 boost I've ever seen), but even then, it is strongest when feeding into Broken Blade or Thrashing Dragon.

Strength of Hell is just an Encouraging Roar that doesn't affect others, and has the user take a -2 to AC just for +1.5 extra damage on average (or +3 avg if target is good aligned)

[Taveena]

Strength of Hell is just an Encouraging Roar that doesn't affect others, and has the user take a -2 to AC just for +1.5 extra damage on average (or +3 avg if target is good aligned)

Profane is borked at the moment so that any attack with a Profane rider effect has ALL of its damage multiplied, even if it's 99 bashing damage and 1 profane damage - against Good creatures, that's 150 damage. (Or 148 Bashing and 1 Profane, depending on how you handle fractional damage.)

[Tuvarkz]

Profane is borked at the moment so that any attack with a Profane rider effect has ALL of its damage multiplied, even if it's 99 bashing damage and 1 profane damage - against Good creatures, that's 150 damage. (Or 148 Bashing and 1 Profane, depending on how you handle fractional damage.)

Wait, what?
*Reads Systems and Use Carefully*

[The Glyphstone]

Just curious (and because I'm poor ), but the Harbinger Beta document mentions that the release Harbinger should eventually be included on the PFSRD, at which point the Beta GoogleDoc will be deleted. Is there any ETA on that wondrous event?

[EldritchWeaver]

Just curious (and because I'm poor ), but the Harbinger Beta document mentions that the release Harbinger should eventually be included on the PFSRD, at which point the Beta GoogleDoc will be deleted. Is there any ETA on that wondrous event?

I wouldn't expect it before the entire book has been finished. And then it likely takes some time for the PFSRD team, which has stated that Spheres of Power has currently the highest prio (aside from Paizo).

[Vhaidara]

Strength of Hell is just an Encouraging Roar that doesn't affect others, and has the user take a -2 to AC just for +1.5 extra damage on average (or +3 avg if target is good aligned)

The -2 AC didn't make it into the long description, so that's what I've been using until we get eratta. And Roar is a morale bonus, so it has things it won't stack with, like bard song, that are also great for flurry hitters like Dragon and Blade.

[Taveena]

The -2 AC didn't make it into the long description, so that's what I've been using until we get eratta. And Roar is a morale bonus, so it has things it won't stack with, like bard song, that are also great for flurry hitters like Dragon and Blade.

Inspire Courage is a Competence bonus in PF, for some reason.

[Vhaidara]

...please tell me I'm not the only one who facepalmed there. Please.

[Taveena]

You are not.

On the bright side, this means a Rubato with Golden General's Attitude can top out at a sizable +9 bonus to attack and damage aura.

[Adam1949]

I wouldn't expect it before the entire book has been finished. And then it likely takes some time for the PFSRD team, which has stated that Spheres of Power has currently the highest prio (aside from Paizo).

I'm still waiting for a DSP/SoP crossover of some kind. Maybe making the Elemental Flux school and Destruction sphere work together somehow.