Erfworld 77, page 71

[PyritePyro]

I don't care for the plot point. The punchline was awesome.

That is was, That it was. And I must say, things are getting tense as we get to the end of this part. Who lives, who dies. Most importantly, what happens to Vinny and Parson. Oh, and the secondary characters too.

[dakiwiboid]

So the Arkenpliers croak undead warlords? Somehow I was hoping for something more spectacular, since they can be croaked with conventional weapons as well.

[sihnfahl]

I don't think Ansom can reach the column with his remaining move - and his forest-capable units are now abandoned in a ring of dragons, without his leadership bonus.

But, in the end, the forest-capable units are pretty much useless and can be ignored. It's the siege that's the greater threat.

If Phat-Singh is dusted, Parson can't do his hit and run tactics with the dwagons currently out in the field. So Ansom will lose siege, but not all of it.

I find it interesting that you CAN move into a battle in progress if it's your turn and your units have the move. That's... kinda unique.

With Ansom's air force unable to reach the hex, next turn is Vinnie, Ansom, Jillian, the 3 archons and whatever gwiffs survive (maybe just 1, since Jillian's on it) with some hits against them fighting against some 27 full-health dwagons, if Parson chooses that route.

[Ink]

Sing along! "Everybody was Kung-Fu Fighting!...."

I sooo want to see more Vinnie-moves. Now only if I could superimpose him over Ryu with serious spinning kick action...

Yeah, Vinny hadoken!

I think it makes the most sense now for the B dwagons to take out the rest of the siege. They got about half the siege last time, so they could probably destroy the rest of it (possibly getting wiped out in the process), and have any surviving dwagons hightail it back to Gobwin Knob.

[Zael Zuran]

I find it interesting that you CAN move into a battle in progress if it's your turn and your units have the move. That's... kinda unique.

I was thinking the same thing. Also wondering why Stanley had such a hard time grasping Real-Time combat a ways back, after reading this.

[ag30476]

So the Arkenpliers croak undead warlords? Somehow I was hoping for something more spectacular, since they can be croaked with conventional weapons as well.

We knew that from before. But now we know that if you pinch the heads of the uncroaked between the pliers they turn into sparkly dust.

What we don't know is what you can do with the pliers if attuned. The hammer let's you threaten the world with dwagons, the dish let's you make money hiring out pro...fessionals. So it stands to reason the pliers have some nifty power too.

[Shatteredtower]

I don't care for the plot point. The punchline was awesome.

Yeah, I liked that almost as much as, "Yoink!"

Well, with what looks like certain disaster on the horizon (one uncroaked warlord against Vinnie, Ansom, Jillian, and the archons doesn't seem to bode well for the fat lady no matter how many dragons she's got backing her up), does Stanley really have any choice but to send his last warlord into battle?

Wait. Whatever happened to Ensign Red Shirt? I must be blind tonight, because I'm unable to figure out where they put him.

[ag30476]

Yeah, Vinny hadoken!

I think it makes the most sense now for the B dwagons to take out the rest of the siege. They got about half the siege last time, so they could probably destroy the rest of it (possibly getting wiped out in the process), and have any surviving dwagons hightail it back to Gobwin Knob.

They can't. The first wave of dwagons took out the siege because they could disengage from ground units defending the siege units after they had taken out the seige units in a hex. When they got wounded enough, they would be cycled for other dwagons. The "archer hitsies" have been revealed to be massive injuries to the dwagons over the last few pages. And this was done with the dwagons having warlord bonuses.

No warlords means the seige cannot be taken out.

[PyritePyro]

Yeah, I liked that almost as much as, "Yoink!"

Well, with what looks like certain disaster on the horizon (one uncroaked warlord against Vinnie, Ansom, Jillian, and the archons doesn't seem to bode well for the fat lady no matter how many dragons she's got backing her up), does Stanley really have any choice but to send his last warlord into battle?

Wait. Whatever happened to Ensign Red Shirt? I must be blind tonight, because I'm unable to figure out where they put him.

If I had to guess, with a stack of gobwins, in the tunnels. Since Hamster only sent out three warlords, not all 5. He did keep a reserve.

[ag30476]

Yeah, I liked that almost as much as, "Yoink!"

Well, with what looks like certain disaster on the horizon (one uncroaked warlord against Vinnie, Ansom, Jillian, and the archons doesn't seem to bode well for the fat lady no matter how many dragons she's got backing her up), does Stanley really have any choice but to send his last warlord into battle?

Wait. Whatever happened to Ensign Red Shirt? I must be blind tonight, because I'm unable to figure out where they put him.

He's still but at GK but you know he can't go on an "away" mission without accompanying a main character...Parson!? Wanda!?!? Stanley!?!?!?!?

[ag30476]

You know...

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Maybe it's not Parson who goes to battle. Maybe it's Stanley with a big Ansom vs Stanley showdown

!?!?!?!?

[PyritePyro]

You know...

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Maybe it's not Parson who goes to battle. Maybe it's Stanley with a big Ansom vs Stanley showdown

!?!?!?!?

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And why the hell would Stanley the Tool risk his very own personal life, when he could send a minion to do it instead. Remember, he IS an evil overlord. Even if not a very good one.

[ag30476]

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And why the hell would Stanley the Tool risk his very own personal life, when he could send a minion to do it instead. Remember, he IS an evil overlord. Even if not a very good one.

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Because this is pseudo medieval fantasy comic story and battles are won by BFS wielding size 4 barbarian princesses, knights in shining 1970's jumpsuit and power-word wielding flying stewardesses not 30 foot long fire breating reptiles or barely intelligent walking trees that can tear the heads of same or thousands of archers and infantry.

I'm saying Stanley may fight for the same reason that Ansom fought, because he can, because he got the big hammer, because his minions have a failed, because he, Tool, has to save the day and most of all because it's cool.

[Lamech]

Now Parson should croak those peeps. No peeps Ansom stuck, then he croaks on Parson's turn I doubt he can survive 24 unwounded dwagons. Anyway any one notice the green dwagon closing in? Or the fact that Jillian lost her precious magic sword? Plus Ansom and Jillian seem slightly distracted.

I think that at least one of a few things is about to happen.
1) Big faceful of green gas for Ansom, Jillian and peep.
2) At least two more peeps croak someone has to stay behind. Possibly two or all three.
This of course could mean if Wanda has the move to get there team Parson gets a new warlord and with the massive bounus wrecks the rest of the siege.
3) Jillian and Ansom take retreat leaving at least one warlord. A lot of the siege is lost.
4) Stanley somehow gets a hold of the Arkenpliers. This could happen without killing Ansom

And why the hell would Stanley the Tool risk his very own personal life, when he could send a minion to do it instead. Remember, he IS an evil overlord. Even if not a very good one.

Mabey Stanley thinks that he could drop Ansom with one KRACK-THOOOOOM!!!! And take the pliers.

[Ink]

They can't. The first wave of dwagons took out the siege because they could disengage from ground units defending the siege units after they had taken out the seige units in a hex. When they got wounded enough, they would be cycled for other dwagons. The "archer hitsies" have been revealed to be massive injuries to the dwagons over the last few pages. And this was done with the dwagons having warlord bonuses.

No warlords means the seige cannot be taken out.

Hmm, but they could still pick and choose the order of their targets, right? He has quite a number of dwagons, he could send them in small groups to the hexes with siege units and have them take out the siege units in the hex first before engaging and going down to the ground troops. It's a kamikaze mission, but maybe it can be done?

[ag30476]

Or the fact that Jillian lost her precious magic sword?

Since when? I just though it was a BFS.

Plus Ansom and Jillian seem slightly distracted.

As long as they don't scare the dwagons.

4) Stanley somehow gets a hold of the Arkenpliers. This could happen without killing Ansom

We know this has happen. It has been foretold.

Mabey Stanley thinks that he could drop Ansom with one KRACK-THOOOOOM!!!! And take the pliers.

Bad bad why'd you spoil the spoiler?

[ag30476]

Hmm, but they could still pick and choose the order of their targets, right? He has quite a number of dwagons, he could send them in small groups to the hexes with siege units and have them take out the siege units in the hex first before engaging and going down to the ground troops. It's a kamikaze mission, but maybe it can be done?

Not in battle. You need a warlord to selectively engage targets or to disengage once engaged. This is explained in Klogs.

He could send 8 dwagons stacks to attack hexes but the dwagons would stay in the hex until they or all the units in the hex were croaked. So though more, or possibly, all of the seige units could be taken out, it would be reasonable to assume that Parson would loose a lot of dwagons.

Given the 25 to 1 force ratio betweent the coalition and Gobwin Knob and the fact that the dwagons are not only Stanley's most effective units but also his personal guard, it does not make strategic sense for Stanley to essentially trade dwagons for siege units.

In story, the point has been underscored by
1) Stanley complaining of loosing 3 dwagons to trap Ansom.
2) Ansom telling Vinny that the stand against all 43 dwagons would be even fight and that Stanley would not take those odds.
3) Ansom opting to go for the hunt, meaning to take out dwagons so as to save the rest of the siege or make the loosing the siege irrelevant.
4) The Archons and now even, reluctantly Jillian seemed to agree with the logic of the hunt.
5) Stanley and minions worried that the hunt would succeed.

[SteveMB]

Hmm, but they could still pick and choose the order of their targets, right?

Parson's Klog #4:

Stacks without a leader are forced to autoattack when in contact with units from non-allied capitals. I don't know how melee works without a Warlord in the group. With a Warlord, the fight can be directed, or the group can choose not to initiate a fight.

The implication I get is that engagement follows some mechanical rule (possibly random, possibly some preset sequence) without a warlord, and that a fight cannot be "directed" to prioritize specific targets (other than what the mechanics dictate) without a warlord.

[Aerysil]

Looks like the Arkenpliers work just fine for Ansom.

This is an odd development. I'm interested to find out why Jillian went so far outside of Wanda's intent. Unless Wanda is smarter than that. Which wouldn't surprise me at all.

[Baru]

This does not bode well for our protagonist.
Tension is building.
Excellent...

[Smiley_]

Why am I the only one to think the following:

Wanda did, in fact, anticipate that a small emotional tweak would be enough to make Jillian send the thinkagram to Ansom. She knew that ansom would ride to the rescue. Wanda managed to use Jillian to get ansom, unprotected and out in the open, into that hex.

While Jilian thinks she is doing something to hurt stanley, she actually helped more than if she just ignored the stack.

Parson does not need warlords if he intends to take the arkenpliers the next turn. Can a damaged Ansom, Jillian, Vinny, and the archons, after being damaged by the A dwagons, survive an attack from 24 wounded B dwagons?

Wanda is shrewder than I thought.

[ReccaSquirrel]

Jillian is stuck between two choices. She is given an option to phone a friend and she calls Ansom.

In it, she ends it with "See you after I croak some dwagons." She never once says she wasn't a traitor. She never once says she wasn't under a spell. She simply explains why she is by Ansom's side and that she is going to do what will likely be a fight to the death.

Would Ansom really not show up after that speech?

So now we take us to the current comic. Ansom arrives and kills Manpower with a nice Buffy reference as the uncroaked turns to dust. And then she looks up in anticipation at who stands over her... and she makes what could be interpreted as a very sly smile.

My friends... Ansom, Vinny, Jillian, and the Archons are all in the same room and, at least at this moment, there is one other Warlord alive. Putting all of your eggs in one basket is not a good thing.

[Krellen]

This does not bode well for our protagonist.
Tension is building.
Excellent...

I disagree. Erfworld becomes less and less interesting with every update, because there isn't tension - there is just inevitability. Ansom was going to win. Parson was summoned. Ansom continues to win.

So what the hell is the point?

[SteveMB]

Parson does not need warlords if he intends to take the arkenpliers the next turn. Can a damaged Ansom, Jillian, Vinny, and the archons, after being damaged by the A dwagons, survive an attack from 24 wounded B dwagons?

You mean "unwounded" -- the dwagons from the remaining ring hexes haven't seen combat, and even if they had they'd heal at the start of Stanley's turn.

The basic question is whether enough gwiffons and Archons will survive to haul Jillian, Ansom, and Vinny to a safer location (either in the column or back with the main force of forest units). If not (and if Ansom and Vinny don't have enough remaining move of their own, which seems likely from what we've been told about their tactical situation), they're in trouble.

[ag30476]

Jillian is stuck between two choices. She is given an option to phone a friend and she calls Ansom.

In it, she ends it with "See you after I croak some dwagons." She never once says she wasn't a traitor. She never once says she wasn't under a spell. She simply explains why she is by Ansom's side and that she is going to do what will likely be a fight to the death.

Would Ansom really not show up after that speech?

So now we take us to the current comic. Ansom arrives and kills Manpower with a nice Buffy reference as the uncroaked turns to dust. And then she looks up in anticipation at who stands over her... and she makes what could be interpreted as a very sly smile.

My friends... Ansom, Vinny, Jillian, and the Archons are all in the same room and, at least at this moment, there is one other Warlord alive. Putting all of your eggs in one basket is not a good thing.

An interesting implication you're making there

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that Jillian pulls the quadruple-cross and turns again against Ansom !?!?!?!?

[ag30476]

I disagree. Erfworld becomes less and less interesting with every update, because there isn't tension - there is just inevitability. Ansom was going to win. Parson was summoned. Ansom continues to win.

So what the hell is the point?

That's what we're being compelled to think. Remember when most everyone thought Ansom was booped because it looked like Ansom was booped?

There are still ways for Stanley to make yet another reversal

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-- Tool attack! CRACK-THOOM!!!
-- The Archons break their contract...for a fee.
-- Never trust a big sword and a smile. Jillian betrays on Ansom, again. (Thanks to ReccaSquirrel).

[GWvsJohn]

I disagree. Erfworld becomes less and less interesting with every update, because there isn't tension - there is just inevitability. Ansom was going to win. Parson was summoned. Ansom continues to win.

So what the hell is the point?

I was in the middle of an eloquent response to your question, but accidentally closed the window. So now you get the short version :)

Parson is the protagonist and the character we all should be relating to the most. We know he can't lose quite yet, so we are left to wonder what he is going to do to survive and what we would do in his situation. That's tension :)

[ag30476]

I was in the middle of an eloquent response to your question, but accidentally closed the window. So now you get the short version :)

Parson is the protagonist and the character we all should be relating to the most. We know he can't lose quite yet, so we are left to wonder what he is going to do to survive and what we would do in his situation. That's tension :)

We relate to Parson intellectually the most. But emotionally, I think most empathize with Jillian.

[GWvsJohn]

Also, did anyone else notice that before Ansom attacks, Manpower's dwagon is alive, but after Manpower gets croaked, the dwagon is croaked also?

[ag30476]

Also, did anyone else notice that before Ansom attacks, Manpower's dwagon is alive, but after Manpower gets croaked, the dwagon is croaked also?

Yeah this happened with Leroy too in the previous page.