Elven Fighter with improved weapon familiarity

[Greenish]

Yeah Greenish but I bet at the level I can take both of those OTWF would be better statically

I wasn't suggesting you take any specific ones out of those, I was just spitballing stuff that increases attack.

[Icewraith]

The thing is, Exotic Weapon Master doesn't get you a whole lot unless you're going to be using the trick as your main schtick. Also, uncanny blow and maybe the flurry of strikes (and there aren't any elven racial double weapons) abilities are far and away the best of the bunch, iirc. I think you can also turn any exotic weapon into a tripping weapon, but that's only good if you're already planning to trip.

[tricktroller]

well with that build I would be able to. I could take improved trip as my 9th level feat and as one of the abilities from ewm. That could be disgusting.....


Ok so I want to circle back to what I originally posted and see what we can do about him, but I also wrote up what we have morphed out of my original concept.

So original post was about an elven fighter who used all of the elven styled weapons and was Elfy with a capital E.

The new idea from all of your input looks like
Human
swashbuckler 3/rogue 3/swashbuckler 1/Exotic Weapon Master 3/ Swashbuckler 10

Feats
Flaw1 EWP Elven Light blade
Flaw2 combat expertise
human superior finesse
1st twf
sb1 weapon finesse
3rd weapon focus elven lightblade
6th daring outlaw
9th improved trip


no idea for the rest of his feats but this ends up with 9d6 sneak attack, +2 Grace, +3 dodge, int and dex to damage, short swords that can trip, that deal double damage on power attacks and that have twf penalties reduced by 1.

Maybe Elfy with a capital E will use all of the weapons but prefers his courtblade with knowledge devotion. Let's explore that route maybe?

[Icewraith]

Uncanny blow only works with the Thinblade, which is a one-handed exotic weapon. The lightblade is a LIGHT exotic weapon and you can't power attack with it at all. However, the point of the daring outlaw build is to get your sneak attack damage as an alternative damage source to power attack.

I believe you want 4 rogue levels for the penetrating strike ACF (gives you half your sneak attack damage to normally immune creatures if you can flank them). You also want to start at 1st level with rogue for skillpoints.

Double edit: swashbuckler has an ACF that reduces your dodge bonus by 1 but lets you apply it to everyone when you attack with two light weapons.

[tricktroller]

Well that's fine, I'm less interested in that character and more interested in Prince Elfy of Elfdom.

[Callin]

Well that's fine, I'm less interested in that character and more interested in Prince Elfy of Elfdom.

Then he would have levels in Elf Paragon and Ruathar.

[tricktroller]

Are those better than a straight fighter? I was thinking not an uber charger build but something that does a lot of damage anyways.

Fighter 6/ EWM 1 Trip/ Champ of Corellon 10/ Fighter 2/ 1 ?

use a courtblade, use knowledge devotion, and be an incredibly smart fighter.

[Red Fel]

In my opinion, the best way to be a smart Fighter is not to be a Fighter - as previously mentioned in the thread, go Warblade. Warblade gets you access to martial maneuvers, and has class features that key off of Int.

Additionally, Warblade gains you access to the Eternal Blade PrC, also mentioned earlier in the thread, which is extremely capital-E Elfy. In fact, Elf race is a prereq. You're basically a destined champion of elvenkind, served and guided by an incorporeal spirit of an ancient Elven warrior. Again, you gain Int-based class abilities, Uncanny Dodge, full BAB...

Oh, and did I mention that your capstone permits you to take an entire turn as an immediate action once per encounter? Why yes, please, enjoy a free turn, on the house. Whenever you want it - even during someone else's turn.

You aren't just Captain Elfy McElvenpants. You're Captain Elfy McElvenpants, Resident BadElf of Elfheim.

[tricktroller]

alrighty well can you get me dex to damage as well as strength along with knowledge devotion with that setup? I think it would be cool to be a champion of corellon and an eternal blade and have my blade guide thingy be Corellon or an avatar of his. Just for fluff reasons.

[tricktroller]

maybe two level dip in fighter for prereqs for ChampoCL and then go warblade 4 exotic weapon master 1 Champ whatever I need to get dex to damage then eternal blade finish off champ?

[tricktroller]

or should I go with the elven thin blade for 1 point of damage less on average but the ability to wield a shield if need be and the the uncanny blow ability from exotic weapon master which would lead to a lot more damage potential

[Callin]

Warblade 7/Champ Cor 2/Exotic Weapon Master 1/Eternal Blade 10


Mix in the PrC's where you want.

(why do you want EWM? just use the Court Blade)

[tricktroller]

ewm for trip or uncanny blow if I used the thin blade.

[Fouredged Sword]

You need two levels of champ to get dex to damage, but there is nothing preventing you from ALSO picking up shadow blade.

I would go Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Warblade 2 / Champion of Corellon Larethian 2 / Warblade 1 / Eternal Blade 10

Pick up martial study, martial stance, and shadow blade - Fairy magic initiate

You get Int to Hp in place of Con

Weapon + Str + dex2 + int to all damage

I suggest assassin's stance so you can also pick up craven, for +20 damage on some hits.

[tricktroller]

Hey FOuredged that doesnt get enough feats to get everything you need with the three feats you are suggesting adding in even with two flaws. ALso lets worry less about adding int to damage and just use in for knowledge devotion. easier that way probably. or might be easier to ignore shadow blade.

[Fouredged Sword]

Yeah, shadow blade is eating feats there. You may find better results from simply going

Fighter 2 / Warblade 5 / CCL 2 / Warblade 1 / Eternal Blade 10

FMI is near vital, as it allows you to grab grey elf and laugh all the way to silly HP totals.

Get a vest of steady spellcasting and use it to supercharge the concentration as damage strikes from diamond mind. Use a court blade with power attack for damage (you can get touch attacks as a strike).

[tricktroller]

but if I use a thinblade and take one level in ewm with uncanny blow I deal double strength damage and I deal double damage with power attack right? Wouldn't that be a useful reason to dip plus I already have the prereqs so that I can take eternal blade (one being weapon focus)

[Callin]

not double with Power Attack. Just treat it as if it was a 2 handed weapon.

and thats fine if you want to go that route. Use the Court Blade for your early career then with warblade switch it all to Thinblade once you get into EWM. That could work

[tricktroller]

well I mean honestly isnt using punishing stance with a heavy shiled and the thin blade more effective than the courtblade? chance of 1-6 as opposed to only +2 damage no reduction on two hit and ability to boost ac?

[Fouredged Sword]

Looking at it, that may be a good way to go.

Fighter 2 / Warblade 4 / EWM 1 / CCL 2 / Warblade 1 / Eternal Blade 10

Use a thinblade two handed once you hit level 7, before that go heavy shield / thin blade. Don't dump strength and you are getting 2X str + dex to damage and deal 2X penalty for power attack damage.

[Callin]

Looking at it, that may be a good way to go.

Fighter 2 / Warblade 4 / EWM 1 / CCL 2 / Warblade 1 / Eternal Blade 10

Use a thinblade two handed once you hit level 7, before that go heavy shield / thin blade. Don't dump strength and you are getting 2X str + dex to damage and deal 2X penalty for power attack damage.

This way also gets you 9th level Maneuvers.

[Icewraith]

If you're going with an initiator class, tacking on other stats to your melee weapon isn't as big a deal. Those kinds of bonus damage are more valuable when you're planning to dual-wield, which it sounds like we've eliminated?

You could for instance dump the three levels of swashbuckler and go straight warblade into CoCL/eternal blade, assuming you can pick up all the feats you want without adding a fighter dip.

If we're going courtblade with this guy, shadow blade won't work IIRC, it's dex to damage only with shadow hand weapons. If we're going dual-wield, instead of assassin's stance and blowing a feat on craven (that's three feats for 2d6+cl damage, blocked by crit immunity and immune to flanking and no craven if you become immune to fear, and you bravely run away whenever you fight a dragon) why not just pick up the white raven stance that adds initator level to damage when flanking (and you still get if it's a golem or undead or something uncrittable)? The main draw here is a solid per-hit damage bonus as long as you can flank reliably and take martial adept classes, and you pick it up from warblade levels instead of three feats.

Also, consider stormguard warrior, which is a tactical feat that gives you some interesting alternative options with your attacks of opportunity and iterative attacks that can add a ton of damage.

Note that if you want to power attack, you still need 13 STR.

edit: mostly ninja'd

[tricktroller]

Ok I like where you guys are going but I have some thoughts.

Warblade 1/Fighter 4/ Warblade 1/ Exotic Weapon Master 1/ Champion of Corellon 2/ Warblade 1/ Eternal blade 10

This way I spread out my initiator levels amongst my non iniator levels to take advantage of the higher maneuvers.

at 1st level I get sapphire nightmare blade, steel wind, stone bones, and punishing stance, at 6th I pick up emerald Razor and at 10th I pick up Bonecrusher. ending up as a 16th level initiator which means I don't get 9th level maneuvers but oh well.

Feats are as follows

Flaw1 Weapon Familiarity
Flaw2 Nobleman (needed to get all skills)
1st Weapon Focus Elven Thinblade (might swap this and knowledge devotion if starting at level 1)
F1 Dodge
F2 Expertise
3rd Knowledge Devotion
F4 Power Attack
6th Mounted Combat
9th ?


This is the only way I can see to get everything I want by 10th level. This guy should be tossing out mad amounts of damage even at low levels and only get nastier as he levels. I wish there was a way to get all the feats I need for this without losing initiator levels but I just don;t see it happening.

[Callin]

Tack on the Drow Fighter ACF (since you dont HAVE to be Drow to use it). With the Dex you got now no reason to wear heavy armor anyways.

[Icewraith]

No 9th level maneuvers is kind of a big deal if you get that far. Any way you can drop those last two levels of fighter? Fighter 3 really isn't doing you any good, and warblade 5 gets you a bonus feat that may or may not be useful to you.

[tricktroller]

do you lose heavy armor prof? also would it really matter if I did since I get it form the warblade too? Otherwise I won;t be able to take champion of corellon.

Unfortunately the bonus feat isnt one of the ones I have listed and so isnt one of the ones I need. I could do it without fighter 3-4 if I didn't take nobleman but then I would lose all knowledges as class skills and my RP feat.

[Callin]

Ok I like where you guys are going but I have some thoughts.

Warblade 1/Fighter 4/ Warblade 1/ Exotic Weapon Master 1/ Champion of Corellon 2/ Warblade 1/ Eternal blade 10

This way I spread out my initiator levels amongst my non iniator levels to take advantage of the higher maneuvers.

at 1st level I get sapphire nightmare blade, steel wind, stone bones, and punishing stance, at 6th I pick up emerald Razor and at 10th I pick up Bonecrusher. ending up as a 16th level initiator which means I don't get 9th level maneuvers but oh well.

Feats are as follows

Flaw1 Weapon Familiarity
Flaw2 Nobleman (needed to get all skills)
1st Weapon Focus Elven Thinblade (might swap this and knowledge devotion if starting at level 1)
F1 Dodge
F2 Expertise
3rd Knowledge Devotion
F4 Power Attack
6th Mounted Combat
9th ?

Not bad, I would SERIOUSLY try to talk to the DM about retraining your elf weapon profs Rapier and or Longsword for Weapon Familiarity. Fits the background and will save you a feat! As Tippy would say Chaos Shuffle the rest around so you have more feats to play with. (Do it, you need em lol)

Edit.. yea then dont take the ACF. I didnt look at that

[Icewraith]

Aside from dex to damage, what is CoCl doing for you that eternal blade won't do better?

Edit: and by that I mean it's getting you a reasonable damage bonus, but at the cost of at least one feat (mounted combat) if not more (dodge), lost initiator level, and even fewer martial maneuvers.

[tricktroller]

Flavor? Honesty the lay on hands will be next to useless the bonus feat will be alright but eh Champion's dex to damage and the fluff are what I like. Like I said I think it would be cool to have ole Corellon himself as my blade guide.

[tricktroller]

I understand that mechanically two levels and 3 feats for at max a +7 to damage isn't optimized especially for non twfing (pronounced twiffing)