133 The Battle For Gobwin Knob, Page 120

[Whispri]

It depends, Jack may know the shortest way to get out of the mountains.

Maybe, but he always stayed home, it's not something he'd need to bother with.

[Robak]

Tarfu and the forest gumps with the 3 dragons is a good example of this as well.

Just had a major *Duh* moment. Hadn't noticed that pun before.

[SteveMB]

Also there has been some speculaition that Stanley would return next turn however, didn't he have to take two turns to get out there. Wasnt that why Jack was veiling them. (Albeti poorly.)

Depending on which dwagons survived, the remaining group might travel a bit faster (a group travels at the speed of its slowest member).

Also, Stanley apparently still had some move left after breaking away from the ambush. That would give him some progress back toward GK, and he might be able to close the remaining distance next turn.

[Whispri]

Maybe, but he always stayed home, it's not something he'd need to bother with.

That said, Stanley earned his reputation leading flyers, the ambush site was within two days travel of his Capital, a side he's at war with today and has fought in the past have a concentration of airpower within a days flight of the area, plus he had that table.

It would be a major case of sloppiness on his part if he doesn't know the shortest and safest routes to his bolt hole.

[JazzManJim]

Jack mentions that they are flying back to Gobwin Knob, No doubt with Vinnie and the rest hot on their heels. By a plot perspective I am betting that Commander Zamussel will rescue Ansom in the nic of time.

Yes, I know that.

I also know that Jack is a Foolamancer, perhaps the best that's ever been. you could be correct, but I don't know that we should divine clues from the words of an existential liar.

[SpacemanSpif]

The list specifies goblin and uncroaked units already though. Those entries just say stabber, pikers, and archers. Besides where did Lord Manpower the Temporary come from?

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0005.html

Wanda say fewer then 200 living MEN

The entry also just says Knights, rather than Gobwin Knights. Some, if not all, of the knights are definitely gobwins, yes?

In fact, there are more stabbers, pikers, and archers than there are living men, according to the two strips in question.

If I had to guess, I'd say that those infantry are a mix of men and gobwins.

[docstrange]

So if Charlescomm allies with Jetstone- they don't get to move or attack outside of their present location. But they get an attack of opportunity on anything hostile that comes INTO their location, which is the GK airspace.

That could include,

- zombie unipegataurs (now hostile units after the alliance switch)
- croakamancers mounted on said zombie unips: but NOT croakamancers standing on the ground looting hardware
- any uncroaked archons that happen to be floating around (and won't that be interesting?)
- a return flight of dwagons, K.I.S.S., and the Tool himself

[fendrin]

The entry also just says Knights, rather than Gobwin Knights. Some, if not all, of the knights are definitely gobwins, yes?

In fact, there are more stabbers, pikers, and archers than there are living men, according to the two strips in question.

If I had to guess, I'd say that those infantry are a mix of men and gobwins.

Random thought: It seems that the info from StupidMeals is accurate, but not the whole picture. Perhaps those Gobwins (or just some of them) have been counted twice, once as a gobwin, once as a piker/stabber/etc.? That could explain why the total # of infantry exceeds the 'less than 200' comment that Wanda made.

So if Charlescomm allies with Jetstone...

Point of clarification: they can do all of that regardless of whether or not Ansom accepts the terms.

[DevilDan]

It would be a major case of sloppiness on his part if he doesn't know the shortest and safest routes to his bolt hole.

The safest route isn't always the shortest route, not that I credit Stanley with being particularly cautious or conservative.

Unless I'm very wrong, I think that Jillian can make it back... during Transylvito's next turn, which takes place tomorrow.

[SteveMB]

Point of clarification: they can do all of that regardless of whether or not Ansom accepts the terms.

Yep -- they can; they just have no reason to do so ("Ansom has given me no incentive to stop you.").

Unless I'm very wrong, I think that Jillian can make it back... during Transylvito's next turn, which takes place tomorrow.

That's what I figure -- she got there in two turns with units selected for Move 26+, and may have wasted a bit of that (depending on the geometry of the situation) to confront Wanda. If her current gwiffon is comparable to her previous one (which had Move 52), she could get back in one turn if she ditches the rest of her group (which wouldn't surprise me at all).

[fendrin]

Yep -- they can; they just have no reason to do so ("Ansom has given me no incentive to stop you.").

True.

One thing they COULD do that Charlie DOES have a motivation for is to attempt to intercept the pliers before they exit the airspace zone. That could involve or lead to a confrontation with a certain croakamancer who is also currently in the airspace.

[DevilDan]

That's what I figure -- she got there in two turns with units selected for Move 26+, and may have wasted a bit of that (depending on the geometry of the situation) to confront Wanda. If her current gwiffon is comparable to her previous one (which had Move 52), she could get back in one turn if she ditches the rest of her group (which wouldn't surprise me at all).

If she knows that Ansom is in peril or that things aren't going well for the RCC, she may decide to head back straight for GK. She does, however, have other "responsibilities." Stanley is one, and Faq is the other. She could still try to hund down Stanley, for whom she feels much hatred. And unless someone takes over Faq or someone continues to hold the chokepoint hex, it is still possible for Stanley to double back. And she feels loyalty toward Faq still, so she would need some assurance from Transylvito that they wouldn't take over the abandoned Faq cities.

[MalikT]

If she knows that Ansom is in peril or that things aren't going well for the RCC, she may decide to head back straight for GK. She does, however, have other "responsibilities." Stanley is one, and Faq is the other. She could still try to hund down Stanley, for whom she feels much hatred. And unless someone takes over Faq or someone continues to hold the chokepoint hex, it is still possible for Stanley to double back. And she feels loyalty toward Faq still, so she would need some assurance from Transylvito that they wouldn't take over the abandoned Faq cities.

There is probably no way she could know that Ansom is in danger, she does not have a hat and probably nobody in the RCC column can send a thinkagram. Unless there is another way of long distance communication she is probably still hunting Stanley.

[fendrin]

If she knows that Ansom is in peril or that things aren't going well for the RCC, she may decide to head back straight for GK. She does, however, have other "responsibilities." Stanley is one, and Faq is the other. She could still try to hund down Stanley, for whom she feels much hatred. And unless someone takes over Faq or someone continues to hold the chokepoint hex, it is still possible for Stanley to double back. And she feels loyalty toward Faq still, so she would need some assurance from Transylvito that they wouldn't take over the abandoned Faq cities.

On one hand, how would she know Ansom was in trouble? As far as I can tell they have no way to communicate, short of a message being relayed by Don King's thinkamancer. Even then, I don't see how either the RCC or Jillian's group could initiate that, and what are the chances that Don King would randomly contact either?

On the other hand, Jillian is not the most patient of individuals, and she may decide that she would rather head back to GK than 'waste' a lot of time searching for Stanley. Also, FAQ doesn't seem to be much of a priority for her. She'd probably object less to TV occupying it than she did to Stanley destroying it.

[teratorn]

She could still try to hund down Stanley, for whom she feels much hatred.

She only has three gwiffons with her. Stanley left with six dwagons and at least one knight (the one engaging TVMario is seen flying with Stanley). Even if she has a few lower move gwiffons nearby, she can only hunt Stanley, or even control the choke point, if TV is willing to help her.

[SteveMB]

On the other hand, Jillian is not the most patient of individuals, and she may decide that she would rather head back to GK than 'waste' a lot of time searching for Stanley. Also, FAQ doesn't seem to be much of a priority for her. She'd probably object less to TV occupying it than she did to Stanley destroying it.

Now that Stanley has a functioning Foolamancer and could be in any of dozens of hexes, trying to hunt him down is hopeless unless you can figure out where he's headed. Given that he exited the choke point on the wrong side to head for Faq, the logical guess is that he might head back to GK.

[DevilDan]

On one hand, how would she know Ansom was in trouble? As far as I can tell they have no way to communicate, short of a message being relayed by Don King's thinkamancer. Even then, I don't see how either the RCC or Jillian's group could initiate that, and what are the chances that Don King would randomly contact either?

Yes, but it wouldn't surprise me if Caesar contacts Don King or Transylvito via their thinkamancer.

She only has three gwiffons with her. Stanley left with six dwagons and at least one knight (the one engaging TVMario is seen flying with Stanley). Even if she has a few lower move gwiffons nearby, she can only hunt Stanley, or even control the choke point, if TV is willing to help her.

I agree. But she could choose to remain with the Transylvito force. I was only mentioning Jillian's choices because other posters were insisting on suggesting that Jillian could show up and help to save Ansom.

Jillian clearly has little or no chance of tracking down Stanley.

[Welf]

Trhree gwiffons mean that she could take 2 warlords with her. But it would be still way to dangerous.

[fendrin]

Now that Stanley has a functioning Foolamancer and could be in any of dozens of hexes, trying to hunt him down is hopeless unless you can figure out where he's headed. Given that he exited the choke point on the wrong side to head for Faq, the logical guess is that he might head back to GK.

Of course it is just as logical that he will wait veiled for her to leave so he can sneak into Faq like he originally planned.

On the other hand, Jillian is not exactly the sharpest unit. Rather than think the situation through logically she's (in my opinion) far more likely to just act impulsively. The decision to return to GK mirrors the decision to rescue Ansom from the dwagon-ring. Either she can futilely search for a stack that could be almost anywhere or she could go fight something.

Yes, but it wouldn't surprise me if Caesar contacts Don King or Transylvito via their thinkamancer.

Well, this gets back to the mystery of how Stanley contacted Maggie; can thinkamancers receive incoming 'calls' from regular units? Or did Stanley order Maggie to call him, indicating that orders can effectively be given with no discernible form of communication?

I think the latter, but only for orders coming from an overlord/ruler.
I have three reasons for this:

1. It is consistent with a TBS game. The player can command units at any distance instantaneously with no mechanism of communication.
2. The idea that anyone can contact a thinkamancer at any time from any distance doesn't seem quite right.
3. If Chief warlords could do it, Parson wouldn't need Maggie to relay his orders. Sure, he might be ignorant, but he's pretty smart and likely would have asked a few questions about how Stanley interrupted his 'call' with Ansom. Even if nobody knew, all he would have to do to test it is to order the troops on the walls to do a 'wave' or other similarly visible action.

If I'm right, not even Cesar could initiate contact with the Don's T-mancer.

[SteveMB]

On the other hand, Jillian is not exactly the sharpest unit. Rather than think the situation through logically she's (in my opinion) far more likely to just act impulsively. The decision to return to GK mirrors the decision to rescue Ansom from the dwagon-ring. Either she can futilely search for a stack that could be almost anywhere or she could go fight something.

True. Vinny et al probably wouldn't try very hard to talk her out of it, because 1)they would think it through logically and realize that the only hope of catching Stanley is to guess where he's headed (and GK is a reasonable guess) and 2)if Translyvito sees the abandoned Faq cities as an opportunity for themselves, the sooner Jillian gets out of the way the better.

[Godskook]

1. It is consistent with a TBS game. The player can command units at any distance instantaneously with no mechanism of communication.
2. The idea that anyone can contact a thinkamancer at any time from any distance doesn't seem quite right.
3. If Chief warlords could do it, Parson wouldn't need Maggie to relay his orders. Sure, he might be ignorant, but he's pretty smart and likely would have asked a few questions about how Stanley interrupted his 'call' with Ansom. Even if nobody knew, all he would have to do to test it is to order the troops on the walls to do a 'wave' or other similarly visible action.

1.If Stanley could command his units psychically, he'd have no need for an eyebook to contact Wanda.

2.An explanation that might make sense is that Thinkamancers are similar to psychics and can 'hear' people calling them.

3.Following my explanation, this would explain how Stanley could interupt Parson's call, why Parson couldn't do the same, and why he wouldn't think it was odd. Stanley outranks Parson. Maggie was compelled by duty to cut the connection with Parson to open one with Stanley. By this logic, any warlord can 'dial' a Thinkamancer, but the Thinkamancer has some control over answering these calls.

[fendrin]

1.If Stanley could command his units psychically, he'd have no need for an eyebook to contact Wanda.

2.An explanation that might make sense is that Thinkamancers are similar to psychics and can 'hear' people calling them.

3.Following my explanation, this would explain how Stanley could interupt Parson's call, why Parson couldn't do the same, and why he wouldn't think it was odd. Stanley outranks Parson. Maggie was compelled by duty to cut the connection with Parson to open one with Stanley. By this logic, any warlord can 'dial' a Thinkamancer, but the Thinkamancer has some control over answering these calls.

Good points, but they don't invalidate mine. I guess we'll need to see more of these events to figure it out.

[kreszantas]

1. Some these points could also fall under the 'Natural Thinkamancy' heading.

2. Parson has Maggie right there to issue communications (not orders that is natural to a chief warlord) to ones who DO NOT have eyebooks, think of his communication to Jack in trying to snap him out of his insanity.

3. The incoming call from Stanley the Overlord who yes out ranks Parson by duty must take that call.

[Lamech]

Well, this gets back to the mystery of how Stanley contacted Maggie; can thinkamancers receive incoming 'calls' from regular units? Or did Stanley order Maggie to call him, indicating that orders can effectively be given with no discernible form of communication?

Wasn't Wanda able to give suggestions to Jillian with out a direct link? Thats an example of a permanent communication spell. Really bad communication, but still communication. Stanley probably has a permanent (and much, much better) communication spell set-up with Maggie. Especially since Maggie was out of juice...

[fendrin]

2. Parson has Maggie right there to issue communications (not orders that is natural to a chief warlord) to ones who DO NOT have eyebooks, think of his communication to Jack in trying to snap him out of his insanity.

Parson had Maggie contact Wanda, even though Wanda has an eyebook.

Wasn't Wanda able to give suggestions to Jillian with out a direct link? Thats an example of a permanent communication spell. Really bad communication, but still communication. Stanley probably has a permanent (and much, much better) communication spell set-up with Maggie. Especially since Maggie was out of juice...

"You know nothing of the underpinnings of this spell!"

Er, that is, Wanda was not communicating. It was a fire-and-forget spell.

[Vreejack]

Is the archon that Ansom is dealing with a real one? The undead archon seems to have disappeared, and the placement of this one is suspicious. Is Maggy working some suggestion on Ansom's dented cranium to make him think he is treating with Charlie? With Sir Webinar coming on the back of a flying abomination to capture him and a very suspicious contract occupying his attention he may not be looking too closely at the archon.

[DevilDan]

Parson had Maggie contact Wanda, even though Wanda has an eyebook.

"You know nothing of the underpinnings of this spell!"

If an overlord can pull a "contact me immediately" call through his thinkamancer, I think it's reasonable that a chief warlord can do the same. Purely speculation on my part, but it is reasonable speculation.

I'm considering the "she knows that this is important to my side and wouldn't want to put my boops in a vice" line by Wanda. It suggests that the spell consists of instructions and generalized influence rather than of specific point-by-point orders.

[Sieggy]

Is the archon that Ansom is dealing with a real one? The undead archon seems to have disappeared, and the placement of this one is suspicious. Is Maggy working some suggestion on Ansom's dented cranium to make him think he is treating with Charlie? With Sir Webinar coming on the back of a flying abomination to capture him and a very suspicious contract occupying his attention he may not be looking too closely at the archon.

Dunno . . . that would imply an AWFUL lot of planning on the chance that Ansom would scream for Charlies aid. But then, if the mission were specifically to take Ansom down as opposed to killing him, it might be a reasonable gambit. Had he not called out, having the ex-Archon pop up (magically disguised) and say "well, Your Highness, ready to deal?", with a contract in hand would stall him for a crucial CR or two.

Of course, if you really wanted to screw things up totally, you have a standard contract looking thing worked up that includes the RCC surrender in the fine print, and have Maggie whup the mojo on the agreement to bind it. Either Ansom reads it carefully enough to let him get zerged by the shambling horde, or agrees, much to his horror.

[kreszantas]

Parson had Maggie contact Wanda, even though Wanda has an eyebook.

Your going to have to back that statement up with a specific fact. If your refering to the latest http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0132.html that is inconclusive as he also needs to use the eyebook for Charlie. Due to the need to have this done same time, it would be logical to have Maggie be the medium between them Parson was merely giving audible recount of what he was watching, he made his decision and acted on it with the "New orders for Wanda" statement. A vast majority of Sizemores orders were given via eyebook, except when the INSTANT reports through Maggie were done in the tunnels. The requirement to maintain the "viewthumbscreen" for the thinkamancy to take place also puts a hinderance on it as well since Maggie DID NOT have to establish that link for Parson, she just put her hands to her temples and relaid the audible commands or gave them by natural thinkamancy.

Case in point in one the other threads Rob states that notes were passed along through the hexes thus Ansom crumples it up... Lots of things are done 'behind the panels' yet are still accomplished.

[Sieggy]

Wanda's performance has been awesome thus far. Her attack was well organized and executed, her troops obviously knew exactly what to do.
And compare Wanda's battle command language with Jillian's. Precise, concise commands, nothing muddled. And she instantly responded to Ansom's loss of the Arkenpliers, commanding her troops to sieze their secondary target, then dove after the primary. No hesitation. That implies a whole lot more command capability than you'd normally find in a caster.

Maybe it's just all the stacked pluses, but I suspect that Wanda has some warlord in her . . . Remember, Wanda was touchy on that subject, and Parson suspected she knew more about war and such than she was letting on.

The implication is that Wanda knew Jillian back in FAQ; the question is how well? I'm beginning to wonder if Wanda and Jillian were having a relationship back in FAQ, and Wanda went out with Jillian on some merc assignments. Jillian said she wanted to take Jack with her, but never did (Banhammer isn't risking TWO of his casters, especially not his world-class Foolamancer . . .) I can seriously see Wanda having picked up a thing or two about battle and warfare.The EP from a few missions (especially if she was an active participant) might be enough to give her at least a few levels of fighter.

I'm also wondering if part of the problem Jillian was having with King Banhammer was this relationship. If Banhammer had a problem with Jillian before(mabwaa), having her involve herself with one of his casters and take her on missions (probably against his orders - 'cause girls are just like that sometimes) It is possible that Wanda engineered the downfall of Faq to free Jillian from Banhammer, and somehow Stanley managed to screw things up for her.