Do you consider a hamburger a sandwich?

[Some Android]

I just watched a let's play where this heated debate came up. What are your thoughts?

[Togath]

Well, it's ingredients between two pieces of bread. So I'd say yes.
Unless you mean a hamburger steak, of course.

[Razade]

A sandwich is

A food item consisting of one or more types of food, such as vegetables, sliced cheese or meat, placed on or between slices of bread, or more generally any dish wherein two or more pieces of bread serve as a container or wrapper for another food type.

A haumbruger is

A hamburger or burger is a sandwich consisting of one or more cooked patties of ground meat, usually beef, placed inside a sliced bread roll or bun. The patty may be pan fried, barbecued, or flame broiled. Hamburgers are often served with cheese, lettuce, tomato, bacon, onion, pickles, or chiles; condiments such as mustard, mayonnaise, ketchup, relish, or "special sauce"; and are frequently placed on sesame seed buns. A hamburger topped with a slice of cheese is called cheeseburger.

The answer is yes. There's no argument to be had. It's a sandwich.

[Liquor Box]

There is always argument to be had - because the definitions of words on the internet are subject to the way the words are ordinarily used by most people. Especially true when the "definition" you find may differ depending which localised version of google you use to find it.

I think the word sandwich means something a little different in USA, to other parts of the English speaking world (such as where I am from. In that regard I note that the Wikipedia page on "Sandwich" says this:

"In the United Kingdom and Australia, the term sandwich is more narrowly defined than in the US: it refers only to an item which uses sliced bread from a loaf. An item with similar fillings, but using an entire bread roll cut horizontally in half, is always referred to as a roll... However, hot sliced (not ground) beef between two slices of toasted bread is referred to as a steak sandwich: it is the sliced loaf bread that distinguishes the steak sandwich from a burger."

I also know that Subway markets their products as sandwiches in USA, but not where I come from, simply because their product does not come within the normally understood use of the word here.

I wonder if the "heated debate" that Some Android was referring to arose from Americans and non-Americans each forcefully asserting that their differing interpretation of the word "sandwich" was correct.

[Remmirath]

Yeah, I think this is really a regional difference. In American usage, there's no reason not to classify a hamburger as a sandwich; it certainly is at least as much as a sandwich made from a sliced croissant, a sliced bagel, a sliced roll, or any number of other things that are commonly accepted as a "sandwich" here. Further, when looking in the menu in a restaurant, hamburgers are almost always found under the "sandwich" section.

However, that's not the universal definition of it. Personally, I actually feel that the other definition of it quoted above makes more sense, but since that's not how it's used here I'm still in the habit of lumping burgers into the sandwich category.

[Keltest]

If somebody asked me directly, as you are doing now, I would answer yes. If somebody asked me if I wanted a sandwich, then came back 20 minutes later with a hamburger, I would be very confused, and possibly annoyed.

[AvatarVecna]

I personally say yes, but then, I'm American. Granted, even thinking about it, I'm not sure why you'd need multiple words for "bread-->non-bread stuff-->bread thing", when describing the stuff on it is usually more important than kind of bread it's on, much less the style of bread it's on. I wouldn't say "I'd like a rye sandwich with roast beef", I'd say "I'd like a roast beef sandwich on rye"; they both mean the same thing, sure, but one feels a lot more natural.

Of course, this leads into other weirdness, where trademarks give things a non-"sandwich" name, and adding sandwich in sometimes feels more clunky. To use McDonalds as an example, I wouldn't feel too weird ordering a "biscuit sandwich", but I'd probably feel weird ordering a "McGriddle Sandwich". And regardless of the kind of burger, "burger sandwich" feels like completely wrong, even though either one alone would be acceptable ("I'd like a number 3, just the sandwich" or "I'd like a number 3, just the burger" is fine, but "I'd like a number 3, just the burger sandwich" feels UGH).

[Some Android]

I wonder if the "heated debate" that Some Android was referring to arose from Americans and non-Americans each forcefully asserting that their differing interpretation of the word "sandwich" was correct.

Everyone in the "debate" was an American born and raised. (debate starts around 1 hr 27 min)

[BannedInSchool]

If we allow a hamburger to be a sandwich then so will be a hot dog in a bun, and that can not be.

[Razade]

There is always argument to be had - because the definitions of words on the internet are subject to the way the words are ordinarily used by most people. Especially true when the "definition" you find may differ depending which localised version of google you use to find it.

I think the word sandwich means something a little different in USA, to other parts of the English speaking world (such as where I am from. In that regard I note that the Wikipedia page on "Sandwich" says this:


I also know that Subway markets their products as sandwiches in USA, but not where I come from, simply because their product does not come within the normally understood use of the word here.

I wonder if the "heated debate" that Some Android was referring to arose from Americans and non-Americans each forcefully asserting that their differing interpretation of the word "sandwich" was correct.

Just another example of the United States improving the language. Getting rid of useless u's. Making the language less anal about definitions. Really, the United States needs a medal for cleaning up a perfectly serviceable language for the rest of you.

[Strigon]

If we allow a hamburger to be a sandwich then so will be a hot dog in a bun, and that can not be.

Seconded.
Today, it's hamburgers. Tomorrow, hot dogs and sausages; soon enough, pizza is an open-faced sandwich!

Seriously, though, those things surrounding a burger? Yeah, they're not slices of bread. They're two halves of a bun. There is a difference, and I challenge anyone who cares to disagree to a round of fisticuffs!

Edit:

Just another example of the United States improving the language. Getting rid of useless u's. Making the language less anal about definitions. Really, the United States needs a metal for cleaning up a perfectly serviceable language for the rest of you.

What? What?
Listen here, Yank, I'll have none of that nonsense. Show up late to no less than two wars, and then talk about improving the language? Bah!
All in jest, of course. Well, except for the part about it being nonsense; I stand by that.

[Liquor Box]

Just another example of the United States improving the language. Getting rid of useless u's. Making the language less anal about definitions. Really, the United States needs a metal for cleaning up a perfectly serviceable language for the rest of you.

You certainly get a metal for unintentional irony.

[Razade]

What? What?
Listen here, Yank, I'll have none of that nonsense. Show up late to no less than two wars, and then talk about improving the language? Bah!

Wie gefällt Ihnen diese Freiheit?

Oh sorry, I figured I should speak to you in the language you would have been speaking if it weren't for us.
Totally, I don't care if you're wrong about hamburgers not being sandwiches or your funny u's.

You certainly get a metal for unintentional irony.

I know what I'm about.

[Winter_Wolf]

Riddle me this: if I take that same patty of ground beef and used two slices of bread instead of a bun (it happens), is it more or less of a sandwich? If it is ground beef with say taco seasoning and salsa and use bread instead of a tortilla, is it not a sandwich?

Also, when you get or make a meatball sub (sandwich), it's a long loaf of bread that often isn't fully cut in two, so as to attempt to keep at least a little sauce inside the sandwich. How is that loaf of bread significantly different than say quality hotdog buns, other than being larger?

But perhaps most important of all, how great are the lives of people debating what is and is not a sandwich? Because if this is an actual topic requiring debate, then this is the kind of thing that is a step beyond "first world problems."

By the way, I've had a pizza sandwich. Literally a slice of pizza between two slices of bread. Alcohol may have been a factor. Still tasted good.

[Anderlith]

What do non-americans call sub sandwiches? It's not two slices from a loaf its an entire loaf.

Sandwich is a general, breadlike object with meat & such (doesnt even really need meat (i.e. PB&J)

A burger is a specific type of sandwich, just like a sub

[Keltest]

If we allow a hamburger to be a sandwich then so will be a hot dog in a bun, and that can not be.

A properly crafted hot dog is not "between" two pieces of bread, but instead resting in a gap in one singular piece of bread, which only becomes two pieces due to mishandling.

[golentan]

Of course a hamburger is a sandwich.

And it's good to know Team Four Star has a fan base.

[Knaight]

If somebody asked me directly, as you are doing now, I would answer yes. If somebody asked me if I wanted a sandwich, then came back 20 minutes later with a hamburger, I would be very confused, and possibly annoyed.

I'm the same - my immediate answer isn't "yes" but "technically, yes", inasmuch as while it fits within the broader definition the term isn't used because of the more specific one. It's like someone describing a square as a quadrilateral - that's absolutely the case, but if you're using that term at all it tends to imply something a little less regular.

[Liquor Box]

What do non-americans call sub sandwiches? It's not two slices from a loaf its an entire loaf.

Sandwich is a general, breadlike object with meat & such (doesnt even really need meat (i.e. PB&J)

A burger is a specific type of sandwich, just like a sub

A roll usually.

[Domino Quartz]

I consider a hamburger to be a specific class of sandwich, although I wouldn't normally think of it that way.

[Anderlith]

A roll usually.

So you would go to Subway & eat a "roll" with swiss & ham on it?

[Fri]

Pretty sure yes. For example, my irish friend eat "breakfast roll" which is basically subway sandwich I guess.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakfast_roll

But since subway specifically call their restaurant a "Sandwich restaurant" it'd make sense if you enter there to ask for a sandwich, no need for be pedantic for that.

[Anderlith]

Pretty sure yes. For example, my irish friend eat "breakfast roll" which is basically subway sandwich I guess.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakfast_roll

But since subway specifically call their restaurant a "Sandwich restaurant" it'd make sense if you enter there to ask for a sandwich, no need for be pedantic for that.

Wasnt trying to be pedantic. Legitimately asking. I see rolls as small soft tiny bread lumps, I dont visualize them as containing much of anything besides butter. Now my family does use them as tiny sandwiches occationally but this doesnt change my reactive visual being a plain bread lump. So calling a sub a roll is interesting. Especially since I always thought a roll would be round & not cylindrical given its name implies it rolls or was rolled.

Take for example cake, most people visualize soft sweet bread with icing i.e. a birthday cake, not a gram cracker crust & creamy filling like a cheesecake, cheesecake should actually be cheesepie.

Leading back to my first question is, just because it's on a bun & not two slices of bread a burger is still a sandwich in the same way a sub is a sandwich even tough it uses an entire loaf

[Ninja_Prawn]

I think the word sandwich means something a little different in USA, to other parts of the English speaking world.

As a Brit, I agree. I would never consider a hamburger to be a sandwich. If it wasn't cooked, it'd be a bun or a bap (or maybe barm) depending on where in the country I was. And yes, the things in Subway are definitely rolls. Or paninis if they're on crusty/French bread. Though I would add that the influence of the Subway chain has led to most people calling their products 'subs'.

Also, as far as I'm concerned, a sandwich can't be cooked. It becomes a toastie if you cook it.

How do you yanks get by with only one word for all these different foodstuffs?

[golentan]

As a Brit, I agree. I would never consider a hamburger to be a sandwich. If it wasn't cooked, it'd be a bun or a bap (or maybe barm) depending on where in the country I was. And yes, the things in Subway are definitely rolls. Or paninis if they're on crusty/French bread. Though I would add that the influence of the Subway chain has led to most people calling their products 'subs'.

Also, as far as I'm concerned, a sandwich can't be cooked. It becomes a toastie if you cook it.

How do you yanks get by with only one word for all these different foodstuffs?

I dunno, how do you brits refer to so many things as "Puddings?"

You've got your umbrella term, which is sandwich, and then you've got all the different subgroups. Hoagies, subs, burgers, cheesesteaks, panini, and so, so many more.

And Subway named their chain for the Submarine Sandwich style, AKA a "Sub," not vice versa.

[Ninja_Prawn]

And Subway named their chain for the Submarine Sandwich style, AKA a "Sub," not vice versa.

Yeah, I get that, but what I mean is, the term wasn't in common use here before Subway cane along. We would have called them 'rolls' before that. Possibly 'submarine roll', but the shortening of that would be 'roll'. And still, if someone said 'sub' to me today, I would assume they meant that one chain specifically.

[Wardog]

As a Brit, I agree. I would never consider a hamburger to be a sandwich. If it wasn't cooked, it'd be a bun or a bap (or maybe barm) depending on where in the country I was.

Ditto. Also, in British use, "burger" can mean the patty itself ("patty" rarely being used in the UK - I went though most of my life without ever hearing the word). Arguably the roll etc is just what a burger comes in by default.

[Fri]

How do you yanks get by with only one word for all these different foodstuffs?

Amusingly, my language does have originally only one catchall word for all "snack pastry." You know what I mean? Basically stuff you don't eat for an actual meal, there's one catchall for that. It's the equivalent of cake. Amusingly, that means "bread" can be called that depending on what it's for. Like, if you have a loaf of sweet bread you meant to use for your lunch it'll be "bread" but if you're going to eat it for snacking later it'll be a "cake."

Also, old people (in my childhood people used to still do it) call any protein part of a meal "the fish." So if someone ask you in lunch. "What's your fish?" and you answer "chicken." That's a legitimate conversation

[factotum]

Brit here, and yes, I wouldn't consider a hamburger a sandwich. "Sub" wasn't a commonly used phrase here before Subway opened up. If we did consider having an entire loaf cut in half and with fillings before they came along it would almost certainly have been a French stick, and I think it would still have been referred to as that after having the fillings inserted.

[Coidzor]

As a Brit, I agree. I would never consider a hamburger to be a sandwich. If it wasn't cooked, it'd be a bun or a bap (or maybe barm) depending on where in the country I was. And yes, the things in Subway are definitely rolls. Or paninis if they're on crusty/French bread. Though I would add that the influence of the Subway chain has led to most people calling their products 'subs'.

Also, as far as I'm concerned, a sandwich can't be cooked. It becomes a toastie if you cook it.

I find it very confusing how someone can use words like "bap" and "barm" and "toastie" and yet care that strongly that a hamburger cannot and must not be a sandwich.

Although in retrospect, calling something a panini when it isn't even a pressed, grilled sandwich is probably the most consternating thing here.

How do you yanks get by with only one word for all these different foodstuffs?

Because the differences are much less than you apparently have built up in your head.

Also, please don't actually use that word to refer to us unironically, it just sounds silly.