Vote Up a Campaign Setting (3E/4E)

[Owrtho]

The direction we're planning with wizardry makes it near-impossible for one person to learn from another, and highly impractical to teach in a wizard school. Otherwise, I agree, it's certainly plausible.

I can understand the lack of schools, but it still seems that in many cases, aside from some self experimentation, those who could use magic or want to would seek one with the knowledge to do so. Even if magic is something that requires a particular trait, a wizard could see that trait in someone and choose to teach them. It just seems that magic would have to be handed down to progress, and most likely it would be done between individuals. Though there isn't too much of an issue if that is not the case.

Certainly not "bad," but as an antagonist, shouldn't it by definition be "seen as bad?"

Not at all. By definition, the antagonist is the primary opposition of the protagonist. This usually results in a polarized comparison of the two, one evil and one good, but doesn't require such. If the story were of someone trying to achieve some award, the antagonist could just as easily be their best friend who is also going for the award as some evil stranger. It is just a matter of who is the one more likely to prevent them from doing so (as in the one with the best chance of getting it them self).
Thus, magic could be something that no one is particularly opinionated on, but when it comes to getting things done, it cad be quite a hassle to deal with when put together with all the other threats. It could also be something that the average man never has problems with as they aren't going out and adventuring everywhere. They may even find it helpful if they have some around to benefit them (such as maybe make the well keep flowing with crystal clear cool water). In many stories from Arabian Nights (many, many stories), women used magic to curse the protagonist. Grouped together, you could argue that the magic was thus the primary antagonist (individually the women cursing would probly take that title, but then in the vote you couldn't choose something so specific). This didn't mean people hated magic. But it was a big obstacle for the person cursed. And despite having the experience of being cursed by a women, almost all (if not all) of the men still married women with magic knowing they had it (normally the ones who removed the curse, but still...). In that, despite being the primary antagonist, there was no ill will toward it. Hence my dislike of the idea that magic is oppressed (that and I like the idea of almost every woman being willing to pull out a spell from who knows where to curse you just cuz she's jealous of some other girl being near you, or you being near some guy as the case may be).

That is incorrect. It is by no means extraordinarily present, but it crops up often and ranges from inconvenience to peril.

I hope I've put some of your fears to rest, Owrtho?

Thats good to know.

The seventh race will not be custom. And it will not be elves. They, too, would lack that "certain something" that's missing in the current racial selection.

Would that "certain something" happen to be the small size, or a tendancy toward stealth?

Owrtho

[Juhn]

Fair enough. Is it the good kind of sneaky?

Assuming this seventh race turns out to be as awesome as the rest of this setting looks to be, I suppose so.

Because admittedly, I deliberately left a 7% hole in the final racial tally and have been bleeding clues to that effect since it was posted.

I really should have caught that. I used to do things like add percents up to see if they worked out for no particular reason other than to be meticulous. I think being out of school for so long has been bad for me.

It makes me smile?

Why should you get to smile? I mean, just because you and your colleagues are creating a campaign setting for our use and letting us have input in essentially every stage of design, and not requiring anything in return? And giving out free homebrews to those who correct your so-called "errors"? You think that means you should get to do things that make you smile?

Well, I suppose you're right.

[afroakuma]

I can understand the lack of schools, but it still seems that in many cases, aside from some self experimentation, those who could use magic or want to would seek one with the knowledge to do so.

Indeed. That need not (read: will not) be a fellow wizard. However, you've hit the nail on the head regarding our plans.

Not at all. By definition, the antagonist is the primary opposition of the protagonist. This usually results in a polarized comparison of the two, one evil and one good, but doesn't require such.

That's what we're aiming for. "Sorcerers" are feared because they are considered to be men who use magic for personal gain (as few have seen magic used publicly to help others.) Meanwhile, supernatural creatures inspire either annoyance or fear. Magic is not necessarily evil, but the public will not think of magic as "good." That said, were a peasant to find a genie's lamp, he'd be quite happy to get the three wishes, or what have you.

Do you kind of understand what I'm driving at?

They may even find it helpful if they have some around to benefit them (such as maybe make the well keep flowing with crystal clear cool water).

This sort of thing will be pretty rare.

In many stories from Arabian Nights (many, many stories), women used magic to curse the protagonist.

Entirely true and entirely funny. I did attempt to stick in a prestige class to that effect (the Jezebel) but it was voted down. If a woman wants to curse her husband, then believe me there will be ways.

Hence my dislike of the idea that magic is oppressed

It is not - it's rare, not easy for mortals to access and usually used by those with intent to annoy, at the very least. There will be benevolent magic-users, and there will be no oppression of wizardry.

Would that "certain something" happen to be the small size, or a tendancy toward stealth?

That is correct.

Assuming this seventh race turns out to be as awesome as the rest of this setting looks to be, I suppose so.

I happen to like them. And as I said, I think they'll add a great flavor to the streets of our cities.

I really should have caught that.

Everyone really should have caught that, since I posted it twice. And tagged it with clues.

[Shadow_Elf]

Hello all. I am back at good ol' Aperture Science once again, and the computer-limiting powers of France have let go their hold on me.

I just wanted to put out there that Zeta and Afro did a super-special-awesome job with extremely limited help from myself.

I also wanted to throw out that the 4e content may or may not (hmwrk allowing) include more PPs/EDs from the voted list than the 3.X content (up to my co-conspirators), since in 4e a PP/ED is vital, whereas 3.X's PrCs are optional.

I also plan to add some sort of exclusive 4e only bonus content. What it is has not been decided yet.

[Ziegander]

Vote for Saberdusk! (As in, I am, and you should too!)

[Juhn]

Oh dear. Halflings? Well, assuming they're properly flavoured (and nothing like kender), then I figure they could turn out alright. We don't really have any "traveling merchant" races, do we? I could see halfling caravans, though the whole city-states thing might get in the way of that.

[afroakuma]

Not so much halflings, no.

[Juhn]

Now you've got me thinking of other small races. Surely not kobolds, as you repeatedly insisted they weren't an option... Unless, that was because they were already included?

Also, Saberdusk.

[starwoof]

Is it goblins or dwarves? Because I still think that sand dwarves are a great idea.

[Juhn]

...Please don't let it be dwarves. My elves got denied, and Dwarves didn't make it in either (thankfully). But they're neither small nor sneaky.

[afroakuma]

Now you've got me thinking of other small races. Surely not kobolds, as you repeatedly insisted they weren't an option... Unless, that was because they were already included?

Also, Saberdusk.

I was wondering when you'd actually vote, Juhn.

[Alteran]

My vote is for Desert Blood.

[Owrtho]

Is it one of the races in this list?
Norker, Kenku, Phanaton, Domovoi, or Gruwaar

Also, does it have an LA?

Owrtho

[afroakuma]

None of them.

And it does not have an LA.

That will be my final word on the subject until the announcement.

[Juhn]

I was wondering when you'd actually vote, Juhn.

Yeah, it looks like I've forgotten to vote a couple of times now: including the PrC vote. I'd have liked to have had an influence on that - Jezebel would have gotten another vote, for one thing. But then, when it comes to single-gender PrCs I've seen several female ones and only one male one - which requires your character be castrated, no less - so I suppose in one way it's not so bad that they were left out. The name really doesn't mean all that much to me, (for one thing I can change it at my leisure if I ever decide to run a game in this setting; I doubt you fine folks would get mad at me or anything over that) but I figured I'd missed too many votes as it is.

[afroakuma]

"Eunuch" was never under consideration.

"Sand Magus" was originally "Sand Witch," though, until...

and yeah, that was me.

[Juhn]

With regard to names, I'm amazed that so few of them relate to magic and/or djinni, considering how heavily they seem to be playing in the flavour of this setting.

[Owrtho]

So, its none of those, and it's an official race... Well, those were all (or atleast most of) the small races with favored class rogue excluding gnome, kobold, and halfling subtypes. So, it could be one of those or some small race withought favored class rogue.

Owrtho

[afroakuma]

As I said, can't comment any further on that one until the announcement.

Anything else, though, feel free.

[Drakefall]

Ah! I forgot to send in a name suggestion.

And it was kinda a good one too... ah well, I guess I'll just vote for Alhorus simply because it doesn't actually mean anything, bar the Horus bit, and because it doesn't make me think of a certain blue shapeshifter.

[Juhn]

I notice two of our (confirmed) races have an ECL of +3, specifically lizardfolk and gnolls. Any word on the ECL/LA of the homebrewed races?

[afroakuma]

Gnoll LA is +1 per the Monster Manual.

Ditto Lizardfolk.

Both will be tinkered with in any event.

Zeta Kai is doing the Half-Ghul and Half-Djinn, so I'll ask him.

[Juhn]

ECL also includes Racial HD, which is two in both of those cases if I'm correct. This, plus their +1 LA, adds up to +3

Also, I keep forgetting that you guys didn't invent Genasi. What's the ECL on those? (Though, they're probably being tinkered with as well).

[afroakuma]

Probably LA +1 and no racial HD.

[LordZarth]

I'll vote for Hourglass of God.

I think it would be cool if there was a big emphasis on the god/God.

You know, Church adventures and stuff. (Schisms? Facets?)

[Juhn]

Probably LA +1 and no racial HD.

I'm figuring this, or something similar, will be the case with Lizardmen and Gnolls as well, so as to make them reasonably even with everyone else?

[Owrtho]

The hourglass could also be used to emphasize the two planes (one being to top of the hourglass and one being the bottom). The only issue with that is it might lead to the idea of one plane being the afterlife... But that is a minor issue which will hopefuly not be the case.

I though the Desert Blood was a good name as many of the races are from humans breeding with the mystical elements of the desert. Thus the desert blood.

Owrtho

[afroakuma]

I'm expecting all races will end up around ECL 0 or 1. We'll see, though.

[starwoof]

I'm throwing a vote at Hourglass of God.

[Mewtarthio]

I happen to like them. And as I said, I think they'll add a great flavor to the streets of our cities.

Ratfolk?90