LGBTAitP Part 23: Et tu, ~Bianca?

[Lea Plath]

You look great, Bianca! Wish I had nails like yours, but I bite mine.

[Asta Kask]

That's a good point... I imagine that any birth made in such a circumstance would have to be through C-Section. Assuming there's room for the uterus, it may actually be possible... :smallhopeful:

The uterus is very small between pregnancies.

The uterus measures about 7.5 cm. in length, 5 cm. in breadth, at its upper part, and nearly 2.5 cm. in thickness; it weighs from 30 to 40 gm.

That's 3 inches long, 2 inches broad and 1 inch thick. Fitting it into the abdominal cavity would not be difficult. We'd have to adjust HRT during pregnancy but pregnancy endocrinology has been studied to death - it wouldn't be difficult. The trick is to come up with donors (does your mom have one she isn't using?) and a willing surgeon.

[Caustic Soda]

@ *-ist media: Wihle I agree that one ought to be conscious about racism, sexism etc. in the media one enjoys, and be aware that enjoying it does not itself make one *-ist, sometimes I simply don't care nearly as much as I feel I ought to. It isn't alle that reare that I use a work, experience something objectionable in it, and go 'meh, people are dumb' instead of anything more constructive. I suppose in general I find it difficult to live up to my ideal of being constructive and/or supportive anywhere near as often as I'd like.

On a related note, can any of you think of any particular way to deal with a story with unfortunate implications (or explications, if you can say that) that you're watching/reading/listening to alone, beyond being aware of it? Discussing stuff on the net or with my peers can be interesting and all, but it doesn't seem to do much beyond that.

@ Bianca: You look cute in that picture. It's also rather obvious that you're a good deal thinner than when you got the jacket, just by looking at your wrists.

@Triscuitable: That's a rather impressive set of accomplishments you've got yourself there. Unfortunately I can't help you with nameing your group, because I'm terrible with naming things. Still, much succes to your group .

@Qaera: That's a shame *hugs*. Hopefully your backup plan will be a good place to study (and socialize).

@Kender Wizard: belated *hugs*, best of luck with your stress issues.

@Dogmantra: You look good in that picture, I especially like the feathers (?) in your headdress. Oh, and that other woman in the picture is also kinda cute, most noticeably the way her hair curls

[Asta Kask]

So... Natalie put up a ring about a magical gender-changing ring for sale on e-bay. Inspired by this I put together a little poem:

Spoiler

Show

Three rings for the qenderqueer high above the binary
Seven for the trans women with their wonderbras
Nine for the trans men who inject themselves with T
One for the kyriarch on his dark throne
One ring to rule them all
One ring to find them
One ring to bring them all
And in the darkness bind them
In the lands of the kyriarch, where the cis rule

No, I don't know what the genderqueer do with their rings either.

[Ninja_Grand]

Major accomplishments that I've made since I came to my new school:

• Tried to (and successfully) convince the staff at the school to change "Autism Awareness Month" to "Autism Acceptance Month".
• Got a club set up for students with social disabilities to help them with learning to tell the teachers what the teacher needs to do to help them.
• Taken down quite a bit of phobias and misbeliefs about Autism and Asperger's, telling others it's nothing to pity.

I should note the club focuses in helping students with getting teachers and students to understand them, and isn't exclusively for the socially disabled. It's just an easy way to identify the group. We have no name for it, but the Vice-Principal appointed me President. What's a good name for it, do you think?

Im in a club just like this! Its call Progect Support. Perhaps you can use that name?


Also I missed y'all! Ive been too busy with school.

What I miss?

Oh, And day of silence is tomarow. Got lots of students to particepate . I wont be posting that day.

[noparlpf]

Not only is tomorrow the LGBTA+ Day of Silence, there's an Open Mic event here. Good planning, guys.
(There's also a blood drive and a bake sale, and it's apparently Pot Day. A friend of mine made the comment, "Watch out for the brownies.")

[Triscuitable]

You look great, Bianca! Wish I had nails like yours, but I bite mine.

You're not alone.

[KenderWizard]

I took a picture today! Of me. :shyface:

Spoiler

Show

You look a lot like I imagined you might! (Not that I was sitting around imagining what you look like, just that when I saw the picture I was like "Yeah, that seems right" rather than, as sometimes happens, "WTF! THAT's what they look like?") Also, lovely hair and I can't believe how patient you must be to have nails that long!

And thank you for the hugs.

Aww, *hugs*. Crying usually makes me feel relieved though, so hopefully this helped get a bit of the stress out of your system?

Well, like I said, I know it'd be way worse for me if I didn't cry these things out, but I also really don't like the experience of crying. And, once I cry once, anything at all will set me off (I call this being fraught, I dunno if that word is used for this elsewhere) for the rest of the day. So, if something minor happens, like I knock something over, or if something reminds me of the thing that made me cry, or sometimes just randomly. I hate being fraught. But I do feel better today and I'm sure crying it out did help.

Also, sorry to hear you missed your appointment. Only a minor problem, soon you'll be on your way!

Kender, I hope you're feeling better now, and add a piece of internet cake to the supplies for the party we will be having.

Thank you!

I'm kind of sad because I was accepted to a college I really want to go to... But can't afford it, so I'm going to my backup school... Probably. ">.>

Can this problem be worked around? Are you in the US? I don't know that system very well, but I understand student loans are the norm?

That's 3 inches long, 2 inches broad and 1 inch thick. Fitting it into the abdominal cavity would not be difficult. We'd have to adjust HRT during pregnancy but pregnancy endocrinology has been studied to death - it wouldn't be difficult. The trick is to come up with donors (does your mom have one she isn't using?) and a willing surgeon.

I'd also be concerned about all the stuff the body does when it's pregnant, like the other organs getting out of the way and the efficient link between eating and "feeding" the foetus.

Also, is it possible to induce lactation in trans women?

On a related note, can any of you think of any particular way to deal with a story with unfortunate implications (or explications, if you can say that) that you're watching/reading/listening to alone, beyond being aware of it? Discussing stuff on the net or with my peers can be interesting and all, but it doesn't seem to do much beyond that.

Not much to do. Being aware is the major step. If you're then discussing it with someone, you could say "I recommend it as a great sci-fi movie (or whatever), but it does fall down a lot on some things - for example, race was dealt with very poorly." Now they're aware of it too!

@Kender Wizard: belated *hugs*, best of luck with your stress issues.

Thank you!


So, I've been thinking about how we experience -isms in our life. Take any form of discrimination based on sexual orientation. There's legal, which is thankfully being taken apart, and institutional, which is much more difficult to deal with. Those are on the scale of societies and groups. Then there's what I'm tempted to call "active" and "passive", in groups and individuals. I'm going to illustrate with examples rather than explain, using me and two of the facets of my identity: being a woman and being bisexual.

So, I'm a woman, definitely. I identify and present as a woman, and, being curvy, not very tall, with rounded features and a feminine haircut, people invariably read me as a woman, even though I often wear gender neutral clothes (and a bra). So, if someone is misogynist or sexist, they can target me. If someone is saying misogynist or sexist things near/to me, they must be aware that they're aiming them at me, as well as at other women. They are actively hurting my feelings.

Then take me being bi. There's no way to "dress bi" or "look bi", so I presume I don't. I'm in a long-term relationship with a man. Also, straight is the default. You are presumed straight until proven otherwise, generally. So, if I meet someone who hates or discriminates against bi people or non-straight people, they don't know, unless I tell them. They can't see it by looking at me, and they can't work it out from my relationship, and it's normal for both men and women to comment on the attractiveness of women, so unless I say something like "I am personally sexually attracted to that woman over there", I'm "secretly" bi. So if someone's saying stuff, it still hurts my feelings, but they don't know, they're doing it passively. It's a by-product of the actions that they would be taking anyway.

What do you think? Is there a difference between passive and active hate that you've noticed in your life? Do you find it easier or harder when whatever it is that people discriminate against is always obvious (often race, presented gender, age, obvious physical disability) or when it's "secret" until you reveal it (often sexual orientation, invisible disability, neuroatypicality, class).

Note: Not all of those examples are always that way. For example, sometimes it's possible to read someone's class, people who are biracial will often "pass" as one or other race, if you're out and about with your same-sex partner people will likely guess you're not straight, etc.

[pffh]

Also, is it possible to induce lactation in trans women?

Considering that it's possible to make men lactate I'd wager on yes.

There's no way to "dress bi" or "look bi"

Challenge accepted.

Hmmm this is a tough one. Maybe some sort of Two-Face suit where one side is stereotypically gay and the other stereotypically straight (ie feminine for women and non-feminine for men).

Or isn't there some sort of bi coloured flag or something? Maybe dress those colours but I doubt many people would recognize that as bi.

SIGNS! Everyone from now on will wear a small nameplate with their sexuality on it. The plaque on the plate can be switched out with ease for fluidity.

[Ninja_Grand]

@ KenderWizard

I think I get what you mean.

At my lunch table im offent called many names. Now they dont know im bi, but it still hurts me deaply. I have some good friends at that table but I cant stand thous "Queer haters".

[Kindablue]

Or isn't there some sort of bi coloured flag or something? Maybe dress those colours but I doubt many people would recognize that as bi.

And they might think you were cosplaying.

Spoiler

Show

[Caustic Soda]

What do you think? Is there a difference between passive and active hate that you've noticed in your life? Do you find it easier or harder when whatever it is that people discriminate against is always obvious (often race, presented gender, age, obvious physical disability) or when it's "secret" until you reveal it (often sexual orientation, invisible disability, neuroatypicality, class).

I've been fortunate enough never to have been on the recieving end of active discrimination AFAIK, so I can't comment on the effect of active vs. passive on the reciever. But it seems to me that people with 'secret' differences have the privilige of being able to pass as a a member of the majority group (is there a shorter word for 'member of the majority group' apart from 'normal'? Normal seems rather disparaging) if they so choose.
Personally, I've almost never experienced any passive discrimination directed towardsa group I belonged to that felt particularly hateful, but then again the issues of sexual orientation, *gender and genderfluid people hasn't come up much in the discussions I've experienced IRL.

My primary experience with gender issues is the idea that the 'gender struggle' has been 'won', equality between men and women has been achieved and feminists are therefore beating a dead horse. Ignorant, but not hateful as such, except for the rare cases where it's coupled with the idea of feminists as man-hating lesbians. I suppose in so far as I agree with the ideals of feminism that might count as discrimination towards a group of which I am a part, but I have to admit that I have a difficult time seeng myself as feminist despite that. Mainly because I don't really do anything particularly active on that front, unless you count occasionally pointing out the arbitraryness of gender roles and stereotypes and how they can have undesirable effects on societhy in general and specific people in particular.

[pffh]

And they might think you were cosplaying.

Spoiler

Show

Mistakenly thought to be cosplaying as the second best pony? Sounds like a win-win situation to me.

[Asta Kask]

I'd also be concerned about all the stuff the body does when it's pregnant, like the other organs getting out of the way and the efficient link between eating and "feeding" the foetus.

Also, is it possible to induce lactation in trans women?

I don't think that the organs moving out of the way is a problem. That's just pressure from the womb. Feeding? Well, we'll have to try it on rats. And if it works in rats and not in humans at least we can help the trans women rats. We have about a half-dozen ways of killing cancer in rats so why not help them transition?

(Actually rats wouldn't do as an animal model in this case, because rats are the only mammals known where the males do not have nipples).

I think lactation is a common problem in transitioning.

[Kindablue]

I don't think that the organs moving out of the way is a problem. That's just pressure from the womb. Feeding? Well, we'll have to try it on rats. And if it works in rats and not in humans at least we can help the trans women rats. We have about a half-dozen ways of killing cancer in rats so why not help them transition?

I love you, Asta.

Mistakenly thought to be cosplaying as the second best pony? Sounds like a win-win situation to me.

I don't think I can pull off purple--or horse, for that matter--but yes. It is.

[Arachu]

You look great, Bianca! Wish I had nails like yours, but I bite mine.

*Hugs* Thanks.

The uterus is very small between pregnancies.



That's 3 inches long, 2 inches broad and 1 inch thick. Fitting it into the abdominal cavity would not be difficult. We'd have to adjust HRT during pregnancy but pregnancy endocrinology has been studied to death - it wouldn't be difficult. The trick is to come up with donors (does your mom have one she isn't using?) and a willing surgeon.

It'd be... More than a little weird to have your parent's own uterus.

Squick aside, though, I'm more concerned with whether there'd be room during a pregnancy. It seems like there should be (organs are pretty tough about that sort of thing)...

There's also the matter of ova. Even if they put in ovaries... Well, those only have so many eggs in them, and their genes are already determined. Hmm... I wonder if they could use a body cell? Now that I think of it, that might actually work... :smallhopeful:

@ Bianca: You look cute in that picture. It's also rather obvious that you're a good deal thinner than when you got the jacket, just by looking at your wrists.

How so? The sleeves never fit me (I actually couldn't button it up at first, and they were just as far down my arms) - wait, "cute"? Uh, thanks.

Also I missed y'all! Ive been too busy with school.

What I miss?

Oh, And day of silence is tomarow. Got lots of students to particepate . I wont be posting that day.

Think fast! *Glomp*

@ KenderWizard

I think I get what you mean.

At my lunch table im offent called many names. Now they dont know im bi, but it still hurts me deaply. I have some good friends at that table but I cant stand thous "Queer haters".

*Hugs*

You look a lot like I imagined you might! (Not that I was sitting around imagining what you look like, just that when I saw the picture I was like "Yeah, that seems right" rather than, as sometimes happens, "WTF! THAT's what they look like?") Also, lovely hair and I can't believe how patient you must be to have nails that long!

And thank you for the hugs.

^_^

The nails aren't actually that much trouble... They're harder to keep up with without nail polish, though (Toni and I haven't really talked since our fight ).

Well, like I said, I know it'd be way worse for me if I didn't cry these things out, but I also really don't like the experience of crying. And, once I cry once, anything at all will set me off (I call this being fraught, I dunno if that word is used for this elsewhere) for the rest of the day. So, if something minor happens, like I knock something over, or if something reminds me of the thing that made me cry, or sometimes just randomly. I hate being fraught. But I do feel better today and I'm sure crying it out did help.

*Hugs*

I'd also be concerned about all the stuff the body does when it's pregnant, like the other organs getting out of the way and the efficient link between eating and "feeding" the foetus.

Also, is it possible to induce lactation in trans women?

Good point... Nutrition may be an issue. The blood goes through some changes, doesn't it?

As for lactation, some meds induce it in cis men. I don't know how nutritious it is (it's probably pretty similar), but it's entirely possible.


~Bianca

[The Succubus]

I have to admit, I really like the way you've done your hair Bianca. The way it covers the side of your face gives you a kind of mysterious look.

[Lix Lorn]

I love you, Asta.

I had dibs first.

[Asta Kask]

Squick aside, though, I'm more concerned with whether there'd be room during a pregnancy. It seems like there should be (organs are pretty tough about that sort of thing)...

There's also the matter of ova. Even if they put in ovaries... Well, those only have so many eggs in them, and their genes are already determined. Hmm... I wonder if they could use a body cell? Now that I think of it, that might actually work... :smallhopeful:

Well, the body makes room. That's why very pregnant women look like they've been quaffing beer for twenty years.

Donated ovaries should have more than enough eggs to go around. At puberty, the average woman has 400 000 eggs in her ovaries. Around 400 of these will ovulate. The rest, for some reason, never make it. We don't know why.

I think your best option for becoming a biological parent is to freeze sperm before you transition. But there are proud parents of adopted children all over the world who say biology isn't the most crucial factor in parenthood.

Good point... Nutrition may be an issue. The blood goes through some changes, doesn't it?

As for lactation, some meds induce it in cis men. I don't know how nutritious it is (it's probably pretty similar), but it's entirely possible.

The thing is - all this is controlled by hormones. And the same receptors are present in both sexes. There's no reason why they shouldn't work the same.

[Lea Plath]

I'm not a massively scientific person, but from my basic understanding of how cloning worked for Dolly, for example, they removed the nucleus of the egg cell and replaced it with the nucleus for another cell to allow cloning. From my understanding, if you can remove half the chromosomes from a cell, you could put that nucleus in the egg cells and make your own "egg" cell.

But biology I am still a little fuzzy on. I am probably wrong.

===

And my diet is going well. Trying to drop 3-4 stone. Eating a lot less, walking 5 miles a day too and from school, cycling to Leeds rather than busing in.

Hopefully I'll have a body shape I can pass for femenine if need be soon. But I've started to feel a kind of shift back from female to male. It feels really really weird to go back and forth. At the same time, exciting. And I'm with Heliomance on prefering my female self, but that might just be my self esteem issues at times.

[Asta Kask]

I'm not a massively scientific person, but from my basic understanding of how cloning worked for Dolly, for example, they removed the nucleus of the egg cell and replaced it with the nucleus for another cell to allow cloning. From my understanding, if you can remove half the chromosomes from a cell, you could put that nucleus in the egg cells and make your own "egg" cell.

Yeah there's more to it than that. Sorry.

[The Succubus]

I'm not a massively scientific person, but from my basic understanding of how cloning worked for Dolly, for example, they removed the nucleus of the egg cell and replaced it with the nucleus for another cell to allow cloning. From my understanding, if you can remove half the chromosomes from a cell, you could put that nucleus in the egg cells and make your own "egg" cell.

But biology I am still a little fuzzy on. I am probably wrong.

===

And my diet is going well. Trying to drop 3-4 stone. Eating a lot less, walking 5 miles a day too and from school, cycling to Leeds rather than busing in.

Hopefully I'll have a body shape I can pass for femenine if need be soon. But I've started to feel a kind of shift back from female to male. It feels really really weird to go back and forth. At the same time, exciting. And I'm with Heliomance on prefering my female self, but that might just be my self esteem issues at times.

Sounds good Lea. If you keep up your new fitness regieme, you'll end up looking good no matter which way you're indentifying.

[pffh]

There have also been experiments in using the genetic material from a sperm and implant that into an empty egg and then impregnate that cell with a sperm and using an egg and the nucleus of another egg instead of one egg and one sperm.

[Lea Plath]

Yeah there's more to it than that. Sorry.

Oh, OK, where did I go wrong? Besides probably everywhere?

[pffh]

Oh, OK, where did I go wrong? Besides probably everywhere?

Well to start it's quite impossible (with modern technology) to remove half the chromosomes from a cell without killing it. Sure you can destroy the cell and force the double helix to open and separate. That is done all the time when you want to use PCR to amplify a piece of DNA.

This is why stem cells or egg cells are used.

[Lea Plath]

Well to start it's quite impossible (with modern technology) to remove half the chromosomes from a cell without killing it. Sure you can destroy the cell and force the double helix to open and separate. That is done all the time when you want to use PCR to amplify a piece of DNA.

This is why stem cells or egg cells are used.

Ahh, which is why they can only clone at the moment?

[Arachu]

I have to admit, I really like the way you've done your hair Bianca. The way it covers the side of your face gives you a kind of mysterious look.

That's... Kinda the way it grew on its own.

Well, the body makes room. That's why very pregnant women look like they've been quaffing beer for twenty years.

Donated ovaries should have more than enough eggs to go around. At puberty, the average woman has 400 000 eggs in her ovaries. Around 400 of these will ovulate. The rest, for some reason, never make it. We don't know why.

I think your best option for becoming a biological parent is to freeze sperm before you transition. But there are proud parents of adopted children all over the world who say biology isn't the most crucial factor in parenthood.


The thing is - all this is controlled by hormones. And the same receptors are present in both sexes. There's no reason why they shouldn't work the same.

Good points... I just worry that there are more closed pelvises in there. It seems like everything should be ready after hormone therapy, but... Well, I don't really know enough to simulate the whole process. :/

I'm not a massively scientific person, but from my basic understanding of how cloning worked for Dolly, for example, they removed the nucleus of the egg cell and replaced it with the nucleus for another cell to allow cloning. From my understanding, if you can remove half the chromosomes from a cell, you could put that nucleus in the egg cells and make your own "egg" cell.

But biology I am still a little fuzzy on. I am probably wrong.

Dolly's what I'm thinking of. Now that I think some more, though, it seems like that wouldn't work without somehow triggering meiosis... The problem would be making the body cell work like an egg.

And my diet is going well. Trying to drop 3-4 stone. Eating a lot less, walking 5 miles a day too and from school, cycling to Leeds rather than busing in.

Hopefully I'll have a body shape I can pass for femenine if need be soon. But I've started to feel a kind of shift back from female to male. It feels really really weird to go back and forth. At the same time, exciting. And I'm with Heliomance on prefering my female self, but that might just be my self esteem issues at times.

*Macho handshake*


~Bianca

[pffh]

Ahh, which is why they can only clone at the moment?

Weeeeeell cloning is a bit complicated and I'm not really all that familiar with cloning as the public knows it (making one animal identical to another) I'm more familiar with the other form of cloning where a piece of DNA is inserted into another cells DNA and then that cell replicates.

I've used the latter form of cloning myself to create glow in the dark bacteria and other sweet bacterias.

[Asta Kask]

Oh, OK, where did I go wrong? Besides probably everywhere?

Well to start it's quite impossible (with modern technology) to remove half the chromosomes from a cell without killing it. Sure you can destroy the cell and force the double helix to open and separate. That is done all the time when you want to use PCR to amplify a piece of DNA.

This is why stem cells or egg cells are used.

You'd also miss out on meiosis, which is a special kind of cell division only gametes go through. And we know that during this process certain genes are switched off, and the pattern is subtly different in sperm and egg cells.

Good points... I just worry that there are more closed pelvises in there. It seems like everything should be ready after hormone therapy, but... Well, I don't really know enough to simulate the whole process. :/

Oh, there will be things we didn't think of. So we start with an animal model and work upwards from there.

[Asta Kask]

I've tried to remove this post three times. Bugger.