OOTS #1183 - Discussion Thread

[Gnoman]

What? I have no knowledge of anything related to tabletop gaming in 1913 (32 years after president Garfield's death, and neither does Google), and I can't find any founder of this genre who qualifies as a sci-fi author.

Herbert George Wells published a book called Little Wars in 1913, which contained simple wargaming rules for toy soldiers. This is considered to be the first commercial "table"top (it was actually intended to be played on the floor, but whatever) wargame, as the Prussian Kriegsspiel games of the 19th century were intended for purely military use.

[Petrocorus]

it breaks the pre-established rules of her shapeshifting, making the twist likely land a bit flatter.

It's not a pre-established rule if it's not established as a rule.
The fact she's never done it, apparently, does not mean she cannot do it.
Both the 3.5 rules and the simple logic say she should be able to change her skin color if she wants to.

I've honestly never paid attention to this before you mentioned it.

She can, but she chooses not to.

This is indeed exactly what we have seen so far.

[Dausuul]

Re: The artifact, it can’t be anything that belongs to the main characters (vilains included) since Cedrik already has it. So it’s most likely a brand new doomsday device. Hmm, does anyone recall what happened to the talisman Nale was after? Weren’t the Directors the one that tipped him about it in the first place?

The talisman was shattered. However, if it's a proper artifact, it can't be permanently destroyed without a special procedure of some kind. And nobody picked up the pieces; the Directors could have retrieved them and reassembled them.

I have been wondering for a while if the Monster in the Darkness was from an older edition of D&D. If so, and the Directors did salvage Dorukan's Talisman, it might become their most potent weapon.

[Ron Miel]

I doubt it, he's a little too paranoid for even a succubus to fool. That, and I seem to recall him saying that he tripped a trap some time ago that castrated him, so it doesn't seem he'd be interested in Sabine's hypothetical advances.

Sterilised, not castrated.

[Particle_Man]

Shirra is recording a book value loss for them. Moreover, since her company doesn't mine rubies, presumably she paid (or traded) for them.

Funnily enough, her giving them to V for free sidesteps the issue. The value is what *she* records (or paid) for them. If, OTOH, she traded them to V for "mates' rates", THAT would be the value and they'd be useless

Shirra is probably grateful for the chance to indirectly (and of course only partially) pay back Durkon's mom by helping Durkon's friend, since getting Durkon's mom to accept wealth directly is like pulling teeth.

[Jannoire]

I doubt it, he's a little too paranoid for even a succubus to fool. That, and I seem to recall him saying that he tripped a trap some time ago that castrated him, so it doesn't seem he'd be interested in Sabine's hypothetical advances.

Just because you're shooting blanks, doesn't mean you don't enjoy shooting

[hamishspence]

The talisman was shattered. However, if it's a proper artifact, it can't be permanently destroyed without a special procedure of some kind. And nobody picked up the pieces; the Directors could have retrieved them and reassembled them.

That only applies to Major artifacts. Minor artifacts are more easily destroyable.

[Riftwolf]

Funny but probably not going to happen: IFCC pull Vs soul just to make an awkward pause 3 minutes long.

[Quartz]

Does this strip tell us that Nero & co are not affected by the memory wipe?

[Skull the Troll]

Does this strip tell us that Nero & co are not affected by the memory wipe?

They said all of those got reabsorbed into their planes, but I'm assuming these three have been told what the deal is by their god(s). Theres a bit of a mish mash of different theological tropes going on here. Hel's hell doesn't seem to be the same as the one the directors live in. But there are lots of planes, so its not really an issue. The point is they want more worlds built around fighting and conflict forever. Its a wonderful subversion for me. When the had that panel when they were tempting Varsuvius I thought they wanted the world to not be destroyed because they wanted the conflict of this world to go on, but now that we know that this might all get fixed, it changes it entirely.

[LordViperagyil]

I'm going to be a bit sad if when we first see our favorite succubus in the new artsyle, and she isn't dressed like Jenny from page 622 or Haley from the end of 752.

[The MunchKING]

I just thought of this. Does the idea that Sabine is using her vaction days mean she DOESN'T KNOW she's supposed to be retrieving this "vessel" for them, but they know her well enough to know she will encounter and grab the vessel when she finds it? Either because it's part of her scheme (like something to rescue Nale's soul or something), or just direct rewards if she finds something useful being a standard policy.

[Rrmcklin]

Does this strip tell us that Nero & co are not affected by the memory wipe?

No? There are any number of ways they could have collected information on the Snarl, like constantly watching (at least one of) our heroes who talk about it fairly often enough.

And they didn't even actually directly mention the Snarl here,

[HorizonWalker]

No? There are any number of ways they could have collected information on the Snarl, like constantly watching (at least one of) our heroes who talk about it fairly often enough.

And they didn't even actually directly mention the Snarl here,

Hell, we even watched Sabine learn about the Gates and immediately rush off to tell the Archfiends.

[Emanick]

They've used "vessel" to refer to a body before, it'd make a lot of sense for Sabine to view finding a body as mixing business with pleasure, the next world could be Eberron and the IFCC's "artifact" is actually a quori spirit from the future that can't act on the material plane without a host (even if it isn't an "actual" Empty Vessel raised and trained for the purpose of being possessed)....Okay maybe the last part isn't serious.

Reading this post gave me an idea: what if the vessel is Nale? She would certainly enjoy "fetching" his soul, so if she was retrieving him on the IFCC's orders, that would combine both business and pleasure. And if they bring his revived body and/or soul on the Material Plane - even as a "vessel" for some other thing - that could easily lead to a scenario where she betrays the IFCC in an attempt to keep a revived Nale alive after their purpose for him has expired.

Sure, by RAW he should already be a mane or something, but it wouldn't be the first time the comic deviated from a traditional interpretation of how the D&D multiverse works.

[Skull the Troll]

Reading this post gave me an idea: what if the vessel is Nale? She would certainly enjoy "fetching" his soul, so if she was retrieving him on the IFCC's orders, that would combine both business and pleasure. And if they bring his revived body and/or soul on the Material Plane - even as a "vessel" for some other thing - that could easily lead to a scenario where she betrays the IFCC in an attempt to keep a revived Nale alive after their purpose for him has expired.

Sure, by RAW he should already be a mane or something, but it wouldn't be the first time the comic deviated from a traditional interpretation of how the D&D multiverse works.

Nale's vessel was disintegrated. I'm betting its Tarquin.

[Riftwolf]

No? There are any number of ways they could have collected information on the Snarl, like constantly watching (at least one of) our heroes who talk about it fairly often enough.

And they didn't even actually directly mention the Snarl here,

If anything, they thought world destruction was good for them. Either they're demigods and so high enough on the food chain that they don't get formatted (which, last time I checked, they were non-divine) or they don't know about the world reboots and are working off Shojos story along with other incomplete information.

[Rrmcklin]

Nale's vessel was disintegrated. I'm betting its Tarquin.

Something I've had pointed out to me - this line of thought of "Sabine is definitely targeting Tarquin" comes with the implicit assumption that Sabine should be able to easily acquire Tarquin's body. That is, um, not anything we have reason to assume.

But, looking back at the strip I noticed something - Lee mentions this vessel with the indefinite "an" not "the" like everyone has been discussing it in terms. Which makes me doubt the specific person, assuming it even is a person will actually matter.

[Schroeswald]

Something I've had pointed out to me - this line of thought of "Sabine is definitely targeting Tarquin" comes with the implicit assumption that Sabine should be able to easily acquire Tarquin's body. That is, um, not anything we have reason to assume.

But, looking back at the strip I noticed something - Lee mentions this vessel with the indefinite "an" not "the" like everyone has been discussing it in terms. Which makes me doubt the specific person, assuming it even is a person will actually matter.

I'm pretty sure that "an" means that the IFCC doesn't need anything too specific, just something that is "appropriate", but the mixing business with pleasure thing likely means that Sabine does care what this vessel will be.

[Rrmcklin]

I'm pretty sure that "an" means that the IFCC doesn't need anything too specific, just something that is "appropriate", but the mixing business with pleasure thing likely means that Sabine does care what this vessel will be.

That line seemed to be in reference to how she was using her vacation days, but still decided to do some work. Not about her specifically caring about this vessel for personal reasons (like revenge, as seems to be the thought process in it being Tarquin).

But since we're talking about this, can succubi even possess people. I get why demonic possession would be the go to place considering who is talking, but is that a thing?

[Petrocorus]

Maybe Sabine is using her own time to try to find a new body / vessel for Nale's soul and it somehow work in favor of the IFCC.

[Sloanzilla]

Wait a minute- won't this forcecage not work since it was a free amount of ruby dust and not the XXX gold amount that the spell requires?

[Schroeswald]

Wait a minute- won't this forcecage not work since it was a free amount of ruby dust and not the XXX gold amount that the spell requires?

I'd guess it cost exactly as much as Shirra payed for it, because somehow I doubt Rich, who only occasionally cares about RAI (I'm honestly still shocked he wrote in V getting some rubies specifically for a Forcecage), would actually care about this RAW when not making a joke about the RAW being dumb (see, last time he made fun of it).

[BarakDeathBlade]

Maybe Sabine is using her own time to try to find a new body / vessel for Nale's soul and it somehow work in favor of the IFCC.

And he gets a soul splice? Because it's a once a century deal; we haven't done one in 100 years, and we won't do another in another 100 years? Director LEe came up with that one.

Oh, and Nale blows total arcane power way worse than V did...

I like it. It won't be what happens, but I like it.

[Rogar Demonblud]

So was I like the only person to think Sabine mixing business with pleasure just meant she was having random sex hook ups while doing whatever the Directors sent her to do?

[Schroeswald]

So was I like the only person to think Sabine mixing business with pleasure just meant she was having random sex hook ups while doing whatever the Directors sent her to do?

Probably not, I disagree with it though (although it is reasonable) because she does that all the time, they explicitly say she's on vacation first, I wouldn't count her having hookups as a vacation because that's no different than her non-vacation time (like returning to the IFCC way back when we first met them), I'd say grabbing the vessel is a side-mission to, whatever she's doing, remaking a Linear Guild, trying to kill Tarquin, trying to revive Nale, sleeping around 100 times more than usual to get over him.

[deuterio12]

So was I like the only person to think Sabine mixing business with pleasure just meant she was having random sex hook ups while doing whatever the Directors sent her to do?

Believe it's more a question of taking targets of opportunity.

Sure Sabine may be in vacation, but if she sees an easy chance to corrupt some extra souls for the lower planes or drain vital energy from suckers, would be a waste to just pass them up.

Succubus aren't "freedom and healthy sex just for the sake of fun, woot!". They're the manifestation of unhealthy sex, getting one addicted and manipulating them until they're nothing but an empty husk (or a pile of dust in Nale's case).

And before anyone goes "But Sabine truly loved Nale and had the best intentions for him", you know what they say about the road to hell being paved with.

[Quartz]

Hell, we even watched Sabine learn about the Gates and immediately rush off to tell the Archfiends.

Just because she didn't know doesn't mean that they didn't know.

[Nomen]

Believe it's more a question of taking targets of opportunity.

Sure Sabine may be in vacation, but if she sees an easy chance to corrupt some extra souls for the lower planes or drain vital energy from suckers, would be a waste to just pass them up.

Succubus aren't "freedom and healthy sex just for the sake of fun, woot!". They're the manifestation of unhealthy sex, getting one addicted and manipulating them until they're nothing but an empty husk (or a pile of dust in Nale's case).

And before anyone goes "But Sabine truly loved Nale and had the best intentions for him", you know what they say about the road to hell being paved with.

Nale died because he told his father not to give him special treatment after killing his father's best friend. Now I'm sure things wouldn't have worked out that exact way if he wasn't dating Sabine for one thing he wouldn't have all those potions, but blaming her for his death makes about as much sense as blaming Belkor for Roy's death. Nale's grudge with Malak had more to do with his father or Malak himself than with Sabine (if I had to guess he's pissy because Malak's taking his place as his fathers legacy), and his defiance is a result of the way he was raised by his father more than Sabine.

[Skull the Troll]

I'm pretty sure that "an" means that the IFCC doesn't need anything too specific, just something that is "appropriate", but the mixing business with pleasure thing likely means that Sabine does care what this vessel will be.

The "an" thing is a good point, but another explanation is that they dont think of the vessels as people, they think of them as things. As far as SAbine goes, getting revenge on the person that killed Nale by tempting him into getting bound to the IFCC and eternal damnation sounds like a pretty succubus thing to do to me. Plus conservation of detail and all, They would just say who/what it is if it wasn't supposed to a surprise.