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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Contemplative and broken interpretations

    Spells per Day/Spells Known: A contemplative who was previously a spellcaster continues to gain access to more powerful divine magic while following the contemplative path. Thus, when a new contemplative level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if she had also gained a level in the spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained (improved chance of controlling or rebuking undead, more frequent remove disease, and so on). This essentially means that she adds the level of contemplative to the level of whatever other spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day accordingly.
    If a character had more than one divine spellcasting class before she became a contemplative, the player must decide which class to assign each level of contemplative for the purpose of determining divine spells per day and spells known. If the contemplative did not previously belong to a divine spellcasting class, she gains the ability to cast divine spells exactly as a cleric of her patron deity. Her spell progression is the same as that of a cleric.
    Now if a straight wizard takes a single level in contemplative he gains a level of casting in wizard and can also cast spells like a level 1 cleric.
    They never says that you do not apply the bonus to your previous spellcasting class if it is not divine and it is not written "as she had also gained a level in the divine spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class" but rather "as she had also gained a level in the spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class" and then there is nothing in the complete text that says that you can not add that casting level to a non divine class.

    Then it says that if the character had no levels in a divine spellcasting class then the character gains "the ability to cast divine spells exactly as a cleric of her patron deity. Her spell progression is the same as that of a cleric"
    And it is written nowhere that is replace the spellcasting advancement.
    Now you can say that there is a table saying otherwise but you know that the text trumps the table.
    What is sure is that if you try to interpret that way this text your gm will definitively throw books at you and will never accept your character.
    Last edited by noob; 2017-10-17 at 03:08 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    AsteriskAmp's Avatar

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    Default Re: Contemplative and broken interpretations

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    Now if a straight wizard takes a single level in contemplative he gains a level of casting in wizard and can also cast spells like a level 1 cleric.
    They never says that you do not apply the bonus to your previous spellcasting class if it is not divine and it is not written "as she had also gained a level in the divine spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class" but rather "as she had also gained a level in the spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class" and then there is nothing in the complete text that says that you can not add that casting level to a non divine class.

    Then it says that if the character had no levels in a divine spellcasting class then the character gains "the ability to cast divine spells exactly as a cleric of her patron deity. Her spell progression is the same as that of a cleric"
    And it is written nowhere that is replace the spellcasting advancement.
    Now you can say that there is a table saying otherwise but you know that the text trumps the table.
    What is sure is that if you try to interpret that way this text your gm will definitively throw books at you and will never accept your character.
    The prerequisites for contemplative:
    Quote Originally Posted by Requirements
    Skills: Knowledge (religion) 13 ranks
    Spells: Able to cast 1st-level divine spells.
    Special: Must have had direct contact with one?s patron deity or a direct servant of that deity, or with an enlightened being embodying the highest principles of an alignment (a solar, for example).
    The table also explicitly states that it adds to your previous level in divine casting class.
    Last edited by AsteriskAmp; 2017-10-17 at 05:42 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

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    Default Re: Contemplative and broken interpretations

    It's kind of weird that it requires divine spellcasting but has a line for non-divine spellcasters.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
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    Banned
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Contemplative and broken interpretations

    Yes, this works. The key is to find a friendly Cleric who is willing to cast imbue with spell ability on you so that you can cast divine spells (the other stuff is pretty trivial for a 10th level Wizard). You don't even have to worry about the issue of what happens if you lose prerequisites -- once you become a Contemplative, you get enough Cleric casting to meet the requirements.

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    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Contemplative and broken interpretations

    I think a Wizard with Southern Magician might also work to get in, and then get Cleric casting in addition to the +1 level of Wizard casting.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Contemplative and broken interpretations

    Rangers and Druids also cast Divine spells
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troacctid View Post
    But that's one of the things about interpreting RAW—when you pick a reading that goes against RAI, it often has a ripple effect that results in dysfunctions in other places.

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