D&D 5e Subclass Contest Chat Thread

[Damon_Tor]

Three way tie going into the last vote? Excellent work everyone, and I'm glad you liked what I came up with.

For this next one, I'm having a hard time thinking of anything except that one episode of Celebrity Jeopardy on SNL.

[MoleMage]

Three way tie going into the last vote? Excellent work everyone, and I'm glad you liked what I came up with.

For this next one, I'm having a hard time thinking of anything except that one episode of Celebrity Jeopardy on SNL.

I hear it in my head every time I have to type it out.

[Segev]

Hm. So, if I understand the next topic/theme, it's anything to do with writing or wordcraft? Geometer from 3.5 would have fit in, for instance? (Not going for that one, as it wouldn't be original, but it's an example.) Is the wizard in general? Obviously, being "a wizard subclass" by itself wouldn't suffice.

Ironically, Pact of the Tome probably fits (except I have learned that people don't consider Pacts to be subclasses).

[Lvl45DM!]

WELP I did mine. Lockdown is killing me haha. Any advice is appreciated. Particularly regarding strength. Dont want it too weak or strong.

The way I read the theme is that it has to be a class that focuses on writing. Pact of the Tome and Wizard are both good starts, but obviously you'd need a little more oomph. Tome of Ancient Secrets Invocation is closer to this than just the Tome Pact honestly. And Wizard writes sure, but like a wizard subclass would be about writing down his spells every day instead of memorising them, and reading every spell from a scroll.

Im trying to come up with an idea for every class. Some are harder than others. Monk and Druid are eluding me. Would being a tattooed monk count?

[Segev]

WELP I did mine. Lockdown is killing me haha. Any advice is appreciated. Particularly regarding strength. Dont want it too weak or strong.

The way I read the theme is that it has to be a class that focuses on writing. Pact of the Tome and Wizard are both good starts, but obviously you'd need a little more oomph. Tome of Ancient Secrets Invocation is closer to this than just the Tome Pact honestly. And Wizard writes sure, but like a wizard subclass would be about writing down his spells every day instead of memorising them, and reading every spell from a scroll.

Im trying to come up with an idea for every class. Some are harder than others. Monk and Druid are eluding me. Would being a tattooed monk count?

I like the inspiration for it; Hero is a great movie for the majority of it.

The theme is clear throughout. I worry that it is fighting itself as it progresses, though: you give wisdom replacing strength to various things as they level from 3rd through 7th. This means they need strength or need to be a finesse fighter for levels 1 and 2, and then abruptly no longer need strength or switch to bigger weapons at level 3. The level seven shift isn’t as bad, assuming grappling and other physical skill checks were of minor importance but now are climbing.

This... might work, anyway. Dex shift to Wis and bigger weapons...it does want mid to high Dex for its armor class after level 3. So giving them wis instead of strength just lets them upgrade from finesse weapons. Okay, not as bad as I initially feared.

[Lvl45DM!]

I like the inspiration for it; Hero is a great movie for the majority of it.

The theme is clear throughout. I worry that it is fighting itself as it progresses, though: you give wisdom replacing strength to various things as they level from 3rd through 7th. This means they need strength or need to be a finesse fighter for levels 1 and 2, and then abruptly no longer need strength or switch to bigger weapons at level 3. The level seven shift isn’t as bad, assuming grappling and other physical skill checks were of minor importance but now are climbing.

This... might work, anyway. Dex shift to Wis and bigger weapons...it does want mid to high Dex for its armor class after level 3. So giving them wis instead of strength just lets them upgrade from finesse weapons. Okay, not as bad as I initially feared.

Yeah that was my main thought. Dex build, with your rapier and take dueling. Hit level three and grab a long sword. Or pick GWM at lvl 2 and just no use it for a level. Now youre Dex and Wis focused. Youre basically a monk with d10s and action surge instead of ki. Your perception skills get to be high too.

I am aiming for them to be Einhanders, but I bet most who play it will pick up Greatswords and Glaives anyway. I did try to avoid making them archers, that just didnt feel right for the class.

As for the lvl 7, yeah for a long time they will just kinda suck or be average at Athletics. But then boom they get to be either good, or great at it.
Hrm. Maybe i should move the Wisdom save proficiency to level 7? As it is, its kinda front loaded.

[nickl_2000]

Three way tie going into the last vote? Excellent work everyone, and I'm glad you liked what I came up with.

For this next one, I'm having a hard time thinking of anything except that one episode of Celebrity Jeopardy on SNL.

Sounds like a perfect start for a bard subclass

Voting is concluded! Excellent batch of entries all around.

New thread is currently being built, should be up in 20 minutes or so. EDIT: Or now! https://forums.giantitp.com/showthre...1#post24475701

Congratulations folks. That's pretty cool that everything was so close.

[Segev]

Yeah that was my main thought. Dex build, with your rapier and take dueling. Hit level three and grab a long sword. Or pick GWM at lvl 2 and just no use it for a level. Now youre Dex and Wis focused. Youre basically a monk with d10s and action surge instead of ki. Your perception skills get to be high too.

I am aiming for them to be Einhanders, but I bet most who play it will pick up Greatswords and Glaives anyway. I did try to avoid making them archers, that just didnt feel right for the class.

As for the lvl 7, yeah for a long time they will just kinda suck or be average at Athletics. But then boom they get to be either good, or great at it.
Hrm. Maybe i should move the Wisdom save proficiency to level 7? As it is, its kinda front loaded.

Maybe some sort of feature that says, "While weilding a weapon in one hand and nothing in the other, you can" do something akin to the scene of the two characters fending off the hail of arrows while the inspiration for this class worked. I know it's conflating others' abilities into it, but it would fit, encourage the einhanding, and make an anti-archer statement. Not sure where to fit it in, though.


Oh, an editing note: I suggest rearranging how you write your abilities so that the "At X level" is very close to the top. Maybe even just - despite this not being 5e's usual format - having a label on it next to or beneath the title that says what level you get it at. I found it difficult to keep track of at which level they got which feature as I was reading it. Admittedly, it was after midnight and I'm not a night owl despite staying up far too late every night, so that could just have been my reading comprehension level.

[MrStabby]

SO I threw my hat into the ring - not so much in a competitive sense but because it seems something fun to do whilst stuck in the house.

Not sure what the guidance is - am I allowed to adjust an entry once submitted (a couple of small changes to mistakes I made)?

Also... the role of this thread? Am I supposed to justify my decisions here and to explain anything that might seem odd?

WELP I did mine. Lockdown is killing me haha. Any advice is appreciated. Particularly regarding strength. Dont want it too weak or strong.

The way I read the theme is that it has to be a class that focuses on writing. Pact of the Tome and Wizard are both good starts, but obviously you'd need a little more oomph. Tome of Ancient Secrets Invocation is closer to this than just the Tome Pact honestly. And Wizard writes sure, but like a wizard subclass would be about writing down his spells every day instead of memorising them, and reading every spell from a scroll.

Im trying to come up with an idea for every class. Some are harder than others. Monk and Druid are eluding me. Would being a tattooed monk count?

I love the theme and the feel of the class. I was a bit nervous about it at first as it felt there was less... special about it. A lot of swapping ability modifiers (which I would totally play - it fits what I like in characters) but you are just doing the base fighter stuff but with different stats. At level 7 the potential for double proficiency is mechanically appealing - although a martial calligrapher being a champion wrestler took a min to get my hear round. In terms of power, the first 10 levels are not weak - wisdom is better save than strength to have a high stat in. You also have a good AC potential. There is some synergy between needing dex and wis on a class that gets extra ASIs. Personally I feel that proficiency in wisdom saves might be a bit overkill, especially at level 3 - it just makes things a bit too easy to dip as the early levels for fighter are just so good anyway.

Rhythm is really the only ability I don't like. The bookkeeping needed to track who you have attacked and how long ago is potentially annoying, and replacing one attack stat with another could be a bit fiddly. Thematically, I love the ability but just not sure I would like how it would play out at the table.

Knowledge is a nice modest but useful ability. I admire the restraint.

I like mastery, but I feel some options might be more problematic than others. Wind, letting you do something akin to an area of attack spell is really nice and feels special and unique and a good capstone...

On the other hand, fire seems abusable. Every attack is a critical hit - including those from action surge. Including bonus attack... including any attack from haste... including any bonus dice you have from other features like say a sunblade... add in the ability to pull of brutal criticals with a half orc and your damage is just too high in my oppinion. I get that fighter should be good at this but on a short rest refresh it seems to blow the other fighter options out of the water.

I love the others though.

All in all I think the option is awesome and one of the most tempting fighter subclasses. I love the way the theme works into the abilities as well and I see the short rest abilities as being a really integrated comfortable addition to the fighter base.

[sengmeng]

College of Arts (and Crafts) is up.

[Segev]

SO I threw my hat into the ring - not so much in a competitive sense but because it seems something fun to do whilst stuck in the house.

Not sure what the guidance is - am I allowed to adjust an entry once submitted (a couple of small changes to mistakes I made)?

Also... the role of this thread? Am I supposed to justify my decisions here and to explain anything that might seem odd?

You can edit your submission up until the deadline. This thread is for discussing submissions, giving and receiving advice, and generally talking about the contest.

Barbarian Subclass: Runebound Thane

You come from a culture that values its history and you are an emblem of that history. That past deeds of your tribe, their legends and achievements are etched into your skin as tattoos. These heroic descriptions both comfort and inspire you to greater acts of valor and the hope that one day your own takes will be written on you skin next to your ancestors.

Nemesis of the Clan
When you chose this path at 3rd level you are able to bring to mind the threats to your clan that have been overcome by great warriors. When you rage you seek to emulate them by using the same techniques that exposed the weaknesses of similar enemies. Chose one target when you start your rage that is nominated "Nemesis of the Clan"; you learn if that target has any resistances, immunities or vulnerabilities and what they are and until your rage ends your attacks score a critical hit on a 19 or 20.

Is the expanded critical range only on the Nemesis? Or period?

Lorekeeper
At 3rd Level, if you do no have it, you gain proficiency in the history skill

Nice little ribbon.

Not sure if knowing vulerabilities, resistances, and immunities is enough by itself, but if the expanded crit range is for everything, it's probably quite sufficient as a level 3 suite of abilities. That's the biggest perk of the Champion subclass of Fighter, after all, at level 3. Limiting it to "while raging" gives room for the rest of these perks.

Decendant of Champions
Drawing inspiration from the tales of endurance of your ancestors wrought in ink on your skin you have advantage on any saving throw you make against a spell or ability inflicted by your Nemesis of the Clan.

This is nice, but very narrowly focused. I suggest also giving Resistance to all damage inflicted by any action taken by the Nemesis of the Clan. Again, because it's just so narrowly focused.

Tales of inspiration
Your tattoos have grown and now include accounts of great courage and leadership. You may invoke these tales to inspire your allies. Each ally within 60ft gains temporary hitpoints equal to your barbarian level and may repeat a save against any spell that they are under the influence of that allows a save to end an effect.

How do you invoke these? Is it when you rage? Is it as its own action? Bonus action? Reaction? How often can you do this? At will? Once, then recover on a long rest? Short or long rest?

Mater of the Records
Beginning at 14th level you see the tales written on you skin as being more than just records or a source of inspiration. The writing itself tunes in to your rage and centuries of martial history manifest themselves as devastating psychic attacks. When you are raging you may add d12 psychic, necrotic, radiant or force damage to your attacks (your choice) and when you score a critical hit against a creature it must make an intelligence save (DC 8 + Proficiency + Strength Modifier) or be stunned until the end of its next turn.

This is pretty darned powerful. Basically adding the best possible crit die to every attack roll (not even limited to melee). Not sure if it's overpowered, but it's very, very strong.

Also, typo in the name. I think you mean "Master of the Records." Though now I'm picturing a tow truck barbarian.

WIP: Scroll-Specialist Artificer
Basic Outline

An artificer that can use his Infusions to create spell scrolls of spells of a level no higher than 1/2 his artificer level. He can create no more than 1 scroll each of 6th, 7th, 8th and 9th levels. This makes him effectively a full caster at the cost of some of his infusions.

• Needs a master scroll "spellbook" to store the spells he knows for transcription purposes, but can't cast them normally.
• Learns 1 free spell from the wizard list each level for this purpose. Can copy spells from other sources (scrolls, spellbooks, etc) as normal.
• Has no class-based limitations on scroll use
• Scrolls you create use your spell attack modifier and save DC
• Spells that consume a costly material component require that component when you infuse the scroll, but are refunded if you uninfuse the scroll without casting it.

lvl 3. Tools of the Trade: Caligraphy Tools Proficiency, Bonus Languages (1 bonus language per IntMod, learn a new one whenever your int mod increases, forget one if it decreases)

lvl 3. Bonus Spells: languages, written/drawn effects like magic circle/glyph of warding, synergy with other features

lvl 5. Magic Scroll Case: Protects scrolls from harm in a pocket dimension, lets you draw scrolls as a free action, infinite cantrip scrolls you can cast as a bonus action (note: cantrip scrolls always cast as if charlevel = 1)

lvl 9. Your scrolls are user friendly: anyone can use them regardless of class

lvl 15. You can infuse your scrolls with a second spell, which must be a cantrip. The scroll casts both spells at once.

Infusion Options:
Magic Stylus that allows writing in the air. Ignore verbal components, spells which require a creature hear you requires they see you instead, casts spells with a casting time of >1 round (including rituals) in half the time.

I don't know enough about the Artificer to really give advice, here, but I wish you luck. Is the unique thing about this subclass the ability to make scrolls?

College of Arts (and Crafts)
Bard college

Props
When you join this college at third level, you gain the ability to craft fake paper versions of mundane items. This takes 1 minute and 5sp for each 10gp in the items price, minimum of one minute and 5sp. These items normally cannot function as their real counterparts, but they can be mistaken for real.

Make Believe
At third level, you gain the ability to expend a bardic inspiration die and imbue your fake items with realness through the power of imagination™. When you do so, you roll your bardic inspiration die and the item lasts for a number of hours equal to the result. While so imbued, you have proficiency with the item if it requires it, and it functions exactly as it's real counterpart.

Crafty Expertise
At sixth level, your imagination™ grows, giving you mastery over the use of your creations. If it is a weapon, you may attack twice when you take the attack action. If it is armor or a shield, you add your proficiency bonus to your armor class while wearing or wielding it (you do not add your proficiency bonus twice if you have both a make believe shield and make believe armor). If the item is a tool or vehicle, you add twice your proficiency bonus to any checks to use it.

Instant Crafts
At 14th level, you may instantly craft as a bonus action. You expend up to all your remaining bardic inspiration dice and may create an item whose normal price in gp is no more than 10x the result of the dice rolled. This item lasts for 1 day per die rolled.

Hm. I don't know if this is precisely on theme, but I like the idea of an origami-master bard. Since papercrafts cost a fair amount of coin for something made of paper, it may behoove you to give an idea of how long they last. Or of their durability when not empowered by the inspiration die. Is the item destroyed after the duration of reality, or just back to being paper? If the former, that answers my earlier question neatly enough.

Why use this, though, when you have to prep the papercrafts ahead of time?

I suggest, to bring it more in theme, that you have the prep work be drawing and painting, and then allowing the Imagination-triggered bardic inspiration die to rapidly fold it (perhaps even magically cause it to fold) into shape. this would let you keep scroll cases full of items, making the storage and the possibility of smuggling things in better, rather than having to carry delicate and awkward (but cheap, one-off) items.


I would let Instant Crafts actually choose how many dice are rolled, too. No need to make it a one-off; if they want to instantly craft an item of only 10 gp, let them spend just one die. Also, do they only have to pick what they're making after rolling? Imagine wanting a 200 gp item (gettable with a 20+ on the roll) but only getting 15 on the roll.

[nickl_2000]

First draft of Monk, Way of the Shrine Guardian is up.

https://forums.giantitp.com/showsing...71&postcount=7

I believe I have the abilities down well enough, but still need to wrinkle out typos and clean up wording.

[RickAsWritten]

My entry is up. The red tape festooning, queue loving Barbarian: Path of the Bureaucrat.

Path of the Bureaucrat

[MrStabby]

You can edit your submission up until the deadline. This thread is for discussing submissions, giving and receiving advice, and generally talking about the contest.

OK, cool. a few tweaks to make.

Is the expanded critical range only on the Nemesis? Or period?

Nice little ribbon.

Expanded crit is just for one creature. I realised that it was MUCH weaker than the champion ability but it came on a class with ready access to advantage. I figured that this was still a lowball ability... So supplemented with a proficiency, to keep the barbarian just a bit more active in the non-combat pillars where I feel the class can struggle.

Not sure if knowing vulerabilities, resistances, and immunities is enough by itself, but if the expanded crit range is for everything, it's probably quite sufficient as a level 3 suite of abilities. That's the biggest perk of the Champion subclass of Fighter, after all, at level 3. Limiting it to "while raging" gives room for the rest of these perks.

Yeah, limit to raging. What I was going for with the class was a barbarian designed to excel at taking down a particular enemy,both alone and with the help of a team. I was wanting a way to represent knowledge from the tales written on the body to contribute to a fight - the extra crit ability was one - a mechanic representing a strike to some critical feature that might be known from a tale. The knowledge about vulnerabilities etc is intended to provide the knowledge to help defeat obscure enemies. I feel that the barbarian is also a bit weak on team support and winning the information war and I was wanting to add an ability to let the player participate in this without stepping on anyone elses toes too much. There is some overlap with battlemaster and ranger though, so not perfect by a long way.

This is nice, but very narrowly focused. I suggest also giving Resistance to all damage inflicted by any action taken by the Nemesis of the Clan. Again, because it's just so narrowly focused.

This is fine and better balanced. I felt that resistance was a bit... unneeded given you got so much from rage anyway and it would be stepping on the toes of the bear totem. Still, with just one creature having the effect it might be different enough.

How do you invoke these? Is it when you rage? Is it as its own action? Bonus action? Reaction? How often can you do this? At will? Once, then recover on a long rest? Short or long rest?

Oops! Yes, I didn't finish writing this. I had intended it to be once per long rest (and bonus action) but I am now leaning towards short rest. I think some of the abilities above have a very tight rein on their power, letting this one out just a little bit more might be good. Thinking through this though, I wonder if it might be better to do something bigger as a single target and as a reaction? A defensive intervention, possibly with a short range, might add a bit more tactical depth and variety to how the barbarian plays. After all the theme is writing, it really should be the thinking person's rage machine.

This is pretty darned powerful. Basically adding the best possible crit die to every attack roll (not even limited to melee). Not sure if it's overpowered, but it's very, very strong.

D12 to every attack will average 6.5 on non crit attacks. At two attacks per turn this is 11, and at 3 it is 19.5. If we assume three rounds of combat and rage activates preventing a bonus action attack on the first round and a 60% hit rate then this would be about 10.4 damage per round. At level 14 the Zealot's level 3 ability would be adding on average 9.66 per round, so less than one point of damage less. Of course Crits will skew it a bit. The stunning ability is a rider that should come up enough that it isn't a waste but not so much it slows the game down.

The main thing I wanted from this level was something that tied together the other class elements - identify vulnerabilities then exploit them with the specific damage type that hurts them. Get bonuses to criticals from the subclass ability and potentially reckless attack and then a boost that synergises with that. I won't argue that this is a strong level, although I had hoped that relatively modest earlier levels would leave a bit of breathing room. Maybe if I add the damage as a d6 earlier then grow it to a d10 at 14 it would lower late game power (personally I feel the barbarian is tapering off a bit at level 14 so a boost plays to my prejudices) and bolster the earlier levels? One change I want to make is to change the force option to fire - it is a classic vulnerability. I am also broadening the level 3 ability to identify vulnerabilities so that it can pick out things such as troll or vampire regeneration.

Also, typo in the name. I think you mean "Master of the Records." Though now I'm picturing a tow truck barbarian.

Good catch!


Thanks for all the feedback.

[Damon_Tor]

I don't know enough about the Artificer to really give advice, here, but I wish you luck. Is the unique thing about this subclass the ability to make scrolls?

That's the core of it, yes.

Normally, the artificer is a half-caster. His spells known and spell slots progress like a paladin's or ranger's do. This subclass closes the gap, giving them access (if limited) to the spell slots and selection they are missing.

Another design goal is to shed some of the "magi-punk" feel the class has baked in from the Eberron setting, make something that fits better in a more typical fantasy world. I love Eberron dearly, but there's not always room for a guy with a robot dog or walking lighting turret in every story. This subclass is very similar thematically to a wizard, and to some degree he's more grounded, so he should fit in just about anywhere wizards do and maybe even some places they don't.

Anyway, he's done-ish.

[Lvl45DM!]

SO I threw my hat into the ring - not so much in a competitive sense but because it seems something fun to do whilst stuck in the house.

Not sure what the guidance is - am I allowed to adjust an entry once submitted (a couple of small changes to mistakes I made)?

Also... the role of this thread? Am I supposed to justify my decisions here and to explain anything that might seem odd?




I love the theme and the feel of the class. I was a bit nervous about it at first as it felt there was less... special about it. A lot of swapping ability modifiers (which I would totally play - it fits what I like in characters) but you are just doing the base fighter stuff but with different stats. At level 7 the potential for double proficiency is mechanically appealing - although a martial calligrapher being a champion wrestler took a min to get my hear round. In terms of power, the first 10 levels are not weak - wisdom is better save than strength to have a high stat in. You also have a good AC potential. There is some synergy between needing dex and wis on a class that gets extra ASIs. Personally I feel that proficiency in wisdom saves might be a bit overkill, especially at level 3 - it just makes things a bit too easy to dip as the early levels for fighter are just so good anyway.

Rhythm is really the only ability I don't like. The bookkeeping needed to track who you have attacked and how long ago is potentially annoying, and replacing one attack stat with another could be a bit fiddly. Thematically, I love the ability but just not sure I would like how it would play out at the table.

Knowledge is a nice modest but useful ability. I admire the restraint.

I like mastery, but I feel some options might be more problematic than others. Wind, letting you do something akin to an area of attack spell is really nice and feels special and unique and a good capstone...

On the other hand, fire seems abusable. Every attack is a critical hit - including those from action surge. Including bonus attack... including any attack from haste... including any bonus dice you have from other features like say a sunblade... add in the ability to pull of brutal criticals with a half orc and your damage is just too high in my oppinion. I get that fighter should be good at this but on a short rest refresh it seems to blow the other fighter options out of the water.

I love the others though.

All in all I think the option is awesome and one of the most tempting fighter subclasses. I love the way the theme works into the abilities as well and I see the short rest abilities as being a really integrated comfortable addition to the fighter base.

Thanks, excellent advice.
I do think Ill move the Wis save to level 7 to avoid dips.

The way I see their champion wrestling is less that they pull off amazing Judo throws but more they passively resist. Immovable object type deal.

I hear what you're saying with Rhythm. Thats less based off Hero, and more off the Drizzt DoÚrden books. Often in fights he uses his skill to change how his opponent fights to gain an advantage. Perhaps a static modifier adjustment though. -Your proficiency modifier from their hits?
And the only reason I phrased it that way was to avoid abusing the ability as I initially had it, which was replacing their ability modifier with any other ability modifier. I didnt want them to give their Cleric buddy +Wis to hit and damage. But if i limit it to Str and Dex, thats probably not abusable. I might just make it a reaction to getting hit.

Hrm yes I havent played any high level 5e so Fire does seem strong when you put it that way. Imagine if they TWF! But I do want a non-magical damage boost for Fire, to fit with what Fire means in Chinese elemental philosophy. Add proficiency mod to damage? Considering the amount of ASI's...maybe it allows them to add their Str mod to damage as well as Wis?
Ok how about a Chaos bolt style effect? If you roll max damage on your hits, you get to reroll the dice?
Or how about a cleave effect?
Ill try a cleave effect

Maybe some sort of feature that says, "While weilding a weapon in one hand and nothing in the other, you can" do something akin to the scene of the two characters fending off the hail of arrows while the inspiration for this class worked. I know it's conflating others' abilities into it, but it would fit, encourage the einhanding, and make an anti-archer statement. Not sure where to fit it in, though.


Oh, an editing note: I suggest rearranging how you write your abilities so that the "At X level" is very close to the top. Maybe even just - despite this not being 5e's usual format - having a label on it next to or beneath the title that says what level you get it at. I found it difficult to keep track of at which level they got which feature as I was reading it. Admittedly, it was after midnight and I'm not a night owl despite staying up far too late every night, so that could just have been my reading comprehension level.

Ah thank you. Giving them deflect arrows at level 3 makes up for what is really a lackluster start, since its just switching scores around. And then i can move Wis save to level 7 to avoid dipping issues. Huzzah!

[nickl_2000]

Feedback, here we go :) Will add another post when there are more subclasses to comment on.

Spoiler: Fighter Subclass: The Calligrapher

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Control - You have a lot going on at level 3 here, even for a fighter. I think there is to much going on personally. I would take away the deflect missiles ability from level 3 and either put it in later or completely remove it. I will openly admit that I don't like this ability given to non-monks though

Balance - This is another level that feels overloaded. I would give athletics/acrobatic as wisdom + prof/expertise OR Prof in Wisdom throws. Not both. Proficiency in wisdom saving throws is extremely powerful on a fighter, so you don't need much else at a level if you are giving that.

Rhythm - This needs to be tightened up some. First thing, you typically don't reduce someone's AC. In the official classes you give the PC an bonus to their attack rolls. As for the reduction of the enemy attack rolls, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me that other PCs would get a bonus. You need something in there that the bonus/reductions are only applicable on attacks you make or are made against you. Also, the "this last until they don't attack you in a round" seems like an odd mechanic. From the aspect of a monster, they wouldn't be smart enough to know about that ability. So, why wouldn't they attack you? Also, this being short rest based means that you will likely always have it up. Either make it last only 1 round or make it long rest based instead of short rest.

Knowledge - Does this turn a mundane weapon magical for the purposes of bypassing magical resistance?

Mastery - For Fire, you may want to add a caviot that you can attack another creature, within reach, immediately. It just clarifies a little bit. For earth and water, what triggers those abilities? Is it a reaction, bonus action, action, etc?


The lore on this is absolutely amazing. It is incredibly well done. Some of the abilities need tightened up or reduced in power though.

Spoiler: Barbarian Subclass: Runebound Thane

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You forgot to label the level 6 and 10 abilities.
Tales of Comradeship - This seems really, really powerful. At will reaction to give resistance to damage taken and 10 plus temporary hp. Does it need some sort of limiter in how often it can be given? Personally, I would rather see it allowed once per ally per short rest and have it give 2xBarb level in temp HP.

Master of the Records - This is a heck of a capstone. Stun seems to much personally, especially with an Int save. If it were a level 18 capstone I may not mind, but 14 seems to low for this where there really isn't much cost. However, you need to be raging, hit with a crit, and they fail a save. So, it's probably okay now that I talk it through.


Overall, it's a good take and a new way to go for barbarians, I like it.

Spoiler: Artificer Specialization: Volumancer

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I was absolutely thinking of an artificer who use sonic damage as much as possible (TURN THE VOLUME TO 11 DUDE!!)

The domain spells here are incredibly appropriate.

Lexicanum Universalis - Does this still require a check to cast a spell higher than half your level to cast? For example, can a 20th level artificer make a 9th level scroll and hand it to his lackey to cast? This does open up the ability for your entire party to have a familiar and be able to cast Summon (Greater) Steed. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just something to consider.


The other thing I was really hoping to see in this subclass was the artificer who is focusing on scrolls being allowed to use their casting modifier in place of the standard scroll DC/attack. Once you get beyond the original level when casting, the DC is pretty low.


I really, really like this subclass. It's a good fit to the artificer and stretches the class in a different direction. Really well done.

Spoiler: College of Arts (and Crafts)

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Make Believe - Funny and cool, there is a bit of an exploit though as written. There is nothing stopping you from making armor or weapons and handing them off to someone else. With this a dex based fighter/rogue could sneak attack with a polearm or a great axe. Is that intended functionality?

Crafty Expertise - Woah, this is broken, really, really broken. You could potentially have full plate + dex + shield + prof mod. So, AC of 18 + 2 + dex + prof = 26 AC at level 6 if you have a +3 in dex. This will get even higher as you level more. As well as 2 attacks with a weapon that is finesse no matter what.

Instant Crafts - Can this be magical items? If yes what are the costs?

So, this is kind of silly, and a really fun start. There are a few significant balance issues though and a few questions that need to be answered prior to it being completed and campaign ready. If you can get those fixed, I would adore this subclass.

Spoiler: The Qualitherate Wizard

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Special Spellbook - One possible issue here. A Wizard can scribe a prepared spell into their spellbook. So, the ability to prepare a spell that isn't in the spellbook then let's you scribe it into the spellbook. You may want to remove that as an option.

"Mind over body: you become immune to poison and disease. When you are hit with a critical attack you can use your reaction to turn a critical hit into a normal one." Immune to poison, disease, and removing criticals seems like to much. Pick one or the other please :)


Other than a few small issues here this seems like a cool class. I like it :)

Spoiler: Path of the Bureaucrat

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Looks like a barbarian. You should mention that. Minor and nitpicky, but worth mentioning

Formulated Rage - While hilarious, this seems overpowered. As an action you can prevent a creature to lose an action at will and it can't be stopped. I feel like you need to make an attack, they need to make a save, or something to prevent this from happening at will.

Other than that, it's a really fun and silly subclass. As a person who has worked in government I can certainly understand how paperwork and bureaucracy can cause one to rage.

[RickAsWritten]

Spoiler: Path of the Bureaucrat

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Looks like a barbarian. You should mention that. Minor and nitpicky, but worth mentioning

Formulated Rage - While hilarious, this seems overpowered. As an action you can prevent a creature to lose an action at will and it can't be stopped. I feel like you need to make an attack, they need to make a save, or something to prevent this from happening at will.

Other than that, it's a really fun and silly subclass. As a person who has worked in government I can certainly understand how paperwork and bureaucracy can cause one to rage.

Ahhh, that's supposed to be "Once during your Rage." Forgot that bit. Thanks for the read-through.

[nickl_2000]

Ahhh, that's supposed to be "Once during your Rage." Forgot that bit. Thanks for the read-through.

That's so much better! :)

[Lvl45DM!]

Feedback, here we go :) Will add another post when there are more subclasses to comment on.

Spoiler: Fighter Subclass: The Calligrapher

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Control - You have a lot going on at level 3 here, even for a fighter. I think there is to much going on personally. I would take away the deflect missiles ability from level 3 and either put it in later or completely remove it. I will openly admit that I don't like this ability given to non-monks though

Balance - This is another level that feels overloaded. I would give athletics/acrobatic as wisdom + prof/expertise OR Prof in Wisdom throws. Not both. Proficiency in wisdom saving throws is extremely powerful on a fighter, so you don't need much else at a level if you are giving that.

Rhythm - This needs to be tightened up some. First thing, you typically don't reduce someone's AC. In the official classes you give the PC an bonus to their attack rolls. As for the reduction of the enemy attack rolls, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me that other PCs would get a bonus. You need something in there that the bonus/reductions are only applicable on attacks you make or are made against you. Also, the "this last until they don't attack you in a round" seems like an odd mechanic. From the aspect of a monster, they wouldn't be smart enough to know about that ability. So, why wouldn't they attack you? Also, this being short rest based means that you will likely always have it up. Either make it last only 1 round or make it long rest based instead of short rest.

Knowledge - Does this turn a mundane weapon magical for the purposes of bypassing magical resistance?

Mastery - For Fire, you may want to add a caviot that you can attack another creature, within reach, immediately. It just clarifies a little bit. For earth and water, what triggers those abilities? Is it a reaction, bonus action, action, etc?


The lore on this is absolutely amazing. It is incredibly well done. Some of the abilities need tightened up or reduced in power though.

Im keeping 3rd level as is, since everything except deflect missiles is closer to a ribbon ability. A fighter who hits 3rd level and picks this subclass doesn't actually gain much without it. Now you get Wis instead of Dex or Str, but your Wis isnt going to be higher than other fighters Dex or Str. Your AC isnt going to be better either. Youve got...16? 17? Well they are running around in halfplate. So you're slightly (a point or two) better at perception, and worse at athletics. Compare to x2 crit range, steady aim, battlemaster manoeuvres...

I weakened Wisdom save to just save against charm and I dropped the Expertise effect. I do want a theme of body and mind. Wisdom save was a little too strong. There should be more diversity in saves in 5e.

I changed Rhythm a little. Its simpler but more versatile. Remove their relevant ability modifier from to hit or damage. The other PC's now can't get the help for more than a round. I disagree with the 'not attack for a round' thing tho. Sure a mindless skeleton or animal won't notice, but a humanoid opponent would. But more importantly, it means that it works best in a duel. Its not that helpful in a pitched melee with many opponents and it doesnt help that much against one big monster that the whole party is fighting, since it can just switch opponents. And the other PC's get the advantage because the effect affects the monster, not the Calligrapher. You have thrown off their fighting style.

Fire was supposed to have 'reach' instead of 'round' stupid typo.
Added actions to Earth and Water.

Just realized that my comments on the other subclasses disappeared from my previous post
I dont think ive played enough 5e to be sure about these so take them with a grain of salt.

Spoiler: Runebound Thane

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I disagree with gaining elemental damage on your weapon as well as information and crit range. Its just a mix of too many different abilities (Like I'm one to talk hah). And I think Stun is the wrong vibe of an effect. What is happening exactly? Your tatts are...stunning it?
So yknow I'd remove the elemental thing from 3rd and change the 14th to "Nemesis makes a save or is vulnerable to your attacks".

Spoiler: Volumancer

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There could not have been better spells picked for this specialty
Letting any party member cast any of your spells sounds like the sort of thing that would snowball. Just a pitch, only those spells that dont require costly components can be so easily read by others? That gets rid of most of the abuseable ones I think.
I strongly disagree with any creature being able to read your works and use them. That means the Paladins horse can cast fireball. I'm reasonably sure that the Artillerists Turret can cast Teleport with this. I mean...pfft. No. Limit it to beings of a certain intelligence and ability to speak a proper language. Its what I'd do if I was DMing this class anyway.

Spoiler: College of Arts (and Crafts)

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I worry this is too far off theme. And I think fake plate mail with full dex and a finesse greatsword lasting for 6 hours is too strong. Make it Minutes, but lower the time it takes to use it. So its something that can be used to prep for a battle, not something you just have up all day.

Spoiler: The Qualitherate Wizard

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I really like the flavour of this but I think the later abilities move further from the flavour. It goes from the Arrival-esque idea of 'languages can shape perception' to "You speak Mind Flayer so youre more abberant."
What if for the 10th level, they get to keep one spell slot they can cast open, and spontaneously cast something during the day, because when they will have prepared their spells tomorrow, they knew what they needed today? Just to stay on-brand. And having the highest level ability of a language based class remove the need to actually...speak seems off too. Maybe just the Telekinesis Somatic thing.

Spoiler: Monk, Way of the Shrine Guardian

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I love this one. Maybe the closest to the actual theme.
I think you've doubled down once too often on the Omomori abilities. Let them do something different for 11th level than just Have More. Maybe they can choose one Omomori to have the passive effect always on. Maybe let them spend some gold to have an even more powerful version of 1 Omomori that is their speciality. Then again I guess they already have their 11th level Spells. Still.
I personally dont like the idea of the Monk summoning something. More cleric than monk. Monks are all about improving the self. Give them something like a Paladins capstone, let them BECOME a Shrine Guardian. Also you don't say at what level you gain Shrine Guardian.
I worry that Winds passive ability is a bit weak. 5 ft means alot to most classes. Monk, not so much. Acrobatics bonus maybe? AC bonus vs Missile weapons?
And, I feel like a Plant Omomori and maybe an evil one? would round them out perfectly. Aku and Moku

Spoiler: Bureaucrat

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Ever notice how spelling bureaucrat feels like engaging in bureaucracy?
Ok I know this is a joke but
Automatically costing a creature a round of actions is utterly huge. Potentially costing them every action based on Int is too much. You've just taken out the big brute of every fight.
So, I'd make it only work on creatures that understand your language, first of all. No you cant make a dire wolf or a black pudding sign a form. And I'd say that while it's filling out the form, you can't do anything either.
Cos then at 6th level your ability to force people to fill out forms is close to back to where it was. Now you can make the troll do it, but still not the black pudding.
And 2ndly Id either give them a save, or I'd make it only cos a move action.
10th level is hilarious, but Im not sure about how often it can be used. Maybe once a creature saves, they are immune.
Rejected is perfect.

[Damon_Tor]

Lexicanum Universalis - Does this still require a check to cast a spell higher than half your level to cast? For example, can a 20th level artificer make a 9th level scroll and hand it to his lackey to cast? This does open up the ability for your entire party to have a familiar and be able to cast Summon (Greater) Steed. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just something to consider.

You might have a hard time finding Find Steed in written form. By the level you get the feature, I wouldn't be terribly concerned about multiple familiars.

The other thing I was really hoping to see in this subclass was the artificer who is focusing on scrolls being allowed to use their casting modifier in place of the standard scroll DC/attack. Once you get beyond the original level when casting, the DC is pretty low.

That's included, or at least it's supposed to be. I'll double check, it's possible it was removed by accident. EDIT: it's there, included in the "master scribe" ability: "Spells cast from scrolls you create use your spell attack modifier and spell save DC. Cantrips cast from scrolls you create are cast using your character level."

[Damon_Tor]

I strongly disagree with any creature being able to read your works and use them. That means the Paladins horse can cast fireball. I'm reasonably sure that the Artillerists Turret can cast Teleport with this. I mean...pfft. No. Limit it to beings of a certain intelligence and ability to speak a proper language. Its what I'd do if I was DMing this class anyway.

The scrolls still require verbal and/or somatic components. A chain pact familiar would likely be able to use the scrolls, but creatures without hands or language would have a hard time getting any use from this feature.

I can see where I need to clarify that though.

EDIT: I've clarified that point.

In effect, this ability is two features:

1. You can communicate fairly universally, albiet in one direction; if you wanted to tell your horse something important you could write him a note, but the horse probably couldn't write back. This seems kind of ribbony, though it has some implications combined with the Arcane Stylus. Together they would allow you to use spells like "command" on virtually any creature regardless of any language barrier.
2. Other creatures (who are capable of speech and/or hand gestures) can use scrolls you create.

The creatures for whom you would most likely use ability #1 are different from the creatures for whom you would most likely use ability #2. The two are part of the same ability because they are part of the same thematic ability, that of universal legibility.

[RickAsWritten]

Ever notice how spelling bureaucrat feels like engaging in bureaucracy?
Ok I know this is a joke but

After typing the word 37 million times while writing this, yes. In fact, it might be worse.

Automatically costing a creature a round of actions is utterly huge. Potentially costing them every action based on Int is too much. You've just taken out the big brute of every fight.
So, I'd make it only work on creatures that understand your language, first of all. No you cant make a dire wolf or a black pudding sign a form. And I'd say that while it's filling out the form, you can't do anything either.
Cos then at 6th level your ability to force people to fill out forms is close to back to where it was. Now you can make the troll do it, but still not the black pudding.
And 2ndly Id either give them a save, or I'd make it only cos a move action.

It's pretty strong, as most creatures have low Intelligence stats, but it's only to one creature per Rage. You're on to something for it needing a limiter though. I think that "you can't do anything either" is a bit too harsh. I think that maybe "you can't attack the creature that is filling out the form, but you can attack others" would be a good middle ground.

It is very much intended for a Bureaucrat to be able to make a dire wolf or a black pudding sign a form. Bureaucracy no know bounds and has no language. The procedure comes above all.

10th level is hilarious, but Im not sure about how often it can be used. Maybe once a creature saves, they are immune.

It can be used Strength modifier times per Long Rest, but yeah they should probably be immune on a success.

Rejected is perfect.

Thanks. And thanks for the feedback.

[nickl_2000]

I love this one. Maybe the closest to the actual theme.
I think you've doubled down once too often on the Omomori abilities. Let them do something different for 11th level than just Have More. Maybe they can choose one Omomori to have the passive effect always on. Maybe let them spend some gold to have an even more powerful version of 1 Omomori that is their speciality. Then again I guess they already have their 11th level Spells. Still.
I personally dont like the idea of the Monk summoning something. More cleric than monk. Monks are all about improving the self. Give them something like a Paladins capstone, let them BECOME a Shrine Guardian. Also you don't say at what level you gain Shrine Guardian.
I worry that Winds passive ability is a bit weak. 5 ft means alot to most classes. Monk, not so much. Acrobatics bonus maybe? AC bonus vs Missile weapons?
And, I feel like a Plant Omomori and maybe an evil one? would round them out perfectly. Aku and Moku

Thanks, as I was brainstorming ideas for the contest this jumped out immediately and seemed like fun. I know that those are the ones of mine that I like the most.

I changed the wind passive ability to "You gain advantage on all acrobatics checks and all jumps you make are considered moving jumps even if you aren’t moving."

I did this at 11, instead of having more charms. "At level 11, when you channel your ki to activate an Omamori you can activate two omamori charms at a single time and gain the abilities in both of them." You get more passive abilities and more options, but doesn't add a huge amount of power as much as flexibility. It does give you more danger of using up your charms though.


As for the Shrine Guardian, I really like that ability. It is so darn fitting for someone who's job was to guard a shrine. I will think about it though.

[Phhase]

I've posted my entry, Otherworldly Patron: Forbidden Ones. PEACH!

[Lvl45DM!]

The creatures for whom you would most likely use ability #1 are different from the creatures for whom you would most likely use ability #2. The two are part of the same ability because they are part of the same thematic ability, that of universal legibility.

Yes that is much clearer. I think it was the "any creature can use your scrolls" that threw me for such a loop.

Thanks, as I was brainstorming ideas for the contest this jumped out immediately and seemed like fun. I know that those are the ones of mine that I like the most.

I changed the wind passive ability to "You gain advantage on all acrobatics checks and all jumps you make are considered moving jumps even if you arenÂ’t moving."

I did this at 11, instead of having more charms. "At level 11, when you channel your ki to activate an Omamori you can activate two omamori charms at a single time and gain the abilities in both of them." You get more passive abilities and more options, but doesn't add a huge amount of power as much as flexibility. It does give you more danger of using up your charms though.


As for the Shrine Guardian, I really like that ability. It is so darn fitting for someone who's job was to guard a shrine. I will think about it though.

I like your changes! Except it looks like your Wind Charm is the same
I did think you had an attachment to the Shrine Guardian, I could just feel it. Thats why i prefaced that one again with "Personally". That feature would make me less likely to play it, but that is totally my thing. I've seen those Shrine Guardians in Japan they would be scary as F. Maybe you need to specify about the summoning though. Where does it appear? Does it take an action to arrive? That sort of thing.

OOOOOOOOOOO i LOVE Aku and Moku. Moku is pretty much exactly what I hoped for but giving Aku the ability to speak evil languages is so fun!

It's pretty strong, as most creatures have low Intelligence stats, but it's only to one creature per Rage. You're on to something for it needing a limiter though. I think that "you can't do anything either" is a bit too harsh. I think that maybe "you can't attack the creature that is filling out the form, but you can attack others" would be a good middle ground.

It is very much intended for a Bureaucrat to be able to make a dire wolf or a black pudding sign a form. Bureaucracy no know bounds and has no language. The procedure comes above all.

Yeah, look you do you, but if I was DMing it I for sure wouldn't let that fly.

I suppose if you can't attack the creature filling out the form that sorta solves my issue. I still worry that a DM would throw one big monster at you like an Ankheg or Remoraz, and you hold it hostage while your party chops it up. Perhaps taking damage violates the terms of the contract? Ah well.

Spoiler: The Forbidden Ones

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Few typos in the opening.
I dont think Frenzy is a good name for the mechanic. Its already a Berserker thing and what you're describing is more like a Breakdown, or Madness, or Revelation. I do like the mechanic. Mental exhaustion. Does it go down in the same way as exhaustion? And what exactly inflicts it? Just a few notes would be helpful there.

I dont think giving them a free +1 to Int at level one is very fair. Giving them the rest of the Keen Mind feat seems good though.

6th level seems interesting, DM dependent though. Dont abuse it.

10th level, ahh if only this gave Telepathy like GOOlocks.

14th. There we go. Explosive Runes and Beyond Ken together at last. I wonder if these need to be two separate abilities though? Maybe have writing be part of 10th and add some more options to the 14th.

The Pact Boon is...look its interesting. Very RP-heavy more than mechanics.
But the invocations add the mechanics i guess.

All in All very interesting and flavourful

[nickl_2000]

I like your changes! Except it looks like your Wind Charm is the same
I did think you had an attachment to the Shrine Guardian, I could just feel it. Thats why i prefaced that one again with "Personally". That feature would make me less likely to play it, but that is totally my thing. I've seen those Shrine Guardians in Japan they would be scary as F. Maybe you need to specify about the summoning though. Where does it appear? Does it take an action to arrive? That sort of thing.

OOOOOOOOOOO i LOVE Aku and Moku. Moku is pretty much exactly what I hoped for but giving Aku the ability to speak evil languages is so fun!

Woops, looks like I made the change in my google doc and never did in the post. It is the quote I put in the response though.

When it came to Moku, I had a glut of choices that would make sense and be very fitting. I debated having speak with plants as a passive ability, but making it Shillelagh gives a monk a lot of choices at level 3 and I really like choices :)

I added in a few things to make the Shrine Guardian more clear for when it acts. Honestly, I see the Shrine Guardian as more of a protective force rather than an offensive one. At level 17 the to hit and the damage is piddly. However, the immunities, resistances, and reaction are primarily what I'm going for. That reaction ability would be a dream for me to have available on my team.

Also, I am actually least worried about capstones that are in the level 17-20 range. There are so few games that get up there it really doesn't matter that that much.

Thanks for the help and thoughts.

[nickl_2000]

New review

Spoiler: Warlock: The Forbidden Ones

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Pact Spells:
I'm not sure I like Hunter's Mark in here. It may be on for theme, but why in the world would a Warlock use Hunter's Mark (requiring a weapon attack) over Hex. This is just a personal opinion, but I feel like it's wasted.

The keen mind feat is fitting, but makes a dip interesting. It would certainly be new for a PC to be able to get +1 intelligence for dipping a single level into Warlock.

Thank you for removing spell book copying for Amanuensis, that was an immediate thought on that spell. The duration is odd though "Duration: 10 minutes/level." Is that supposed to mean that the spell last longer depending on the level tier of the PC (40 minutes max)?

I see that later you allow that though.

Beyond Ken - All creatures that can hear you. You can hear yourself, does it self-inflict?



There is a lot going on here and a lot I like. I'm trying to process it all and find ways to break things. So far I haven't found anything that looks broken, just a subclass that would create a Warlock the is frightening as hell.

[Lvl45DM!]

Hey about Beyond Ken.

Niche case, but can I say it out loud AND use telepathy simultaneously?

[Damon_Tor]

Divided the Master Scribe ability into bullet points so it can be read more easily.

I also added a prohibition against more than two infused scrolls of any one spell level; without it, the spells-per-level-per-day became funky, peaking at level 10 when the Volumancer would be able to make 4 5th level spell scrolls while a full caster would have just 2 5th level spell slots. This change keeps the volumancer a small step behind full casters, which is about where I want them, without having to present players with a table of what scrolls they can make and when.

Changed some wording here and there where I thought it felt sloppy.