Erfworld Thread X: A Series of Unfortunate Cliffhangers

[Whispri]

I do believe we've sighted SKIPsign.

[guttering flame]

http://www.erfworld.com/blog/view/58899/important

This sounds bad. I felt Rob talked too much about business at a time like this actually. {Scrubbed}

As far as the comic goes, he wants to keep going but with more art per page and shorter text pages. The comic might become better due to this.

[-D-]

This sounds bad. I felt Rob talked too much about business at a time like this actually. Actually, what happened to Obama's healthcare plan? It sounds like their health plan sucks bigtime. (I'm not an American)

As far as the comic goes, he wants to keep going but with more art per page and shorter text pages. The comic might become better due to this.

{Scrubbed}

I hope very best for Linda and Rob.

[Anteros]

Liver cancer is no joke. Health care plans are pretty irrelevant. It's not something you can just throw money at. Especially if it's progressed to the point where she's having the symptoms Rob describes.

I didn't bother reading the part of the post about comic updates and finances, and I'm not going to be crass enough to comment on it when someone just found out their wife had cancer. If Erfworld ends because of this then it ends.

Here's hoping she manages to beat the odds and makes a full recovery.

[Divayth Fyr]

Liver cancer is no joke. Health care plans are pretty irrelevant. It's not something you can just throw money at.

While true, having whatever treatments the doctors decide on covered by your plan allows you to focus on the person treated, instead of having to work out where to get the money. And the sums that may be required can be quite large.

[tomaO2]

{Scrubbed}

[keybounce]

{Scrubbed}

[Welf]

This is sad news. I googled it.

[Killer Angel]

This is sad news. I googled it.

I had no need to google it. I already know by personal experience... and the person didn't make that "hell of a saving throw", to quote Balder.

I just hope Linda will be luckier.

[DigoDragon]

New Page already?

Spoiler: 316

Show

This is why I dislike other temples showing up, such as Shirley. I enjoyed the rapport Charlie had with his archons, where they filled him in on news around Erfworld and then Charlie comes up with plans based on the intel gathered. Here, Shirley just...pulls the plug on anything charlie can do (literally in this scene). More hindrance to the story plot's movement than anything.

Well, if anything, at least we now have a plot point that Hamster's side is broke and might not be able to pay upkeep next round. It's potentially something we can see Parson think his way out of with creative use of rules. Guess we'll see what happens?

[MReav]

Spoiler

Show

How is Charlie able to lift his hand in the picture? Is he in Thinkspace?

[HandofShadows]

New Page already?

More than even they need the income.

[Fyraltari]

Spoiler

Show

How is Charlie able to lift his hand in the picture? Is he in Thinkspace?

The baby suit and hanging-toy (don't know how it's said in english) archon would suggest so, yes.

[deuterio12]

Stanley: I started as a piker, I love to hit stuff in melee.
Jed: Cool, how about I introduce you this tribe of piker elves?

Spoiler

Show

Charlie: I started as a carnymancer, I love to cheat the system.
Shirley: I'm afraid I can't let you do that Charlie.

And since Charlie's disabled, he now can't do anything besides remain locked in the darkness, with only Shirley's voice to haunt him.

[zimmerwald1915]

hanging-toy (don't know how it's said in english)

"Mobile." Pronounced "mo-BEEL."

[Douglas]

Stanley: I started as a piker, I love to hit stuff in melee.
Jed: Cool, how about I introduce you this tribe of piker elves?

Spoiler

Show

Charlie: I started as a carnymancer, I love to cheat the system.
Shirley: I'm afraid I can't let you do that Charlie.

And since Charlie's disabled, he now can't do anything besides remain locked in the darkness, with only Shirley's voice to haunt him.

On the other hand, without Shirley it's likely that Charlie would still be stuck in despair, thinking he's lost unrecoverably.

[deuterio12]

He would've snaped out of it, sometimes you just need some hours cut off from the world.

But if Charlie can't even use his tricks anymore, what's exactly left for him? Spending an eternity trapped in the dark inside Shirley, unable to ever touch the arkendish again? That is the true unrecoverable loss.

[Jasdoif]

New Page already?

The news post did say he opted to hold off on Friday's intended update until today.

[tomaO2]

Lame update. Charlie has been "stealing" from the source for thousands of turns, and it's not like Shirley didn't know Charlie was "stealing" either. My best understanding of her is that she thought that it was okay to do so, and the only reason she doesn't now is because Jed told her that she needs to pay it back. Why does Jed know this? I dunno. I personally feel that Jed doesn't care, and would have no issues doing it himself, just like he wants to copy Charlie's portal cheat, but he's just saying anything he can to get Charlie in trouble. The most logical thing to do here is to shelve the issue until the end of turn, when they can focus on it properly, not just shut things down, and messing everything up again.

I know Rob can do foreshadowing. So, assuming that this really is as bad as is being suggested, how about drop some hints beforehand on what the big deal is? What is stealing from the source? What are the effects? Does everyone suffer from doing it? Is Wanda stealing with her zero upkeep decrypted? What about the big think that stole juice to bring all these towers to life and stuff?

This is crap, and I say this as someone that doesn't even like Charlie. Shirley is rapidly becoming one of the most annoying characters in Erfworld. Right after Jillian and Wanda. Charlie is a carny, their whole point is to cheat. That is their reason for being, and they were created by the titans too. If the titans didn't want people to cheat, they could have prevented it. Who the hell is this woman to try and say that he should just stop doing it?

There better be some really good answers for this little bit of railroading.

Well, now we got it all set up, Charlie has lost all connection with TV, no more super speed conversations, and he's just clearly too distracted to do the logical thing, which is cut his losses there and kill Caesar before someone rescues him. I mean, heaven forbid he does something that leads to a clear win, for once. Every damn thing he has done, since the start of the series, has backfired in some way. Except when it involved helping Jillian, naturally. Jillian is the true final boss.

[Aquillion]

Jed did seem to legitimately think stealing from the source was a problem (he mentioned it in the update where he yanked Parson back) - although it's odd to think that a tower could, if they wanted, apparently provide unlimited juice to any caster on their side.

Stanley: I started as a piker, I love to hit stuff in melee.
Jed: Cool, how about I introduce you this tribe of piker elves?

Spoiler

Show

Charlie: I started as a carnymancer, I love to cheat the system.
Shirley: I'm afraid I can't let you do that Charlie.

And since Charlie's disabled, he now can't do anything besides remain locked in the darkness, with only Shirley's voice to haunt him.

Remember, every tower other than Jed was created by Big Think with an explicit goal of "make people stop cheating." Jed was fine with Stanley doing that because that's the kind of think a leader is supposed to do. An infinite-energy hack, on the other hand, is not what a leader is supposed to do.

[Zalabim]

If there is someone that can give permission to tap the Source for juice, the arkendish would be the Tool to contact that one. If it's just a matter of negotiation, Charlie should be well equipped to still get what he wants once it's all said and done. Meanwhile, Jed is worried about paying for all of the side's upkeep while paying back the Source thanks to the loss of the gems in Charlie's totally fair (but not nice) move at TV. Maybe this is where the arkenhammer pays for itself, or maybe this gets solved with schmuckers from their TV ally, but it certainly has a solution in sight. Either way, this all seems like a temporary setback to explain the movement of pieces right now, with the long-term consequence just being everyone has less money.

"Mobile." Pronounced "mo-BEEL."

Just the perfect kind of thing to tease Charlie with.

[deuterio12]

Remember, every tower other than Jed was created by Big Think with an explicit goal of "make people stop cheating."

I may've missed that between all the STRINGSTRINGSTRINGSTRINGSTRINGS and "KILL US AND WE SHALL RETURN STRONGER THAN YOU COULD POSSIBLY IMAGINE!!!" bits. Had the impression they basically just went mad and were awakening cities for the lulz and disrupting the statuos quo.

Plus how could they even make sure that the awakened cities would be anti-cheating? Why do they all have so different personalities then? Did the omni-mind even know about the Source and that taking energy from it was cheating? That's like a 50 step Xanatos Gambit to me, too many unknown variables for how the awakened cities would turn out.

Jed was fine with Stanley doing that because that's the kind of think a leader is supposed to do. An infinite-energy hack, on the other hand, is not what a leader is supposed to do.

Finally, somebody who agrees that Stanley going to recruit the clown elves was the proper move for a leader!

Still GK has the zero-upkeep hack with the decrypted, but Jed doesn't seem to be in any hurry to lockdown Wanda.

[guttering flame]

Plus how could they even make sure that the awakened cities would be anti-cheating? Why do they all have so different personalities then? Did the omni-mind even know about the Source and that taking energy from it was cheating? That's like a 50 step Xanatos Gambit to me, too many unknown variables for how the awakened cities would turn out.

Wasn't it the World/Fate that wanted uber-mind to make the Temples? It was the Dollamancer and Dirtmancer that wanted to awaken the Towers. The Ubermind only started making them after both Charlescomm and Gobwin Konb were Templed.

Finally, somebody who agrees that Stanley going to recruit the clown elves was the proper move for a leader!

Still GK has the zero-upkeep hack with the decrypted, but Jed doesn't seem to be in any hurry to lockdown Wanda.

And the Dwagons freely give away their loyalty to the Hammer wielder and the Archons are fanatically devoted to Charlie thanks to the Dish. Those are natural Tital Tools qualities, not a cable-hack to steal power from a Portal.

[deuterio12]

If the titans could make the arkenpliers produce zero-upkeep units, couldn't they have made the portals work on zero energy too? That way there would be nothing to steal.

If the titans didn't want it to be exploited, they could've made the rules cover it.

Like they made bedrock impossible to produce outside of bedrock level so that you can't have bedrock armor and stuff.

Who the cities think they are to divine the intentions of the titans that something is working as intended, and something else is an hax exploit that must earn a penalty? They even made a whole magic discipline about cheating-carnymancy!

[guttering flame]

If the titans could make the arkenpliers produce zero-upkeep units, couldn't they have made the portals work on zero energy too? That way there would be nothing to steal.

If the titans didn't want it to be exploited, they could've made the rules cover it.

Like they made bedrock impossible to produce outside of bedrock level so that you can't have bedrock armor and stuff.

Who the cities think they are to divine the intentions of the titans that something is working as intended, and something else is an hax exploit that must earn a penalty? They even made a whole magic discipline about cheating-carnymancy!

The Tools purpose as far as we know is to be used. The Portal's power's source purpose is to power the portals. Not the lightbulbs in Charlie's city.

They're Temples (for the Titans I assume). You get divine revelations at your temple.

As for carnymancy, who knows. They're good at cheating, though not that good, they can't win against Fate. But they're also entertainers and story-tellers. Maybe that's what their titanic purpose was originally.

[Aquillion]

Finally, somebody who agrees that Stanley going to recruit the clown elves was the proper move for a leader!

I don't know whether it was an ideal thing to do (he put himself at risk), but it was at least reasonable and, more importantly for this discussion, fit into Erfworld's "intentions", which the towers seem to back up.

Still GK has the zero-upkeep hack with the decrypted, but Jed doesn't seem to be in any hurry to lockdown Wanda.

The pliers are supposed to do that, though - she's just using them the way they were designed to be used. It's not really a "hack" at all.

I suspect that Carniemancers were intended to cheat in specific, limited ways.

Also, again, it's important to remember that the towers were created by the Great Minds specifically to punish Charlie. It's not that surprising that even Charlie's tower would interpret things in a way unfavorable to him and that the towers as a whole would have rules that don't mesh with Charlie's MO. Even though they didn't create Jed, logically the Great Minds wouldn't have created a bunch of towers if they didn't think doing so would cause Charlie massive problems down the road.

[-D-]

As for carnymancy, who knows. They're good at cheating, though not that good, they can't win against Fate. But they're also entertainers and story-tellers. Maybe that's what their titanic purpose was originally.

Well, think of it logically, who would be the one most attuned to understand the stories and attempt to modify them? Those who believe Fate is immutable or those who know, Fate is a story you convince yourself?

[DigoDragon]

The news post did say he opted to hold off on Friday's intended update until today.

I guess I didn't expect it to be first thing in the morning. Got used to late evenings. ^^;

[Jasdoif]

Who the cities think they are to divine the intentions of the titans that something is working as intended, and something else is an hax exploit that must earn a penalty?

Maybe they acquired the technique from royal sides.

[Anteros]

Maybe they acquired the technique from royal sides.

Well, the Arkentool wielders do the same thing. Everyone but Charlie and Parson seem really dedicated to deluding themselves that they're following the Titan's will.