Magic the Gathering XXII: Where Puns Go to Die

[Carl]

hmmm doing my homebrewing and a thought crossed my head and it's prompted a rules question the wiki failed to answer . Attach, is there any innate rule to the attach function that prevents a card being attached to more than one card at once? Or does that need to be specified?

[tgva8889]

It is an innate rule, otherwise the Equip ability should allow multiple things to hold the same equipment, but it does not. See rules 301.5c and 303.4d. 701.3 may also help you.

[Carl]

Thats what i thought but i wanted to double check as the wiki page on attach didn't list an explicit rule though one did imply without actually stating it, (probably 701.3 as the rules listed where all 700 series).

[Dhavaer]

Whoo! I went to the morning HOU prerelease with my girlfriend. We didn't do very well in games, but we opened two Locust Gods, a Scarab God, Samut and a Doomsday.

[Svata]

Nice! My FLGS didn't do a midnight prerelease, but I'm going to the noon one.



Unrelated, I've been on a bit of a card designing kick lately, and was wondering if people minded telling me what they thought of the cards/mechanics I've made, and if this'd be the appropriate thread to share them on, and, if not, where that place would be.

[Carl]

Nice! My FLGS didn't do a midnight prerelease, but I'm going to the noon one.



Unrelated, I've been on a bit of a card designing kick lately, and was wondering if people minded telling me what they thought of the cards/mechanics I've made, and if this'd be the appropriate thread to share them on, and, if not, where that place would be.

Yoink. Set it up not long ago for that very purpose :).

[Svata]

Oh, sweet, thanks!

[ImperiousLeader]

This format is still more aggressive than I'm really comfortable with, but I did just walk out my pre-release undefeated. Played a Green/White deck with a lot of exert creatures and some untap effects, and just beat down with attacking creatures. Pride Sovereign did okay, if nothing else, it drew out all of my opponent's removal. And I did manage to attack with the Sovereign, untap it, then pump it up by activating its token making ability.

[Duck999]

This format is still more aggressive than I'm really comfortable with, but I did just walk out my pre-release undefeated. Played a Green/White deck with a lot of exert creatures and some untap effects, and just beat down with attacking creatures. Pride Sovereign did okay, if nothing else, it drew out all of my opponent's removal. And I did manage to attack with the Sovereign, untap it, then pump it up by activating its token making ability.

I went to a prerelease this day and pulled a Locust God, and immediately built a red/blue deck. It seemed okay, but was weak on the creature side (because of what I pulled). Because of this, during the deck building time, I did my favorite thing to do at a prerelease and built a green/white deck with tons of combat tricks (the combat tricks being my favorite part). I basically did the same green/white beatdown thing with some exert and lots of buffs.

The one game I did sideboard in my blue/red deck was a game I lost, but my opponent had sideboarded in removal of white creatures, making it totally worth it.

I placed third, which got me a few packs, one of which had Armageddon, which was probably my highlight.

[Svata]

Went 2-1-1. Pulled Gideon of the Trials and Horselord. Built 2 decks, W/B splashing red for some extra removal and to fill in those last 4 playables and G/B splashing white for Horselord.

[Turalisj]

Went 3-0 in the Sunday 2hg. Partner was bant beats and I was grixis control/aggro. Sadly, no Bolas pulled.

[tgva8889]

We didn't open anything particularly exciting, but my 2HG partner and I won the tournament with medium to good generic decks without really any bombs or anything, which was satisfying. Taking down Planeswalkers and Gods on your way to the top certainly feels great when you're winning with piles of commons.

[Boci]

So for the intro decks for Hour of Devastation, is it just me, or does Nissa's seem to be better than Nicol Bolas? Maybe I'm off, and I hope I am, as I'd like to buy the wedge deck, but if Nissa is that much better maybe I should reconsider.

[Bucky]

I found an infinite combo for Hour of Devastation, but it's the least elegant one since the M10 Mirror of Fate loop. I'm looking at a 15-card combo 13-card combo with additional requirements, 10 of which are just for generating enough mana to satisfy the extremely hungry engine. Currently looking for a simpler solution.

Spoiler

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4x Swarm Intelligence + 1x Mirage Mirror (copying Swarm Intelligence) + 4x Bloodwater Entity + Leave//Chance + Act of Heroism + River Hoopoe + Oasis Ritualist

= infinite mana, infinite life and an infinitely large Oasis Ritualist

I still don't have anything for Amonkhet.


(E) Simplified the combo (-1 mana generator and -1 engine card) by...

Spoiler

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drawing and casting all the spells with River Hoopoe instead of stacking a library for Hazoret's Undying Fury.

[Fable Wright]

I have found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

I almost found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

Got it to work again.

Spoiler: This could have been a lot easier, Wizards.

Show

New Perspectives + Gideon of the Trials emblem + Pyramid of the Pantheon at 3 counters + Vizier of Tumbling Sands x4 + Scribe of the Mindful x2 + Samut, Voice of Dissent + Shadow of the Grave + Wander in Death + Sacred Excavation.

Initial state: Tapped Pyramid of the Pantheon and Samut on the board.
Hand: Four Vizier of the Tumbling Sands, two Shadow of the Grave, Sacred Excavation, two Wander in Death, two Scribe of the Mindful
Graveyard: One Scribe of the Mindful

Cycle four Viziers to make 12 mana of any color, then cast Shadow of the Grave (10 floating), cycle and tap again (22 floating), then cast both Scribe of the Mindfuls to return the Shadow of the Graves to your hand (14 floating). Cast Wander in Death to return both Scribes to hand (11 floating). Cycle one Viziers, then return it and the third Scribe of the Mindful with Wander in Death (11 floating). Cast Sacred Excavation to return both Wander in Deaths (7 floating). Cast and activate Scribe of the Mindful to return Sacred Excavation (3 floating).

End state: Tapped Pyramid of the Pantheon and Samut on the board
Hand: Four Vizier of the Tumbling sands, two Shadow of the Graves, Sacred Excavation, two Wander in Death, two Scribe of the Mindful
Graveyard: one Scribe of the Mindful

Gives you infinite mana, infinite cycling triggers (so infinite drakes or lifedrain or whathaveyou), and with one or two more cards, could easily grant you infinite life. The main stumbling block was the difficulty of losing the game when you ran out of cards in your library with no infinite way to shuffle them back... but Gideon cleanly sidesteps the issue.

EDIT: ...And then I realized that I forgot to include a way to recycle Scribe of the Mindful. Derp.

EDIT^2: It is now definitely infinite, but I feel like the execution of the loop could be significantly cleaner.

[LastCenturion]

I have found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

I almost found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

Spoiler: This could have been a lot easier, Wizards.

Show

New Perspectives + Gideon of the Trials emblem + Pyramid of the Pantheon at 3 counters + Vizier of Tumbling Sands x4 + Scribe of the Mindful + Bloodlust Inciter + Shadow of the Grave. Gives you infinite mana, infinite cycling triggers (so infinite drakes or lifedrain or whathaveyou), and with one or two more cards, could easily grant you infinite life. The main stumbling block was the difficulty of losing the game when you ran out of cards in your library with no infinite way to shuffle them back... but Gideon cleanly sidesteps the issue.

EDIT: ...And then I realized that I forgot to include a way to recycle Scribe of the Mindful. Derp.

Spoiler

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So, I'm not sure I'm getting this right: New Perspectives (assuming you have >= 7 cards in hand) lets you cycle for free, Gideon keeps you from losing, Pyramid taps for three mana every time you can untap it, Scribe lets you recur Shadow of the Grave, and Inciter lets you activate Scribe once you recur that. Shadow is two mana, which nets you one mana per loop, and Scribes are cycled to untap... Pyramid, Inciter, and two others? One of the things you untap would have to be a mana source, in order to still profit in mana from the loop.

I don't think there's anything in Amonkhet that does that. Dawn (from Dusk//Dawn, adding in another Scribe) comes so close, but it's not quite there.

[Fable Wright]

[SPOILER]So, I'm not sure I'm getting this right: New Perspectives (assuming you have >= 7 cards in hand) lets you cycle for free, Gideon keeps you from losing, Pyramid taps for three mana every time you can untap it, Scribe lets you recur Shadow of the Grave, and Inciter lets you activate Scribe once you recur that. Shadow is two mana, which nets you one mana per loop, and Scribes are cycled to untap... Pyramid, Inciter, and two others? One of the things you untap would have to be a mana source, in order to still profit in mana from the loop.

I don't think there's anything in Amonkhet that does that. Dawn (from Dusk//Dawn, adding in another Scribe) comes so close, but it's not quite there.

Okay, I think I got the loop working in the post you quotes, but feel free to triple check my math:

I have found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

I almost found the infinite combo of Amonkhet.

Got it to work again.

Spoiler: This could have been a lot easier, Wizards.

Show

New Perspectives + Gideon of the Trials emblem + Pyramid of the Pantheon at 3 counters + Vizier of Tumbling Sands x4 + Scribe of the Mindful x2 + Samut, Voice of Dissent + Shadow of the Grave + Wander in Death + Sacred Excavation.

Initial state: Tapped Pyramid of the Pantheon and Samut on the board.
Hand: Four Vizier of the Tumbling Sands, two Shadow of the Grave, Sacred Excavation, two Wander in Death, two Scribe of the Mindful
Graveyard: One Scribe of the Mindful

Cycle four Viziers to make 12 mana of any color, then cast Shadow of the Grave (10 floating), cycle and tap again (22 floating), then cast both Scribe of the Mindfuls to return the Shadow of the Graves to your hand (14 floating). Cast Wander in Death to return both Scribes to hand (11 floating). Cycle one Viziers, then return it and the third Scribe of the Mindful with Wander in Death (11 floating). Cast Sacred Excavation to return both Wander in Deaths (7 floating). Cast and activate Scribe of the Mindful to return Sacred Excavation (3 floating).

End state: Tapped Pyramid of the Pantheon and Samut on the board
Hand: Four Vizier of the Tumbling sands, two Shadow of the Graves, Sacred Excavation, two Wander in Death, two Scribe of the Mindful
Graveyard: one Scribe of the Mindful

Gives you infinite mana, infinite cycling triggers (so infinite drakes or lifedrain or whathaveyou), and with one or two more cards, could easily grant you infinite life. The main stumbling block was the difficulty of losing the game when you ran out of cards in your library with no infinite way to shuffle them back... but Gideon cleanly sidesteps the issue.

EDIT: ...And then I realized that I forgot to include a way to recycle Scribe of the Mindful. Derp.

EDIT^2: It is now definitely infinite, but I feel like the execution of the loop could be significantly cleaner.

[Turalisj]

Just put the finishing touches on what will hopefully be my new EDH deck.... critique is welcomed. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/trumpcare-1/

[LastCenturion]

Okay, I think I got the loop working in the post you quotes, but feel free to triple check my math:

... braVO! The math checks out to me, and it's an entire card heavier than the HOU one. 14 cards is totally viable in sealed, right? Only one of them is mythic, and only two are rare. Haven't counted the uncommons.

On the other hand, I wouldn't run this combo just because I don't want to have to explain it to my opponent;

"Uh, so first I do... uh... what was it? There's an infinite combo somewhere in here... Uh... just a moment" *stares at hand for a moment* "Oh yeah, so first I'll cycle all of these, and then... Uh... Hold on... oh yeah, then I cast this... and... mmmm... JUDGE! WHAT'S THE INFINITE COMBO WITH THESE CARDS AGAIN?"

[Fable Wright]

... braVO! The math checks out to me, and it's an entire card heavier than the HOU one. 14 cards is totally viable in sealed, right? Only one of them is mythic, and only two are rare. Haven't counted the uncommons.

On the other hand, I wouldn't run this combo just because I don't want to have to explain it to my opponent;

"Uh, so first I do... uh... what was it? There's an infinite combo somewhere in here... Uh... just a moment" *stares at hand for a moment* "Oh yeah, so first I'll cycle all of these, and then... Uh... Hold on... oh yeah, then I cast this... and... mmmm... JUDGE! WHAT'S THE INFINITE COMBO WITH THESE CARDS AGAIN?"

It's two mythics, as Gideon's emblem is required to make sure you don't mill yourself to death and Samut is needed to give haste without burning Vizier untaps on things other than the Pyramid. It... is actually 15 cards, as I forgot to update the count at the top of that.

Still, it gets a lot easier to go infinite in limited when you can have more than four Vizier of the Tumbling Sands in your hand or deck.

[LastCenturion]

It's two mythics, as Gideon's emblem is required to make sure you don't mill yourself to death and Samut is needed to give haste without burning Vizier untaps on things other than the Pyramid. It... is actually 15 cards, as I forgot to update the count at the top of that.

Still, it gets a lot easier to go infinite in limited when you can have more than four Vizier of the Tumbling Sands in your hand or deck.

No, I was counting from what you said you needed in describing the combo, not from what you said you needed in listing it.

I didn't realize Samut was a mythic; I thought she was just a rare.

[Bucky]

Well done! But you need an actual Gideon in addition to the emblem.

[Fable Wright]

Well done! But you need an actual Gideon in addition to the emblem.

Oh, yeah, derp. Still, it's a combo to add to the log book, and makes Hour of Devastation's wombo combo look less like a kludge in comparison.

[Bucky]

As far as clunky goes, it's competing with Shadows' "Cryptolith Rite, Tenacity and 17 random creatures" mana component.

[LansXero]

What do you need Gideon for? you only lose if you cant draw during your draw step IIRC.

[Mystic Muse]

What do you need Gideon for? you only lose if you cant draw during your draw step IIRC.

Wrong. If you're instructed to draw, and can't, you lose regardless of whether it's your draw step or not.

[Dhavaer]

I'm thinking of making a God-Pharaoh's Gift deck. The basis is:

4x Gate to the Afterlife
2x God-Pharaoh's Gift
4x Cathartic Reunion
25x Creatures
25x Land

The mana base is Jeskai fastlands with manlands and basics to fill out. The creatures I definitely want are:

4x Insolent Neonate (because it's ability helps fill the graveyard, and it's a decent reanimation target)
4x Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun (because a 5/5 unblockable haste creature is better than a 4/4 haste creature)
4x Aven Wind Guide (because a 4/4 haste, flying, vigilance creature is better than a 4/4 haste creature)
4x Scrapper Champion (double strike is sweet and the art is awesome)

What are some good picks for the other 9 creatures? ETB abilities, keywords, undersized bodies and some way to get them into the graveyard are all pluses. The mana base will probably be leaning red, so please avoid double white or blue costs unless the creature is super awesome (like maybe the anthem angel from Kaladesh). I'm thinking Ulamog because tiny blue Ulamog sounds hilarious and it should actually be pretty good, but it would just be a 1 of.

[Gauntlet]

I'm thinking of making a God-Pharaoh's Gift deck. The basis is:

4x Gate to the Afterlife
2x God-Pharaoh's Gift
4x Cathartic Reunion
25x Creatures
25x Land

The mana base is Jeskai fastlands with manlands and basics to fill out. The creatures I definitely want are:

4x Insolent Neonate (because it's ability helps fill the graveyard, and it's a decent reanimation target)
4x Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun (because a 5/5 unblockable haste creature is better than a 4/4 haste creature)
4x Aven Wind Guide (because a 4/4 haste, flying, vigilance creature is better than a 4/4 haste creature)
4x Scrapper Champion (double strike is sweet and the art is awesome)

What are some good picks for the other 9 creatures? ETB abilities, keywords, undersized bodies and some way to get them into the graveyard are all pluses. The mana base will probably be leaning red, so please avoid double white or blue costs unless the creature is super awesome (like maybe the anthem angel from Kaladesh). I'm thinking Ulamog because tiny blue Ulamog sounds hilarious and it should actually be pretty good, but it would just be a 1 of.

I dunno if you need 4 copies of Temmet, seems like a lot for a Legendary creature you can recur.

Wharf Infiltrator seems pretty solid for you - you want to be pitching creatures a reasonable amount. Stromkirk Occultist, Curator of Mysteries, and Nimble Obstructionist also all seem like good choices.

[solidork]

Highlights from Maro's SDCC panel:

http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post...gic-panel-info

We're finally getting contraptions. It's silver border, but I'm still excited.

[Astral Avenger]

Hi people, I'm not a serious m:tg player by any means, but i work at a summer camp where some of our older kids (5-6th grade) love playing it. So far this summer I've been using the kids extra decks to play against them whenever they want to play, but wanted input on potentially buying my own deck. Since I'm not playing in tournaments, but rather against kids I want to play a deck that isn't going to steamroll the kids, but still forces them to work for the win. As i said earlier, I work at a summer camp, so cheaper is better for me. I dont have a hard limit on budget for this, but if I can keep it to 15 USD or cheaper, I would be very happy. If it affects card/deck availability, I live in Minnesota. Thanks in advance for any help and advice, and my apologies if this is outside the scope of this thread.