Questionable Content 11: It's Like Seeing a Unicorn

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I still don't understand why Taffy had to be added to the mix in the first place. Why not bring back Marigold instead?

Why would Marigold be hired by Hannelore's mom?

GW

[Fawkes]

Maybe she needs someone assassinated in World of Warcraft.

[Max_Killjoy]

Why would Marigold be hired by Hannelore's mom?

GW

Why do we need a character hired by Hannalore's mom?

It's not like this story is all that interesting or entertaining, at least so far. It's just "how will Taffilly react oddly today" and "how will Hanner's mom be a raging evil ***** to everyone around her today" so far.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Why do we need a character hired by Hannalore's mom?

It's not like this story is all that interesting or entertaining, at least so far. It's just "how will Taffilly react oddly today" and "how will Hanner's mom be a raging evil ***** to everyone around her today" so far.

1) We don't get to "need" anything. You don't like a story, stop reading it. You do not get to declare that the author is your bitch and has to do what you "need" him to.

ETA:

Dropping in to say, "This scene is pointless," neither addresses any possible reasons I may have had for including it nor outweighs the opinion of those readers who are enjoying it, so I dismiss it without further consideration.

2) I was responding to a very specific post saying that the character could be replaced with Marigold.

Grey Wolf

[Yana]

Why would Marigold be hired by Hannelore's mom?

GW

I was thinking more in terms of "why did we need a story about a new character supporting another character who hasn't been around for at least 5 years and was never a major character in the first place when we could have a story about a well-liked character who has an existing rapport with Hannelore who also hasn't been seen in awhile."

Let's not get snippy on my behalf.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I was thinking more in terms of "why did we need a story about a new character supporting another character who hasn't been around for at least 5 years and was never a major character in the first place when we could have a story about a well-liked character who has an existing rapport with Hannelore who also hasn't been seen in awhile.".

Presumably because whatever character growth Jeph is intending would not work with Marigold rather than Taffy.

GW

[Keltest]

Presumably because whatever character growth Jeph is intending would not work with Marigold rather than Taffy.

GW

I think you are confusing Jeph with the Giant. Jeph has, numerous times, just included additional characters because he felt like drawing them, and then dropped them shortly later. For example, Brun. Or worse, he doesn't drop them, and they keep returning to be bizarre, like Barry.

I enjoy QC, but lets not pretend its anything other than what it is.

[Max_Killjoy]

1) We don't get to "need" anything. You don't like a story, stop reading it. You do not get to declare that the author is your bitch and has to do what you "need" him to.

Wow. OK.



That escalated quickly and with no actual relationship to what was actually posted by anyone here.

Oh well.


E: Let me phrase it another way, that hopefully won't evidently trigger something -- what is the author hoping to accomplish with the addition of this Tillaffy / Taffilly character? What new things about the existing characters was the author hoping to tell us? How does this progress the overall story or the stories of the existing characters?

[Traab]

Wow. OK.



That escalated quickly and with no actual relationship to what was actually posted by anyone here.

Oh well.


E: Let me phrase it another way, that hopefully won't evidently trigger something -- what is the author hoping to accomplish with the addition of this Tillaffy / Taffilly character? What new things about the existing characters was the author hoping to tell us? How does this progress the overall story or the stories of the existing characters?

The author is introducing this new character, most likely in an attempt to help hannelore grow as a person. She need to learn how to deal with all sorts of garbage. There is no "overall story" its not OotS, its a slice of life story with AI and strange people. And as I said, its probably to help advance hannerlore as a character, or maybe even deal with her mother as more than a cardboard cutout of a james bond villain.

[Hackman]

E: Let me phrase it another way, that hopefully won't evidently trigger something -- what is the author hoping to accomplish with the addition of this Tillaffy / Taffilly character? What new things about the existing characters was the author hoping to tell us? How does this progress the overall story or the stories of the existing characters?

Well, the allosauruses have to be fed occasionally.

[AvatarVecna]

Is it possible to "overcorrect" in terms of representation in a particular work?

*cough*Sinfest!*cough*

[dps]

Because mentally ill people are people and deserve to have just as many stories told about them as neurotypical people have?

I'm not sure that anyone "deserves" to have fictional stories told about them, exactly.

The problem here, though, isn't that there are mentally ill characters in the comic. The problem is that the comic already has a lot of characters with issues, but many of the long-established characters were still relatable and there were good stories being told about them. Even characters who seriously lacked social skills, like Marigold, or those who clearly had serious mental health issues, like Hannelore, were kept relatable. Generally, characters who weren't relatable were clearly secondary characters, such as the Vespa Avenger, or were strictly comic relief, like Pintsize.

In contrast, a lot of the more recently introduced characters, such as Brun, Emily, and Tilly, seem to just be weird for the sake of weirdness. They aren't relatable, nor are they particularly amusing, but they're given major story arcs and a lot of "screen time".

[Fawkes]

Brun at least was at least a somewhat convincing portrayal of someone who was somewhere on the autism spectrum. Unfortunately she also happened to also be generally unpleasant and prone to violence.

There's no real portrayal of mental illness with Taffy. She's just hijinx style wacky to the point of unpleasantness.

[Max_Killjoy]

Brun at least was at least a somewhat convincing portrayal of someone who was somewhere on the autism spectrum. Unfortunately she also happened to also be generally unpleasant and prone to violence.

There's no real portrayal of mental illness with Taffy. She's just hijinx style wacky to the point of unpleasantness.

Indeed, some people are just annoying, or ill-adjusted, or unpleasant, without it being a mental illness or "atypical neurology".

[Shadow of the Sun]

The Taffy storyline so far has been at a detriment to characters I'm actually interested in. Specifically, Faye and Bubbles, and Clinton, Brun, and Elliot.

I know a lot of people don't like Brun, but as someone on the spectrum myself, I enjoyed her portrayal.

Taffy... seems like Jeph came up with a cute design and wanted to shoehorn it into the story and kludged together a "oh she was hired by Hanners' mum" thing. Stuff like this is exactly why Bleach became terrible - the author was great at creating visually interesting characters but terrible at actually telling stories with them, so they'd introduce a character, show them off for a bit, and then just ignore them when they realized they didn't have anything for the character in mind or had moved on to a new character to introduce.

[Cikomyr]

*cough*Sinfest!*cough*

Hey AvatarVecna, do you remember the origin of the post you use in your signature?

I remember it being hilarious. But thats it.

[Lethologica]

Hey AvatarVecna, do you remember the origin of the post you use in your signature?

I remember it being hilarious. But thats it.

Here you go

[Yana]

Error 404: Empathy for pointless character still not found.

[eee]

Oh, for pity's sake, Tilly!

The order to disregard Hanner's preferences was so she, who would automatically refuse a personal assistant, would have no choice but to have one around for at least a limited time and so could determine if yes, such a person MIGHT be useful. You're not supposed to KEEP disregarding her instructions in all things, just the one to go away. If you don't understand that, then jumping in the ocean actually is warranted.

Either she has a major personally pivot and stops being such a Tilly, or this is going to be a LONG week.

[Keltest]

Oh, for pity's sake, Tilly!

The order to disregard Hanner's preferences was so she, who would automatically refuse a personal assistant, would have no choice but to have one around for at least a limited time and so could determine if yes, such a person MIGHT be useful. You're not supposed to KEEP disregarding her instructions in all things, just the one to go away. If you don't understand that, then jumping in the ocean actually is warranted.

Either she has a major personally pivot and stops being such a Tilly, or this is going to be a LONG week.

Yeah, seriously. Do you even understand what a personal assistant is supposed to do, Tilly? Following instructions and facilitating the desires of the assisted is practically the entire job.

[Fawkes]

Do you even understand what a personal assistant is supposed to do, Tilly? Following instructions and facilitating the desires of the assisted is practically the entire job.

I'm unsure if Jeph understands what a personal assistant is supposed to do.

[PhantomFox]

While I can understand Tilly's mindset, I don't approve of it, but it seems like it'll get a correction pretty soon.
Tilly Thought 1: Help Hanners in any way, shape, or form possible (Because job, and to prove usefulness, plus self-worth boost?)
Tilly Thought 2: Hanners doesn't want a PA, but any objections to that may be safely ignored as per orders.
Tilly Conclusion: Be the personal assistant version of a smothering mother (smother?) because this is her job and she knows the best how to do it.
Hypothetical analysis: She has Hanners on a VERY high pedestal, which Hanners dislikes, but Tilly doesn't realize that due to serving a strong corporate power that ENJOYS that for so long.
Tilly Realization: While given authorization to do so, she's crossed a line that is proving detrimental to service.

[Shadow of the Sun]

Okay, so what I think when I see Taffy is: "Jeph really liked the character Lotte from Little Witch Academia and so made a character that's visually inspired by her without any actual bloody plans for what to do with her".

[AvatarVecna]

Hey AvatarVecna, do you remember the origin of the post you use in your signature?

I remember it being hilarious. But thats it.

Quotes come with little buttons next to the quoted person's name, if it helps in the future.

[Dukkai]

I'm not sure that anyone "deserves" to have fictional stories told about them, exactly.

The problem here, though, isn't that there are mentally ill characters in the comic. The problem is that the comic already has a lot of characters with issues, but many of the long-established characters were still relatable and there were good stories being told about them. Even characters who seriously lacked social skills, like Marigold, or those who clearly had serious mental health issues, like Hannelore, were kept relatable. Generally, characters who weren't relatable were clearly secondary characters, such as the Vespa Avenger, or were strictly comic relief, like Pintsize.

In contrast, a lot of the more recently introduced characters, such as Brun, Emily, and Tilly, seem to just be weird for the sake of weirdness. They aren't relatable, nor are they particularly amusing, but they're given major story arcs and a lot of "screen time".

This.

At one point, this comic just went from one that is portraying, in an amusing fashion, everyday struggles and ordinary (a bit weird) characters to one that is downright silly and wacky and lacking actual content.

I mean, just to illustrate one thing (ordinary before vs wacky now): at one point, almost all the characters were in relationships and most of them were straight with Tai being poly-amorous/gay and Marten's father and Maurice being a gay couple. Now, almost all characters are in a relationship and (unless I'm missing someone) only one relationship is straight (Dale/Marigold). Hannelore is asexual, Dora/Tai, Marthen's father/Maurice and Marten/Claire are gay relationships, Bubbles seemingly has a crush on Faye and it seems like the comic was also guiding Clinton and Elliot towards one another.
It almost feels like the author wants to have each type of relationship represented in the comic which, while commendable, is also something that disconnects the reader from the comic, as he is not able to identify himself with the characters.

P.S. I'm not a native speaker so I apologize if some phrasing is a bit clunky.

P.P.S I just remembered that Marten's mom is in a straight relationship, forgot about that.

[Max_Killjoy]

First, I don't think Martin/Claire can so easily be identified as a "gay" relationship.

Second, I'll never understand this notion that a work of fiction needs "characters I can identify with" in order for the reader to connect with what's going on.

[georgie_leech]

First, I don't think Martin/Claire can so easily be identified as a "gay" relationship.

Second, I'll never understand this notion that a work of fiction needs "characters I can identify with" in order for the reader to connect with what's going on.

More to the point, I always thought that meant we interpreted characters through the lens of our own experiences. Like,I've never been tasked with saving the world by tossing a ring in a volcano, but I can certainly relate to feeling duty-bound to see a task through that I feel is way beyond my abilities. Things like whether he's gay or straight or short or a different species are sort of incidental to those things. In other cases, part of the point is "these people that seem different have problems much like yours;" I don't need to be a lesbian to understand Dora and Tai's relationship struggles, because problems with control or the like are sort of independent of the homosexual part.

I certainly get that it's easier to identify with people more similar to yourself than not, but I don't think that means everyone should match who you see yourself as. It's just helpful to have someone that can act as a jumping off point as a reader. Like, I totally identified with Martin's struggles with motivation and being a doormat, which helped me care about him. And as part of that I cared about his relationships, which means I started caring about his friends, and their relationships, which means I started caring about those people, and oh look, it's 3:00 in the morning and I've just binged the entire archive

[Dukkai]

First, I don't think Martin/Claire can so easily be identified as a "gay" relationship.

Second, I'll never understand this notion that a work of fiction needs "characters I can identify with" in order for the reader to connect with what's going on.

1) Ok, Marten is in a relationship with a transsexual. While it may not be a "gay" relationship, I think we can agree that it is not exactly a common occurrence :)

2) Well, yes and no. I mean, except for autobiographies and similar works, everything is, to some degree, a work of fiction. Relatable characters and "characters people can identify with" are what separates crap fiction from good fiction, in my humble opinion. In order to connect with what is going on, I need to connect with the character so I (to some extent) care about what happens to him/her and around him/her. If I have a bunch of characters I do not care about what happens or what is going on with them, the story as such becomes dull and boring, similar to when you read a book and flip through the pages just to get to a part that is interesting or that is connected to the character you find interesting.

[Cikomyr]

Here you go

Quotes come with little buttons next to the quoted person's name, if it helps in the future.

Much appreciatee, gentlemen. Or ladies. Or else.

"I am Ozymandia. Lol"

Its an instant classic.

[Dukkai]

:snip:

just to be clear, I'm not trying to bash on whether someone is gay or not, I have nothing against it. I just wanted to point out a segment of the comic that I find was indicative how the comic has changed from something everyday to something that is a bit out there.