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2012-04-02, 04:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
This group of people who define it in such a way keeps getting brought up almost every time the question comes up, but no one ever seems to own up to defining it that way when it does get discussed... It makes me wonder, has anyone here actually encountered someone who subscribes to that belief?
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2012-04-02, 04:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2008
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Doesn't that also sorta spread the belief that sex is only worthwhile if orgasms are involved?
But then again, you could fill a library with the troublesome attitudes society has about sex.
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2012-04-02, 04:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Xin-Shalast
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 05:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2008
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 06:16 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- UK
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Hmmmm.
While I didn't hold any great spiritual attachment to my virginity (although I do recall cursing it on more than one occasion >.>) I always wanted my first time to be with someone I truly loved, rather than a casual fling.
It's really weird - you spend years obsessing about losing it and how the first time will be something magical but instead it turns out to be slightly awkward, slightly embarassing and over waaaaaaaay too quickly.
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2012-04-02, 06:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- Melbourne, Australia
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2012-04-02, 06:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- UK
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Coming back to the original point about qualifies as "losing your virginity", it's a tricky one, especially for the LGB folks in this thread. I think trying to pin it down (oo-er) on things like orgasms and penetration and what not is the wrong way to look at it, because it's only a short step before people break out the rulers and tape measures and stop watches.
At the risk of sounding like an episode of Scrubs, I think I'd class losing your virginity as that exact moment when you're naked together in each others arms and all the barriers between you come down.
As a slight aside and I hope I'm not offending anyone by asking this but do trans folks get to lose their virginity twice?
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2012-04-02, 07:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Yes, that is true
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
... I have a question about virginity...
SpoilerIf one were to... Well, with themselves... Would that person count as having lost their virginity?
Dude, they're teleporting horses with spears on their heads. They're as pretty as they say they are.
There are already libraries full of it.
... It seems like the answer should be "yes", but I have to wonder if the first first time 'counts'... :hmm...:
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2012-04-02, 07:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2008
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- UK
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 07:40 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2006
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- Dinosaur Museum aw yisss.
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I think our cultural obsession with virginity and the "loss" of it is absurd, and quite harmful. Virginity is nothing but the lack of a particular experience - how can you "lose a lack"? The double negatives makes it a gain. You don't "lose your virginity", you "gain the experience of sex". I think ideally everyone should have an overall pleasant first time, preferably with someone you love and who loves you. But if you don't, it's not the end of the world. You'll have plenty of other opportunities to get it perfect (as if there were such a thing...). And lets face it, sex is (in my opinion) weird and awkward and ridiculous - the very first time, that gets ramped up to 11.
Being nervous about one's first time and romanticising about it before it happens is understandable, and I think people shouldn't make the decision to do it lightly, but let's not take it to extremes. Billions of people have done it before you, and billions of people will do it afterwards. If goats can do it, I don't think it's such a big deal.The Iron Avatarist Hall of Fame!
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2012-04-02, 07:58 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2011
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- Endrae
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I think it's a cultural thing, but I think that your first movie is special, your first day of school is special, your first wedding is special, your first car is special, your first time having certain foods is special.
I want a Unicorn! It would be the best thing ever, it would bring sparkles and rainbows and sunshine wherever I went, and it could gore anyone who dared appose me.
I recognize that it will not and cannot be perfect, but I do believe it will be enjoyable and honestly I'm pretty sure I can just cuddle with them, because I'm not ready, and I'm good at ignoring my erections.
But screw condom fumble, I'm asking for a mutual STD test. No chances. Also gay, so no pregnancy.
Apparently if you can last five minutes the first time, you have the potential to be a pornstar...
autoeroticism is generally not counted.
Dude, they're teleporting horses with spears on their heads. They're as pretty as they say they are.
... It seems like the answer should be "yes", but I have to wonder if the first first time 'counts'... :hmm...:
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2012-04-02, 08:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2008
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Stopwatch? Ruler? I would just say that you aren't a virgin anymore when you don't consider yourself to be one anymore. Cause where do you draw a line? Cybering? Does phone sex count? Mutual masturbation? etc...
I'm not really getting the "losing virginity twice" question? I guess you could consider it like that; but you could also consider a bi person losing their virginity multiple times depending on what gender they're sexytiming with.
(Also, what about sexytimes when you are transitioning; not everyone gets GRS; non-binary people; I guess you could make a case about pre-realizing you are trans / pre-starting transition vs. having "finished" transitioning but even that is iffy because it depends on the people you're with as well how far you can express yourself etc... )
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2012-04-02, 08:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2006
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- Leeds, UK
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I'd say you've lost your virginity when you feel like you've lost it. There's certainly something that went "click" when I first did things, and I'm guessing it's much the same with other people.
"I'm just going on motive and opportunity here and the fact that if the earth got swallowed by a black hole, I'd look suspiciously in your direction first."
~ Timberwolf
"I blame Castaras. You know... In general."
~ KuReshtin
"Castaras - An absolutely adorable facade that hides a truly ruthless streak."
~ The Succubus
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2012-04-02, 09:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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2012-04-02, 10:12 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2011
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- Växjö, Sweden
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
To Heliomance (quote may be from an "old" post, possibly):
To: Triscuitable
Allies, etc:
SpoilerThank you.
But aren’t pride parades meant to be eye openers for straight people, to combat ignorance etc? Perhaps those straight people involved in the parades are at least *somewhat* queer, or experimenting, and why not give them a chance to explore that with more experienced persons?
Having said that, movements have to be much more careful about letting extremists run the show. It's all too easy to let ideological purity become a litmus test, which turns the movement into an ingrown caricature. Most of the examples I can think of are political and/or religious. I'm sure you can think of political and/or religious groups that have turned in on themselves to this degree on your own.
Do we need to discuss the difference between a sane view of self-defense and preemptive attacks?
It’s a good, but very unnerving experience.
SpoilerI have an idea for an explanation for how to make my point, but it’s tangent to politics, and I don’t want to go there, sorry.
How You Know You're An Ally:
Spoiler¤ While checking a bulletin board, you see a free course in Somalian folk dance from the Somalian Women's Association. You read: “Only for women”, and think, “Oh, what a pity, but I guess they need a safe zone, and that should be respected.”
Then you start to wonder how they would react if a trans woman would want to join the dance class. ._.
¤ One of the reasons you don’t go to the doctor to check up your depression is that your friends have it worse, so you think your depression can’t be that bad. However, when voiceing that, your friends tell you that your depression is still an issue, and you get courage to seek professional help.
¤ You’re considering to make peace with a trans activist you’ve fallen out with, and plan to send a message about “burying the hatchet”. Then you realise that the cliché phrase might be offensive to Native Americans/First Nations. Even if you consider making a convulated explanation about Vikings having lived in North America as a Native American tribe.
¤ Your wish fulfillment Author Avatar/Marty Stu is a friend and/or lover to several characters belonging to minority groups, and your character is making what hir can do to not be offensive to them, but some times slips up. Since it’s wish fulfillment, the friends and lovers are patient and forgives hir.
Also, THEY FIGHT CRIME!
Voice group:
Spoiler
Humour tangent/To: Serpentine:
SpoilerLove it!
It's similar, but different... Less about privilege, and more (?) absurdity:
SpoilerThere was a Norwegian, a German and Bellman, and they were all bragging about how small their fathers were. The Norwegian proudly stated that his father slept in a dresser drawer. The German said,
- Bah, my father sleeps in a matchbox.
Then Bellman said,
- I don't have a father... He fell off a ladder and died when he was picking strawberries...
http://www.pinetreedevelopment.net/bellmanjokes/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellman_joke
To: Arachu
To: New members:
SpoilerYay!
Good luck, and if you want them, *hugs*.
*hugs* (If you want them. )
If you’re interested, I’m a cis male bi-sexual and bi-romantic 27 year old Swede with partial Slovak ancestry. I discovered my sexual orientation about half a year ago; before that, I thought I was straight (with some interest in androgynity). I’m also poly-amourous, and have several “kinks”, both real life ones like transgender men and women and fictitious like humanoid life-forms in fantasy and Science Fiction, including aliens, androids, gynoids, orcs, goblins, elves etc). I’m in a long distance with fellow GiantitP member Skeppio. Sadly, I’m still in the closet with my family, but out if it over here and the GiantitP Facebook chat (and with a few “IRL” mates).
I hope I haven’t scared you away.Viking/Paladin by Astrella
Gender Bender by Geomancer.
In love with Skeppio.
Contact me:
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2012-04-02, 10:50 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Yes, that is true
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
That's what I've been assuming, but it's just iffy enough to make the question hard to answer... Being able to imply that you've actually done that is probably the best answer to "you can't know you're bi until you've been with a man", though.
That was my reaction. ^_^
To: Arachu
Spoiler
*Hugs Arachu* That makes me glad to read. ^_^
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2012-04-02, 11:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2008
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 11:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2010
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- Dublin, Ireland
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I think I've heard people claim to, but I'm not sure. Maybe more in a suggestion kind of way. "Well, if we're measuring by orgasms surely both (or all) partners would have to experience orgasm for it to count?"
I don't think any of my examples are the "right" way to define the virginity-losing moment, if such exists. But then, I don't think there is a "right" way to define it. I think it's for each person to decide.
By your definition, no? There can only be a first time that your barriers come down with another person for the first time (by definition), and that could happen pre-, mid- or post-transition.
Some people would say yes, other people would say no. I think the general consensus would be no, but then the general consensus is that it's PIV that counts and that doesn't work, so what does the general consensus really know?
TMI alert!
Spoiler
I didn't consciously dot dot dot with myself until after I'd had dot dot dot with my partner (I'm actually still awful at it. I wouldn't have thought one could be awful at it!) So for me, certainly not. I think going by a Victorian-type loss-of-innocence idea of a "first time", or a hippy idea, it could count because it could be the sexual awakening of an individual, more dirty/special than a subsequent addition of a partner into the mix. All about how each person thinks about such things!
I agree! And I think "If goats can do it, I don't think it's such a big deal" is a fantastic ground rule!
I like first times too. I think the best balance is feeling that the first time of something is special, but if it doesn't go perfectly, it's not the end of the world; there'll be other movies or schooldays or sexytimes.
Mutual STD test is a very good idea.
Cheerfairy, Kenderwoman and Geologist by Succubus, Feminist Geomancer by Astrella, Kender Wizard by me
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2012-04-02, 11:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2008
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 11:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2007
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- Canada
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2012-04-02, 12:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2006
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- Dinosaur Museum aw yisss.
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Although on the other hand, there are some things goats can do which would be a pretty big deal if a human could manage it...
...and now I'm wondering what human cheese tastes like :I
Regarding "doing it with yourself", is it strange that I thought it was about doing it with a clone until other people started responding to it? <.< (my answer would be "yes - at the point you had two separate bodies, you each start forming your own memories and experiences and therefore are two separate beings, therefore it would belosing one's virginitygaining one's first experience of sexual intercourse, although it would also be incest" - which by implication I guess covers my basic requirement for first sex)
Regarding "loss of virginity": I'd personally say the point where one's naughty bits come in naked (except contraceptive devices) and "connected" contact with another person's naughty bits. But that doesn't mean I think it applies to everybody. I think that conversation from Chasing Amy covers most problems with defining the boundaries of virginity.The Iron Avatarist Hall of Fame!
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2012-04-02, 12:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2008
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- Bottom of a well
Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-04-02, 12:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2010
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- Dublin, Ireland
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Cheerfairy, Kenderwoman and Geologist by Succubus, Feminist Geomancer by Astrella, Kender Wizard by me
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2012-04-02, 12:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2009
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- Gothenburg, Sweden
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
TMI
SpoilerMy medications makes it difficult for me to climax. I can still enjoy sex.Avatar by CoffeeIncluded
Oooh, and that's a bad miss.
“Don't exercise your freedom of speech until you have exercised your freedom of thought.”
― Tim Fargo
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2012-04-02, 12:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2008
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- Xin-Shalast
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Spoiler
Generally not, unless you mean something like a time-clone or other scenario where there's two identical bodies that are "that person." It's generally defined as requiring more than one person-body involved.
Eh, dumb horses with pointy sticks are about as nonthreatening as a deer. Sure, it could kill you, but it doesn't want to be around you long enough to actually hunt down and kill you because of its sexism. Which means they never have full opportunity to choose the terrain, which is generally their downfall from the stories I've read about the "typical" unicorn hunt.
Why?
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2012-04-02, 12:52 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2011
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- Leeds
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2012-04-02, 12:59 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2007
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- Canada
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Frustrating is a pretty mild word for being left in stabbing aching agony for an hour because my partner speaks French like a Welsh sheepdog.
I'm bitter because a total of 1 - yes one - partner in my whole life has ever been able to finish me a sentence, and that was nine years ago. I'd need both handsand both feetto count all the other tongue-tied oafs. Sigh.
For women it's likely different -- that's a whole pathless forest I am content not to explore -- but for me, as a man, a lack of orgasm and the accompanying pain is a pretty good indicator that something went wrong.Last edited by Kneenibble; 2012-04-02 at 01:08 PM. Reason: Actually I'm not sure if I need feet yet, I'd have to sit down and think about it which I really don't care to do
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2012-04-02, 01:53 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2010
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- Neurotypicalville, WA
Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Steam username is Triscuitable.
I got VAC banned in COD: Ghosts for using an FOV changer.
I try not to think of how sad that is.
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2012-04-02, 01:57 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
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- Dinosaur Museum aw yisss.
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
That's nothin'. In my school biology class where we dissected rats, one girl took some intestines and wore them as a necklace
(also the inside of sheeps' eyes is quite pretty)The Iron Avatarist Hall of Fame!
Prizes(Un)Official Best Playground Avatarist Competition
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2012-04-02, 01:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2011
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- France
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