Arena Tournament, Round 26: Todd vs Kurgan

[ArenaManager]

Arena Tournament, Round 26: Todd vs. Kurgan

Map:

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XP Award: 300 XP
GP Award: 300 GP

Mavian - Todd
Kurgan - Dragonstar

All Combatants, please roll initiative.

[Mavian]

I have a question... Can you take a class substitution in the middle, ala Kurgan's Dragonscale husk. Or do you have to wait until you level up and retrain it?

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

Arena rules allow for retraining between matches, per PHB 2.

In the 1st paragraph of retraining in the PHB2, retraining is stated to be available only when levelling up.

Dragonstar needs to correct this by removing the Dragonscale husk variant and replacing it with the armor proficiencies lost.

[Dragonstar]

I don't believe that's the way it works. The Arena rules state that you may retrain between matches. As you can not level between a match, only once you are out of a round, that makes the option to retrain between matches completely pointless. I believe the intent of the rule is to override the leveling requirement, but to still follow the PHB2 retraining rules allowing only a single thing to be changed.

I'm calling for this ruling to be overturned by higher authority before we continue on.

[chilepepper]

ref chilepepper
Ah, I see Dragonstar's point. It says in the section "In Between Matches" that you can retrain. Everything else in that section clearly refers to things you can do in between matches, like purchasing items. It doesn't seem like the section is mistitled.

IMO, the retraining guidelines shouldn't be in that section. I can't see retraining between levels.

[Kyeudo]

GM Kyeudo

Let's look at the rule in question.

*Characters may be retrained, as by the Player's Handbook II Retraining Rules.

Bolding Mine.

Because we specify that it is as per PHB2's rules, those rules still hold sway unless specificaly noted otherwise (such as with the retraining of flaws and traits), even if it is listed in the "between matches" section of the rules. Because PHB2 clearly marks retraining as an action that can only happen when leveling up, that is the only time it can be done.

The rule is listed as something to do between matches because everything you can do that doesn't take place at the begining, during, or end of a match is listed there. The heading of the section is in no way its own ruling.

Since there is no current need for a "things to do when leveling up" section, I don't see any reason to move the rule to a new section at this time.

[Dragonstar]

Fair enough then. I'd recommend altering the text on the front page to clarify that point though. Sheet altered, purchased a potion and new weapon.

Let's get this show on the road. After all, I may have to do this match twice.

initiative - (1d20+2)[6]

[Mavian]

Another point of order.

I do believe your over the wealth by level guidelines now.

If I remember correctly, the WBL for a level 2 character is 900 gp. Your equipment exceeds that at the moment. So what are you leaving behind?

[Dragonstar]

Sorry, I wasn't aware of the rule - I leave behind one of my two potions of Cure Light, bringing me 16gp below the limit. Continue on?

[Mavian]

As some people have noted, I'm a bit of a rules lawyer, so I apologize if I gave any offense, I just liking things neat and orderly. I also bought a potion of Beastland Ferocity, which I will be starting with in one hand, holding my poleax with the other as I stand in B14

Initiative - (1d20+1)[6]

@Edit: Tied matches go to the higher modifier which means that its your move.

[Dragonstar]

No offense taken. I've been DM for the same group on Thursday nights for well over two years, and I have two very capable rules lawyers. One is a DCI judge - he's the prosecuting attorney type. The other is the ambulance chasing lawyer type. Both very different, but very capable forms of the same thing - for a time the former was a paladin and the latter a rogue. Imagine that one...

Point being, I'm used to it.

But enough rambling - let the battle begin!

Start in Y14, Shield in one hand, potion in the other. Standard action drink potion, move action 20' forward to U15, drawing my pick as I go. Pass the turn.

Stats:

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Location: U15
HP 20/20
AC 16, T 9, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 1/30

[Mavian]

Todd - Round 1

Double Move to I17

End of Turn:

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Hp: 19
AC: 15
Speed: 20
Manuevers: All Readied
Stance: None

[Dragonstar]

Move to Q15

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Standard action total defense.
Location: Q15
HP 20/20
AC 20, T 13, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 2/30

You may go.

[Mavian]

Todd: Round 2

Standard Action: Drink Potion
Move Action: I17 to K15 regripping my Poleaxe in both hands

End of Turn

Stats for Refs:

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Hp: 19
AC: 15
Speed: 20
Manuevers: All Readied
Stance: None
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 1/10

[Dragonstar]

Move to N15

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Ready action, if he gets within 10' (such as M16) I will 5-ft adjust to close in and strike.

Location: U15
HP 20/20
AC 16, T 9, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 3/30

You may go.

[Mavian]

Todd - Round 3.

I'm assuming you've readied an action, since all you preformed was a move action. Kyeudo has ruled that readying an action is visible here.

Swift Action: Activate Strength Domain
Free Action: Five-foot step to L15
Standard Action: Smash the wall
Attack Roll: (1d20+3)[23]
Damage: (2d6+4)[7]
Stance: (1d6)[5]

End of Turn:

Stats for Refs:

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Hp: 19
AC: 13
Speed: 20
Manuevers: All Readied
Stance: None
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 2/10

[Dragonstar]

Move to N17 and take a more defensive stance.

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Standard action total defense.
Location: N17
HP 20/20
AC 20, T 13, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 4/30

You may go.

[Mavian]

Standard Action: Attack with Poleaxe and Sapphire Nightmare Blade
Concentration Check: (1d20+13)[25] If this hits you are flat-footed
Attack: (1d20+4)[23]
Damage: (2d6)[8] + 4 Strength which I forgot to add.
Stance: (1d6)[5]
Sapphire (1d6)[2]

So, 19 points of damage in total.

Move Action: L15 to K15

End of Turn:

Stats for Ref:

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Hp: 19
AC: 13
Speed: 20
Manuevers: Charging Minotaur, Moment of Perfect Clarity
Stance: Punishing Stance
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 3/10

[Bayar]

Ref Bayar

Another point of order.

I do believe your over the wealth by level guidelines now.

If I remember correctly, the WBL for a level 2 character is 900 gp. Your equipment exceeds that at the moment. So what are you leaving behind?

I belive that that is a suggested rule and should not be in effect. So Dragonstar can keep his second CLW potion.

[Dragonstar]

Point of order - I don't see anywhere that you took a swift action to activate your stance. You applied the stance damage to the glass as well, but your swift action that round was activating your domain power.

Free action - draw potion
Standard action - drink potion (1d8+1)[8]

I'll wait on my move action until I know how much damage I really took that round.

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

While I'm sure Mavian would have agreed with you, your point is correct. Mavian hasn't actually spent an action to activate his stance. Bonus damage from that stance did not occur.

[Dragonstar]

Move to O18

Stats:

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Location: O18
HP 16/20
AC 16, T 9, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 5/30

You're up. Any Happy Easter to anyone here who celebrates it!

[Mavian]

You are quite correct, I was thinking of my strength domain, forgot which one I had activated. Consider my Hoist by my own Petard

Move Action: K15 to N16
Standard Action: Attack with Poleaxe, recovering my used manuevers.
Attack: (1d20+4)[23]
Damage: (2d6+4)[7]

@Edit: Sigh, I obviously should've switched over to a 19-20 threat range weapon for this match.

End of Turn:

Stats for Refs:

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Hp: 19
AC: 13
Speed: 20
Manuevers: All Readied
Stance: None
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 4/10
Strength Domain: 2/10

[Dragonstar]

No kidding - for such a small bonus, you've been rolling like a complete badass.

5-ft Step into O17

Free action enter a Righteous Fury

Standard action attack - (1d20+8)[18] for a potential damage - (1d6+8)[9]

If Nat 20, then confirmation - (1d20+8)[28] for an additional crit - (3d6+24)[34] damage.

@Edit: Figures, I Nat 20 on the unnecessary confirmation roll.

You may go.

Stats:

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Location: O17
HP 9/20
AC 16, T 9, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 6/30; Righteous Fury 1/2

[Mavian]

Todd - Round 6

Swift Action: Activate Punishing Stance
Free Action: Five foot step to M16
Standard Action: Attack with Sapphire Nightmare Blade
Concentration Check: (1d20+13)[22] If this hits you are flatfooted.
Attack Roll: (1d20+4)[23]
Damage: (2d6+4)[8]
Stance: (1d6)[1]
Sapphire: (1d6)[1]

@Edit: That's it, I'm switching weapons if I get a rematch.

End of Turn:

Stats for Refs:

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Hp: 11
AC: 13
Speed: 20
Manuevers: Moment of Perfect Clarity, Charging Minotaur Strike
Stance: Punishing Stance
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 5/10
Strength Domain: 3/10

[Dragonstar]

Round 7

5-ft step to N17 and utter a prayer to Bahamut to let me destroy this pretender.

attack - (1d20+8)[15] for a potential damage - (1d6+8)[11].

If Nat 20 confirmation - (1d20+8)[15] for an additional crit - (3d6+24)[38] damage.

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Location: N17
HP -2/20 (diehard)
AC 16, T 9, FF 16
Fort +6. Ref -3, Will -1
Ongoing Effects: Bull's Strength 7/30; Righteous Fury 2/2 (ends at the beginning of my next turn)

You may go.

[Mavian]

Talk about a Slugfest :p

Todd - Round 7

Free Action: Five foot step from M16 to L15
Standard Action: Launch an attack with my poleaxe, recovering my maneuvers.
Attack: (1d20+4)[23]
Damage: (2d6+4)[7]
Stance: (1d6)[3]

End of Turn:

@Edit: I swear, I'm not cheating... Honest. *Kicks the dice roller a few times*

Stats for Refs:

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Hp: -1
AC: 13
Speed: 20
Manuevers: All Readied
Stance: Punishing Stance
Beastland Ferocity: ( Can fight until -10 hp) 6/10
Strength Domain: 6/10

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

Well, technically Todd brings his foe to -10 before he drops to -1, so it looks like the win is well earned.

Todd wins, and collects the bounties noted above.

[Mavian]

Actually, we both had diehard up :P so I've got about 24 seconds before I drop dead. :P

[Mavian]

Todd vs Kurgan - Take two.