Crusader Kings II Thread IV: Time to Create a New Title

[Artanis]

No, the correct thing to do is exterminate the Karling line.

That pretty much goes without saying

[IthilanorStPete]

I started up a game for the first time in a while, creating a custom character as the Count of Caligari. So far, I've conquered two of the other Sardinian counties and established the Duchy of Sardinia; problem is, the HRE has picked up the rest of Sardinia and Corsica. I've also grabbed a couple of Tunisian counties from holy wars against vulnerable targets. Matilda di Canossa's line is getting scary; she married into the Duchy of Lombardy, establishing a super-duchy of Lombardy, Tuscany, Modena, Spoleto, Genoa, and Corsica. I'm contemplating swearing fealty to the HRE and working my way up in there, but that's a frightening potential neighbor.

[Thufir]

No, the correct thing to do is exterminate the Karling line.

Personally, I've been finding it quite amusing that thanks to me pressing a de jure claim on some land I'd previously lost and the relevant vassal demanding conversion, there are now a bunch of Germanic Karlings hanging around. Some of them aren't even in my realm, they're still in Francia with all the Catholics.
The dynasty I did put some effort into extinguishing was the Piasts as I nurse a centuries-old grudge against them for converting Norway to Catholicism and somehow vassalising the Jomsvikings. At this point the only ruling Piasts are on the other side of the Byzantines though so that's been put on hold for the moment.

[Leecros]

Well.....er....I uh....


I'm not sure how to feel about this. A bit of history, I generally stay away from the demon cult and only occasionally use it for RP reasons. Well, I had this incredibly debauched emperor who was all but a devil worshipper. So I decided that he would be my once in a few hundred years demon worshipper. Weeeellllllll.....

Spoiler

Show

Turns out his child was the daughter of Angra Mainyu.

But wait! There's more!

See Donya wasn't just satisfied with being literally the embodiment of evil. She wanted to etch her name in the history books permanently. You might be able to see where this is going. Yes, that's right!

Spoiler

Show

So...The Daughter of Angra Mainyu has also become The Promised Savor of The World.






Also can we talk about the awesome wooden mask she gets for being leader of the cult?

[Rockphed]

Well.....er....I uh....


I'm not sure how to feel about this. A bit of history, I generally stay away from the demon cult and only occasionally use it for RP reasons. Well, I had this incredibly debauched emperor who was all but a devil worshipper. So I decided that he would be my once in a few hundred years demon worshipper. Weeeellllllll.....

Spoiler

Show

Turns out his child was the daughter of Angra Mainyu.

But wait! There's more!

See Donya wasn't just satisfied with being literally the embodiment of evil. She wanted to etch her name in the history books permanently. You might be able to see where this is going. Yes, that's right!

Spoiler

Show

So...The Daughter of Angra Mainyu has also become The Promised Savor of The World.






Also can we talk about the awesome wooden mask she gets for being leader of the cult?

This sounds like a good time to kidnap and then murder all the other members of the cult.

[Avilan the Grey]

Yes indeed.
Fight Fire With Fire. Nobody's trying to give me a bag of chicken feet yet.

In the meantime... This version of 769 was oddly uneventful for me. I know they have done tons of balance patches but one of the reasons I wanted to start at 867 originally was that I had heard so much of thre world going haywire in a 769 start (Muslims conquering Britain, France conquering Sweden, Norse conquering everything EVERYWHERE.

In my start (I think I am about 810 now) and well... The French nations are busy being French. Nobody conquered Lombardia, who seems static.
The Muslims in Spain has not moved at all.
The biggest player is the Khanite south of me who has swollen HUGE and then converted to Catholicism quickly and thus stopped expanding.

Oh one thing though. So far the Norse has been absolutely calm too. I know the Viking age event sometimes won't trigger until 830, but I have not seen a single Norseman anywhere.

[Eldan]

Things are... interesting in the current game. It's around the year 1100 and the Tengri religion just reformed out of nowhere, so all the Steppes are now part of one giant theocratic empire. So far, they are just sitting there, but it's worrying.

Oh, and the Byzantine Empire became Shia, after they folded to a religious war. I mean, what the hell. Meanwhile, I'm all the way over here in Spain, wrapping up the reconquista and just as I'm preparing to move on to Mauretania... the entire coastline of Africa suddenly says "Most Serene Republic of Pisa". They control everything from Morocco to Tunis. (Not Egypt, obviously).

[Avilan the Grey]

Oh that happened too. Not Shia, but my Byzantines are now 100% Iconoclast. Orthodoxy is the new Heresy.

[Eldan]

I think that happens quite commonly. In some start dates, the Emperor starts out Iconoclast and then the rest of the country eventually follows.

[Caelestion]

Byzantine iconoclasm was a major part of Orthodox religious history.

[Avilan the Grey]

One thing I noticed going from Chieftess to Queen is that the marriage options for my children quadrupled or something. Nobody wanted anything to do with my Heir, the very attractive well educated guy. My daughter, who became of age after I became queen? I got 4(!) marriage proposals from both pagan and Iconoclast rulers!

[BannedInSchool]

New Player. Hmm, my sister and heir is also my regent and doesn't like me. Goodbye, Fernando.

[Avilan the Grey]

New Player. Hmm, my sister and heir is also my regent and doesn't like me. Goodbye, Fernando.

Nothing explains CK2 as the statement "Great! He's FINALLY depressed so he can kill himself!"

[Grytorm]

Played more. Finally got Gwynned. It is under three counts who hate me so I am holding onto the duchy title until I can hand it off along with a county or two to a brother in law. Real question is should I found Wales when I get one more territory?

Saddly one of the Irish duchys is no longer under my dynasty, two vassal counts ganged up on the relative. But the others are firmly under the family line.

Decided I didnt like my current king so I had him take a vow of celibacy so the line will move to the more capable brother. It is a bit arbitrary, but he is married to a scottish princess with a strong claim. Taking over Scotland wont be to hard, they have had a lot of civil war and it seems like the crown has passed around several times.

England seems similar but they have maintained control of their dejure territory. I know the crown started under Harold Hadrada, and has definitely passed through the de Normandie family. Other than that, mostly I have seen the capitol move a few times, it spent most of its time just to the east of Wales, some time in Cornwall and it has now returned to southern England.

[Flickerdart]

Played more. Finally got Gwynned. It is under three counts who hate me so I am holding onto the duchy title until I can hand it off along with a county or two to a brother in law. Real question is should I found Wales when I get one more territory?

Always upgrade your top-level title if you can. If you own but one kingdom, not even Gavelkind can snatch it away from you, plus you gain big fat gobs of Prestige. The only potential drawback is that a King cannot swear fealty to an Emperor the same way that a Duke, Count, or Baron level independent lord can (possibly unless the Emperor is de jure, not sure).

[Malimar]

Always upgrade your top-level title if you can. If you own but one kingdom, not even Gavelkind can snatch it away from you, plus you gain big fat gobs of Prestige. The only potential drawback is that a King cannot swear fealty to an Emperor the same way that a Duke, Count, or Baron level independent lord can (possibly unless the Emperor is de jure, not sure).

Also try to set your succession laws to what you want them to be before creating the King title. A Duke can change succession laws easily, while a King or Emperor has a much harder time of it. (This may be different if you have Conclave, I don't know.)

[Avilan the Grey]

Also try to set your succession laws to what you want them to be before creating the King title. A Duke can change succession laws easily, while a King or Emperor has a much harder time of it. (This may be different if you have Conclave, I don't know.)

There is one thing to keep in mind: Are you playing for Dynasty or for Family?
The game is simple in one way: the only way to get game over is if there is no landed heir ANYWHERE.

This means that expanding your dynasty is a good idea even if you lose control over them. So instead of worrying about "I" must have the biggest empire personally, you can play it another way: Prop up your dynasty where you can, and don't panic if you have two kingdoms and one will go to your cousin and one to your heir when you die. Just make sure that cousin marries well and can continue to spread your dynasty. Eventually you probably will have the chance of creating an Empire anyway.

[Eldan]

So, I'm now bordering the Mongols. Yay?

Long and complicated process of conquest and re-conquest. Byzantium lost a war to the Persians and became Muslim. Then, they fell apart into several kingdoms. Persia snapped up Anatolia. A Crusade re-converted Greece and handed it to me. Then, the Mongols conquered Persia.
So, now everything east of Constantinople is Mongols. They border Egypt in the South, they have conquered Delhi, they control all the steppes. Not Russia, so far. Russia is part of the glorious Suomi empire.

Did they rebalance the Mongols? Usually, I see them potter around the steppes for a bit, then fall apart. It probably helped that Ögedei Khan (no Temujin in sight) is also leader of the reformed Tengri faith.

[Avilan the Grey]

So, I'm now bordering the Mongols. Yay?

Long and complicated process of conquest and re-conquest. Byzantium lost a war to the Persians and became Muslim. Then, they fell apart into several kingdoms. Persia snapped up Anatolia. A Crusade re-converted Greece and handed it to me. Then, the Mongols conquered Persia.
So, now everything east of Constantinople is Mongols. They border Egypt in the South, they have conquered Delhi, they control all the steppes. Not Russia, so far. Russia is part of the glorious Suomi empire.

Did they rebalance the Mongols? Usually, I see them potter around the steppes for a bit, then fall apart. It probably helped that Ögedei Khan (no Temujin in sight) is also leader of the reformed Tengri faith.

I think they did, because if you compare the old screenshots from when the game was new, the Golden Horde usually ended up in Iceland*, or even England, or Norway... So they nerfed them but way too much. For a long while all they did was (due to an AI error) conquer Baghdad and then just sit there. Or they half-heatedly threw a few stacks at Hungary and then gave up. I DO think they after Reaper's Due have buffed them a bit (and above all fixed that AI error).

Oh btw: Did the AI actually form Finland of it's own? I have never seen that in a game. Ever.

*For a while it was actually quite common that the last holdout for the Golden Horde was Iceland, when they had been thrown out of all other places on the map, was Iceland.

[Eldan]

I think they did, because if you compare the old screenshots from when the game was new, the Golden Horde usually ended up in Iceland*, or even England, or Norway... So they nerfed them but way too much. For a long while all they did was (due to an AI error) conquer Baghdad and then just sit there. Or they half-heatedly threw a few stacks at Hungary and then gave up. I DO think they after Reaper's Due have buffed them a bit (and above all fixed that AI error).

Oh btw: Did the AI actually form Finland of it's own? I have never seen that in a game. Ever.

*For a while it was actually quite common that the last holdout for the Golden Horde was Iceland, when they had been thrown out of all other places on the map, was Iceland.

They didn't just form Finland, they conquered a good chunk of Russia. Never saw it before, either.

[SZbNAhL]

A King cannot swear fealty to an Emperor the same way that a Duke, Count, or Baron level independent lord can (possibly unless the Emperor is de jure, not sure).

Really? Because in my current "exploit the satanic devotion mechanic to vassalise the world" game, I "convinced" the King of France to swear fealty to my Emperor of Brittania/Scandinavia, and I'm pretty sure that's outside of the de jure empire. Unless there's a restriction on players swearing fealty to AIs but not vice-versa?

[Caelestion]

New Player. Hmm, my sister and heir is also my regent and doesn't like me. Goodbye, Fernando.

Do you hear the drums (of death), Fernando? :)

[Avilan the Grey]

When the Queen of Poland is fighting a 5 year long liberation war of Pommern Saxony to throw out the cursed Norse worshipers and ends up killed in battle... And her son is too weak to hold on to the entire kingdom AND suffers from a severe infection from an amputated leg... At least he managed to assassinate his brother and reconquer 90% of Poland. Let's see if he survives long enough to conquer the last county too...

[Thufir]

Really? Because in my current "exploit the satanic devotion mechanic to vassalise the world" game, I "convinced" the King of France to swear fealty to my Emperor of Brittania/Scandinavia, and I'm pretty sure that's outside of the de jure empire. Unless there's a restriction on players swearing fealty to AIs but not vice-versa?

Satanic devotion may alter things? In general though, I'm pretty sure it's the other way around - to my knowledge, a player can offer fealty to any higher tier title which is either their de jure liege or on their border, whereas the AI will only accept offered vassalisation if the higher title holder is at least 2/3 of: same culture, de jure liege, 2 ranks higher than them. Oh, and you need to be the same religion as well.

[Eldan]

Aren't Doctors wonderful? I complained about gout in my feet and he cut my legs off.

[Grim Portent]

Aren't Doctors wonderful? I complained about gout in my feet and he cut my legs off.

He fixed your gout didn't he? There's just no pleasing some people.

[Avilan the Grey]

He fixed your gout didn't he? There's just no pleasing some people.

Tomorrow he's got a special on Headaches!

[Grytorm]

Always upgrade your top-level title if you can. If you own but one kingdom, not even Gavelkind can snatch it away from you, plus you gain big fat gobs of Prestige. The only potential drawback is that a King cannot swear fealty to an Emperor the same way that a Duke, Count, or Baron level independent lord can (possibly unless the Emperor is de jure, not sure).

Oh I am already King of Ireland, decided to go ahead with also being King of Wales. I already instituted Primogeniture so I think Wales picked it up as well. Since my last king died in a tragic balcony accident I am now playing as his brother with four sons. The first one will eventually be king and rule the main Irish patrimony. The others will need a little work. If I am lucky I can hand one of them a duchy in Ireland whose holder is in his sixties, without children, and married to an elderly relative.

[BannedInSchool]

Do you hear the drums (of death), Fernando? :)

Once he hit 15yo the assassination attempts were hitting something like every two months. I tried to discover the plot but without luck. The fourth attempt got him and he never figured out someone was trying to kill him. So I'll admit I reloaded and gave a gift to my elder sister/heir/regent to not kill me to see if that worked. It did. And then I couldn't go back to him being dead, so Fernando lives. Although now a childhood rival is trying to kill him. Trading the rival off to a German court didn't work to get rid of him, so it's daggers in the night now. (And I feel a little bad about eldest sister. I did save and tag it when she inherited and the kingdoms all split up, so I'm probably going back to see how that alternate history works out.)

More New Player woes: Went about making all the duchies I could because it seemed like a fun thing to do. So now two of the three I don't hold are uniting their rulers, and in the second duchy I hold I don't own the capital county. Sure, *now* I know something more about duchies.

[Wardog]

I'm 73 years old, and my eldest son and heir has just declared an independence war against me. :facepalm: