Ghosts of Satlmarsh: already out?

[QuickLyRaiNbow]

I had just asked on Canonfire! what the module's starting year could be, and I suppose that certainly narrows it down; I recall hearing ages ago that they wanted to reboot the WORLD OF GREYHAWK^® back to 576 CY, and as an ardent fan of 3e… I'm honestly not against that.

Hell, when contemplating converting my plane-hopping 3e sorceress, Quintessa, to 5e, I had thought of her visiting Toril just as the Spellplague hits and ending up frozen by a variant temporal stasis. Eventually she's freed only to find that not only has a 100+ years passed, but the temporal connection between Oerth and Toril has altered so that she'd return the Oerth of "the past" — possibly an Oerth where she was never born.

I don't know anything about Greyhawk lore, but Iuz is around, Keoland has been defeated in its wars of conquest and Iuz's kingdom and Keoland have a neutral-to-amiable relationship, if that helps narrow things down any. I believe Kimbertos Skotti is the king of Keoland, which would put it between 564 and 598 IIRC.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

I don't know anything about Greyhawk lore, but Iuz is around, Keoland has been defeated in its wars of conquest and Iuz's kingdom and Keoland have a neutral-to-amiable relationship, if that helps narrow things down any. I believe Kimbertos Skotti is the king of Keoland, which would put it between 564 and 598 IIRC.

So is that "older" than the version of Saltmarsh we're shown in 3.5's Dungeon Master's Guide II? If it is, I'll feel safe to skip trying to hunt down a copy of it, since it's out of print.

[QuickLyRaiNbow]

So is that "older" than the version of Saltmarsh we're shown in 3.5's Dungeon Master's Guide II? If it is, I'll feel safe to skip trying to hunt down a copy of it, since it's out of print.

No idea, I'm afraid; I never looked at Saltmarsh in DMG II, and don't know enough about Greyhawk to say one way or the other. If you want, I'll try to find my DMG II copy this afternoon after work and look at some of the similarities and differences.

[Âmesang]

I took a peak through the DUNGEON MASTER'S Guide II and found this:

"Longtime D&D fans no doubt recognize the town of Saltmarsh, which was originally introduced in 1981 in dungeon module U1: The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh. This module was followed by two more adventures, U2: Danger at Dunwater and U3: The Final Enemy … The town of Saltmarsh presented here exists several years after the events in those adventures."

I'm kind of a pedant for such things, even when my group's DM is extraordinarily lax… though with my luck we'll just end up playing some FORGOTTEN REALMS^® version just out of laziness. I would like to peak through the book just to see what the new factions are like (assuming they're as detailed as the Realms'). Considering I'm the primary note-taker, though, I'd like to include something for a year just for posterity.

EDIT: If we were to take a LIVING GREYHAWK™ approach, then since the DMGII came out in 2005 that should correspond to 595 CY. Of course if Overking Ivid V is still in power, then the year would likely be on or before 586 CY (which I imagine would line up better with the older modules).

[Spriteless]

Question: How different is the Saltmarsh of this book from the Saltmarsh described in 3.5's Dungeon Master's Guide II? I'm wondering if scrounging up the old 3.5 book would enhance my experience of the 5e one.

Veeeery different. DMG2 Saltmarsh is like, a small, well developed city, with a theater and other civilized stuff, as I recall. This Saltmarsh is a smaller smuggling outpost fishing village, with a bit of a schizm in local politics (which could be charted on the chaos/law axis) that means the PCs could influence the future of the settlement. Very intriguing, in a blue collar way.

I mean, I still love the DMG2 for walking one through making a city, though.

[Unoriginal]

Veeeery different. DMG2 Saltmarsh is like, a small, well developed city, with a theater and other civilized stuff, as I recall. This Saltmarsh is a smaller smuggling outpost fishing village, with a bit of a schizm in local politics (which could be charted on the chaos/law axis) that means the PCs could influence the future of the settlement. Very intriguing, in a blue collar way.

I mean, I still love the DMG2 for walking one through making a city, though.

I know a D&D Livestream that's about to go to Saltmarsh, with for adventurers an half-elf narcissistic alcoholic Myrkul Cleric, an half-elf Bard and wizard-wannabr who spent 10 years transformed into a raven, a Tabaxi Rogue who once stole a chief's crown in the middle of his tribe, and a Warforged Fighter who still hasn't figured everything about not being at war or how to live in this different world.

I fully expect them to take the city over or burn it to the ground semi-accidentally within a few sessions.

[Spriteless]

What is this stream? I want to see people try to burn a swamp down to the ground.

[Unoriginal]

What is this stream? I want to see people try to burn a swamp down to the ground.

Well, it's called "Roll20 presents:...", DMed by Adam Koebel, but the Saltmarsh stuff is supposed to start on the 27th.

Also they might not burn the town. Or the town might burn without it being their fault.

EDIT:
Here's a twitter post about it:

https://twitter.com/roll20app/status...96364419727361

[Puh Laden]

For anyone who has it, did they make the secret of "The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh" more sinister?

Because:

Spoiler

Show

when I ran U1 today in AD&D, my players ended up making an alliance with the smugglers; the party occupies the upper mansion and the smugglers carry on about their business (they were able to convince Sanbalet that having the mansion be legitimately occupied was a better way to deter unwanted eyes than just making it look haunted.) Of course, part of the reason they were able to do that is because in the papers that related to the purchase of the mansion, it was decided that "of course, the deed is there". And they already had a council member's agreement that they could keep anything in the mansion. And they have no guilt because none are lawful and the smugglers are literally only committing tax evasion -- they're not evil cultists, necromancers, slavers, or anything else like that. Of course, if the council finds out, they'll be in trouble for sure.

[Âmesang]

Also, does anyone know if this'll come with a Player's/DM's Guide like previous big 5e modules? I'd like to see if they have an official write up for the new factions (at least done up in the same format as before, just to keep things consistent).

[Unoriginal]

Also, does anyone know if this'll come with a Player's/DM's Guide like previous big 5e modules? I'd like to see if they have an official write up for the new factions (at least done up in the same format as before, just to keep things consistent).

Not sure what you mean? There is a section describing factions, backgrounds, downtime activities, etc, based in the Saltmarsh region.

[Merudo]

There's a sea lion.

There are a few beasts! The giant sea eel is CR 1/2, the sea lion is CR 1/2, the giant white moray eel is CR 2, and the giant coral snake is CR 4. There's also a sahuagin hatchling swarm at CR 3, which is classified as a beast for some reason, and a unique CR 1/8 awakened crab named Barnacle Bess, which belongs to an NPC.

Thank you! I'll be added these beasts shortly.

[Âmesang]

…but is Bess a monstrous crab?

Not sure what you mean? There is a section describing factions, backgrounds, downtime activities, etc, based in the Saltmarsh region.

I meant something more akin to this — the Adventurers' League Player Guide for Waterdeep: Dragon Heist/Dungeon of the Mad Mage
https://media.wizards.com/2018/dnd/d...ds/ALPGv82.pdf

I'm considering picking up Saltmarsh just 'cause it's GREYHAWK^®, but there's also the chance my group'll run it and I don't want to risk peeking ahead. Granted, kind of my fault for using a form-fillable pdf character sheet to get a character ready ahead-of-time.

[Kane0]

Just picked up my copy yesterday, haven't had a chance to read through it but looks solid enough from a skim.

[2D8HP]

…I meant something more akin to this — the Adventurers' League Player Guide for Waterdeep: Dragon Heist/Dungeon of the Mad Mage
https://media.wizards.com/2018/dnd/d...ds/ALPGv82.pdf....

That's neat!

I've never seen anything like that (but the last "Adventurer's League" game I played in was over two years ago, I played "Lander Stormwind" an Urchin background human Fighter and....)

[Âmesang]

So I just picked it up, and after a quick page-by-page of scan with my eyes… I found information on the three factions, but not presented in the way they are in most Adventures' League player guides; fortunately the Greyhawk Grognard has a detailed write-up for the Scarlet Brotherhood, which (along with Faerûn's factions) should provide a great template for the Loyalists and Traditionalists.

I also made myself a faction logo template, so I'm thinking of something based on the nations' respective heraldry.

Spoiler: Example — Menzoberranzan's "Army of the Black Spider"

Show

[Envyus]

For anyone who has it, did they make the secret of "The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh" more sinister?

Because:

Spoiler

Show

when I ran U1 today in AD&D, my players ended up making an alliance with the smugglers; the party occupies the upper mansion and the smugglers carry on about their business (they were able to convince Sanbalet that having the mansion be legitimately occupied was a better way to deter unwanted eyes than just making it look haunted.) Of course, part of the reason they were able to do that is because in the papers that related to the purchase of the mansion, it was decided that "of course, the deed is there". And they already had a council member's agreement that they could keep anything in the mansion. And they have no guilt because none are lawful and the smugglers are literally only committing tax evasion -- they're not evil cultists, necromancers, slavers, or anything else like that. Of course, if the council finds out, they'll be in trouble for sure.

In an optional way if the DM wants to make everything part of one adventure.

Spoiler

Show

One of the town council is involved with the smugglers and the smugglers are also involved in the slave trade along with giving weapons to the lizard folk.

[2D8HP]

As I read more of Saltmarsh it becomes more and more impressive to me (yes I was buying modules when Saltmarsh was printed for 1e, I remember some of In Search of the Unknown, The Village of Hommlet, Against the Giants, and The Vault of the Drow, but I don't remember this one), it really looks to me to be the best "campaign" WotC has put out since Tomb of Annihilation, and the suggestions for mixing the setting and adventures in it with those from Tales of the Yawning Portal are spot on.

Besides, with the new Backgrounds of "Fisher", "Marine", "Shipwright", and "Smuggler" there's expanded oppurtunities beyond the "Sailor" background to have a PC who says "Matey", "Seaward ho! Hang the treasure! It's the glory of the sea that has turned my head.There's never a man looked me between the eyes and seen a good day a'terward", "For thirty years, I've sailed the seas and seen good and bad, better and worse, fair weather and foul, provisions running out, knives going, and what not. Well, now I tell you, I never seen good come o' goodness yet. Him as strikes first is my fancy; dead men don't bite; them's my views" and "ARRRR!"

I'm impressed.

[deljzc]

For those Greyhawk fans out there, here is Anne Myers interactive map:

https://easyzoom.com/image/122424

One of the coolest things for us old school D&D fans on the internet.

Note, this uses of a lot of the 3e Living Greyhawk chronology and shows Saltmarsh as a large town when the original source material (U1-U3) describes it as a fishing village with maybe 1000-2000 people (including the surrounding countryside).

It kind of makes sense as well because there is no reason for a large town to be so close to Burle and Seaton. I think the adventure runs better as a small fishing village and surrounding agrarian properties and I hope the new release goes back to that (sounds like it does).

I loved this location to start adventurers in Greyhawk. There's a ton going on. Lots of old-school modules in the vicinity and didn't follow the typical Village of Homlet and Temple of Elemental Evil path many were doing back in my day (which was up in the City of Greyhawk area). Not that running Homlet, TOEE and Slave Lords (Wild Coast) and even into Giants/Drow wasn't a good old school adventure (it was). But if you want something different, Saltmarsh was a fun start.

[Unoriginal]

It kind of makes sense as well because there is no reason for a large town to be so close to Burle and Seaton. I think the adventure runs better as a small fishing village and surrounding agrarian properties and I hope the new release goes back to that (sounds like it does).

Specifically, it's a small fishing village/town that might get bigger in the near future thank to the mine that recently opened