OOTS #1179 - The Discussion Thread

[Rollin]

Which fit in nicely with the Interdenominational Cleansing of Fenrir's High Priest Who Really Shouldn't Have to be Told to Wash at His Age.

The Church of Balder probably held off until after that to announce their Truth and Reconciliation Cake Social, because there was no point unless they could invite everyone.

[Sorator]

An idle thought: what are the chances that someone else becomes high priest (of any of these gods) while the current ones are stuck? What's involved in becoming/being a high priest? It's probably not purely the highest level cleric of the deity in question for most of them, but it's possible that at least one works that way, and that could get rather interesting if they're stuck in place gaining no XP long enough. We know the rules of the Godsmoot don't prohibit transferring the title of high priest, given what the "church" of Hel did, though it's possible they prevent it transferring to someone outside the Godsmoot structure...

Probably won't matter, though; it's more convenient plot-wise if they stay there until things elsewhere get resolved.

[Rogar Demonblud]

You become High Priest when the relevant god tells you you're the high priest.

[Anitar]

and the rules say no backsies.

The rules that gods employ to stop themselves from devolving into chaos and creating new mini-Snarls are not the same rules that a bunch of old dwarves are beholden to, even if the old dwarves are coming together specifically to give advice to one of said gods.

[Emanick]

You become High Priest when the relevant god tells you you're the high priest.

Was it Hel herself who made the Frontarch the new High Priest of Hel? Or was it the current high priest?

While I'm sure a church would obey its god's orders on the matter, it seems that at least some gods are just fine with their followers making their own decisions when it comes to leadership-transferral. (There's a scene in Start of Darkness that also suggests as much, though I won't go into it because I don't want to bother with spoilers.)

[Rrmcklin]

Was it Hel herself who made the Frontarch the new High Priest of Hel? Or was it the current high priest?

While I'm sure a church would obey its god's orders on the matter, it seems that at least some gods are just fine with their followers making their own decisions when it comes to leadership-transferral. (There's a scene in Start of Darkness that also suggests as much, though I won't go into it because I don't want to bother with spoilers.)

I mean, the "frontarch" situation was very clearly just so the real High Priest could go off and actually complete Hel's plan. She was never High Priest in any truly meaningful sense, and everyone knew it, they just couldn't call the vampires on it.

[Fyraltari]

Given the votes already cast, it's quite possible that when they reconvene Hel wins if the issue is still on the table. The winning vote for her was cast at the same time the elder paused the meeting, and the rules say no backsies.

The only thing that matters is wether Dvalin considers that vote cast or not. Since the table was broken before the vote was cast, Dvalin can simply rule that it was invalid. Not to mention that when the council reconvenes and that particular Elder vote ‘No’ who is going to argue that he shouldn’t be allowed to?

An idle thought: what are the chances that someone else becomes high priest (of any of these gods) while the current ones are stuck? What's involved in becoming/being a high priest? It's probably not purely the highest level cleric of the deity in question for most of them, but it's possible that at least one works that way, and that could get rather interesting if they're stuck in place gaining no XP long enough. We know the rules of the Godsmoot don't prohibit transferring the title of high priest, given what the "church" of Hel did, though it's possible they prevent it transferring to someone outside the Godsmoot structure...

Probably won't matter, though; it's more convenient plot-wise if they stay there until things elsewhere get resolved.

The churches (except Hel’s, obviously) most likely all have protocols that forbid changing High Priest while they are away on Godsmoot duty to avoid accidentally depriving their patron of their vote.

[Lupus Major]

Hmm, I'm not too active on the forums, but did I miss them taking some action regarding the poor dude who got transported to the Plane of Infinite Painful Slopes?

[Psyren]

Is there some enhanced version of Stone Shape that would let the clerics create something akin to a shower head?

No need - you can actually cast Create Water into the air and let it fall as a downpour/shower already.

But as stated, this is funnier.

Resolving the situation as quickly as possible against Hel is favorable to stalling, so you're logic doesn't hold up.

Except if the vote resolves against destroying the world, nothing stops them from holding another one not long after. To paraphrase Roy, "the day is only saved if we stop this vote AND there isn't another one."

[RatElemental]

The winning vote for her was cast at the same time the elder paused the meeting

If the vote was considered cast, the vote would have concluded and there'd have been no more need for a meeting.

and the rules say no backsies.

The rules of the godsmoot do, not necessarily the rules of the clanmoot. They can't be using the same rules because the godsmoot has no table.

And mending won't do squat in any case, as the table weighs more than one pound.

But make whole would, that's a moot point though.

[factotum]

Summon Monster. Order it to be quiet. Drink the monster's blood. Dismiss the monster.

If it was that simple Durkula would have been doing that on the Mechane rather than relying on the rest of the Order allowing him to take a sip now and again. Also, I suggested using Summon Monster for food earlier and was told that monsters just vamoose back to their home plane when they die or are dismissed--pretty sure that means any part of the monster goes back as well, so your meal suddenly vanishes.

[The_Weirdo]

If it was that simple Durkula would have been doing that on the Mechane rather than relying on the rest of the Order allowing him to take a sip now and again. Also, I suggested using Summon Monster for food earlier and was told that monsters just vamoose back to their home plane when they die or are dismissed--pretty sure that means any part of the monster goes back as well, so your meal suddenly vanishes.

After you've eaten it? Like, the blood vanishes from the stomach of the cleric? Weird.

Well... Maybe there are rats there?

[mjasghar]

It wasn’t 3 castings of create water due to it not taking that long
The Giant has a convention where he portrays long casting time spells by having the caster simply repeat the name of the spell (Roy’s return to life is the one I remember the best)
Usually this is emphasised for comic effect.

[greenfunkman]

Does this strip imply that the gods are effectively paralyzed until the vote is resolved? Could they now destroy the world in time if the Snarl got free?

[factotum]

Does this strip imply that the gods are effectively paralyzed until the vote is resolved? Could they now destroy the world in time if the Snarl got free?

Of course not. We've already seen Thor, Loki and Hel acting just fine while the vote is suspended, and if it came down to "destroy the world or die", it'll be destroyed regardless of the outstanding state of this vote.

[Malloon]

HAHAHAHA! Really glad I decided to make an account last strip, it allows me to comment on side-splitting posts like these. Funniest thing I've read all month.

[CriticalFailure]

It seemed implied that they already agreed to do something if the last gate falls/the snarl is getting out.

[Schroeswald]

Hmm, I'm not too active on the forums, but did I miss them taking some action regarding the poor dude who got transported to the Plane of Infinite Painful Slopes?

Durkon’s Cousin’s Brother-in-law’s Niece’s Fiancé hasn’t been saved, plane shift is a ninth level spell for clerics so Durkon can now save him (unless Sigdi picked Hilgya up and forced her to cast it, or Logann’s Sister is a level 13 sorcerer/wizard and for some reason only cast really low-level spells so far).

It wasn’t 3 castings of create water due to it not taking that long
The Giant has a convention where he portrays long casting time spells by having the caster simply repeat the name of the spell (Roy’s return to life is the one I remember the best)
Usually this is emphasised for comic effect.

But Create Water is a short casting time, one standard action so it was cast thrice.

[CriticalFailure]

Isn’t it a 5th level spell for clerics?

[Schroeswald]

Isn’t it a 5th level spell for clerics?

Yeah, I’m never gonna get used to the terms to describe levels and caster levels, plane shift is a fifth level spell so you’d need to be ninth level to cast it, and for sorcerers and wizards it’s a 7th level spell so you have to be 13th level.

[CriticalFailure]

yeah having spell levels be different from level levels was A Choice

[Peelee]

Yeah, I’m never gonna get used to the terms to describe levels and caster levels, plane shift is a fifth level spell so you’d need to be ninth level to cast it, and for sorcerers and wizards it’s a 7th level spell so you have to be 13th level.

14th for sorcs.

[Fish]

The created water doesn’t just vanish. What they need is the spell “create drain.” How many showers will it take before the Godsmoot is knee-deep in bathwater?

Or, yeah, make a basin and re-purify the same water after each bath. But this is funnier.

[Schroeswald]

14th for sorcs.

Of course it is, because why would caster levels be at all consistent if there is a way for them to be inconsistent?

[Dion]

I wonder if being a dwarven treeslayer is any more dangerous than being a human lumberjack, or if they’re roughly the same job.

[CriticalFailure]

Well, lumberjacks do have one of the higher rates of workplace mortality, sadly.

[Breccia]

Someone who would probably have the Fire Domain casting Create Water would probably give us a nice hot shower.

Wouldn't that be heresy?

[Algeh]

Someone who would probably have the Fire Domain casting Create Water would probably give us a nice hot shower. Much better for cleaning.

Wouldn't that be heresy?

Depends: is the person trying to take a shower on fire at the time?

[Peelee]

Of course it is, because why would caster levels be at all consistent if there is a way for them to be inconsistent?

Well that's at least easily explainable; sorcerers get cast spontaneously, which is a pretty big boon, so they get their spell levels upgraded at one level later. And have a hard cap on how many spells they can know. And don't get any bonus feats. And are fluffed as inferior to wizards despite being born with the innate ability to create what wizards have to study in order to replicate. And still need material components despite having the innate ability to cast magic.

So... Pathfinder Sorcerer, you say?

[Schroeswald]

Well that's at least easily explainable; sorcerers get cast spontaneously, which is a pretty big boon, so they get their spell levels upgraded at one level later. And have a hard cap on how many spells they can know. And don't get any bonus feats. And are fluffed as inferior to wizards despite being born with the innate ability to create what wizards have to study in order to replicate. And still need material components despite having the innate ability to cast magic.

So... Pathfinder Sorcerer, you say?

I feel like having a hard cap is enough to balance the spontaneous casting, the rest makes the class seem really poorly balanced (correct me if it turns out that doesn’t matter all that much and the other stuff matters a lot).